They are out in force tonight. They must be very scared.

[TruthIsAll]

Luckily, there are some great DU newbies who spot them right away.

The machine irregularities, the registration scams, the terror alert lockdowns..are all being documented. And they all seemed to work out positive for Bush and negative for Kerry.

It's very powerful evidence. And it's having a powerful effect.

Many have been spinning like crazy over the last day or so, throwing tired strawmen all over the place. Trying to divert, to fog, to stonewall any reasonable attempt to throw the light of basic statistical analysis on the subject.

I am not discouraged; on the contrary, I am very encouraged to see legitimate contributions and suggestions made which have helped me in fine-tuning the statistical probability models I'm always working on.

Those who come to disparage my efforts are easy to spot. They never offer a specific suggestion regarding any of the analysis.

That means either one of two things. Either they don't know what they are talking about or they agree with the analysis and cannot debunk it.

MathGuy, on the other hand, a new addition to DU, actually got it right when he spotted a flaw in my calculation. He spelled everything out beautifully. Put a lot of effort into explaining why I should make a minor change. I liked that. A lot. That's what this should be all about - a collabarative effort.

For those long-time debunkers who never quit, I admire your tenacity. But that's all you've got. Tenacity. So does Bush. Tenacity. Bull-headed. Never discuss specifics. Never analyze. Just
attempt to divert. To divide and conquer.

They cannot succeed in their efforts. That's because we're mostly liberals. We like to analyze problems in order to solve them. We don't avoid them just because they're hard. It's in our nature. We like to solve problems.

The information gathering will soon grow into a crescendo, and those who avoid the truth will crash and burn under the weight of overwhelming evidence.

It's not a question of if.
It's only a question of when.

I love the smell of Bush-bot panic in the morning.

Will any of them reply to this post? So far, none have. Let's give them a little time.

[dzika]

1. It seems like someone is shaking the tree.

n/t

[mary195149]

8. And you don't think people involved in the bush scam,

is running scared? They can't cover their tracks when they are under pressure, they worry about making mistakes, they worry about being ratted on. It will be fun to watch it unravel!!

[jamboi]

35. We're smoking the terrorists out of their caves. :-) n/t

[Action Jackson]

2. let 'em sink

posts like this fire me up!!!

[BlueStateBlue]

3. God, I hope so! n/t

[T Town Jake]

4. Who exactly is...

..."They"? :shrug:

[reality_bites]

23. This is undeniable proof that Kerry won. Woo hoo. n/t

[jsamuel]

5. Something definitely seems to be going on...

[mountainvue]

6. They're everywhere.

I've never seen so many low count posters with an "authoritative" knowledge of election law.:crazy:

[martinolich]

9. ..Sorry for the "low count," Mountainvue...but

its "authoritative", btw.

[mountainvue]

15. Bless your heart. n/t

[Kurovski]

50. And "its" is " it's"!

:-)

[BlueStateBlue]

19. I'm especially impressed

by their lack of spelling skills.

Idiots!

:puke:

[mountainvue]

25. What, no profile?

Transparency is everything my dear.

[BlueStateBlue]

44. Is that better?

Sorry, didn't realize I had "hide profile" checked in options...

[Spiffarino]

53. All right!

Glad you're here, BSB! :hi:

[BlueStateBlue]

106. Thanks! n/t

[juajen]

82. Welcome to DU BlueStateBlue

We're all blue, but the sun will rise.

[BlueStateBlue]

107. Tha nks for the welcome! n/t

[spotbird]

29. Amen.

If we are to be undone it will be by our trust in strangers.

[NVMojo]

85. what a true statement!!!

[alittlelark]

56. Yea, pretty wierd day...

and this makes my 6th post today - but I've been lurking and taking notes.

[txindy]

7. In force?

That's the understatement of the day. That's akin to saying, "B*sh has a slight tendency to bend the truth." :+

I think we've been invaded. Ain't it grand?! LOL! :toast:

I love the smell of freeper fear in the air. Smells like sulphur.

[mountainvue]

10. Hee hee.

Pass the popcorn. Show's about to start.

[bleever]

38. And speaking of odors, whenever I see quotation marks used

to denote emphasis (e.g., "Mathematically Impossible", "Legally Irrelevant") it reminds of the sign I once saw that read:

"FRESH" Fish.

[txindy]

52. Think the fish might disagree, eh?

How do you think the monkey is holding up? I'm thinking they're having to use elephant tranquilizers on him just about now. Probably delivered from a distance. ;)

[bleever]

60. I'm inclined to think that monkey's mental state is like his mandate:

fragile, tenuous, precarious.

I've been under the impression that he's been on meds for a while now, and those meds (Xanax? Antidepressants?) are not easy to calibrate -- it takes time.

But I also know he's insulated from the news, just like he's insulated from detailed policy deliberations: that's not his job, as, you know, The Leader.

But I do think that he has sufficient awareness of the hanky-panky to have some level of ongoing...discomfit? Anxiety? And he's definitely not in control of his own cigarette boat here, and that spells trouble, and that rhymes with rubble.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

11. I keep my Bullshit Filter at its highest setting, at all times.

It serves me well. As I get older, I trust it more and more.

The roses that grow around here are gonna be prizewinners, come spring.

[txindy]

32. As big as dinner plates, they'll be

We're going to need hip boots or waders, though. That's fine. It may be smelly for a while, but, as you pointed out, the end result will be well worth the effort.

[bj2110]

12. Right On! Was this message approved? n/t

[Stand and Fight]

13. You've got that right.

There is most definitely the case. A lot of people appearing out of no where and making arguments against and for all sort of crazy things. It's just interesting to watch and make note of, but it is also both annoying and amusing at the same time.

[troubleinwinter]

14. Glad to hear someone mention the odor...

it positively reeks!

Them poor babies. :hurts:

[helderheid]

16. Fear is in the air

but not from me. I think we'll finaly see the justice we deserved in 2000 and now this election! No more stolen elections and justice for those who would shit all over our democracy!

[verdalaven]

17. Something I don't....scratch that....will NEVER understand-

Why Bush still has so many supporters after all the crap he has dealt this country. How far will they allow him to go before they reach their limit and wake up?

Mind boggling.

[WillJP]

41. He doesn't,

it was vote fraud.

[Spiffarino]

55. No, he does have a lot of support

A lot of support from batshit crazy amoral nutcases, but lightly sprinkled with a few well-intentioned religious single-issue voters.

[AgadorSparticus]

68. he has a lot of support from a relatively small percentage of the populati

...population. certainly nowhere near to win or exercise his ridiculous mandate.

[Spiffarino]

71. Nowhere near a majority

...but they're armed religious zealots and amoral hate-filled militiamen who will attack anyone who doesn't worship at the altar of Shrub.

[Mandate My Ass]

18. Riddle: How many trolls does it take to prop up a fraudulent election?

Answer: Lots if you go by the number of trolls in this forum.

[Old and In the Way]

24. I read the RNC has outsourced their trolling jobs to India.

Hey, they spent $750MM big ones this cycle....got to cut back somewhere.

[Mandate My Ass]

33. I wish they'd outsource vote counting

and MSM coverage of voting irregularities. We might still be living in a democratic republic if that was the case.

$750M huh? Graft and bribery ain't as cheap as they used to be.

[jamboi]

88. Or Russia? n/t

[ewulf]

91. LOL, that's an awesome image (n/t)

[Scout1071]

20. Low Count

Doesn't necessarily make you one of "them." Just stay open minded to some of us newbies. I tend to be a bit more selective when posting.

Having said that....have a lovely evening. I'm off for bed.

[Spiffarino]

58. That's your problem, Scout

See, most of us don't need any sleep. We exist on pure caffeine and moral outrage!

[Kurovski]

66. And Chee-tos!

Which seems appropriate.

[ebayfool]

75. Ummm, Cheezy Poufs! n/t

[New Earth]

21. one thing i really don't get, is why do they bother?

them coming here and trying to put down every action being taken in this election is pointless. it is not going to change anyone's mind!!! it is not going to make us any less hopeful.

there are people out there working on this who know what they're doing (for the most part) - when the actions are taken and the REACTIONS (legally) to those actions are taken, THEN we will know what is to come of it all.

All this 'freeping' is doing nothing, so they should all just go home and take a nap.

[Skip Intro]

22. yeah, I noticed

all focused on bush's attempted theft of this election, it seems

telling

[rdmccur]

26. TruthIsAll, you said it very well

Your statements mirror my thoughts about this. Some people, perhaps due to ignorance or perhaps due to intention, point to certain arguments regarding fraud and claim them to be, at best, questionable while ignoring the vast preponderance of evidence that has been accumulating for the last month plus. It is the weight of all of this evidence which has me convinced that there was widespread fraud (and coverup). It's all circumstantial (for the case of widespread fraud that is), but there's so damn much of it! If I were a juror sitting in a trial I would have no hesitation in reaching a verdict.

[mountainvue]

34. They convicted Peterson on a hell

of a lot less. So why not? Maybe we can see if those folks are available.

[Atman]

36. Scott Peterson was convicted on "circumstantial" evidence.

Think about it. They may fry that guy. Oh, the irony...he was used by the MSM to distract us from looking at the REAL evidence against Bush.

[Pepper32]

102. Agreed. n/t

[New Earth]

27. don't feed them after midnight

[Patsy Stone]

47. Hi! ROFLMAO! n/t

[BlueStateBlue]

28. They are scared. Poor little fascists... n/t

[Patsy Stone]

30. Thought it was just me

Nice to know I'm not crazy.

In the words from Finding Nemo: SWIM DOWN!!!

[HeeBGBz]

31. A nasty little distraction

The fact that there are a whole bunch of peeps jumping in with stuff that I have no clue about. I have to leave the number crunchers and the computer wizards to defend the things I do not comprehend.

I do have a finely tuned bullshit alert system that I trust deeply.

This is amusing to watch.

I love you guys!

[mike_c]

37. you know, I almost posted about this earlier today, then I thought...

...nah, it's just me. Good to hear that others have noticed the sudden weirdness here.

[bleever]

39. Seems to come in waves. n/t

[DemonFighterLives]

40. It's like the Northern Lights of a month ago

Really putting on a show tonight! The cultists are out to make us love dubbie.
Won't happen, so give it up. Once a fraud, always a fraud.

[GingerSnaps]

42. I think of them as termites

Your know that the termites are in the walls but it takes time for them to appear. Some have been around for a long time and it's only a matter of time before there are so many of them that the wall caves in and you find a bunch that have been around for years ;)

[dmac]

43. "They are out in force tonight. They must be very scared."

I think you are right! And I must say, it is the greatest feeling I have had since I found DU - it's about time. Let's keep our fingers crossed that it is just a matter of time now . . .

[SueZhope]

45. and the good news is some

are vanishing into thin air by the powers that be.....
Thank you! Thank you!

[WebeBlue]

46. Awww, I'm too young to know the difference.

Mind if I hang out with you veterans who know enough to know the difference?

[Spiffarino]

48. I just put a freep on ignore

I strongly urge you all to do the same if you haven't. They're just trying to net people. Starve them of attention and *poof* - they disappear.

TIA, thanks for helping keep everyone's eyes focused firmly on this issue. By god, if it wasn't fraud it was one hell of a coincidence that they will have to go through great pains to prove.

:yourock:

[aquart]

89. I dunno. If a freep attack means we're onto something.....

Shouldn't we welcome them? Perhaps serve a few crullers? Tell them how delighted we are to see them?

[IndyPriest]

49. TIA, if I could, I'd have your baby! n/t

[nofurylike]

51. but they're lucky. they only have to fear losing. they have no idea

how much they should fear * getting away with it.

i think of them all as the Niemoeller community.

may they wake in time.


peace

[Liberty Belle]

54. It's interesting that none of the "accused" have claimed libel.

The mainstream media has been so paranoid about covering anything that could trigger a libel lawsuit, yet I find it fascinating that not one of the individuals or companies acused of involvement in the voting fraud scheme have stepped foreward to proclaim their innocence or threaten a libel lawsuit. (If I'm wrong and I've missed something, please let me know.)

Silence can be damning.

[Garbo 2004]

84. One, it would draw attention to the claims which they don't want & 2.

even if the election fraud claims were all bogus (just for sake of argument; don't jump me folks, lol), Madsen's, Curtis' and even Fisher's stories touch on some real dirty laundry and sleazy connections that can be documented I think and the names named don't want it aired in the MSM. Civil lawsuits can open a Pandora's Box and discovery can be a bitch. ;)

And if the election fraud claims are hitting too close to the jackpot, well of course that's another very excellent reason to lay low and encourage the MSM not to "dignify" the claims of the "tinfoil hat crowd."

A kill by silence approach. It's worked before. And if the fraud claims gain traction and wider attention, then I figure the smear campaign will roll out.

Remember what they did with Paul O'Neill, Richard Clarke and Joe Wilson. All served in Republican Administrations and were swell respectable fellows...until they broke ranks. Then they were nuts, cranks, partisans, out of the loop, liars, etc. Look what they did to Kerry.

So one can only imagine what will come down on reporters and whistleblowers who don't have that kind of standing. Even if they've got the goods.

The interesting thing is I recall right before and during the election how we were convinced that Kerry was going to win the election. That was to be expected here. But if I recall correctly, from reports here, over in freeperland by election day there was wailing and the gnashing of teeth. Hell...even they appeared to believe Kerry would win. I think a lot of 'em were shocked as we are when the tide seemed to turn all of a sudden.

Now it looks like perhaps even these "tin foil" speculations and reports may be rattling some cages? Or is it the prospect of a very real recount in Ohio and Conyers' little discussion group that some may find threatening? Because maybe a lot of 'em really believed Kerry won and only by the grace of God or Diebold or the dead rising and voting did Bush & Co. retain their grip on power.

Just speculating... :tinfoilhat:

;)

[NVMojo]

86. I was in high school at the time but how did the Watergate stuff

first roll out? How did the media react? Did they jump on it? I remember something about a "deep throat" but wasn't paying much attention to the politics at the time.

Someone told me I should rent "All the President's Men" or something like that.

[Garbo 2004]

90. A break in at DNC HQ and "burglars" w ties to the CIA/RNC/CREEP.

Cubans who had CIA connections breaking into the DNC HQ with bugging equipment during an election year when Nixon was running for re-election? Not particularly subtle. Raised a few questions.

Also among those arrested:

James W. McCord - a security co-ordinator for the Republican National Committee and the Committee for the Re-election of the President. McCord was also a former FBI and CIA agent. He was dismissed from his RNC and CREEP positions the day after the break-in.

Original Washington Post report on the break in: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/watergate/articles/061872-1.htm

So there was an overt criminal act at the DNC during the election campaign for Nixon. And the characters arrested had ties to the CIA and the "security consultant" with an alias turned out to be working for the RNC and the Committee to Re-elect the Pres (CREEP). That was reason enough to raise some eyebrows and for reporters to dig for more info.

Also, the press was different then. They weren't just stenographers like so many are today, who think a major "scoop" is a comment by a "senior White House official." And Congress was different too.

More info: http://www.watergate.info/

[MarkusQ]

110. Dorthy Vandenburg Bush

IIRC, the office they broke into was the office of Dorthy Vandenburg Bush, of the DNC.

G. W. Bush was the head of the RNC and CIA around the same time (I don't recall the exact order).

G. H. Bush was in the national guard that summer. Or so I'm told.

"The Cubans" were, of course, from Florida, home of honest elections for a price.

--MarkusQ

[Garbo 2004]

92. More info on Watergate also available at the WaPo's special section

on Watergate revisited: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/onpolitics/watergate/splash.html

[understandinglife]

57. Call'um out; flush'um out; put the laser of truth in their faces...

...and, ain't it interesting, when you call'um out, they run -- the trolls, that is.

That's the message folk; bullies when confronted, for real, run.

We are for real.

No one is going to do another 6 Jan 2001 on us, ever again.

We are going to save our democracy franchise and we are never going to allow anyone to mess with even one citizen's right to vote and right to know that their vote was counted exactly as they intended it to be.

Take it to the bank.

Peace.

"Did Bush Know?"

[Spiffarino]

63. That's what they've been doing

Post and run. One idiot started two threads stating "Ohio is over." Every time he was confronted with facts he couldn't refute, he'd post a "You are wrong n/t" or similar in the subject. It's a dead giveaway.

There are a few right now trying to pump up their post counts in the Gungeon and the Lounge. They post LOLs or short subjects to raise their counts, then they start trolling.

[Patsy Stone]

64. Clever

Just found one in a thread I started. Maguzzi - 9 posts, avatar of Che.

"Kerry's dreamin'" was the name of that Peabody Award Winning post.
Screw 'em. I'm too happy. Cheers!

[Spiffarino]

65. Cheers, Pats!

And have a lovely ciggy and a Stoli on me, dahling!

[fearnobush]

59. You hit the nail dead square. It sure seems like there is a lot of

intentional side tracking going on. They seem to be hard at work. It's nice to see that others too can see right threw it.

[merh]

61. Do you think Skinner could post a "troll alert" at the top of

every forum? You know, use a color code scale with
Blue representing a safe, calm environment where discussions can be had without fake and courteous posters warning that the continuation of the discussion on an issue will "be harmful to the cause";
Purple would represent that the little premies with ulterior motives have been spotted but have not been able to survive due to their transparent efforts to annoy and disrupt; and,
Red would reflect that an all out invasion has occurred because we are discussing issues that really scare the beegeezebbes out of them.
(sarcasm)

If we had the "troll alert" red would be our color tonight !

Smell it, that is desperation.

[Patsy Stone]

62. Pardon the repetition but,

I can't stop saying this: "The onrush of a conquering force is like the bursting of pent-up waters into a chasm a thousand fathoms deep." - Sun Tzu

[tommcintyre]

67. I nominate this one as "Best of the Day" & "TOP TROLL HUNTER"

Xxxxxxxx (80 posts)
AFTER DEC 7TH ANY RECOUNT IN OHIO IS NOT LEGITIMATE
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=119337

Actually, I did learn a lot from the responses there. Like most, he? wouldn't respond to: "who ARE you?" (just like: "what's your REAL motive?" - always avoid or no response).

------------------------------------------------------
EDIT- Update: I didn't notice this since I read the thread earlier. Prety good proof positive (saracat should get a notch on his/her belt or something)

120. I'm locking this thread


reason :

the original poster has been banned ,
no need to keep threads open started by them .

--------------------------------------------------------

Also, FYI for more info related to this subject (these are "deep" and hard to remove):
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=108750#114729

[eleny]

69. My personal antidote

Listening to Mike Webb talking about a full recount in Washington State - and calling Republicans cry babies and shit like that. Oh yeah, baby. Keep on truckin' TIA!

....Step by step....slowly we turned....

[RaulVB]

70. Don't you love the smell of victory?

TIA, something big is about happen.

Keep up the great work.

Take care.

[texpatriot2004]

72. I admire you TIA, thanks so much for this great thread. n/t

[Broken Acorn]

73. Keep up the good work TIA

You're conclusions regarding probability of B*sh's victory are evidence in itself that FRAUD was committed on a widescale.

[AnIndependentTexan]

74. something strange is going on

To many random post with nothing in it being made. Seems like something is going on with so many threads being CREATED. I'm not going to assume but if more threads keep popping up that are one liners then it just feels like someone is trying to push legit threads out. The overload of new threads are just making me suspect it. I may be wrong. I also won't assume anything about anyone just a feeling that can not shake though.

[intheflow]

79. I'd never thought of that, AnIndependentTexan.

I just figured the people posting the copycat threads were playing a forum version of tag or were just realy full of themselves. I did notice tonight that they weren't posting them in the Lounge but on the Election Results board. Thought maybe they were dumb newbies. Now you make me wonder....

Thanks for the food for thought.

[NVMojo]

87. Could it be to increase their numbers or to hog up space on the

server?

[lamp_shade]

93. kick..

[SmokingJacket]

103. Push the good threads off the front page. n/t

[George W. Hayduke]

76. CLINT CURTIS'S DOG FOUND DEAD?!

posted by bradblog at:

http://www.crooksandliars.com/

[MarkusQ]

109. You're mentioning this as an example of a troll, right? (n/t)

[Bill of Rights]

77. I was a troll for awhile, but not here

I was a troll on Dean's blog. I was there because he was doing better than my candidate in the weeks leading up to Iowa. I was freaking out, inside. I typed up posts that were factual, but disparaging to Dean. And I posted them on his blog. I wouldn't have bothered, if I wasn't fearful that a movement was developing, and that it wasn't to carry my guy to victory.

So, I understand the psychology of trolls .... having been one myself.

Actually, I think most of them are quite mild-mannered. They are disciplined.

Sorry, Deaniacs, for what I did. :spank:

[jamboi]

78. Have you reformed? n/t

[Bill of Rights]

101. I only did it for a couple of days

n.t.

[Andromeda]

80. Here, here TIA...

I was impressed with MathGuy too and I read that exchange on one of your threads.

Dang, we've got some smart people on DU!

[juajen]

81. This is a post of appreciation!

I'm not sure any of us would have gotten through this debacle without you, TIA. You're one smart cookie and I appreciate the many, many hours you spend attempting to educate math dummies like me. Sometimes I can't even understand all you say, but I do recognize a statistician when I see one.

My brother is a well-known mathematician who is now living in a nursing home with an incurable disease. I used to ask him questions; now, I can't. Thank you so much for being a very good substitute. I miss him daily. If he could, he would be analyzing this election to death. Thank you so much.

[TruthIsAll]

98. Thanks, but I'm NOT a statistician. But I have always solved math problems

in engineering, finance, investments, etc. as an analyst/software developer.

I do have several degrees in applied math.

But I am NOT a professional statistician.

[tommcintyre]

83. Not all are amateurs. Some are PAID to do this.

Although most are generally so bad at it, paying them any amount of money is too much. ;~}

Read here for more info:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=108750#114729

[PATRICK]

99. A big point why the established

leadership in many many institutions wants to ignore the cancer. Simply, ALL the fraud is being exposed right from the college students seeking a future in the GOP by doing rat work in voter intimidation to ambitious DINOs in charge of spoiled voting precincts. In the general crime organization mode of the GOP, as it intersects and infects our own party as well, the weeds have choked the life out of democracy and de-legitimized the GOP completely and the Democratic Party quite a bit(if only by silent collusion).

The fear of ruining the myth of America itself and them looking in the mirror and seeing the "enemy" is actually a wink and nod continuity of generations of unreformed scandals and an "imperfect" democracy they even bragged about.

Common criminals and uncommonly bad law and party leadership. The common people will come to see that and something hotter than cynicism and greater than despair will shake the roots. It's called truth. It once was thought to be America. The people want the crime syndicate OUT of public affairs and a way will be found that will not involve the suckers fighting among themselves or trusting patsies with feeble promises to soothe away their cares.

The great revelation to news people that they are NOT acting professionally except as conduits of official propaganda and titillating trivia would be making progress. The total discrediting of so called leaders who inhibit progress and sometimes cravenly follow the real heroes with no intention of anything other than exploiting defeat will come as a result of this attempted suppression. The grass will overcome the weeds.

What law? What protected vote? What system and chronolgy that strangles just challenges and democracy? What "news" that locks down vital American affairs? What party leadership that put their white nag back in the stable? It is all chaff. To pretend the fraud does not matter is to offer hundreds of million people to the whims of bloody tyrants and crooks.

[tommcintyre]

111. WELL WRITTEN!

"The great revelation to news people that they are NOT acting professionally except as conduits of official propaganda and titillating trivia would be making progress."

Viewing "Manufacturing Consent" should be required for all media people.

[jamboi]

94. Evidently!

[Roger_Otip]

95. some Republicans are accepting fraud now

here's what one said on the ABC news forum:

I just wish the democrats could find someone smart enough to figure out how to prevent election fraud. Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be anyone that intelligent within the democratic base? Too bad...

Four years they had to work out problems and still they couldn't keep the election from being stolen right from under their eyes. Worst yet, all the money spent on the thousands of lawyers and election monitors to no avail.

The republicans were just too smart...

Maybe if they spend enough, they call get some brilliant republicans to switch parties??

http://forums.go.com/abcnews/thread?threadID=103258

[txindy]

100. So, that character thinks theft is enviable? Telling, isn't it?

:eyes: We shouldn't fix the fraud, we should adopt their ways? Good Lord. That guy must've been having a Prozac moment when he wrote that. No one can be that stupid.... On second thought....

[Mandate My Ass]

105. erm, uhmm, the problem isn't lack of intelligence

It wasn't RW brilliance that allowed them to steal it, it was their unethical tactics and privatization of a public system that isn't overseen by any outside entity, isn't auditable, or subject to any form of government regulation.

Calling vote-counting software proprietary would be laughable if it weren't such a deliberately twisted subversion of the traditional safeguard that was established to honor voter intent. It has somehow become acceptable that the integrity of the vote is now of secondary importance, or more likely of no consequence, compared to shielding corporations from accountability. Meanwhile they strip us of the protections the founding fathers believed to be the basis of a free society, a thorough counting of the votes by the public, and electoral redress.

The horrific thing is we're paying these people to steal something more valuable than money from us, our voice.

Funny how it's the RW that always says if you have nothing to hide.....:mad:

[HEAVYHEART]

96. AMEN TO THAT!

And let's remember to ignore the bastards!!!! I know it's hard, I've been guilty of responding to them. But if we just try really really really hard to ignore freeper and troll posts and responses, they'll go away! I wish there was smiley on here with a middle finger so I use it to respond to the fuckers. No words, I would just give the motherfuckers a finger! Ok, not a good idea I know. Let's just ignore them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Quakerfriend]

97. Yes, Amen to you TIA

Love your posts. But, more than that your indomitable spirit!! :hi: You keep us all going!

[Peace Patriot]

104. Garbo...

"And if the fraud claims gain traction and wider attention, then I figure the smear campaign will roll out."

This IS going to happen--both parts of it. The fraud claims will get traction because the evidence has become overwhelming, but there is another reason--because Kerry voters want and need to know this. They know deep down in their hearts that Bush Inc. could not have won a fair election, but most don't have the facts, many not even a clue that their gut feeling is correct. And they deserve to know it--they who stood out in the freezing rain for 10 hours to vote, and those who got them out there, seeking redress, seeking expression of the will of the people.

I have such enormous admiration for what the people did that day--our collective citizenry--and such loathing for those who stole this huge victory for democracy away from them, from us.

It will come out! And the Karl Roves and the Swiftboat Liars will do their worst. But it won't matter, because the story is not for them or their supporters, it's for all those people--the majority--who voted for Kerry. They will understand it immediately. They are the same people who saw through all of Bush Inc.'s lies, and voted them out of office!

Those who have worked so hard, and done all this difficult analysis, and have hung in there, and provided forums and encouragement, you will be rewarded by the light in the eyes in those voters, and the great relief in their faces, when they realize they are not alone, that their instincts were correct, and that THEY are part of the marjority in a country that they will begin to recognize again as their own.

I have seen this light, and this relief. It's real. They know the truth already.

[BeHereNow]

108. You can make a list of "them" here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=122654&mesg_id=122654
14 and counting...
all of them joined within a week of one another
in November 2004, all of them chanting the same chant.
They move from thread to thread together.
Not very subtle of them.

bhn