Maybe This Is A Teachable Moment For Joe Lieberman

[DemocratSinceBirth]

I believe he is one of the "without whoms" DADT would not have been repealed, ergo:

Gillibrand: This issue is so important to so many of the Democrats -- both Mark Udall <(D-Colo.)> and I have been working very hard -- but we asked Sen. Lieberman to take the lead. He brings and commands so much respect both with the Democrats and with the Republicans

As the senior member of the Armed Services Committee, we could think of no better person to be the leading voice for this bill, and that's why we asked him to take the lead from the very beginning.

http://metroweekly.com/poliglot/2010/12/talking-with-lieberman-were-on.html

Maybe he will see what a hateful old man his erstwhile buddy, John McCain , truly is and why such a hateful old man should never had the opportunity to lead this nation...

[bluestateguy]

1. I think it shows he's running for another term in 2 years

And he's starting the long process of earning back support from the left. He still has much work to do. Don't be surprised if he comes out in favor of withdrawing from Afghanistan next year too.

Republicans will probably run a real candidate against him this time.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

2. All That May Be True But He Was Indispensable On This Issue

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[Lasher]

4. Is that you, Joe?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

8. Maybe Santa Will Leave You "Reading Is Fundamental " Under Your Christmas Tree

Gillibrand: This issue is so important to so many of the Democrats -- both Mark Udall and I have been working very hard -- but we asked Sen. Lieberman to take the lead. He brings and commands so much respect both with the Democrats and with the Republicans

As the senior member of the Armed Services Committee, we could think of no better person to be the leading voice for this bill, and that's why we asked him to take the lead from the very beginning.

http://metroweekly.com/poliglot/2010/12/talking-with-lieberman-were-on.html

[Lasher]

11. I see you didn't answer my question.

I think you look just like Willie Tanner.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

12. Deleted At The Request Of My Lighter Angels

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[Lasher]

37. Hee hee, OK I surrender.

Happy holidays to you and yours.

Lasher

[Bumblebee]

3. Does not have to be all political; can be personal. He may have close relatives

who are gay. His comfort level with the issue, and the seeming genuineness of his conviction tells me that he in fact does.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

5. Growing Up A Minority I Am Sure He Felt The Iron Heel Of Oppression At One Time Or Another

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[martymar64]

27. Rich is a minority that doesn't get oppressed

If he ever was poor or middle class than he is a traitor to that class. He helped kill the Public Option.

[Bluenorthwest]

35. You need to learn some history

Rich often matters not. The wealth or lack of wealth an individual might have does not mitigate the oppression they might also suffer. Wealth was simply taken and the holders killed in WW2.
But let's take a look at less stressful examples. Take the great story of Madame CJ Walker, an African American woman who by about 1910 had become a cosmetics millionaire. Her parents and elder siblings had been slaves. Obviously, Ms Walker never had the right to vote, and as was the case until the 60's, he wealth did not allow her to purchase real estate where she wished as there were restictive covenants and other tools of oppression in full action.
What a limited view you have.

[gateley]

13. Even Cheney supports gay rights, doesn't he? That's a good point,

Bumblebee, he may actually know some gay people (hell, his BFF Lindsey Graham!)and that may have been what influenced him.

[CTyankee]

10. He doesn't have a party to back him up. And I ain't seeing him raising any money.

As the saying goes, if they're not raising money they're not running.

The Dems have had it with him. Most of CT never sees the guy. Linda McMahon will probably get the puke nom cuz she pays her own way and the pukes don't have any money.

I think he is a dead man walking at this point.

[COLGATE4]

14. You got it. Joe only acts in Joe's own interest.

[martymar64]

26. We need to crush him in 2012

No other outcome is acceptable.

[StevieM]

31. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt that this is what he truly believes in (eom)

[Hippo_Tron]

32. I think he's going to run again but as an independent

His decision to obstruct health care reform and help kill the public option made absolutely no sense for somebody who wants to win a Democratic primary in a blue state like Connecticut. At the time I assumed it meant he was retiring in 2012 and going to be a lobbyist for health insurance industry and I'm still convinced that's the most likely scenario given his low approval ratings.

The only possible other explanation for it is that he traded his vote in exchange for Obama to come campaign for him during the Democratic primary and whatever else he got in exchange was simply window dressing.

[stray cat]

6. Maybe it can be a teachable moment for du - it is too easy to just see the fault in others

And demonize individuals who we disagree with on an issue

When it domes to bigotry the right and left just direct their bigotry against different groups

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

9. I Have Two Gay Friends Serving And Another Retired

This issue is personal to me.

[GinaMaria]

15. The issue is personal to me too

but I'm not gushing over that prick. You want to gush? Praise the activists who remained engaged on this issue since DADT was enacted. Their lobbying and organizing efforts should be praised too. And while I'm here, I'm not going to celebrate blue dogs and republicans who voted for this to be repealed either. Doing the right thing once doesn't merit a parade down main street. Working tirlessly for years and not giving up certainly does.

Good lord, the man is a troll who did one thing right and you act like we should be lining up to give him blow jobs.

Your energy would be better spent on those who have consistently fought for gay rights, than on this tool.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

16. If It Wasn't For A Few Brave Repubs Voting For Cloture DADT Would Not Have Been Repealed

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[GinaMaria]

21. I heard you the first 30 times

Politicians aren't brave. They weigh the risk vs. reward and cast their votes accordingly.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

23. Why Do Elected Officials Become Dems And Reps In The First Place?

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[GinaMaria]

24. What party is holy Joe in?

ultimately, they are for themselves and what benefits them. Dems used to connect to higher principles but as you can see by the division on this board, that no longer applies to all dems. They are elected and decisions must be made with that in mind. There are also campaign contributions to think of.

They don't vote their conscience. If they did we would never have compromise.

If you want to get on your knees for holy Joe, have at it. There are other people much more deserving of praise for this effort. You seem particularly fixated on Joe in multiple threads. It's surprising in it's volume.

There was something in this for blue dogs, repukes who voted for this. Their constituents might be a powerful reason in this case. Same with the troll.

Enjoy heaping all your worship on one feeble and severely flawed little man.

I am moving on to focus my energy on those who really deserve it; the very people who will continue to work against the DOMA.

[democrat2thecore]

18. One decent act? Joe is a leader on labor issues - everything is NOT all black and white - nt

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[martymar64]

28. He spoke against Democrats in a speech at the Republican Convention

And you say we should support this asshole?

No wonder Democrats get rolled time after time. You act like battered wives.

[avaistheone1]

29. I agree. Liberman is pretty bad.

I think he has done more bad than good for the Democratic party.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

36. We Shouldn't Support Him. That Was Messed Up What Lieberman Did Then

But the point of the thread is maybe through his fierce advocacy and tireless work to repeal DADT he saw the folly of John McCain working just as hard against its repeal and will come to realize what a mistake it was to support him for president.

[TheKentuckian]

30. Joe is a leader of the neocons and a shill for the insurance cartel

He is damn near an anti-civil libertarian, for crying out loud.

He has always been good on civil rights but he sucks as bad as a Teabagger on many critical issues and deserves to be culled from the herd as his reward.

[Petrus Romanus]

17. Teachable? Lieberman is one of the most progressive senators on social issues.

That doesn't excuse the fact that he's one of the most regressive on national security issues, but credit where credit is due.

[Warren Stupidity]

19. nope

[DemocratSinceBirth]

20. Give Me Time Warren

And I win ya over like I did on The Grand Bargain.

[martymar64]

25. Lieberman still needs to go away in 2012.

He is the traitor that gave a speech at the Republican Convention and has undermined democratic initiatives at every turn.

I would not piss on him if he were on fire.

He is not a democrat and he deserves to lose big in the next election. That will be a great day for America.

On the downside, he will likely get a job as a lobbyist for AIPAC and will still refuse to leave us the fuck alone.

[Hippo_Tron]

33. I'll be curious to find out if this was really about personal relationships when the book is written

Because if you ask just about anybody, personal relationships across party lines are pretty much dead in the Senate and you can't accomplish much of anything that way anymore. The narrative here is that Lieberman's personal relationships with Snowe, Collins, etc. was crucial to getting their votes. That defies pretty much everything one reads about the Senate these days. Perhaps the Republicans voted the way they did because they saw the change was inevitable and wanted to be on the right side.

This isn't to knock Lieberman. Regardless of how effective he was, he was certainly on the right side of this issue and a fierce advocate for it. I'm just really curious as to whether he was as important to the efforts as Gillibrand claims he was. If so, then that means there's some remnants of the pre hyper-partisan Senate left.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

34. I Have Read A Lot On The Issue And He Appeared To Be A Real Bridge To The Persuadable Republicans

My post and posts on this topic were not meant to be an endorsement of Joe Lieberman but to highlight the fact that bad people can do good things and good people can do bad things. Look at some of the heroes on the left for evidence of that observation. If we can not extend that analysis to those we dislike we are no better than the hate filled Republicans we routinely decry...