Logic Question to those that think we can win in 2008 (or ever)

[ciaobox]

Looking at the maps, we can NEVER win without Ohio or Florida. The righ will continue to steal these two states for the rest of time.

In a fair fight (we being fair, them cheating) we always lose these. So what do we do? We will have to cheat as much as they do to make it a fair fight.

[7th_Sephiroth]

1. kill repubs in those states

i can wipe out all the repubs here in about a week

[Dems Will Win]

22. THE solution is in this thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x16099

[Eagle_Eye]

2. It is not cheating if everybody is playing by the same rules

We need to use every tactic they employ against them. The people are for what is right and good, and by the next election they will see bush for what he really is. Now have a drink and relax

[ciaobox]

3. Dude, your high

Bush cheated to get this election. Now you are saying that "the high road" will work the next time? We need to cheat to compete.

[Danger Duck]

8. He did not cheat

We lost. Quit blaming "cheating". We lost....time to fix the problem, not whine about it.

[texastoast]

19. Excusez-moi?

Voting machines with no paper trail suck. I have no doubt he earned a lot of his votes that way. Too easy to manipulate, and thereby, cheat.

[Fovea]

4. Moot point

There will not be a 2008 election, per se.

[Birthmark]

6. I'm not sure that there was an election this time, my friend.

We been had...again.

[ethereal]

21. Exactly.

The times they are-a changing. In fact, they changed in 2000 and we should have made BBV our main focus. Sadly, it was too horrifying to contemplate for most, and here we are.

[MallRat]

5. Better solution: WIN GOVERNORSHIPS IN OHIO & FLORIDA.

With a Democratic party machine running things in both states, they wouldn't dare fuck with the ballots.

-MR

[Nadeaufan17]

17. EXACTLY!!

We have to start small, take back state government first. Ohio is totaly Republican state government wise. Republican governor, 2 repuclian senators, a majority of our representatives, both of the general assembalys as well. 2006 is key. We have to take back the governorship since Taft has reached his term limit, and we have to take DeWine's senate seat.

[BillZBubb]

7. We are in a period like the early 20th century.

It's not just Florida and Ohio. States like Missouri, Virginia, and North Carolina shouldn't be Repug states either. But they are and will for the most part remain that way.

The public is naive (ignorant) and has fully bought into the corporatist propaganda. Americans have no historical memory. Before 1929, the industrialists and financiers were viewed as working for the benefit of society. Whatever they did was good for all. They were viewed as demigods and public servants.

Then the reality of the depression changed all that. Energetic government was seen as needed to make sure the haves weren't screwing everyone else. Sadly, after decades of New Deal/Liberal based prosperity, people are back to the corporatist faith.

Something very big and very bad will have to happen to make people realize they are being had. That is the only way we'll see a fundamental shift without changing ourselves into what we currently despise.

[Roland72]

9. Support a Moral Third Party

Court empty seats will cause a fatal crack in their support...

[byronm]

10. Ground UP!!! GROUND UPPPPP

We need to go district by district, county by county, city by city and state by state.

We need to convert middle america to be thinkers, we need to educate, we need to inform and we need to prove ourselves.

[union_maid]

13. Absolutely

And issue by issue. Bread and butter, pocketbook issues.

[SCDem]

14. But I speak for myself and my precinct and my county

we did that this year we had one of the most mobilized grassroots efforts..... but in South Cacalacky and a lot of other states we are fighting against God reincarnated.... they could care less about the Issues that affect them.... they think they are voting for God.... How do you suppose we convert them?

[LuminousX]

23. You are correct... Mission America - go out and educate the voters

[arwalden]

11. When The Game Is Rigged... Stop Playing The Game

The game is rigged.

[RememberTheCoup]

12. Patrick Henry

"They tell us, sir, that we are weak; unable to cope with so formidable an adversary. But when shall we be stronger? Will it be the next week, or the next year? Will it be when we are totally disarmed, and when a British guard shall be stationed in every house? Shall we gather strength by irresolution and inaction? Shall we acquire the means of effectual resistance by lying supinely on our backs and hugging the delusive phantom of hope, until our enemies shall have bound us hand and foot? Sir, we are not weak if we make a proper use of those means which the God of nature hath placed in our power. The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us."

[BOHICA06]

15. Here is what needs to be done

What went wrong, or how to counter the Solid South, West and Mid-West:

Embrace the Culture of Life with a twist: – campaign to make abortion rare, but safe and available. Develop plans for adoption programs and homes and combine them with better access to family planning. When in power, carry through with these plans, but work even harder to expand the availability and safety of the abortion option.

Do not espouse that all nations are equal: It isn’t true – and our candidate ought to scoff at the UN when it does stupid things, like make Syria chair of the Human Rights Council or takes bribes like in the “Oil for Food” program. Say we will promote nations that embrace democracy and freedom, and work to bring the same to others. Recognize that we are the only country that can project power and that those that can’t are not our equals.

Promote a vision with plan: Develop specific plans for energy independence, environmental protection, and economic growth and share them freely. When criticized, invite the critic to work on modifications to better the plan. Learn these plans and package them to look inviting and practical.

Go working class: Avoid the elitist leisure look – skiing & sail boarding for example. Appear hardworking and competent at a Habitat site or clearing a National Park trail. Give the impression that you drink beer from a bottle and can fumble your way through an explanation of the infield-fly rule.

Go to church: Establish several years of regular church attendance and church activity. Do it in a manner that the congregation can speak well of you.

[carolinalady]

16. Who's the best southern candidate we got? That is who to run.

[Nadeaufan17]

18. Clark n/t

n/t

[Mountainman]

20. The right will defeat itself. I don't know when but it will happen

If there is nothing we can do and we want them to lose, logic says they have to defeat themselves if losing is to be the outcome.

Always the pendulum swings back the other way. Also the things that are coming because of this election are not good for the majority of the voters. At some point there will be an uprising and a vote to throw the bums out. I don't know when that will be. I hope we don't become a dictatorship before that.