Hey my A&A peeps- I'm thinking about joining a UU church. Give me some feedback.

[EvolveOrConvolve]

I've read up on my local UU congregation, and it fits me pretty well (other than the required annual "monetary pledge" form that is required of all members). They accept atheists and agnostics, and put an emphasis on humanism and science. I see some borderline woo-woo stuff, but I can live with that.

Has anyone attended a UU church now or in the past? What can you tell me about your experience - is it a worthwhile community to be involved in? Would I get anything out of it?

[immoderate]

1. I have some experience, but I'm sure it's not typical.

When I joined my atheist meetup, Florida Atheists and Secular Humanists (FLASH) a guy there announced he would not be coming to meetups anymore. Instead he was going to the UU church to meet with the Pagans, because they had more available women. This conforms to my observation. Atheist groups have relatively few females and Pagan groups are quite the opposite.

Now I have for several years been participating in a weekly drum circle, which is organized by a woman who is a Wiccan high priestess at the same UU church. She describes herself as a Pagan atheist. OK with me, since I am a Jewish atheist. The drum circles are purely secular, and the only agenda is drumming, and making intricate polyrhythms, except for a minute at the beginning of each session where we play "traditional" rhythms, which recognize the four elements, air, earth, fire and water. Now, she also puts together drum groups for the Pagan rituals, which generally celebrate natural phenomena like phases of the moon, solstice, and equinox, and any drummer is invited to participate, so I go. It's kind of fun to drum while women dressed as fairies and other forest deities dance around the bonfire. And they serve mead. (There is one guy there who always seems to have an axe and a sword with him, and looks a bit scary, but has been pretty nice. He did get pissed at me once for tossing a cigarette butt into the "sacred ritual fire" before he was going to grill a steak on it. LOL)

The church has banners for several religions on the wall. I have not been to the regular Sunday service, but it seems the Pagan group is the most active here. I know there are lots of atheist or non-theists there. Some people just like rituals and ceremonies. Some are looking for a connection and support from a community. These are generally very nice people and very accommodating. I do know one person, a creationist, who claims that the UUs rejected him because he believed in the divinity of Christ, and they did not allow that. I doubt that happened, but knowing this guy, a "persecuted" Christian, I'm not surprised he thinks that. The UUs just laughed when I asked about it. BTW, I know this person from the local Socrates Cafe, a discussion forum held at the Presbyterian Church. I go there because the food is good.

Tonight there is a drum circle for the last quarter moon. We'll sit around the fire and play drums. People will wander off occasionally into the woods to smoke some weed. No gods, no religion, how much better can it get?

Note: I can't say that my experience, or this UU Church is typical in any way.

--imm

[EvolveOrConvolve]

2. Thanks for the response!

My local UU group is led by someone with a "spiritual christian" background, and she writes a column for the local newspaper that is pretty good (although ventures too much sometimes into "christian" concepts, or at least the ones that I would consider okay because of their liberal bent).

I'm looking more for a community experience. A place where I can hook up with people to do volunteer work and other things outside of a political atmosphere. I attended an Episcopal church a long time ago that accepted me as an atheist, and I loved it because we'd drink coffee and shoot the breeze for an hour on Sunday. After that came the Eucharist (which they allowed me to participate in even though I'm a godless heathen), a 15 minute sermon, and we adjourned to drink beer and watch football or go fishing or picnic at the park. It was a cool experience, but that congregation is in another state, and from what I've heard has been taken over by stricter elements.

Thanks for you insights! If I was in Florida, I would definitely check out the drum circles - they sound relaxing and fun.

[immoderate]

8. Google drum circles in your area.

Then go check it out. Most are like hippie meetups -- they'll make you welcome. Let me know how you do.

--imm

[realisticphish]

3. i only have one big problem

This isn't so much for you, or even your church in particular. I just dislike the attitude I see often: Those stupid Christians, and their nonsense. Now, I'm going to get out my healing crystals and cast spells...

To me, "pagan atheist" is a complete oxymoron.

But it's all semantics, so whatever, as long as you enjoy yourself :shrug:

[EvolveOrConvolve]

4. I'll probably get that to a certain extent at any UU congregation

Whether it's the "naturalists" or whatever, there's probably a certain amount of that in any of the UU groups. The attractive thing about my local group is their focus on science and to a lesser degree, rationalism. I like that.

[realisticphish]

5. right

I mean, that's the whole POINT of a UU church; getting perspectives from other faiths

[Manifestor_of_Light]

6. I had a bunch of pagans get mad at me. They were a meetup group.

The head of it admitted he did not have the money to pay Meetup to keep it going. So I stepped up and paid for the meetup fee. Then they all got mad for taking it over to save it, when nobody else woulld do it. THEN they got mad at me because I said I was an atheist and then sent them an email with "Namaste" at the end which means "I salute the Divine Force within you". One of em sent me a nasty email getting insulted at my wishing them well, and then two more people in the group copied the same sentiment to me.

Would they have liked it better had I said, "Sorry you're a meaningless, transient, mortal, illusory meatsack"????

:shrug:

A lot of pagans seem to be not able to deal with atheists.

Dear OP: Check out a UU church. I've been a UU for many years. I consider myself a secular humanist who reads a lot of Buddhism.

But there is no UU group within driving distance for me since I live in Shitholia.

UU churches vary all over the place. Some have lots of pagans, some have few.

They are all different.

www.uua.org

[EvolveOrConvolve]

15. Thanks for the suggestion!

I think I'm going to check out the local UU group and see how it goes.

[immoderate]

7. I run into that.

Hold on now, it's not really my church. I'll play my conga and eat the food. That's as far as it goes. Also share a bowl. :smoke:

There is plenty of woo there. I ignore it. When people spout theories at me about the "quantum flux" I usually ask them a straight science question which they invariably don't know the answers to. That pushes them back a bit.

As a Jewish atheist, I'm acknowledging a cultural, actually tribal, identity. Most of the Jews I know are atheists. Some rabbis I know are atheists. I'm guessing that also applies to some who identify as Catholics. The woman who calls herself "pagan atheist" seems to be pretty much that. I think she likes leading the drummers. She gets to smack a huge gong! We've been pretty good friends for a few years and she's never brought up any woo with me. I think many pagans take the whole thing rather lightly, like theater. (I see Satanists that way.) This last equinox was done with an Alice in Wonderland theme. And then there are people "dancing" around the fire. Alcohol (and drugs) are OK. What could be bad? :shrug:

Our regular drum circles are only about drumming. Except for announcements, there's rarely any talking. The big quarterly drum circles are like festivals. Jugglers, fire spinners and belly dancers show up in droves. I usually avoid the big ones. Hard to make good music.

--imm

[realisticphish]

9. the cultural thing is totally understandable

the same thing would, i imagine, hold with a native american, for example. Even if one didn't believe in the ceremonies, etc, there's a deep cultural connection to them, especially for a subjugated culture

[immoderate]

10. I hesitate to generalize, but...

Pagans are people who want that culture and identity, but don't relate to the standard religions. I can see that need. One of the things that's difficult for atheists is associating with a community, especially if there is a family. Churches provide those social and support services -- it's part of their marketing plan.

Our atheists group has some long range plans to provide some of those services. We'd like to acquire a building. The first floor would be a pub. :D So much potential there. LOL. Some of our members are secular celebrants. They can legally perform most civil ceremonies that clergy or magistrates usually do.

We also can perform a de-baptism. Hint: It's done with a hair dryer. :)

--imm

[realisticphish]

11. i can buy that

that is what's nice about UU churches. They provide the same social structure as a church, but sans nonsense.

And I like the idea of a first floor pub at the atheist building. Now THERE'S a holy sacrement :)

[Iggo]

13. Hair-dryer.

That's beautiful, man.

[iris27]

21. LOL at the hair dryer

de-baptism!

[Iggo]

12. Are you doin' it to meet chicks?

'Cause that's cool.

[EvolveOrConvolve]

14. LOL, no - I'm married

It's more about being part of a community and meeting like-minded people. A lot of that atheists where I live are the hard-core big L libertarian types, I don't usually get along well with them.

[Iggo]

16. Believe it or not, I think I understand.

I'm an atheist and an ex-drug addict. I quit everything, including alcohol, a little over 13 years ago. It probably saved my life, and it definitely rescued what was left of my potential. But the sad fact is, over the years I lost that sense of community. Last year I seriously considered starting drinking again so that I could go to bars and socialize the only legal way I know how. (I came to my senses, but still...).

So yeah. I get that "searching for a sense of community" thing. Good luck with that, for reals. :)

[omega minimo]

17. This is amazing

Given this discussion and others where the atheists/skeptics let their hair down and are honest with each other, about their lives/experiences/interests, so many ideas are expressed that beg the question: why oppose that sort of community and commingling of (non) belief systems on DU?

[EvolveOrConvolve]

20. You weren't invited into this discussion

I know what your views are, and I consider them particularly noxious. I've made that clear on more than one occasion. I don't really like you, and that's alright - I don't need to like you or gain your approval to consider myself worthwhile.

However, coming into a forum that I consider my sanctuary and posting more of your sanctimonious shit crosses the line. And I didn't alert on it because I want other posters to see your subtle methods of attack.

[Goblinmonger]

22. Get Out of Here.

Seriously. How many people would give give birth to a cow if any atheist went into a religion group and started up with our thoughts on the discussion in the manner you did?

We gave our star. We have a group. Now leave us alone. Is that so much to ask.

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Deep13]

18. For what purpose? Why are you considering it? nt

[EvolveOrConvolve]

19. To be a part of a community

An organization that does good things and I can feel good being a part of. It's the only thing I really miss about religion.

I'd love to do some volunteering - work in a soup kitchen, clean up a park, etc. without having all the baggage of dogma and the other bullshit you find in most religions.

And really, I want a place where my atheism is okay and not merely accepted.

[elleng]

24. My best friend has been such since '65,

and it sounds like just the right thing for you, considering your interests.