conference.
He spoke out:
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0707/12/sitroom.02.htmlBLITZER: Democrats are lashing out at the White House report card on Iraq, saying President Bush is reading it through rose colored glasses. Some are calling him delusional.
Joining us now from Capitol Hill, Democratic Congressman John Murtha of Pennsylvania. He's one of the early voices calling for a troop pull back in Iraq.
Congressman, thanks very much for coming in.
REP. JOHN MURTHA (D), PENNSYLVANIA: Nice to be with you, Wolf.
BLITZER: I'm going to play a little excerpt of what the president said earlier today and get your reaction.
Listen to him.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I don't think Congress ought to be running the war. I think they ought to be funding our troops. I'm certainly interested in their opinion, but trying to run a war through resolution is a -- is prescription for failure, as far as I'm concerned, and we can't afford to fail.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: All right, what do you say to the president?
MURTHA: Well, it's delusional, to say the least. As I said earlier, and you heard me say, it's a failed policy wrapped in illusion. Nothing has gotten better. Incidents have increased. We've had more Americans killed in the last four months than any other period during the war. More Iraqis have been killed. Incidents are up. Unemployment is still 40 percent to 60 percent. Oil production is below prewar level. And this -- this rhetoric about the constitution and the changes -- they say, well, they're making changes. There's no changes that have been made. They haven't done the thing that's necessary in order to satisfy the Sunnis.
So our troops are caught in a civil war. As I've said over and over again, It can't be won militarily. There can only be a diplomatic effort. And I think this surge is a perfect example where we aren't making any progress and we've got to start to redeploy the troops as quickly as possible (INAUDIBLE).
BLITZER: But he says Congress should not be running the war -- that's a responsibility for the military commanders out in the field, as well as the commander-in-chief. You're stepping on his turf.
MURTHA: Well, the constitution is very clear. It says we'll provide for the Army and the Navy and, of course, when the constitution didn't have any other forces. But the constitution is very clear -- we're the people that decide whether we go to war. We're the people that decide whether the war should be funded.
Now, when they keep making mistakes, as they have made, we have to intercede. The public spoke in the last election and it said very clearly -- we want these troops redeployed. Congress has agreed with that, basically. But it's a matter of getting a resolution through to convince the White House.
Now, I see more and more people coming around. I'm more optimistic than I've ever been that we're going to start redeployment before long. The problem we've had, Wolf, and the thing that's happened that's so -- hurting the troops so badly is they extend these people and break all of the rules and guidelines they have because they haven't been able to raise the number of forces that they have.
So we're looking at a poorly managed war, a war -- we went to war unnecessarily.
BLITZER: All right --
MURTHA: We didn't have weapons of mass destruction. We no Al Qaeda connection. And now they're saying things -- that things are going better. There's no way you can measure things going better.
BLITZER: On a couple of the points, they say things are moving in the right direction. It says the government of Iraq has made satisfactory progress toward providing three trained and ready Iraqi brigades to support Baghdad operations. And then it says the government of Iraq has made satisfactory progress in ensuring the Baghdad security plan does not provide a save haven for the outlaws, regardless of their sectarian and political affiliations.
Do you acknowledge that some progress over the past several months has been made?
MURTHA: I don't acknowledge there's been any progress made. Maybe in Baghdad. But it just breaks out someplace else. We called for extra troops two years ago. We put money in for 30,000 troops. They haven't been able to raise the 30,000 troops they have. So they have to break all their guidelines. But there's no progress being made. And the way you measure it is, is the security itself.
Are the incidents decreased?
No.
Have the civilian deaths gone down?
No.
Have the American deaths increased?
Yes.
That's the way you measure whether we're making progress. We need a diplomatic effort rather than a military effort. The chief of the Joint Chiefs said we can't win this militarily. The secretary of defense said it before our subcommittee, you can't win it militarily. I've been saying it for two years.
The only answer is to let the Iraqis handle this themselves. They have to step up. We can't intercede every time they fail.
BLITZER: Well, the president says if you do that, if the U.S. were to simply withdraw, as bad as the situation is now, it would be a whole lot worse, not only for the Iraqis, but for the entire region. And he also raises the specter of Al Qaeda having a base there from which to attack America.
MURTHA: Well, first of all, let me say there's more Al Qaeda because we're in Iraq. That's the incentive for the Iraqis -- for the al Qaeda. They see us as occupiers and they fire up the Sunnis and Shias. As soon as we leave, the Shias and the Sunnis will get rid of Al Qaeda, because they're such a small group. They actually incentivize them.
So, because the president and the White House says that we're going to have chaos, it doesn't mean we're going to. Heaven's sakes, the Iraqis want us out of there. They think we're occupiers. And they said there's weapons of mass destruction. They said there's an al Qaeda connection. They continue to say for four -and-a-half years there's progress.
So why would I believe that there's going to be chaos just because they say it?
BLITZER: Congressman John Murtha, thanks, as usual, for joining us.
MURTHA: Nice to talk to you, Wolf.