idiot liberal mothers of soldiers--why don't they go home and shut up?

[Evergreen Emerald]

They are so stupid all they can do is complain that their boys are dead or suicidal. They want answers? From who? They want the war to end? What a bunch of idiot liberals. No one can end the war. What were they thinking? Idiots. Take a lesson from the mothers of those republicans, you don't see them sitting in the ditch in Texas or sitting in the halls of Congress. They are just fine with the way things are going. They are proud to sacrifice their son's for Bush and Co. See Cindy? See Tina? Don't be idiots! Shut the fuck up and go home!

God, what a bunch of idiot liberals.

[kestrel91316]

1. Yeah. K&R

[HCE SuiGeneris]

2. One of the best

rants ever! Message communicated loud and clear.

[babylonsister]

3. ...

:wow: :applause:

[Systematic Chaos]

4. Yeah! You're right!

After all these idiot liberals are just a bunch of poor eaters who drain the resources of the government with all the handouts they beg for every month. They eat lousy cheap food and live in filthy "projects" and never once try to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps. Why should they expect to outlive their own children? Who the hell are they to complain that they got shot and blown up over in Iraq, rather than in some incident of gang violence here at home? They should be honored!

We should all get together and write a book about this, and edumacate these damn liberals about the error of their ways. Maybe Ann Coulter could ghost write it for us since we're all just a bunch of liberals and too stupid to do it ourselves....

Um... wait a minute.

<Error 037FD4 - major logic circuit breakdown memory dump and total system shutdown in progress>

[karlrschneider]

5. Here:

http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/6000

[Evergreen Emerald]

11. I know! What were they thinking walking the halls of congress asking for help?

In fact, although she didn't technically berate him--she did TALK to him. Idiot. Where does she get off asking HIM off all people for help? Doesn't she know that his ineffective actions are above reproach? That she would have the nerve to tell him her son's story? That she, an American citizen, have the nerve to complain to him?! Rage away sir. You have earned it with all your hard work. You certainly do not deserve to be approached by a a a ...mother. Ignore the idiot mother. She is an embarrassment to the liberal agenda.

I'll bet she doesn't even have a yellow ribbon on her car.

[karlrschneider]

13. She WAS an idiot. That is not something I can fix.

Nor can you, probably. Maybe she should have just thrown a bucket of red paint on him...just to 'get his attention'...

Like I said in another post, you don't get rid of cockroaches by poisoning the honeybees.

:eyes:

[Evergreen Emerald]

16. She WAS an idiot. How stupid of her to talk to an elected official!

He was righteous in raging at her and calling her names. So what if she technically did not attack him or even go after him...so what if she technically didn't even confront him, but simply approached him as she did many who were in the halls of Congress. What the hell was she thinking? This is America. We don't question our elected officials in America!

She WAS an idiot.

[karlrschneider]

Nice sarcasm. How do you feel about the unlawful secret camera

that was used? Why the subterfuge? For the record, I would condemn it if it were done to a Republican pro-war
congressman instead of a VERY ANTI-war Democrat. What EXACTLY is your problem with Obey other than his
less than diplomatic response? Be specific.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

22. Illegal? Then, no doubt she should be arrested. Shouldn't she?

[karlrschneider]

26. No. She wasn't operating the camera.

...

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

46. But, wasn't she a part of the evil liberal conspiracy to embarrass the poor congressman?

The "set-up" to ask a representative of the people about a bill to fund the war that he's sponsoring?

[Evergreen Emerald]

24. As I said earlier: her voice was the most important voice in that hall

and he should have been on his knees begging her forgivness for failing to protect her son. No matter what he has done and what he has yet to do, he failed. Her voice was the most important voice in that hall. And he ignored her. He ignored her as an American, as a mother in pain, as a patriot who said goodbye to the son she fears she may never see again.

[undergroundpanther]

29. Well I think We NEED cameras in washington

They have no shame spying on us looking at our bank accounts and what we buy where we go and what we say on line. Why not even up the playing field? If you want real change sometimes you gotta see it for yourself and do it yourself.

About time citizens Go into that rats nest with a camera and give them NO place to hide from themselves.

Yeah a Dem was shamed.GOOD.It tells me a very important thing here NO PARTY REPRESENTS ME. I am very glad of that lady and her camera That is how truth comes Abu Gharib would never have been exposed without a camera in the hands of a decent person. I don't think she expected this asshole to call her an idiot when she was filming him.She probably thought brand Dem Cared.

And the sooner we realize that THEY ALL DON"T CARE the sooner we can get rid of the asshole infestation of two faced hypocrites and greedy pigs and criminal elitist shit heads causing this war for profits and end this corruption in our government they STOLE..Cameras everywhere in the PENTAGON the FBI the CIA the Halls of congress EXPOSE THE TRUTH of Who they really ARE Uncensored.. Expose the real workings of these pigs and their"class" without the spin doctors making them look like "nice guys"to us. Dem and Republicans are the same they are all rich and elitist.And evil.

[proud2BlibKansan]

48. It was not a secret camera

It was in full view of Obey. He knew he was being filmed.

[Nutmegger]

6. #6

:applause:

[emulatorloo]

7. KICK AND NOMINATED n/t

[bettyellen]

8. because protests and huge groundswell of support never changed the course of history anywhere, ever!

and it's easier to pretend there is no will of the people.
we'll score a bigger win in 08 if we have the war to run against!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

9. Another K&R from an idiot liberal who believes that politicians should be questioned.

Not to mention pushed, shoved, exposed, threatened, embarrassed, and otherwise forced to do more than talk, appease, and tell us that they "can't".

They need to be constantly reminded that they work for the people that they disdain not the other way around.

[karlrschneider]

10. Yeah, that damn Obey guy should have promised to end the war in 2 weeks

right there in the hallway. And then did it within an hour.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

18. Beats the hell out of promising to end it in Sept. 2008 IF Bush agrees.

Oh, right, it might "embarrass" Bush thus causing him to end the war.

http://www.kansas.com/mld/kansas/news/politics/16866924.htm

The House plan would require Bush to certify by July 1 and again by Oct. 1 that Iraq is making progress toward building its security apparatus and stabilizing the country.

If the Iraqi government met those benchmarks, U.S. troops would end their combat role no later than Sept. 1, 2008. If Iraq did not meet either of the deadlines, troop withdrawals would begin immediately and be completed in six months.

The legislation also allows for Bush to waive the standards, but such a situation could be embarrassing to a White House that maintains the troop increase is already having a positive effect in Baghdad and restive Anbar province.

[karlrschneider]

25. Look. We all want this quagmire to end ASAP. Reality has a way of getting the way of

ideal solutions. Congress as whole, let alone one member, does NOT have the ability to do that. You don't like that simple fact and I don't either but it's what we have. What advantage do we get by having someone wrangle one of the FEW congressmen who's doing all he CAN? It's counterproductive and it's stupid. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face...:eyes:

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

45. How is it "counterproductive"?

Since when is holding politicians feet to the fire counterproductive? They work for us, not the other way around.

Sure, Obey is a "good guy". But, Obey is of the belief that funding the war for another 19 months and hoping that Bush will agree to set a timetable is more than a bit farfetched.

They don't have the votes to cut off the funding, he says. That was also said about the Civil Rights Bill and the "good guys" complained that the protesters were too "impatient" and should be nice. It was also said about the protesters in the '60s who were giving the "liberals" who were trying to stop the war (sort of) a "bad name".

Should we just pat them on the back and congratulate them for allowing the killing to go on because they're "not as bad" as the Republicans?

I think not.

[leftchick]

35. it is like the IWR all over again

trusting boosh to make the right decision???? I have had it with these bullshit amendments. It is almost like the Democrats want the war to continue until after the next election.

[Tin Man]

12. How many times are we gonna have this thread? Honestly, this is probably the 15th I've seen now.

Do we have a "beating a dead horse" emoticon? I need to use it.

[Evergreen Emerald]

14. why beat a dead horse?

Let's rage at the mother of the suicidal soldier! It is much more satisfying. She deserves it after all she was so so so stupid.

[karlrschneider]

15. Some DUers can't accept yes (or an apology) for an answer.

And just love to beat up on the most anti-war congressman in D.C. because he got exasperated with a woman who didn't know what the fuck she was talking about.

[Evergreen Emerald]

17. Don't you see Karl? Hers was the most important voice in that hall.

He is responsible for her son's life and well being. And she wanted help. And he should have been on his knees begging her forgiveness for his failing in the task of protecting her son. I don't care what he has done and what he has yet to do. He and everyone else in that government has failed her and her son.

Not deserving of rage or wrath or name calling. Hers is the most important voice in that hall.

[karlrschneider]

20. I hope your stock in that apostrophe company pays well.

:eyes:

[Bjorn Against]

19. I have accepted Obey's apology, why haven't you?

Obey apologized, but you are still calling the woman an idiot. You obviously have not accepted Obey's apology because you still think he was right to say what he said even though he admitted he was wrong.

The woman is not an idiot, she is a concerned mother.

[karlrschneider]

27. I absolutely accept his apology and she is still an idiot.

If she had the foggiest notion how things work in Congress and had done some homework the encounter would never have occurred.

[Bjorn Against]

32. If you are accepting his apology then how can you call her an idiot?

If you think she is an idiot and he said nothing wrong, then explain to me why you are accepting apology. After all you don't seem to think he had anything to apologize for.

I do think he owed her an apology, and I accept his apology. But you are still calling her an idiot, if you think he was right to apologize to her then you should apologize as well. Or do you think Obey is wrong?

[karlrschneider]

37. If someone is an idiot and is treated rudely he or she is entitled to an apology.

It does not cure the idiocy. I'm sorry but I really don't understand how that simple fact eludes you.

[Bjorn Against]

38. THAT IS NOT A FACT!!!

Sorry for using all caps, but it seriously pisses me off when people call a mother whose son's life is in danger an idiot and claims their slander to be fact.

On edit: I have no time for people who attack grieving mothers, you are now the second person on my ignore list.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

41. If I'm Not The First, Can I Be The Third Please? Cause Even Worried Mothers Can Be Idiots.

The two concepts are completely unrelated. If an idiot has a kid and that kid is put in danger, I'd fully expect said idiot to be worried. But I wouldn't think some magical change would occur that deemed the person to no longer be an idiot. Idiots worry too. Idiots grieve too. I can't for the life of me understand your assertion that because she's a concerned mom that means she can't act like an idiot. Of course she can, and in this case she did.

[Bjorn Against]

44. It is not idiotic to talk to members of Congress

And yes, you can be the third I have been debating putting you on ignore for some time as I know many others already have for good reason.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

49. Of Course It Isn't. It's Only Idiotic When It Comes From An Idiot. Duh.

And thanks for honoring my request for you to put me on ignore. Ta ta! :hi:

[undergroundpanther]

30. Obey

let his mask slip and you saw the cold inhuman ruthlessness of his kind of people.I think obey apologized to save his own ASS. Like any skillful abuser would if he thought his mealticket might leave him. He doesen't REALLY care about her son or anyone not of his class.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

42. You Obviously Know Little To Nothing About Obey If You Say Such Things Sincerely.

You must not know him at all. He's a great man and a great rep. I think it's nothing short of PATHETIC how he's being demonized online now by some. Pathetic.

[rodeodance]

52. Obey is a good man---who momentarily look his cool. He used to be my

Rep. in WI. He made a mistake --apologized. Now it is time to drop it.

[undergroundpanther]

31. Because

obey is a politician and the Dem's have been so soft on Bush so gutless and so much like republicans..I don't trust ANYONE in washington's words anymore they are a nest of vipers. Not to be trusted or believed.No matter how sincere they appear on a carefully groomed news program.
What happens candid is where more truth is.Not in a presentation"apology" on TV in CYA mode..

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

21. Ohhh. Wow. n/t

:yourock: MKJ

[bonito]

23. It is really very sad though

And very difficult to face up to the fact they were lied to, and because of this, there child is no more, I really feel for these people, its not there fault for placing their trust in their leaders, it just shows that they are trusting people with good intent, taken in by these evil people. This must stop.

[undergroundpanther]

28. Every person in washington

Has a problem, they are assholes. Some closet their asshole, some don't bother to as much. Republicans don't closet their assholes Dem's do and we think they are so nice..The Dem's don't care about anyone but their in group of buddies at best , really.Politics stopped caring about the quality of lives of we the not so elite people long, long ago.. If it EVER did care. The leaders busy themselves with creating false appearance for 'votes. schmoozing and getting richer.They never cared the people like me or you, they care about gathering our money from us and they want us to work for them and buy shit..CONSUUUME!!

The sooner people realize that,corruption is everywhere , it is the NORM..in BOTH parties and these merchants are not loyal to anything but their own gathering of wealth for themselves the sooner WE won't be fooled by politicians making grand promises to make our lives better on election days, but fail to deliver it every time because once they're in, the got the power and clout and connections to outrageous money and more power..

So They secretly think who cares what people like us think,we are plebeian, They don't REALLY care about your kids lives,Because you and your kid are expendable drones in the wealth machine. The Market of lies and tokens.

The rich really need your kids to do the dirty work of the Empire to kill,steal other countries resources and plunder ,torture , rape and terrorize the"Enemy du Jour"..in war .oR work UNTIL death and buy shit lots of buying shit in peace time ..All to increase the wealth and power of the wealthy. So if the plebian kids die,in war,or come home broken ,oh well the politician thinks,but dares not say, they signed up to be sacrificed to Mammon the Market God.So?


No rich man will risk his soft ass be a DIRECT thief of another nations STUFF ,no this sick gang of elites bribe,manipulate(with poverty (no jobs)or the threat of it or grandeur) or they just force desperate plebeians to be the mercenaries for the rich and it is our class who are shot at or they go to jail and work for fingerhut the state or IBM for free...So shut up stupid liberal you know NOTHING about how the power elite run things, best not to meddle in the affairs of royals 'cause you ain't one..

That is what I saw as the unspoken meaning behind this asshole's angry outburst.Realize this To the leaders We are worker bees expendable drones, and some politicians agree behind closed doors we are too numerous and our genetic stock too messed up to ever be worth anything really important. They do not see us as human beings or equals.Psychopathy rules the rulers.And so they don't care and maintaining the false front that they do care is hard werk.

[KelleyKramer]

33. Where is this video??

I've seen all the threads about it but no links.

Did a search for David Obey on youtube and it only had one talking about the Repub budget.

Anybody got a link to the vid?

[Bjorn Against]

34. Here it is...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=385&topic_id=18941&mesg_id=18941

[KelleyKramer]

36. Thanks!

[stranger81]

39. ooohhh -- SNAP!!! K&R [n/t]

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

40. She Acted Like An Idiot, Plain And Simple. No Matter How Much You Twist The Reality Of What We're

debating it still doesn't change that. You can twist the premise and ignore the reality of what occurred all you want. You can falsely assert that she was acting as nothing more than a concerned mother who was being genuine in her actions. You can twist the reality around with inaccurate and blatantly absurd sarcasm that attempts to paint a picture of pure innocence and 'that poor woman' syndrome all you want. But it still doesn't change the reality that she acted like an idiot, refuses to listen to reason, has a delusional, inaccurate and ignorant perception on the realities of what can occur to stop this war, and went in there with the sole purpose of harassing one of our best reps and then with a hidden camera video posting it online to embarrass him.

She most definitely came off as an idiot. A good person with good intentions maybe, but still an idiot. But that doesn't mean I want her to shut the fuck up and go home. Merely means I would like her to educate herself on reality, open her mind a bit, and not attack via sheer ignorance and stupidity the reps of ours that are doing the right things.

[Me.]

43. K & R Because

No member of Congress should EVER speak to a citizen that way. They are answerable to us, not the reverse. And if he wants to talk frustration, let's talk about the frustration, rage and grief all of us have felt for the last 6+ years.

He did apologize and that counts, I don't know if others would.

[undergroundpanther]

47. They don't think they have to apologize for calling a grieving mother an idiot

Look at bush being an asshole to Cindy Sheehan..Elitism is their attitude That's a problem with most of them.

[MLFerrell]

50. That says it all.

[Rex]

51. I'm going to be blunt.

I like Obey, haven't seen anything bad from the guy up until that comment. IMO, someone told him beforehand that if he ran into 'hysterical' people - to call them 'liberal idiots'. Now that is a very stupid thing to say for any Left leaning politician. On camera or off. He was an idiot for saying something someone else told him would be a good PR move.

It just didn't sound like 'him' IMO.

[Danger Mouse]

53. So he made a mistake. He slipped up, got frustrated.

He's human.
She was trying to set him up.
As I said before, did she expect him to be thrilled? Personally, if I am doing everything I can to get a task done well, and someone is giving me a hard time about it, saying i'm not doing enough, then I tend to get pissed off.
He apologized for his comment...which I think was the right thing to do.
But she was in the wrong as well, and if you really want to hold a politicians 'feet to the fire'...why don't we work on all of those OTHER CONGRESSMEN WHO AREN'T DOING JACKSHIT??? Why go after one of the only few who is?
It's smacks of...well, idiocy.

[Jcrowley]

54. Have you seen this?

You can actually look at Obey's voting record and bill-sponsoring record on this war on the website of United for Peace and Justice. Obey has not joined the Progressive Caucus or even the Out of Iraq Caucus, a step that requires merely wanting the U.S. to get out of Iraq some day. He has not cosponsored any of the bills that would end the war, not the strongest, not the weakest, not any of those in between. He did not sign the petition last year that was aimed at forcing the Republican Congress to allow a vote on the weakest of the Democratic proposals aimed at possibly ending the war some day. He has not cosponsored bills opposing the ongoing construction of permanent U.S. military bases in Iraq. He has not cosponsored a bill aimed at allowing students to keep their personal information from being handed over by their schools to military recruiters. He has not cosponsored a bill to provide adequate VA health care. (He's adding that into a war funding bill as a means to garner votes and cover some of the odor, but he has not supported a clean bill to fund VA health care.) In 2003 Obey voted to fund the war. In 2004 he voted against funding. In 2005 he voted to fund it again. Obey, like most Democrats, voted in favor of Congresswoman Lynn Woolsey's amendment that would have asked the President to devise a plan to end the war some day. There are not many Democrats with a worse record than Obey's.

At the Democrats' March 8, 2007 press conference, Obey made clear that he did not want to end any war at all. He wanted to shift the war from Iraq to Afghanistan, where the U.S. could, he said, attack "the people who attacked us."

Sirota continues:

"Now, you can argue whether his tactics right now are smart. You can have a reasoned disagreement about whether he should be pushing a supplemental appropriations bill that includes new money for veterans medical care and binding language to end the war by March of 2008. There is a very legitimate case to be made that Democrats shouldn't support any money to continue the war and that the supplemental appropriations bill that Obey is carrying does also do that."

No, David. With all due respect, it does not ALSO do that. That is the overwhelmingly enormous and central and costly thing that it does. That is THE purpose of the bill. How dare you try to imply that I oppose veterans' medical care or binding language to end the war? How dare Obey use injured veterans' need for care to package his bill to put our grandchildren into debt funding more war and more deaths and injuries? And there is nothing binding about requiring George W. Bush to stop doing something, while giving him the money to keep doing it. If you want to be binding, you'll have to use the power of the purse, something this supplemental will not do unless Congresswoman Barbara Lee's amendment is voted on and passed.

http://www.davidswanson.org/?q=node/765