Wasting my time watching Big Ed prove politics is over his head and he's a partisan hack

[zulchzulu]

He is saying that it's a political calculation that is wrong and that he should tell the "American people now is a time to sacrifice".

Maybe Ed doesn't remember Carter when Jimmy said that. It worked out well for him... but I digress.

He is absolutely not mentioning the middle class tax cuts and the unemployment benefits nor the payroll tax cuts. He has zero clues that it actually is a Stimulus 2.0 because the the first one was not enough. It is sloppy partisan hackery at its finest.

Should Obama tell the poor that the 50% tax hike is good for them? Should Obama tell the unemployed that are a check away from living in the streets that sacrifice is what is needed right now?

Just for good measure, he has Bernie Sanders on with his talking points. Sanders seems clueless that the votes in the Senate that led to nothing had already been shot down and that something had to be done before the tax hike for the middle class and the poor as well as the unemployed become the political purist parlor talking pieces that some appear to care about more than reality.

Also, just to prove that all of this is over his head, Ed pulls out his best Glenn Beckian paranoia by suggesting that Obama and "the centrists" are somehow in cahoots to take down Social Security.

When is Ed getting a chalkboard, ferchrissakes... Big Ed, a registered Republican to this day, agrees with many of the Fox News PNAC signatories on the Obama plan. You connect the dots.

:crazy:

[madfloridian]

1. "political purist parlor talking pieces that some appear to care about more than reality"

Getting tired of the use of the word purist.

[zulchzulu]

4. "Purist" fits

I have friends who are "purists". It's usually their way or the highway. It's usually based on a complete lack of information on a subject and the ability to not even consider realistic thoughts.

I still love those friends. They keep me laughing.

[madfloridian]

10. The continued use of such words will do irreparable harm..

to our party.

I am tired of having people refer to us as uninformed.

Some of us really do care about the future of our country.

[hlthe2b]

18. And here is a word in retort...."snide"

Synonymous here for "ugly and unnecessary generalizing."

Can't you discuss in a constructive way that doesn't put everyone who disagrees with you down?

[zulchzulu]

36. Oh please...

If I have the intellectual understanding that this Obama deal has to work since the Senate can't get 60 votes for even those making a million dollars a year and see that the Middle Class, the Poor and the Unemployed will take a huge hit if the deal doesn't get passed, I (and others) are accused of being "centrists" and not even Progressive.

I have plenty of street cred out in the streets doing grassroots work for progressive issues since the fucking Reagan administration. If I think we need to work on this temporary solution to help out the Middle Class, the Poor and the Unemployed at a time when it would be disastrous, I'm accused of not being a whatever... I DON'T CARE.

With the likes of purists (and that's what they are) who would rather be incoherently and divisively and intellectually dishonest, all I can say is LEAVE The Democratic Party and start your own Parlor Talk Party. Get your goofy candidate to run and get your ass firmly kicked in the ass.

Rant off.

[hlthe2b]

37. Such stridency from someone who advocates pragmatism...

poses an amazingly foolish paradox for returning Obama to office. We may well need every segment of his 2008 support--something you might keep in mind, rather than insulting others who largely share your ideals.

[dflprincess]

42. If Obama was truly pragmatic he'd be looking at what was best for the country in the long run

not cutting back room deals for a short term fix.

[hlthe2b]

43. My comments were referring to the poster...

and their rather divisive comments towards those who disagree with them. I was not referring to Obama at all. I believe you misunderstood.

[dflprincess]

45. Sorry, I did post in the wrong spot

Though, the posters who claim to be pragmatic, also tend to tout Obama's so called pragmatism. Something that is not in evidence with this bill.

[hlthe2b]

46. ...

yup...;)

[Donnachaidh]

58. wow -- ever look up the definition of cognitive dissonance?

*purist* completely covers this tantrum OP. Name-calling, bashing -- it's a Free Republic rant!

Oh boo hoo -- Big Ed doesn't toe the line, he's not wearing the blue jackboots! Waaaaaa.... :eyes:

[sasha031]

2. lol, here we go bash Big Ed, he's a closet Repug

:popcorn:

[DemocratSinceBirth]

23. Res Ipsa Loquitur

Schultz's News and Views radio show was very similar to his WDAY Viewpoint program and quickly grew into a regional broadcast dominating the North Dakota airwaves, with additional listeners in South Dakota, western Minnesota, Montana, Manitoba, and Saskatchewan. Schultz's political views leaned towards the right during the early years, and Schultz told the Los Angeles Times that he "lined up with the Republicans because they were anti-tax, and I wanted to make a lot of money...." Schultz pondered a run as a Republican for the U.S. House of Representatives against Democratic Rep. Earl Pomeroy in 1994, but decided against it after visiting with state Republican leaders.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ed_Schultz

He made a wise career move. Repg radio is saturated. All the empty space in on the left.

[sasha031]

25. Evolution of political views

In the late 1990s, several events occurred which he said changed his political leanings to a more liberal understanding. One was his mother's (a former educator) battle with Alzheimer's Disease which began a long, slow decline of her mental health. Schultz found it frustrating trying to get her the services that she needed. The other was that he met a psychiatric nurse named Wendy who ran a homeless shelter in Fargo.<13> He attributed much of his political change to her, and although he had criticized the homeless on his show, he said in his book that she helped to humanize them. To his surprise, he found that some of the people he had insulted were veterans, and many were unable to get the psychiatric or medical services that might help them. He says that was the moment he began to look at poverty differently.<14>
He became a Democrat in 2000 marking the formal turn in his politics from conservative to liberal. He went out to do radio promotions in rural North Dakota, and told reporters about how he met farmers who were suffering and hard-working people who were going hungry, even though Republicans said the economy was doing fine. (Vowell 2004) He began to hold benefits to raise money for people in the heartland who were going through tough times.<15> In addition, he began questioning some of the assertions of George W. Bush; although he supported several Republican candidates in the 2000 election, he was becoming critical of other Republicans. Schultz considered running for the Democratic-NPL party nomination for governor against incumbent Republican John Hoeven in 2004, but decided to continue his career in radio.
Not all of his views are considered liberal though. He is pro-life (but doesn't want Roe v Wade overturned), and against gay marriage (but is not pushing for any kind of legislation outlawing it).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ed_Schultz

[sasha031]

27. facta non verba

Causes

Schultz has championed the plight of the 99ers, laid-off United States workers who have exhausted their unemployment benefits (video).<16>
On August 4, 2010, Schultz hosted the announcement of Senator Debbie Stabenow's (D-MI) The Americans Want to Work Act (S. 3706), which would extend unemployment benefits to 99ers and provide employer incentives to hire the long-term unemployed (video).<16><17>

[MadHound]

3. This isn't a stimululs, far from it.

It is tax cuts and tax credits, that is all. The only stimulative portion of the bill, the extension of UI, could have been passed with a little bit of fighting and gamesmanship on the part of the president and Congress. Instead the president did a faceplant cave, and we are all going to suffer for it.

And you don't think that Social Security isn't on deck to be cut? Haven't you been paying attention?

Well, when that happens, don't be surprised, you were warned.

[zulchzulu]

7. Let's see an honest concise assessment as to how this deal will destroy Social Security

I would assume your silence on the matter tells me that it's all a conspiracy wrapped inside an enigma...

:hi:

[MadHound]

19. First of all, I don't have to hang on your every post and answer you immediately

So stop demanding that I answer you. I will get back around to you when I get back around to you. You are like an impatient, whiny child, wanting everything now.

Now, back to the cuts on Social Security: First, the enormous amount of debt we're adding on with this bill. Early next year(wait, I can hear them now) there will be renewed calls to cut the debt down, to cut spending. We're already hearing these calls, and now that the cherry has been popped on daring to touch the third rail, it will be firmly grasped and SS will be cut, probably sometime in the upcoming year, perhaps as soon as this spring. I can easily see a scenario where the debt ceiling will be raised in exchange for spending, ie SS, cuts.

You don't believe me, you don't want to believe me, that's fine. I guess we'll know who is right, who is wrong in a year. It will be one of the most sorrowful times I will have to say "I told you so"

[frazzled]

16. Even Krugman thinks it is

Mr. Obama got a significant amount of short-term stimulus. Unemployment benefits were extended; there was a temporary cut in the payroll tax; and there were tax breaks for investment. Incidentally: how, exactly, did we get to the point where Democrats must plead with Republicans to accept lower corporate taxes?

Unemployment benefits aside, all of this is very much second-best policy: consumers would probably spend only part of the payroll tax break, and it’s unclear whether the business break would do much to spur investment given the excess capacity in the economy. Still, it would be a noticeable net positive for the economy next year.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/10/opinion/10krugman.html

True, he doesn't think it's a long-term (i.e., for 2012) POLITICAL benefit (but then, Krugman is an economist, not a political analyst, as he's proven time and again), but he admits it's a short-term stimulus. I guess I'll listen to the Nobel prize-winner in economics, instead of a random person I don't know on the Internet.

[MadHound]

22. Again, every economist, including Krugman,

Agree that tax cuts and tax credits are the least effective form of economic stimuli going. Yes, since we're throwing billions and billions of tax cuts in the pot, there will be some stimulative effect, especially over the short term. But at what cost? Long term economic disaster as our debt increases, revenues decrease, which will lead to cuts in spending, especially cuts in SS and Medicare.

We would be getting a much better stimulative effect if we were to let these cuts expire and direct a significant portion of that money towards a true WPA style job creation program. Or increasing food stamp benefits, or any one of a dozen other more effective stimulus strategies.

[frazzled]

Your "if" ... "then" statement is the clincher

No WPA style job creation program is going to pass this Congress, especially in a few weeks. No stimulus plans, period. So your hypothesizing is completely without real world consequences. As Krugman says, we got much more than expected and it will have a noticeable net positive effect.

If the middle class tax cuts expire, the economy (and many families) will be much worse.

[jaxx]

5. I was just thinking.....big Ed has gone self-righteous.

And loud er.

[FrenchieCat]

6. Yep...I gave up on Big Ed.....unfortunately.

He seems quite impressed with himself though....
and I guess that's what counts.
A political strategist or an economist, he ain't.
But then I watch no television these days for now....
otherwise, I'd be sitting there talking to my television...
Cause alas, I'm starting to realize that I know more than
Most folks getting paid the big bucks on the Teevee,
and it shouldn't be that way. :(

Maybe he's over compensating for the fact that his taxes will now stay low,
and doesn't want anyone to pick up on that. He's probably right there at the
limit, and therefore might have gotten hit the hardest, taxwise.

Who knows what lurks in the hearts of men, but if he can think the worse about Obama,
than I guess I'm at liberty to think the worse about Big Ed.

[ClassWarrior]

8. Take a real close look at your television. Somewhere, on the bottom front, or perhaps the side...

...is a power button. Use it and please spare us the histrionics.

NGU.

[zulchzulu]

9. Is someone is on the tube with lots of viewers and is full of shit, I plan on trying to answer back

I won't cry like Boehner.

[polmaven]

21. Even his own poll

last Friday night "Should the democrats keep fighting against the president's tax cut plan" (that is the gist...the exact wording may be a little off)................... Y 49% ; N 51%.

[Vinnie From Indy]

12. +1 Amen!

cheers!

[zulchzulu]

13. Yay! Just shut it off! Like facts! n/t

[CakeGrrl]

15. Trying to stifle dissenting opinion, are we?

Does that go for the histrionics that accompany some of the assertions that Obama is a closet Manchurian Republican puppet to his corporatist masters?

Or are THOSE histrionics OK as long as they support your beliefs?

[ClassWarrior]

24. No, that sucks as well. I'm saying if Ed's a hack, why not just ignore him?

And talk about histrionics: "Trying to stifle dissenting opinion, are we?"

:eyes:

NGU.

[zulchzulu]

38. He's a "progressive" on MSNBC

I say he isn't.

If I want to torture myself, I can.

:hi:

[ClassWarrior]

40. Torture away, my fellow Sconnie. Torture away...

:hi:

NGU.

[CakeGrrl]

11. Denial is the only way to keep advancing his argument

It's as if those who want to fixate on only ONE component - the upper-income tax cut - are talking themselves into thinking that no one who receives unemployment checks to survive or are looking for the extra tax cut money in their pocket are going to notice or care that those are going away.

That "reasoning" is baffling.

[jenmito]

14. K&R. I said the same thing and was thinking of starting a thread titled, "Ed Schultz is Stupid."

Don't forget, during the health care debate, he said on more than one occasion that congress should wait 'til after the midterms when the Dems. could get a larger majority!

[otohara]

17. God Forbid We Sacrifice

flip/flop America

[FrenchieCat]

20. Many already are sacrificing,

in case you didn't notice. Not everyone is lucky like some folks here.

[Donnachaidh]

59. yeah, those 99ers Obama left out of this tax giveaway

Those folks are suffering.

Too bad they got *disappeared* before this tax deal was cooked up. Would have punched up the numbers of bodies Obama used to cover the giveaways to elites.

[golddigger]

26. Maybe they should put Ingram, Limbaugh or Beck

in his place?

[Cali_Democrat]

28. ....

:popcorn:

[AtomicKitten]

29. Big Ed isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer, but he means well. nt

[Raine]

51. Ed speaks for the ordinary working man & woman

unfortunately there is much elitism here in DU. :-(

[JoePhilly]

54. Big Ed is confused.

The majority of Americans are not with him on this. The middle class is not willing to give up their own personal tax cut just to make sure that the rich don't get theirs.

If Obama let's the middle class tax cuts expire, the media will claim that Obama broke a major campaign promise to NOT raise taxes on those making under $250,000.

That is how it will play out on every channel, including on MSNBC. I saw Chris Jansing on MSNBC say EXACTLY that yesterday on MSNBC.

[KoKo]

30. Oh Give it a Break! You'd rather listen to Limpballs or Beck?

Why do you give Ed such a hard time?

[zulchzulu]

31. Ed SOUNDS LIKE Limpballs AND Beck

That's my point!

[KoKo]

32. I guess folks hear what they want to hear. I wonder if you listened to his Radio Show

that was on AA and then moved off to other stations. I get mine through liberal Chapel Hill, NC radio station..and it's so good not to have Religous Radio or Limpballs for hours...but to have Ed Schultz and and Thom Hartmann to listen to where I live.

Maybe where you live you have lots of Progressive Radio...so you don't know what we out here in the rest of the country have for limited choices.

Ed's radio show is even MORE PROGRESSIVE than his MSNBC GIG, though. And, he's warned us that he has to "tone it down" for him MSNBC GIG.

I'm glad to have at least two on radio and four on Cable that don't treat me like an idiot.

That's why I was sad to see that you thought so little of his show. But, as I said, you maybe have access to much better Radio and TV than many of the rest of us do where we live in the USA. If so you are lucky and should feel free to say he's not Dem Enough...but the rest of the shit we have is enough to have to turn it off and be silent or if you have access ...just listen to your I-Pod if you can't stand anymore of the RW Radio and TEEVEE.

[zulchzulu]

34. I gave up on listening to Ed after I could see he doesn't do his homework

I like Mike Malloy if only because even if I think he might be over the top, he's at least funny as hell. Ed tries too hard and frankly I find his claptrap very predictable, pedestrian and self-glorifying.

Give me Randi, Stephanie, Mike and Thom. The rest of them suck.

[KoKo]

41. Mallow and Hartmann are one's I listen to also...but

Randi and Stephanie get me crazy.. So ...at least we have a variety now. Not like in the old days. But,it's hard for some of us to get them without Satellite radio. And only time I can get Randi and Stephanie are when I'm on the road with that radio.

Otherwise for most of us it's hours of Rush and other RW or Religious Preaching Radio. Ed has gotten better through the years with his facts, though. And, I understand his voice is similar to Rush..but that's why he's getting an audience for us. Sounding like Rush.

[WiffenPoof]

47. Really? They Suck?

"Give me Randi, Stephanie, Mike and Thom. The rest of them suck."

Really, they suck?

[Supersedeas]

56. they hear and merely want to provoke divisiveness between progressives

Like Limpball and Beck....wow, I guess submstance means nothing when cheerleading and personality worship has been a substitute for political discourse.

[Bluenorthwest]

33. So your message to the 99ers is:

You are not rhetorically useful, thus you do not exist, and your starvation and homelessness is your own concern.
Got it.

[zulchzulu]

35. And you are for raising taxes on the poor by 50% and the middle class by 12%

Yeah. But at least you're "purer" than me....

:crazy:

[brentspeak]

48. Are you sure it's Ed who's the Republican and not you?

"And you are for raising taxes on the poor by 50% and the middle class by 12%"

Who's taxes are being "raised"? Allowing the tax cuts to expire -- as Obama vowed to do for years -- would not result in a tax "raise", but just restoring them to pre-cut levels. Only the GOP, Fox News, RW talk show hosts -- and, now, the Obama administration itself -- refer to the expiration of the tax cuts as a "tax raise".

[burning rain]

39. If I watch something at 6pm EST, it's "Democracy Now!" with Amy Goodman.

Edward Shoutypants isn't really my cup of tea.

[DaveofCali]

44. Randi Rhodes is a White House hack, so we are even...

[Clio the Leo]

49. He's not a partisan hack...

... he's a peanut head! ;)

[donheld]

50. I'm with ED

[jefferson_dem]

52. Oh, good Gawd... Did he really "go there"?

Guess someone has to balance out Beck's "teh crazy"... Might as well be Big Eddy. :crazy:

[BlueGirlRedState]

53. Give me Randi Rhodes any day

I can only take Ed in small doses -- like once a month. But I listen to Randi every day.

[niceypoo]

55. Randy is barely above Ann Coulter

[zulchzulu]

60. Who's Randy?

I like Randi!

[Phx_Dem]

57. He's under the delusion that the tea party loves the tax deal.

But in reality, they right in line with the progressives.

:crazy: