Travel to Mars in Three Hours

[n2doc]

Physicists are working on technology that could one day have us traveling in hyperspace.

By Gene Charleton | Thu Jan 21, 2010 04:04 AM ET

We’re going to step into the middle of a nifty science and engineering controversy. Today. On Engineering Works! Listen to the podcast.

If you’ve ever taken a physics course, you know that nothing can go faster than the speed of light, 186,000 miles a second. Seven-hundred-million miles an hour. Everything physicists know says you can’t go faster. But some physicists and engineers think they can do an end run around the speed-of-light limit.

They say that ideas developed about 50 years ago by a German scientist named Burkhard Heim suggest that we could use a very strong magnetic field to push spacecraft into another dimension. A dimension where the physical laws that make the speed of light as fast as anything can go don’t exist.

The idea sounds like science fiction. And a lot of top physicists say that’s all it is. But if it’s real, it could mean traveling to Mars in three hours or to a nearby star in three months. The interesting part is that the Department of Energy has a device -- the Z-machine -- that could produce the kind of ultra-powerful magnetic field we’d need to see if the idea might work. If it does, researchers could be testing a working engine in five years.
more
http://news.discovery.com/tech/travel-mars-three-hours.html

Pandora, here I come!

[DeSwiss]

1. How about 39 days to Mars!?!?!

- With a new type of http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdZ-idbRz_8&feature=player_embedded">plasma rocket.

http://www.physorg.com/news174031552.html">Plasma Rocket Could Travel to Mars in 39 Days

[postulater]

2. I travelled to Mars in about 30 minutes once back in the 70s

Dead concert.

[ixion]

5. rofl

yeah, I remember that show. :woohoo: :applause: :woohoo: :smoke: :smoke: :woohoo: :applause:

[leveymg]

6. I don't really remember it clearly, but I "know" I was there. Further . . .

[qazplm]

3. seems to me

it's pretty hard to know what OTHER physical constants would change in said higher dimension.

What if the ship goes into that higher dimension, and then promptly disintegrates because of a change in the weak or strong force, or EM force?
It is highly unlikely that only the speed of light would change but nothing else.

[thereismore]

4. Garbage journalism. If If If.. No! nt

[Lint Head]

7. Extraterrestrials may already know this and that is why there are

sightings of UFOs. Just saying.

[pokerfan]

10. Well, it does make one rethink Fermi's paradox

It's one thing to imagine an advanced civilization populating an entire galaxy in just a few hundred thousand years without necessarily exceeding c, given the nature of exponential growth. But if FTL is possible, then this quickly extends to the entire universe, a universe which contains more galaxies than there are stars in the Milky Way.

So.. where is everybody? Oh right, they're already here, experimenting on cattle and buzzing corn fields.

[Occulus]

8. Ah, Heim theory

There were some experiments being done on this a couple years back. The problem is, you'd need a magnet generating a field of 20 Teslas or more in order to slip into the higher dimensions posited by the theory.

Basically, it's an end-run around the speed of light.

[pokerfan]

11. So you're telling me

it's just an engineering problem. :)

[Occulus]

14. Heh. IF Heim was right.

I don't know; There are several problems with Heim Theory that are not related to the theory itself.

THIS IS THE HEIM THEORY WIKI PAGE

THIS IS THE BURKHARD HEIM WIKI PAGE

For one thing, Burkhard Heim was, from the age of nineteen, mostly blind and deaf, as well as handless from an accident in a chemical laboratory. He developed his theory in almost total isolation, and in its original form it's entirely in German. Additionally, Heim apparently had to invent his own form of mathematical notation and his equations are presented as part of the body of the text (and not, from what I've been told, as is done today, in a separate appendix), and in some cases the equations are merely described in the text and not actually written. I'm no kind of mathematician; his equations make my head spin, and really, I don't want to know what that 'mess of Greek' means.

I do understand, however, that it's an absolute nightmare for any translator. If Heim's theory is in some way correct (and there is evidence that parts of it in fact are correct), it could- eventually- lead to field propulsion and FTL travel, but I haven't heard that experiments designed to test the theory have borne any fruit. As the article itself states, most physicists believe there's no "there" there, but it's still nice (and perhaps actually vital) to continue to ask how field propulsion and FTL travel might be eventually accomplished. Perhaps Heim Theory is part of that.

Personally, I believe such will only become possible at incredibly high energies of some sort (electromagnetic, gravity maybe) and only then incorporating exotic materials (which is consistent with this theory). Incidentally, I recently posted a thread on a discovery that may lead to creation of materials with the exotic properties of very heavy elements, if the procedure can be shown to affect the periodic table as a whole, or in large parts.

Maybe that's part of it, too.

[Phoonzang]

9. Assuming for a second you could push a spacecraft into another dimension...

How do you then guide the spaceship to it's destination in this dimension then return? Seems like anything you push into another dimension would stay there.

[Ter]

13. Yep

How do you stop, steer, guide, and land at speeds so fast?

[Occulus]

15. The idea as I understand it is that you have to maintain the energy required

As soon as the 'engine', if you will, is turned off or set back to 'normal' field propulsion (yeah, that's part of the theory too), you slip back into 'normal' space.

According to the theory, a gratuitously enormous EM field is required; you need a magnet capable of generating a field between 20T and 40T. We can't do that yet.

You wouldn't be able to steer, either. Your destination calculation would be a function of the magnet, the energy you're putting into the system, direction, and duration. In other words, you 'fire' it for this long, going in this direction, at this energy, and you precalculate all of that. Then you say 'bing' and you go.

You better be right or you'll be lightyears off course.

edit: You can use the magnet at lower energies for interplanetary travel, using the same principles. The effect would be 'forward only'; at some point in the trip, you would flip the ship (literally) and start slowing down. However, during travel in 'normal' space, you would consistently (except for the flip) be experiencing a force of 1g under your feet. We wouldn't need to simulate gravity using such a system. To answer how that would work, you need to ask how you would experience a consistent force of 1g against you feet if you're already in microgravity. Heim Theory supposedly answers that question.

I don't really think this theory has a whole lot of validity, but it's definitely fun to speculate on. Truthfully, these are ideas we really ought to devote time to. there has to be an end-run around the light barrier. We just need to find it.

[Phoonzang]

22. Just for kicks, how much energy would would it t ake to generate a field of 20T and 40T?

Is it conceivable possible within the near future or is it one of those things that requires "more energy than is available in the entire galaxy"?

[Occulus]

23. It would take an onboard fusion or antimatter reactor

and I don't believe we can currently construct the magnetic coils necessary in the first place. There's also the pesky issue of not knowing whether it actually works as advertised, but I never allow that to stop me from engaging in a good bout of pure speculation :silly:

As a science fiction device, though, a Heim engine could be very useful.

[Phoonzang]

24. Indeed. It's an excellent sci-fi story device.

But who knows....one day... :)

[tinrobot]

12. Here's a more complete article on Heim theory

Very interesting concepts, but he was so reclusive, he never got peer review.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg18925331.200-take-a-leap-into-hyperspace.html?page=1

[Occulus]

16. Here's a very, very long discussion thread on this theory

this

I've read this particular thread. It's a long discussion with some actual information. You'll want to view pages from the two years or so.

[struggle4progress]

17. Good physicists have drawers full of untested theories, almost all of which will be wrong

[atomic-fly]

18. it takes crazy ideas to realize new frontiers...

go for it guys!

[pokerfan]

19. The acid test is whether or not they reflect reality

Otherwise it's just metaphysics.

[krispos42]

20. Farthest distance from Earth to Mars is about 375 million kilometers

375,000,000km ÷ 300,000km/s = 1,250 seconds = just under 21 minutes at light-speed.


And they say in 3 hours at a faster-than-light pace? Maybe this dimension has a speed of light LOWER than ours! :rofl:

[Orrex]

21. I can get to Mars in about 40 minutes

Zip down I-79 and then hang a right. Zoom!