This guy didn't get a trial either, in California. Will DU be flooded with outrage for him?

[YellowCosmicSun]

California slayings suspect killed in massive manhunt
Fugitive hid in redwood forests, eluded police for month after 2 officials found dead

A man suspected in the fatal shootings of a Fort Bragg councilman and a county land trust official was shot and killed Saturday after a massive manhunt in the redwood forests of Northern California, authorities said.
Mendocino County Sheriff Thomas Allman said Aaron Bassler was shot seven times some 6 miles east of Fort Bragg after he was sniffed out in the forest by a bloodhound tracking a nearby burglary. Three members of the Sacramento County's SWAT team were in the trees above Bassler and when they saw him coming toward them on a timber trail, they shot him.
Allman initially said Bassler, 35, raised his gun at the deputies as they approached, but later said he raised his rifle as he was falling from the gunfire.
"I wish that this incident could have ended without another shot being fired," Allman said. But, he added, "I fully support the manner in which this ended. There will be no more lives which will be endangered by Aaron Bassler."

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44743207/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/

al-Awlaki was not the first and will not be the last fugitive to be killed while evading capture.

[Tx4obama]

1. Check out the COMMENTS on the link below regarding the same OP article ...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2040056

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dkf]

2. An earlier post said in order to protect human rights you must defend the most heinous of the

Heinous. So I am sure they will.

[droidamus2]

4. Maybe I'm just being picky but

I think when most people hear the word 'assassinate' they think of this definition "to murder (a usually prominent person) by sudden or secret attack often for political reasons". So to try to set up what I see as a false comparison (not saying what the police did was right or wrong) by using the word 'assassinate' to connect the two situation is weak. Again not a fan of police shooting people but there is a big difference between confronting somebody with a rifle in the middle of the woods where it could be seen as reasonable you would be in fear for your life and dropping a drone on somebody that in the area of the world was apparently prominent and when the attack definitely has political overtones. Would I have liked to see both mean captured and tried? Absolutely. Are the two situations comparable? I don't really think so.

[YellowCosmicSun]

13. So you think California is more dangerous than Yemen? Baloney.

[droidamus2]

35. Confused

I'm not really sure what your point is. I grew up in Northern Califorina, Eureka to be exact, and though some of the jackasses that come from out of the area can be very dangerous during growing and harvest season for the most part the locals are cool. As far as Yemen, still know what that has to do with what I said, I have no idea what it is like there. The only point I was trying to make is that trying to equate a globally related politically influenced killing with a local manhunt where one is face to face and the other is dropping a clone on somebody isn't really valid. I would rather have seen both suspects captured and tried but in the end it is hard to make a call without all the facts.

[YellowCosmicSun]

37. " but in the end it is hard to make a call without all the facts." exactly.

and the White House has more facts than we do. wouldn't you agree?

[Vinnie From Indy]

5. As far as I know al-Alawki never shot anyone

carry on....

[Vicar In A Tutu]

6. No, he just encouaraged mass murder and plotted to blow up planes

But hey, because he wasn't successful that's okay. Next time we have to let them follow through before doing anything about it!

[Vinnie From Indy]

7. And you know these things to be true how?

Is this evidence valid or fabricated? Are there witnesses to corroborate this evidence? Would al-Alawki have denied all of the claims against him? Would he have argued that it was his right to call for the downfall of America and advocate violence against the US? Would that argument be upheld by the Supreme Court?

Please feel free to start with any of those questions.

Cheers!

[phleshdef]

8. Fuck your questions. He was openly a member of Al Qaeda.

[Vinnie From Indy]

10. Gee, just think of how much wasted time the founding fathers spent writing the Constitution

without you around. You could have saved them a great deal of time by drawing a huge X over the first draft and writing "Fuck your questions" across the page. Well done!

Cheers!

[phleshdef]

11. OMGZ! TEH FOUNDING FATHERS CARD!

The fact is, the AUMF grants the President the authority to use all force against, specifically, members of Al Qaeda. The Supreme Court has not overturned this law as unconstitutional. Therefore, it is the LAW of the land unless the Supreme Court were to say otherwise or Congress overturned it. Neither of those things has happened, so that is still the law, period. No getting around that fact at all.

[COLGATE4]

12. Slavery was also the law of the land. So your point is....?

[Ikonoklast]

32. That it WAS LEGAL until it wasn't anymore.

Until it was adjudicated as no longer Constitutional, it was the law of the land, and there was no court in this country that could rule otherwise.

Prohibition was once the law of the land, too...until it wasn't.

Don't like the law?

Work to change it.

[treestar]

34. Exactly! It's not like the government would prosecute

for things still legal and the ex post facto clause protects people where the law changes.

[phleshdef]

43. Slave owners broke no laws by owning slaves. So your point is....?

[Mr Deltoid]

27. Really convincing argument you floated there

[Cherchez la Femme]

38. Dupe, DU stutter

[Cherchez la Femme]

39. Dupe, DU stutter

[Cherchez la Femme]

40. Dupe, DU stutter

[Cherchez la Femme]

41. Gee, well I'M convinced with such logic!

:eyes:

[Vicar In A Tutu]

15. There has been plenty of his correspondance found

And indeed used in other court cases, such as that of the very guilty piece of scum working for British Airways. Away from that, he implored his people to kill Americans. We know that for a fact. He was not an American, he wouldn't have considered himself one, he was an enemy at war.

I find it deeply insulting to many people whose guilt is by no means a forgone conclusion to put this sort of scum in the same bag.

[treestar]

33. You don't know much about him

There are answers to those questions.

[Warren Stupidity]

9. They were attempting to arrest, not assassinate him.

Lets see if you can figure out the difference.

[YellowCosmicSun]

14. Is that why they shot first?!? Let's see if you can actually read the article.

[Warren Stupidity]

16. Seriously, you want to get into the details?

"Bassler, 35, had an assault rifle in hand, his finger near the trigger, when three members of a SWAT unit posted in the dense forest spotted him walking about 40 yards away along a timber road, Mendocino County Sheriff Tom Allman said.

The team fired. Bassler raised his weapon and they fired again, Allman said. Seven shots later, Bassler was dead, Allman said.

...

An extensive manhunt was launched in the timberland east of town immediately after Melo's death. Mendocino County sheriff's search teams were augmented by dozens of agents who arrived from agencies across California, including the U.S. Marshals Service.

Authorities had left numerous messages in the woods for Bassler with instructions about how to surrender.

But on Thursday, he opened fire on three Alameda County deputies aiding in the search. They fired back about 10times before he disappeared, deputies said."
http://www.pressdemocrat.com/article/20111002/ARTICLES/111009980/1033/sitemaps?p=2&tc=pg

This was not an assassination, it was an extensive attempt to arrest a violent mentally disturbed individual, an effort that ultimately lead up to the final confrontation in which Bassler was killed.

[YellowCosmicSun]

19. He was a cop killer. His chances of surviving were slim to none.

"Three members of the Sacramento County's SWAT team were in the trees above Bassler and when they saw him coming toward them on a timber trail, they shot him.
Allman initially said Bassler, 35, raised his gun at the deputies as they approached, but later said he raised his rifle as he was falling from the gunfire."

They shot first, asked questions later.

[bhikkhu]

17. ...and around 400 other American citizens killed each year by police

In most cases, its a matter of law enforcement being allowed reasonable measures of self defense.

I don't think trying to arrest al-Awlaki had been going very well, as that part had gone on for years, and he was surrounded by a heavily armed guard and had gone half-way around the world to avoid arrest.

If you look at what he said and did, like many others, he clearly made a choice and crossed the line. Nothing fuzzy about it.

[Honeycombe8]

18. Self defense. He raised his gun toward the officers. After hiding from them...

and refusing to be arrested (legally, running is evidence of guilt...remember that from the OJ trial?).

I have no problem with this, if that article is correct. I would not want to see any of the officers injured or killed, so I want them to do what they legally can to protect themselves. This guy was clearly armed and dangerous.

Any idiot knows that if you are being sought for arrest for murder, but you run, with your artillery, to the woods to evade arrest, that you will most likely be shot, if an officer runs across you in the woods. Assumption of the risk. He knew the risk. And more than that...he raised his gun to the officers, but they had seen him first and were the first to shoot.

[YellowCosmicSun]

20. look again.

"Three members of the Sacramento County's SWAT team were in the trees above Bassler and when they saw him coming toward them on a timber trail, they shot him.
Allman initially said Bassler, 35, raised his gun at the deputies as they approached, but later said he raised his rifle as he was falling from the gunfire."

They shot him before he even knew they were there.

Just like al-Awlaki.
Death from Above.

[COLGATE4]

22. If that's true, the cops should be prosecuted.

[ClassWarrior]

24. +1

NGU.

[Honeycombe8]

42. I still have no problem with that. What do you think they were supposed to do?

Shout at him, "Halt! Police officer!" So that he can raise his gun & shoot? ????

No, the guy was armed and dangerous and on the run, evading arrest for murder.

If he didn't want to be shot, he should've turned himself in and called a public defense attorney. Instead, he chose to be GI Joe, artillery soldier, and head to the woods, like one of those militia men.

Safety for the officers is the priority.

I have little pity for people who take actions like he did, putting others lives in jeopardy. If you found you were wanted for murder, would you gather your weapons (do you even HAVE any????), and head to the woods to live for who knows how long, to evade arrest? No, that's not the sort of thing an innocent person does. Or a person who is not dangerous.

I do take a hard stance with criminals. Cops put themselves out there on teh front lines, and have to confront very dangerous people and bring them in. A lot of them get injured or killed. Whatever they have to do to ensure they don't get hurt or killed seems okay, as long as it's legal.

If it's not legal, there will be an investigation and arrests.

[Mr Deltoid]

21. I have no clue what point you are trying to make.

[YellowCosmicSun]

23. You wouldn't. The point is that this is a normal occurrence in fugitive pursuit.

Many of whom never went to trial.
Just like al-Awlaki.

[Mr Deltoid]

25. I have seen five threads naming five different fugatives

Most of them murderers.

Yes, some people refuse to be captured alive. Criminals do that sometimes, your point?

[YellowCosmicSun]

28. How can you condemn them as criminals if they've had no trial??

That is what people were all hopping mad about Obama doing to al-Awlaki.

[Mr Deltoid]

30. you make zero sense

You also ignored what I was talking about

[YellowCosmicSun]

36. don't be obtuse. or do you really just not comprehend?

[frazzled]

26. From Fred Hampton on, every day in the USA

I posted this a few days ago and it got no responses, so I'll try again:

Start with Fred Hampton and continue with the more mundane, everyday murders of innocent (unarmed) people who were never charged with anything:

Last week, Kevin Drum wrote about Johannes Mehserle, the white former transit cop who was convicted of involuntary manslaughter for shooting and killing an unarmed black man, Oscar Grant, who was lying face down and handcuffed. ...

1999: "It looks like one guy may have panicked and the rest followed suit," a police official told The New York Times after the fatal shooting of 22-year-old Amadou Ahmed Diallo, a Guinnea-Bissau immigrant who was killed when four white New York police officers in plain clothes fired 41 shots at him, 19 of which hit his body. The officers said they thought Diallo was reaching for a gun when they shot him in the doorway of his apartment. Turns out it was his wallet.

2003: While surrendering on his knees in front of four Las Vegas police officers, Orlando Barlow is shot with an assault rifle by officer Brian Hartman from 50 feet away. Hartman argued that he feared Barlow was feigning surrender and about to grab a gun. Barlow was unarmed; a jury ruled the fatal shooting was "excusable." Hartman later resigned from the force a month before a federal probe uncovered that he and other officers printed T-Shirts labeled "BDRT" which stood for "Baby's Daddy Removal Team" and "Big Dogs Run Together."

2006: Just hours before his wedding, 23-year-old Sean Bell leaves the strip club hosting his bachelor party, jumps into a car with two friends, and is killed when police fire 50 shots into his vehicle, wounding his friends. Police say they opened fire after Bell rammed his car into an unmarked police van filled with plainclothes officers. They say they followed Bell and his friends outside the club suspecting that one person in their group had a gun. Referring to Bell and his friends, Mayor Bloomberg told the Associated Press "there is no evidence that they did anything wrong." A judge acquitted the officers of all charges in 2008.

2009

January 1: On New Years morning, three Bay Area Rapid Transit officers pull 22-year-old Oscar Grant and four other black men off a train in Oakland. You can view what happened afterwards in this Youtube video. In it, now former-transit officer Mehserle can be seen shooting Grant in the back.

June 10: Niles Meservey, 51, tries to drive away from a Washington state restaurant, but he's drunk. Officers are called to the restaurant parking lot to intervene. They block Meservey's car with their vehicles, shoot him with a Taser, and his car lurches forward. At that point, Officer Troy Meade fires seven shots with his handgun into Meservey's back, killing him.

2010

January 29: Portland police officers get a call to check on a suicidal and armed man at an apartment complex. Aaron Campbell, 25, comes out of the apartment walking backward toward police with his hands over his head. The Oregonian reports that police say Campbell ignored their orders to put his hands up. At which point one officer fired six bean bag shots at his back.

January 10: Porterville, Calif. police officers shoot and kill Victor Steen after stopping him for a traffic violation he committed while riding his bike. Officers say they struggled with Sheen, Tasing him, and chasing him to his mother's house where they broke down the door and the altercation continued, until they shot him.

June 5: Tyrone Brown, a 32-year-old former Marine from East Baltimore, is shot 12 times in a crowded bar after an off-duty Baltimore police officer fires 13 rounds at him for groping one of the officer's lady friend's.

http://motherjones.com/mojo/2010/07/when-police-shoot-unarmed-man-oscar-grant-verdict-Mehserle

[Tarheel_Dem]

29. Thanks for that.

:kick:

[Vattel]

31. Two relevant differences:

Number one: In Bassler's case, if the police headed out to the woods to assassinate him, then they would be subject to prosecution. Hopefully, they headed out to the woods to arrest him. Was there any attempt to arrest Awlaki? Or did we simply have an assassination attempt?

Number two: The police had an arrest warrant. There was judicial involvement in his case. Did it ever occur to you that much of the objection to the assassination of Awlaki is based on the lack of any judicial involvement?

[COLGATE4]

45. They don't see any differences. Their motto is "Shoot 'em all

and let God sort them out". Fuck the Constitution. After all, as Little Boots famously pontificated, "it's just a damned piece of paper".

[COLGATE4]

44. You've already posted this once. What's the point in your being obtuse?