Bev Harris Shot Herself in the Foot...

[Triana]

...I'm sorry but she has. I agree w/ her cause but, she's lost all credibility with me.

I agree there's a lot of discrimination against women still out there (I KNOW DAMN WELL there is) but for her to use this as any excuse for her behaviour - well - it just doesn't wash. She did that to herself.

I'm really sorry she has had to become a bruise upon the fruit of the cause but that is what she has become.

Sorry....

(edit to correct spelling)

[LoZoccolo]

1. Did she do anything new?

As in, the past two days?

[Wabbajack]

2. What did she do?

[grumpy old fart]

yep

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x161885

[Triana]

4. and...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=161632&mesg_id=161632

[IAMREALITY]

3. I thought she couldn't even see her feet? n/t

[fishnfla]

5. which is worse

betrayal of a friendship or betrayal of a country?

[cali]

16. Odd that you ask that

"I hate the idea of causes, and if I had to choose between betraying my country and betraying my friend, I hope I should have the guts to betray my country." E.M. Forester

BTW, Forester worked tirelessly against fascism, and wrote brilliantly about such matters.

[hlthe2b]

6. Both Men and Women can be guilty of letting their emotional response

guide (misguide) their actions. This is what I see here and it is not gender discrimination at its core.

Do I doubt Bev has experienced gender discrimination in the past and is (understandably)sensitive to the issue? No. But, unfortunately she has caused so many of her own problems now by being unable to get past her own perceived grievances and inablity to trust anyone.

I see this in her very clearly because I've fought the same kind of response and mistakes in the past, myself. It is no less painful watching someone else commit these mistakes, particularly one involved in such an important cause. Especially distressing is not being able to help her-- or the situation from playing out in a very negative way.

[jamboi]

17. Well put. n/t

[Kralizec]

7. Please follow this link to my opinion of this matter.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=161632&mesg_id=161715

[mistertrickster]

8. If there is evidence that Democrats have benefitted from fraud or

irregularities, we should be receptive to that. We don't want to win that way.

It seems like all the evidence is on the Republican shenanigans, particularly since a computer programmer testified under oath that he was approached to write a vote tweaking program according to recent blogs.

But if our side is doing it, we should be on it and attacking it the same as any other vote fraud.

********

Just like the electoral college--the Republicans ALMOST got screwed by the EV this time. If Ohio had gone for Kerry (only 100,000 votes), he would have won the presidency and lost the popular vote by over 2 million votes.

You're either against the EV and vote fraud because it's wrong, or you're against it because it hurts your side.

I'm against them because they're wrong.

[Kralizec]

9. I completely agree. This isn't about winning or losing. I have

been so pissed at the Democrats as well this year! Now, that anger is nothing compared to the anget I have towards the men who have illegally taken control of our country, but nonetheless, my opinion is that the entire political system in this country needs to be reformed. If there's evidence that the Dems cheated as well, the let them stand trial as well.

[jamboi]

18. Amen! n/t

[smartvoter]

21. Absolutely. n/t

[grasswire]

10. STOP IT

Geez.

How many threads must there be discussing this matter??

STOP IT NOW.

This is ridiculous. The mods should stop it if people can't restrain themselves.

[LoZoccolo]

12. Board nannay!

Nannay nannay nannay nannay!

Woooooooo hoooooooo!

Nannay nannay nannay nannay!

[grasswire]

14. grow up, son

eom

[LoZoccolo]

15. "Sit down, my son."

"We don't read most of the bills."

Meanwhile...

STOP IT! STOP IT! STOP IT! STOP IT!

:grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr:

STOP IT RIGHT NOW! STOP IT! STOP IT! STOP IT! STOP IT!

[hlthe2b]

19. Genie is out of the bottle and very difficult to stuff back in...

I'm afraid....

[info being]

11. I called her out from the first post on DU

Sad to say I was right about that PR wh*re.

[progressiveboston]

13. How BBV can come back

As someone who donated $100 of my hard earned money to her cause. I have been dismayed with her lack of communication about how the money is being spent. I am further dismayed by her actions towards Olberman and now Randi Rhodes.

I would suggest Bev use some of the money she raised from a large majority of us and hire a secretary who can help her organize her media appearances and communications and help her while she focuses on her mission. She's trying to do it all and she obviously can't (could any of us?)

The argument that they would jeopardize future investigations by communicating with us is nonsense. BBV should be communicating every activity with as much specificity as to not jeopardize investigations and show us that our money is going to a good place.

OK steps off soap box

[insane_cratic_gal]

20. Bev's choice

"She's trying to do it all and she obviously can't (could any of us?)"

It's her choice to go it alone. She has staff, but she's a control nazi, unable to let go of her own ego for the sake of the greater good.

[jamboi]

23. Lets hope that between her and her board she can pull it together. n/t

[jamboi]

22. Excellent post! n/t

[grasswire]

24. don't you think...

...that your money already did some good?

Geez. The woman is the very reason that we know about the trouble with electronic voting and Diebold. Your money supported the exposure of that information. A good portion of America now worries that votes aren't properly counted now. How much is that worth to you? Millions? I say it's priceless.

I disagree with tactics on both sides. But this public bloodletting is harming America.

[Stephanie]

But in fact, grasswire you and I knew about it long before we heard of Bev

I am sick of the bashing too but don't give Bev more credit than she's due. This issue was going to come out regardless, and Bev was not the only, nor was she the first, one on it. You remember when we first started discussions of this and it was way before we knew Bev.

[grasswire]

26. yes...

...but we didn't have the PR mechanisms and expensive lists of media contacts and expertise that Bev did have. And we didn't develop the Diebold information. All I knew previously was what I read in the book "Votescam" -- everything after that came through Bev's work.

[Stephanie]

27. Well then I guess you missed all my posts on this at TAP & TAPA

stories that did not come from Bev. Very early on.

[Triana]

25. I agree...

...the money went to a good cause and the cause is definitely a good one. Bev has done a great (HUGE) service with all her work. It just saddens me to see all the infighting with her and Rhodes and Olbermann, and to see her mismanaging her public appearances the way she is.

Someone else mentioned that maybe should get a PR/media person to help her manage her appearances, etc. Probably a good idea.

And, no matter how blatant sex discrimination may be at times - discrimination isn't the problem in every circumstance. Once it happens to a person, (s)he gets uber-sensitive to it and everything looks like it - even when it isn't. It's sad to see someone like Bev have that sort of raw nerve endings on display, though I've been guilty of it myself. That's how and why I understand it.

The best way to describe how I feel about Bev is with a sigh and a rather sad frown. I've got no bad feelings towards her - mostly sad ones. Her work and what she's done is - without question - priceless.