I don't like Kagan, but back off her doing her job!!!!

[KansasVoter]

If Obama had defended a murderer as a lawyer out of college would you be mad at Obama?

Wow, I think Kagan is a horrible choice because I want someone as left as Roberts is right. But I don't blame her for doing her job based on what the administration wanted her to do.

Get a clue!

[UndertheOcean]

1. I believe 90% of people don't have enough brain capacity to get a clue , but I admire you trying

it is futile though.

[KansasVoter]

2. lol

[RandomThoughts]

3. The goal is to get you to believe it is futile, so it would then be futile. n/t

[IndianaGreen]

4. Like her support for a ban for the so-called 'late-term' abortion?

We are citizens of the republic, not subjects to an absolute monarch!

[FrenchieCat]

9. 'Late-Term" abortion with the exception for the health of the mother, you mean?

Back when Clinton's Republican Congress was pushing to pass a ban on Late Term without exception,

Meanwhile Clinton was trying to water that down.....

but that didn't work.....and the congress pass the Ban on Late term without exceptions.....

which Clinton then vetoed, but wich congress was unable to overide.

That was a tough decision.....a choice between taking a chance and ending up with
Ban on Late Term without Exceptions or crafting a compromise providing the Health exception.

Yes, Kagan was the real ogre in this case....NOT!

[IndianaGreen]

11. A tough choice for Clinton... like DOMA!

Gotcha!

[FrenchieCat]

13. You don't have me.

I have had little to say about Clinton's DOMA.

The point is she was in an advisory role only....
her as well as others.

The fact that folks use this point by omitting the story
for their propaganda means your entire being is meant
to do the "Gotcha". How do you sleep at night,
knowing that you are actively working to attempt to bring
down an administration and a nominee that are the best
that we've had in eons? Feels good to be helping the GOP?

[IndianaGreen]

15. Dianne Wood fought for civil liberties and against overreach by Executive

while Elena Kagan hid in the closet. Not the sexual orientation closet, but the closet of silence while Bush was raping the Constitution.

[FrenchieCat]

22. Her job at the time was in the Clinton White House.

For you to believe that passing a Late Term Abortion Ban without exception (which congress did)
would be preferable to a ban on Late Term Abortions with exception for the health of the mother,
has nothing to do with closets, and has everything to do with common sense.

1994's congress was overwhelmingly Republican,
as you well know.....but are trying hard to forget to further your own current agenda,
and in fact you are playing the game exactly the way Republicans play it....omit the facts,
and go for the smear. Congratulations! You are doing a fine job in playing a Republican
in a Democratic arena.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

5. Thank You for understanding this....

Only about 80,000 more DUer's to go!

[Bluenorthwest]

6. Because she was born with a UPC code on her neck

that somehow forced her to take that job, and made her willing to make those arguments? Yes, that was her job, but it is not like it was that or the Wendy's window. She had choice, that was her choice, and doing what the administration wants is, one hopes she remembers, not what a Justice does.
If confirmed, I hope she remembers her new role and duties, and also forgets the old ones. Whatever she is being rewarded for she has done already. If she can move on and be a Judge, not a gun for hire, that would be good. If she remains on retainer to the White House, this would not be good.

[ProSense]

7. "I think Kagan is a horrible choice because I want someone as left as Roberts is right."

Speaking of a clue, Lawrence Lessig:

<...>

To hear the liberals talk about it, it sounds like they think we need a Thomas or Scalia of the Left. A bold, if sometimes bullying, extremist that marks off clearly the difference between the Left and the Right. Someone we could rally around. A new hero for an ideology too often too afraid to assert itself.

But nobody who understands the actual dynamics of the Supreme Court could actually believe that such a strategy would produce 5 votes. No doubt it would produce brilliant dissents. No doubt it would give the Keith Olbermann's of the world great copy. But it would fail to achieve the single thing we ought to be focusing on: How to build "coalitions," as Massachusetts Chief Justice Margaret Marshall put it to NPR yesterday, of five. Not compromises, not triangulations, but opinions that work hard to cobble from this diverse court a rule of principle that our side could be proud of.

The kind of justice who could do this well is not the justice who goes in with guns blazing. The lesson of Scalia's tenure is one of alienating his most likely friends, not forging strong alliances. Souter, Kennedy, and O'Connor all came to avoid following Scalia's lead by default. He set the extreme. They were not interested in extremes.

Instead, the kind of justice who could do this well is one who was practiced in "listening, before disagreeing," as the President put it yesterday. One who could disarm, through trust and respect, so as to get the other side to at least listen.

<...>

[Bluenorthwest]

8. Lessing?

He has been less than honest, and he spouts off about 'liberals' which is what Conservatives do, and a less than accurate conservative is not my kind of guy. For Kagan's sake, he needs to shut up.

[ProSense]

10. No, Lessig. n/t

[Cha]

18. Yes, as usual, Pres Obama is looking

at the whole picture.

[KansasVoter]

19. And too worried about appeasing the right.....again!

[Cha]

23. No, you have it wrong..Pres Obama chose Elena Kagan

as the best one for the job of SCOTUS..not appeasing the rw as you ignorantly put it.

[niceypoo]

46. Indeed, the right automatically gets whatever it wants

The insurance reform bill had everything the GOP wanted in it without a single one of them even having to vote for it, meanwhile everybody else got a few toothless token scraps. What is wrong with this picture?

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[FrenchieCat]

14. Your words are bullshit,

without substance.

Give us some substance so that you can be not bought but buried.

[ultracase24]

16. here you go

http://www.cleveland.com/nation/index.ssf/2010/05/elena_kagan_criticized_for_get.html (shielding thousands of American families from filing suit for damages)

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100511/ap_on_re_us/us_kagan_abortion
(agreeing with republicans on late term abortion, even in instances of the mother's health)

[IndianaGreen]

17. K&R n/t

:kick:

[FrenchieCat]

20. Ok,

From the article you posted, paragraph 2:
Documents reviewed Monday by The Associated Press show Kagan encouraging Clinton to support a bill that would have banned all abortions of viable fetuses except when the physical health of the mother was at risk. The documents from Clinton's presidential library are among the first to surface in which Kagan weighs in on the thorny issue of abortion.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100511/ap_on_re_us/us_kagan_abortion


In reference to the Saudi Issue, this may be her biggest "issue", although it relates directly to her job, and the long-standing agreements and treaties between the U.S. and Saudi Arabia in the foreign policy Arena. I don't believe that it was her idea, nor did she relish her particular duty in that case.

[IndianaGreen]

21. The 'I followed orders' defence

I think I like Dan Meltzer, who chose to resign.

[FrenchieCat]

24. Her job as Solicitor General went beyond consideration of more

than how cases affecting foreign relations matters would play domestically.

That's what Republicans do; everything for domestic consumption without a care
in the world of what ratroactively breaking a treaty might bring internationally.

I don't particular agree with the case that she brought, but I understand why she brought it.
If this is the reason that you have been working overtime trying to bring Pres. Obama since
a long time ago, or now Kagan's nomination right here at DU, OK, do the GOP's work.
It's your country too!

[ultracase24]

25. banning all abortions except when mom's health is as risk

is called anti-choice. Its the Republican compromise of banning all abortions no matter what.

Last time I looked abortion is legal and a right. Sounds like Kagan(under Clinton's administration) caved to Republican compromise, which was defeated anyway.

If you like SC pick that compromise with Republicans, why dont you just pick a Republican?


The Saudi issue is the EXACT same stance the Bush administration held. Continued under President Obama.

Do you know what that makes the Obama administration?



Complicit.

[FrenchieCat]

27. LOL!

Twist and turn on the Abortion issue if you wish,
Roe v. Wade does not guarantee later Term abortion on demand....
it leaves it up to the state. A Republican Congress voted to
outlaw all late term Abortions without exception, and you find
her the bad guy. In otherwords, you registered today to provide
us with this propaganda? Even when you posted, you lied to say
that she supported banning Late term abortions without exceptions.
Why did you lie?

As for the Saudi issue, I find it problematic, but it was her job
and the objection was based on treaty agreements, not some whim.

...and yes, I know what the Obama admministration is; and it ain't
nothing like the Bush admin, no matter how many of you all would
try to repeat it. Whatever your reasons for registering today at DU,
I ain't buying them.

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[FrenchieCat]

30. The Republicans rejected the compromise offer and voted to ban late term abortions, NO EXCEPTIONS...

and it passed.

Kagan only advised Clinton on offering a compromise to safeguard the mother's health,
....and yes, I would have caved too....
considering that the Republican had such a large majority, and as such rejected
the compromise and went on to pass a ban on late term abortion WITHOUT regards
to the health of the mother.

But I'm curious, what other reason other than the mother's health would someone have
to abort a 6 month old or older fetus? I realize the slippery slope argument,
but still, I do believe that most, even those who support abortion rights, kind of slow down
on that one. Which is precisely why Roe v. Wade left the third trimester issue up to the states to decide. The Republicans were trying to do what they have always wanted to do, leave it up to the Fed, and to leave NO EXCEPTION. Kagan did what she could to keep that from happening, by conceding
that their was a majority to get this passed, and so she advised Clinton to offer up a compromise....
which was turned down anyways, and the only thing that saved Late Term was a veto....which nearly was overidden. You can choose to take chances with such laws....while it appears that Kagan was
advising to do what could be done to save such rights, even if she couldn't get 100%. You in effect are assigning her powers that she did not have, and the sad thing is; you know this by now....
even if you didn't know it initially, because you didn't bother to read the article, just go with the smear.

[ultracase24]

31. It passed and was vetoed

The abortion issue was one of chipping away and back to the time when it was outlawed. That was the point. Its no ones business why a woman would want to have an abortion after 6 months pregnant. Its her body and her choice, period. There are many reasons why, in any case, including fetal genetic tests why a woman would want to abort.

My bigger concern is why Obama had her continue Bush's policy of rejecting lawsuits against the Saudi government, in spite of the fact that they had evidence that suggested that Saudi royalty financed some of the hijackers.

This isnt conspiracy stuff. These were lawsuits filed on behalf of thousands of Americans for material greviences against known terrorists and their financial backers. You can defend Obama if you want on this, but many people are not going to continue to buy it. We didnt elect Bush's third term.

We elected a Democratic President that was not beholden to the Saudi's. Unless of course, you disagree and support Obama's looking the other way with this Kagan nomination.

[JTFrog]

33. And it's a busy little bee this carnation. n/t

[FrenchieCat]

38. I noticed.

So obvious.

Like we're stupid. :rofl:

[JTFrog]

47. It appears the mods finally noticed too. n/t

[bertman]

26. I get so tired of hearing that we have to have a middle-of-the-roader as our nominee

for the Supreme Court. Elena Kagan is not a voice for the left. She is another centrist. We need liberals on the court.

As Margaret Kohn said on Countdown tonight: we need a nominee who says in her confirmation hearing that HUMAN RIGHTS should always take precedence over PROPERTY RIGHTS.

[KansasVoter]

28. I agree!!!

[depakid]

32. Here's a clue- Kagan owes a duty to the people (her client) to exercise appropriate prosecutorial

discretion.

Whether she does so or not in any given case (or in a pattern over several cases) is not only fair grounds for review and criticism- but also necessary for a functioning constitutional Republic.

All too many here deem that Obama has some sort of dictatorial powers- like Bush seemed to be granted.

That's dangerous ground which will come back to haunt everyone, including those folks who think Obama can do no wrong, because sooner or later there'll be a new President, and chances are you and I may like them a whole lot less than the current one.

[ProSense]

35. "Kagan owes a duty to the people (her client)" What?

The Solicitor General represents the government and serves the President. It is the President who is elected to serve the people.

[depakid]

37. There you go again...

Kagan owes a duty to the people to use her best discretion or to resign in the event that she's asked to take a position that runs substantially contrary to her discretion with respect to the law, ethical obligations or the administration of justice.

[ProSense]

39. "Kagan owes a duty to the people to use her best discretion or to resign"

You don't know what you're talking about.

[depakid]

40. You go take a professional ethics course, pass the MPRE and get back to me.

[ProSense]

41. Evidently,

that doesn't give one the qualifications to understand a Solicitor General's role.

[Name removed]

42. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

43. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TheKentuckian]

34. I don't blame her for taking crappy positions as Solicitor General BUT

that also precludes credit for taking a more admirable stances like going against Citizens United. Which many want to point to as evidence that she isn't a corporate lackey but it makes no more sense to give her kudos there but a pass on stuff that is unacceptable.

[Jennicut]

36. Being SG means to me that none of what she argued for the US was her own opinions.

I agree, negative or positive, she was simply doing her job. Nothing more or less. The only thing is, she wanted to be SG for a Dem President and has voted Dem and given to donations to Dems. That is about all her job as SG has told me.

[HughMoran]

44. Exactly

I've had to remain mum on the praise as it is no more deserved than the criticism, she is simply speaking for the gubmint.

[mmonk]

45. Get a clue yourself.

I will not support anyone who supports in any way detention without trial, the concept the world is a battlefield and thus no accussed can have access to a speedy trial.

PERIOD

[The Damned]

48. Amen!

I said the same here yesterday.