Let's Call It What It Is: Privatization, Not Education Reform

[Dinger]

Fuckin' arne has his corporatist education privatization cronies in high gear. michelle rhee, fuck that. Either you want PUBLIC education or you don't. This charter school privatization plan is a runaway train, and you don't want to be on it.

[Lifelong Protester]

1. With ya there, Bro. or Sis.

Was terribly disappointed with Arne as the choice from the git-go. Dislike him even more now.

[Dinger]

8. Sis, And Thanks : )

:)

[SammyWinstonJack]

2. K&R

[no_hypocrisy]

3. This can be reconstituted by a new governor, right?

Undo the damage in the future?

[derby378]

4. The same can be said about this "healthcare reform" BS on Capitol Hill

The fox is going to be put in charge of the henhouse. Thanks a lot, Pelosi and Reid... :grr:

[ecstatic]

5. I believe Obama went on record as being against vouchers, etc.

So I don't think Arne will be able to do the things you're fearing.

[Dinger]

9. Yes he Will

It's already happening.

[tonysam]

14. Wrong. Arne IS doing it through his "Race to the Top" scheme

It would take a Democratic administration to destroy a once-great institution and turn it into a shithole of corruption.

Michelle Rhee of D.C. is in a struggle with teachers there because she wants to shitcan senior teachers to hire these cheapie hires she hired right before she decided to sack the senior teachers, crying budgetary reasons.

Bloomberg and Klein in NYC are pulling the same schemes.

School districts all over the country are being infested with Eli Broad "academy" graduates as superintendents and "executives," which administrators are now being called, most of whom have little experience in the classroom as teachers, who blather about "data" and are looking for clever ways to subvert tenure laws and regulations.

[donco6]

18. He already is.

Here in Colorado, if you're in the bottom 5% according to test scores, you have 4 options:

Become a charter

Fire the principal and 50% of the staff and start over

Adopt a new instructional model (i.e., become a charter)

Close the school

[mopinko]

21. and what would you propose?

let failing schools flounder?

[tonysam]

28. So you think Arne should privatize them

I think you really need to research the billionaires who are trying to ruin a great system, and they are getting away with it. Arne Duncan, an idiot, has no conception at all of what ails public ed.

Running schools on business models will fail.

The real problems in public education have to do with WHO is running the schools, and the fact these people are not held truly accountable for their actions. Those who are or have been on the inside of this sick system know exactly what I mean.

[donco6]

31. Yeah, that's what I'm all about.

First, we have to face the fact that charters are not a "magic bullet" of any sort. The "miracle" turnarounds they boast of are nothing more than emptying the school of the population it used to serve and replacing them with an entirely different population. A population that has parents who care enough to enroll them and get them to school, make their lunches, get their homework done (it's required to remain in the school), etc. etc.

And for the kids who don't have that kind of support? They get to go to the "default" school, which will be next on the list to close for poor performance. Then those kids will get kicked out again to find another default school . . . lather rinse repeat.

This is just "skimming." It's taking the best kids from any given population and helping them achieve - which is lovely, of course. But it's not systemic reform by any stretch. Anyone can do this, if they're willing to give up on the rest of the kids. And evidently Arne is perfectly willing. It's sad.

What we need is reform that doesn't place the entire burden on a teacher. In my district, our BEST teachers are in our lowest-performing school, working with our 60% monolingual Spanish students and 90% free lunch kids. And they get hammered because the kids aren't performing at grade level in English reading and writing by 3rd grade. It's preposterous.

[mopinko]

46. you know, you are dealing in stereotypes here.

my son did his americorp year tutoring at a charter here. it was run by the university of chicago lab school. this school is one of the top private schools in the country, and the philosophy is one of educating and nurturing the whole child. the charter is an amazing school.
it is in a poor neighborhood, and takes all comers. and the big thing, imho, is that they really reach out to find the resources that they need to do things the way they do at the very pricey lab school. they get the same per student as the public schools. but they work hard to go out and get what they need.
the americorp kids really gave these kids the kind of nurturance and help that every kid deserves, and that poor kids need the most. the teachers teach, but those kids filled in what the parents couldn't give. the results were phenomenal.

none of this stuff is the secrets of the 57th degree masons. everybody knows this shit. but nobody seems to put it into action. the best schools in the chicago public school system do the same things. but so many more are just paper shufflers, get what is handed to them and nothing more, and do a half assed job.
maybe this charter is trying to prove a point. you don't get anything for that in the system. some charters suck, and others fill gaps that badly, badly need filling. i just don't see the whole point of arguing about who runs the school, when you could be arguing about who does a good job and who doesn't.

[donco6]

49. Well, wait a minute.

"takes all comers"

Uh, the tuition is $23,000 a year. How in any sense of the phrase can that be seen as "taking all comers"?

But as to the rest of your post - I saw in our Denver Post today that Denver Public Schools got yet another grant to study teaching to identify effective practices. Now, really, we don't need more studies on this. We have books and books and books on best practices for a myriad of populations. What we need is for people to do it. I see fellow teachers who don't. I can help the younger ones who will listen to me. But these are people who've been here longer than me. I can't really do anything to influence them.

[mopinko]

51. sorry, slightly muddy writing on my part.

the charter is free, and not the lab school. it is a chicago public school. no tuition.

and you are correct. this shit is already out there. some teachers need to reread their howard gardner. that is what this charter (and charters in general) are about- proving grounds for stuff that is on paper. and this one is a shining example.
now if only it is replicated. unfortunately, the continued fighting over the very concept will probably make it difficult to absorb the lessons that the charters have to teach.
sometimes i think change in education is impossible.

[Catshrink]

65. Some of our classes have 40 kids

with 25-30% sped kids in them. This kid reads at a 3rd grade level, that one has no number sense. This one over here is lazy and just sits staring at the floor while these two get all their work done with time to spare.

Yeah, let's make the teacher read Howard Gardner again because she didn't get it the first time through.

Why are the classes so large? Because exclusive charter schools are siphoning off public funds. Oh yeah, they offer education but they also manage to pay their owners/directors 6 figures. The Legislature is slashing funds for education because the economy is in the toilet which only exascerbates the problem.

Really, the charter school movement is a ruse to break teachers' unions, dump teachers' pensions, lower salaries to what they pay day care workers, and offer no job security. The best teacher in the world could be canned because of one parent whose kid got a bad grade or asked the wrong question. Is there any wonder teachers are nervous and opposed to Arne's methods? We have not been included in the process, our concerns have not been addressed in a reassuring manner. We've only heard that WE are the problem when in fact the deficiencies in our education system reflect what is going on in society.

[Dinger]

67. True Words

Thank you.:thumbsup: :hi:

[mopinko]

68. whatever it is like where you are-

first of all, there are not 40 kids in classes here because at one time teachers unions fought for what was best for kids. not that they do anymore, but that is a can of worms. don't really want to go there .

but second, charters here get the same per pupil spending that the public schools get. and although there are some work rule concessions, most have union teachers, and union salaries. in fact, the chicago teachers union holds several charters.

maybe your state government has abandoned your schools, but that is not what is happening here. putting the blame on charter schools is unproductive hogwash. put the blame where it belongs if you want to solve the problem.

[Catshrink]

70. I believe the evidence of charter schools

says that your experience is the exception. Florida and Arizona have lax oversight and poor results. I believe Colorado has a similar record.

Arne Duncan has no business "reforming" education because he doesn't understand how it works and he has no respect for those who do the job.

[Hannah Bell]

59. "failing schools" - lol. no child left turns every school into a "failing" school.

[Dinger]

61. Touché Hannah

:)

[mopinko]

62. pithy but meaningless

good schools still exist. and bad schools remain mostly unchanged when the naysayers have their way. when arne duncan started holding failing schools actually accountable, the wailing could be heard from outer space. change is hard. it requires people to be thoughtful and honest, not just to hurl zingers.

[Hannah Bell]

63. not meaningless at all. nclb is designed to ensure that an ever-increasing proportion of schools

"fail" every year so that they can be taken over a/o turned into charters. it does so by:

1. mandating 95-100% achievement of identical standards for all students, including special needs/esl students
2. not fully funding its mandate
2. defunding schools who fail to meet targets, so they have even fewer resources to meet the next year's target
3. raising standards through time, ensuring that "failing" schools fall further & further behind.



change is hard. it requires truth, not agenda-driven lies. the goal of nclb is to privatize public ed, using the rhetoric of "reform" as cover.

[mopinko]

64. yeah, i am well aware of nclb

but it is time to move past simply decrying the law. schools are failing, not just by nclb's dubious measures, but really. when they are actually held to account, and restructured, like i said, the wailing is heard in outer space.
change is hard. it requires more than rote whining.
i don't really care who is in charge, as long as they do their job. and i have no illusions that public education is a totally altruistic undertaking from which no one profits. people always have made money off of schools. which is as it should be. teachers should be paid. contractors should be able to stay in business. even if we could hire slaves, it isn't right, so i wouldn't support it.

charters here are more accountable than the public schools. failing charters loose their charter. failing public schools go on and on and on.
this whole argument serves no one.

[Hannah Bell]

69. pure bullshit.

[Catshrink]

71. +1

[fascisthunter]

6. what a collosal screw up...

those corporate dems sure seem eager to privatize as much as the republicans.

[stray cat]

7. And lets call our current system what it is as well in many locations = crap

[Dinger]

10. And Why Is That? Unions? Teachers?

Which long-time PROGRESSIVE Democratic-supporting group is the problem?

[roody]

12. details, please

[tonysam]

15. It is by design, by the way, thanks to privatization

Blame BOTH political parties for this.

[C_Lawyer09]

11. Say you were in charge of an unlimited public education budget

But you could only spend it on three things, what would those three things be, or said differently, what three problems would you attempt to impact the most?

[roody]

13. tests, test prep, and administrators and their luncheons

[tonysam]

17. Lawyers, lawyers, and administrator salaries and perks

Lawyers who defend administrators at whatever cost to taxpayers in rigged "tenure" or "due process" hearings; lawyers who will defend administrators and districts in wrongful termination lawsuits clear up through the United States Court of Appeals in an attempt to starve out teachers and other staff into piddling settlements, all paid for by the taxpayers; administrators who have ironclad job security and obscene perks, thanks to the taxpayers, who don't know what REALLY goes on in public schools.

[Dinger]

19. + 1

Thanks tony.:)


You get it.:headbang:

[C_Lawyer09]

22. Thanks for the answer

My relatives in public ed. have been getting more irritated by the year. Sounds like maybe the administrator/teacher scenario might be mirroring the ceo/worker scenario. I just started tutoring primary kids as a part time job. It's fun so far, but it's easy to see that the school is understaffed.

[tonysam]

26. You are correct. Teachers, once considered professionals, are having their work

deskilled, while principals and others are being molded into "managers" and "executives," which they are NOT and cannot be.

Public education is a SERVICE, not a for-profit enterprise, and forcing schools into business models will inevitably lead to failure.

[C_Lawyer09]

24. That is what the teachers I came in contact with in WA state told me

A lot of them were upset about the state standardized test known as the WASL. I was told that the math portion of the test involved a lot of analysis and writing. Really couldn't wrap my arms around that concept, but that's what they told me.

[tonysam]

34. Any standardized or criterion referenced test is going to fail

simply because students don't take the tests seriously. Little kids are being forced to take these tests, starting around third grade for standardized and ALL grades for CRTs, and they either freak out over the tests or they rush through them, filling in the bubbles any which way. Yet teachers spent hours and hours and hours in "professional learning communities" or "grade-level meetings" planning for lessons which teach to these tests. Meanwhile, real learning is thrown aside because teachers MUST teach to the cookie-cutter curriculum.

[C_Lawyer09]

37. I appreciate the insight

It's a sad tale you tell. If teachers are hired they should be trusted to exercise most of the say so over the curriculum they choose to teach. Not that the jobs are very similar, but a lot has changed in the military. Over time, much of the Non-Commissioned Officer (NCO)authority has gradually been usurped by Officers whom are bored (I'm generalizing, there are still good ones)while the ever increasing raft of paperwork, that is their responsibility, gets ignored or dropped on the NCO. If you can't train the troops in your charge, what is getting promoted worth? I try to stay optimistic, but there are so many aspects of our society that need attention/fixing. It seems so many have more on their plate, and less time and money.

[donco6]

35. The math tests are not about doing lots of problems -

but they give you a scenario, and you have to solve it in multiple parts, then explain your answer.

Like this:

During the summer, Henry earns $5 per hour babysitting and $4 per hour mowing
lawns.

Part A Henry babysat a total of 48 hours. How much money did he earn babysitting?
In the space below, show your work and write your answer on the line.

Part B Including the 48 hours of babysitting, Henry earned a total of $308 by the end
of summer. How many hours did he spend mowing lawns?
In the space below, show your work and write your answer on the line.

They may get the correct answer, but if they cannot show how they got it, they get cut way down on points.

[roody]

36. So the math score is dependent on the child's reading level.

[donco6]

39. AND writing.

Yes, absolutely.

So for our kids - 40% monolingual Spanish districtwide and way higher than that at specific schools - we get killed on this, even if they know the math.

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

54. A child's ability to actually utilize math skills

is dependant upon thier comprehension of real-world concepts and how to FORMULATE the equations they need to solve for the answer. Few people in life are given straight numerical equations to solve. Knowing how to solve an equation is useless unless you know when to use that equation and how to formulate it.

I wholeheartedly agree with using word problems to demonstrate math comprehensoin skills. Sure, you need a few number problems to guage ffundamental math problem solving... but if you want to test what was actually learned, word problems should comprise most of the test.

I remember reading this on test question once.
An F-35 travelling horizonal at Mach 1.1 @ 10000ft begins a directly vertical maneuver, pulling up @ 5g of accelleration. If engine rotational velocity and mass are 30000rpm and 3500lbs, respectively, what net forces must the control surfaces exert on the aircraft to counteract (and prevent) yaw? (Assume the motor to be a uniform cylinder 3ft dia by 10ft long)

[donco6]

16. These things:

Ratios of 15:1 at K-3rd grade.

Free preschool for all 4 yr +

Textbook replacement cycles every two to three years.

Art, music and PE at all levels.

Capital construction money to keep all sites functioning on par

Multiple interventionists at each school to perform Tier 1 intervention work

More classroom paras and office assistance to do data entry for test data, etc.

Free lunch and breakfast for all

[Dinger]

20. What Donco Said

:)

[mopinko]

25. with you on all but the textbooks.

time to stop writing stuff on dead trees. give the kids kindles or something. expecting kids to drag 20-30 pounds of dead trees to school and back every day is a major, major component in failure to do outside school work.
it is also increasingly f'ing up kid's backs.

[Dinger]

29. Our School District Is Going Paperless

More and more school districts are, but I teach in a district with a high poverty rate, and we do not have very many students with internet access at home or otherwise. We'll do what we can.

[donco6]

32. Sure. I wasn't thinking big enough.

Laptops with software versions of all texts, updated electronically.

[roody]

38. New textbook adoption is a major corporate scam.

Also tests and test prep.

[donco6]

40. Well, maybe, but I'll tell ya -

When the majority of your teachers are young, they need all the help they can get. Ours floundered for years trying to develop curriculum for math from their individual models (Montessori, Exp. Learning, CES, International Bacc, New Technology, etc.), but they just killed themselves and got no results at all. Terrible.

We adopted Everyday Math after looking at quite a few of the programs out there. It honestly has helped a great deal, especially for our teachers who just really didn't know how to teach math.

Maybe someday we can get to paperless, but I sure can't pull it off now - looking at a 6.12% cut in funding (not cut in *increase*, but in actual funding) for next year.

[roody]

41. My garage is full of discarded textbooks.

I wish I could get them where they are needed.

[donco6]

42. We sell ours to charters (when we have any to sell)

And Follett will buy them back, too.

But I mentioned textbooks because in our system, we don't have the money to replace them, so we just keep using them forever.

[mopinko]

45. they are so f'ing expensive.

i am sure when they get them all electronic they will still find a way to stick you for big fees to use and update them.

[donco6]

47. Oh yes.

Although I went to a seminar at Stanford a while back and they were touting a FREE electronic textbook coop, that they've been using for schools in 3rd world, and now they're bringing it here to the US. It's not fancy/dancy, but it looked pretty good - for the price!

[C_Lawyer09]

27. I'm enjoying these thoughtful answers

Been curious about this for a while. I agree with you a lot regarding art, music, and PE. I'm not going to take up more of your time, but I'll have to look into the interventionist/tier 1 you mention, I think I've an idea of which you speak, but not quite sure.

[bullwinkle428]

23. Think Dubya's "Social Security Reform"...'nuff said.

[Dinger]

30. Good Analogy

:thumbsup:

[DU GrovelBot]

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[EndersDame]

43. I have my high school diploma thanks to a charter school

I was about 16 when my dad did not feel like paying child support anymore. My mom had counted on that money and fell behind on our rent. We soon were evicted and lived in a tiny motel room. It really sucked. I couldn't sleep or concentrate on anything .The bitchy girls who harassed me for being weird found new ammunition to taunt me with. I ended up dropping out and getting a job.

I was informed about this cool charter school called American Youthworks and was drawn to that initially because they had a more flexible schedule and dealt primarily with the so called "at risk youth" (homeless, pregnant, parents and kids already having legal problems ) They sponsored an Americorps program which was really cool because I could go to work (earning money and a scholarship) and learn new skills.In the morning I worked on an environmentally friendly low income house and then was dropped off to school for the rest of the day. The school also provided day care for the moms and dads trying to get their diplomas.

The school also attracted creative types who did not fit the one size fits all educational factory . The class sizes were smaller and I was treated as an individual. The teachers really took time to address our educational needs as individuals as well.We even had a one on one lit class! Our art program was very cool we were even allowed to express ourselves in alternative media such as graffiti and film. Since the school is situated in downtown Austin, the PE progr took the kids on long walks exploring the historical sites around the area!We also did yoga. We even had frank discussions about sexuality in health (something you could not do in a Texas public Highschool)Another thing that is unheard of in public high school is that we learned about the actual subjects instead of the standardized test! Since the teachers had more freedom my history teacher brought in current event stories about slave labor in Africa and China while relating to us learning about the slave trade of the past.

The best thing about it though is that the whole school felt like an extended family

http://www.americanyouthworks.org/overview.htm

My boyfriend's little sister is also finding much success in her charter high school which is named after Katherine Anne Porter (how cool is that!)
She has been homeschooled all her life and decided to try public school for high school and was placed in the pre ap courses since she scored perfectly on the TAKS (the administrators did not expect her to pass :rofl:)

She spent two weeks and just felt like she and her fellow students were just like cattle. Luckily she is in a small hippie charter school that takes a more holistic approach to learning .

http://kapschool.org:8080/KAPS/about%20KAPS.html

[donco6]

48. I have no problem with the charters serving at-risk kids.

We have a Big Picture high school, which normally would be a charter anywhere else.

http://www.bigpicture.org/

We just believe this work can be done through regular public schools, taking advantage of the systems of support we have (transportation, food service, special ed, training supports, capital construction money, bonding capacity, etc)

[EndersDame]

50. I think that with all of the adminstrators and bureaucracy it is almost impossible to have an

innovative public school. They are like factories in my opinion and they have to be because of all of the regulations and bs that they have to adhere to. I think it is ridiculous that they have these state organizations dictating a one size fits all approach on how to teach kids in the entire state of Texas instead of letting the teacher figure out what is best for their students in their areas. Besides it would be politically incorrect here anyway to have frank discussions about sexuality in a normal public school but charter schools have more freedom to teach. As i said before my history teacher was fantastic.She used the text book as an outline to what we would be studying and brought in all sorts of articles and alternative information. The teachers nor the students could not get away with being as creative and different in a public school.

[donco6]

52. Well, maybe it's because we're small.

But I don't see that here - at least, not as much. Yeah, we have bureaucracy that we have to deal with, but my job is to keep it away from the teachers.

Colorado is a local control state. We don't have a state curriculum or state textbooks. We pick our own.

[EndersDame]

55. That is good!

I find it kind of ironic that public schools here shy away from being innovative because of fear of backlash from parents where as charter schools are innovative to attract parents and students!

[JuniperLea]

44. Only the rich deserve an education...

The poor are overweight and sickly and and dim and should be culled from the heard. If you can't afford it, you don't deserve it. Stop your whining.

[murdoch]

53. This is going to be the medium-term future

Just look at today's headlines about California universities boosting college tuition by 33% within one year.

There's money to bail out Wall Street.
There's money to build dozens of nuclear submarines.
There's money to put military bases in Peru, Colombia, Kyrgyzstan etc.

But money to educate people, so that they will be more productive at work of all things, which will enhance future competitiveness and tax revenues - no.

If you look at where billionaire foundation money (Walton, Scaife, Hunt) etc. is going, the biggest thing they are financing is defunding public schools, deemphasizing learning and emphasizing tests for students and teachers. They also want to make school basically a cash handout - a certain amount of dollars is given for every student - poorer students use all of it to go to the lowest schools, working class people supplement it to go to slightly better schools. Right off the bat, only 40% of kids will get anything near a real education, and that number will keep shrinking.

Just looking at how the health care thing is going, I don't see any way to stop this. It can be blunted possibly.

[JuniperLea]

60. Exactly!

Now that's following the money! Clearly it's a plan... it flies in the face of reason.

Same with healthcare... if you give a poor family healthcare, they will have access to birth control, there will be fewer abortions, access to regular check ups would cut the higher priced emergency and dire need costs way back... it makes fiscal responsibility sense on so many levels to give everyone healthcare. Lower-class American life's a death sentence, plain and simple. Soon there will be only two classes. I know I'm not in the top one...

[tonysam]

56. That's the ultimate goal. The masses are supposed to serve their "betters." n/t

[JuniperLea]

58. Bingo...

They want to be sure that the youngsters can't even spell the word "oppression" let alone understand the meaning, or that they are a victim of same.

Edited to say I think this is why we are being pushed to hate more brown people... you see, we've become too friendly with the black people and the latinos... that wedge doesn't work anymore, so onward to the crusade against Muslims... the other brown people. They have to keep us all hating so we don't understand that racism is what keeps our eyes off classism. Divide and conquer at a base level... shiny keys... look over here.

[Name removed]

57. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Mithreal]

66. K&R