The Nashua Advocate: G.O.P. Election Reform Bills Drop Like Bombs on U.S.

[nashuaadvocate]

Find the new article here.

The News Editor
The Nashua Advocate

[Pam-Moby]

1. They are scared!!

The repugs know that if the ability to vote was free of suppression and easier to accomplish without problems that they would be signing them selves out of ever being the majority again. Statistically it is known that more citizens are democratic leaning than repug!!!

[Stand and Fight]

2. Link please...

I've never come across anything that suggests that "more citizens are democratic leaning than repug"... Please provide a link for that bit of information. I've never read that anywhere -- that people are moderates, yes. But "statistically democratic leaning," no.

[fasttense]

4. Read these

See:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

http://uscountvotes.org/ucvAnalysis/US/USCountVotes_Re_...

[Wilms]

3. Hang on.

Dodd's upcoming Bill is rumored to have flaws related to the enshrinement of DRE's. Some feel that's very bad.

Massive DU Discusion:

<http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x306505>

On the Repub side:

John Ensign of Nevada has introduced S2437, the Voting Integrity and Verification Act of 2004, which requires a voter-verified paper audit trail.

A comparison of some of the Bills floating around.

<http://www.verifiedvoting.org/article.php?id=5074>


The King Bill:

H. R. 278
King (R-IO)

<http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c109:H.R.278:>


Rumored to be re-introduced:

H. R. 2239
HOLT (D-NJ)

<http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c108:H.2239:>

I'm having a tough time sorting all this out, in part because all the Bills are not yet available.

Can you have a crack at it?

[EFerrari]

5. Spreading Democracy

in Iraq has left us a little light at home.

I keep having this terrible analogy urge: If American democracy is like peanut butter, is it Jif, Skippy or Peter Pan?

[L. Coyote]

6. Article compares Dems and Repug proposals == Here's a snip

Election Reform Sweeps the Nation, Supported By Democrats and Republicans Alike -- Albeit Disingenuously, and Even Deceptively, By the Latter

"The Advocate offers its readership this whirlwind tour of election reform developments the nation over, paying particular attention to the egregious lack of integrity evidenced in the Republican-sponsored bills cited herein, as compared to the pragmatic and positivist approach favored by the more progressive-minded, Democratic bills."

[bush_is_wacko]

7. Question? Why the hell do all these bills STILL not address

the need to remove Diebold Sequoia, ES&S, and opti-scan COMPUTERS from the voting process? That should be the NUMBER ONE reform! Are Democrats really this stupid?

There are alternatives to computers that don't involve hand counting, which, quite frankly, is an IMPOSSIBILITY in a country this size. Mechanical money counting machines can be easily calibrated and easily checked before, during, and after the counting process. It would be quite easy to find volunteers of all party affiliation (my recommendation is one representative from each party to periodically check the machines.)

[msongs]

8. yes, really this stupid..............................................

same reason kerry abandoned ship without a fight, throwing the wimmen and children overboard so he could get in first.

Msongs
www.msongs.com/political-shirts.htm

PS - repubs have no scruples or morals so they do what has to be done to win at any cost.

[bush_is_wacko]

9. No flame war here...just a simple comment...

Eating your own is cannibalism and leads to extinction! Get over yourself!:wtf:

[starmaker]

10. all bills seem to deal with voting

101 ways to disinfranchise and make life difficult
make recounts more difficult if not impossible
all the talk is about voter fraud and disenfranchisement
is a diversion so no one talks about the vote count
and the massive problem with letting corporations
with secret codes count our votes
it's the vote count stupid and all this help america vote axis
does nothing to insure accuracy in the vote count
why can't we count?

[Wilms]

11. I kind of agree.

There's quite a bit of hashing these issues on the DU Threads I posted above.

One argument says take what we can get now, as long as it's not a set-back, then fight for the rest later.

Another idea is to fight for exactly what we want now.

I'm wondering about the possibilities for bi-partisan activity and modifications of the Bills as they're debated in Congress.

[nashuaadvocate]

12. I say "take now -- and then take later, too." We must make progress. n/t

[Wilms]

13. How about double-dipping now.

Pressure Ensign to upgrade his legislation.

And/or, get Dodd to craft the Bill he introduces so as to supplement Ensign's with what we want.

[Bill Bored]

15. I vote for the second choice.

Ensign's bill is fine as far as it goes and it may actually pass.

Another reason to leave it alone is this:

ANYONE WHO OPPOSES IT CAN AUTOMATICALLY BE BRANDED AN ENEMY OF DEMOCRACY. This is because it's so pure and simple that no one with any integrity from either party could find any excuse to vote against it.

With the more complex, multifaceted legislation like Dodd's, someone will always find something they don't like about it and vote against it, like Kerry with the $87-Billion for Iraq.

If the legislation is kept simple, it's easier to pass and the opponents are much easier to ridicule and hold accountable. Both can work to our advantage.

Meanwhile, sure, go blast Dodd, et al to make their bill even better!

[Bill Bored]

14. Yo Advocate! What about Senator Ensign's bill?

What about Senator Ensign's (R-NV) bill, which will be co-sponsored by Harry Raid (D-NV) known as VIVA 2005, discussed and debated at length on this very forum?

This one requires a VVPB immediately for all HAVA-funded e-voting machines. Why did you omit it? I hope it's just because it hasn't been formally introduced to the 109th Congress yet.

[Bill Bored]

16. URGENT ACTION ALERT

Please urge Senators to SUPPORT THIS BILL!
Voter Verified Paper Ballots, VIVA 2005

<http://www.ballotintegrity.org/action.html>