Retired pastor knows why people don’t like Christians any more

[sufrommich]

Retired pastor Kirk Minor remembers a time when working with his church was centered around people, and not rhetoric – and he’s wondering where those days went.

“We’re finding more and more that there are a lot of people out there doing a lot of talking and protesting and bellyaching, but fewer people actually walking the walk,” said Minor, author of Journey Across The Tiber: My Many Rooms. “We have extremists protesting funerals of gay soldiers, pundits decrying the use of abbreviations for the word Christmas and activists campaigning for prayer in public schools. These are all very divisive issues, and have little to do with the good works the Bible wants the faithful to perform.”

Minor bemoans that the Bible has become a book with which to bludgeon people.

“Too many people are using religion as a sword to fight those with whom they disagree, instead of as a plowshare to help their fellow neighbors tend the land and form a community,” said Minor, who retired as a United Methodist Church pastor after 23 years.

The key to reversing the trend, according to Minor, is to use actions more than words, and for people of faith to quietly go about the good works and charity that is at the essence of the Bible’s teachings.

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/features-the-religion-world/2011/05/25/retired-pastor-knows-why-people-dont-like-christians-any-more/


Pastor Minor needs to come out of retirement.

[aquart]

1. Now there's a man of true faith.

[xchrom]

2. he remembers church the way i do -- many of us do.

i miss the haydays of the ecumenical movement and vatican 2.

[white_wolf]

12. I've heard Vatican 2 was a very good thing for the Catholic Church.

From what I've heard it open the doors of the Church to reform some of their more contentions doctrines such as the whole "outside the church there is no salvation" one and anything that can bring people together instead of fanning the flames of religious intolerance and division is good in my book. I'm not the biggest fan of organized religion, but I'll admit there is something I like about the Catholic Church and after reading this the Methodists don't seem too bad.

[xchrom]

13. i'm a fan of liturgical churches generally speaking.

and i was a fan of vatican 2 catholic church -- it gave a much more vibrant role to nuns -- i think they were heading to elevating the Virgin to redeemer status -- we're hoping some pope will do that soonish.

vatican 2 worked very closely with liberation theology movement in central and south america -- which ushered in a good deal more lay people inolvement with the church -- church from the bottom up.

[undeterred]

3. The other thing is the use of "christian" as a marketing tool.

Whenever I see the "Christian Business Directory" or websites and emails advertising something Christian I automatically think they're trying to pull something over on me. I avoid these businesses deliberately.

And I'm a Christian. Go figure.

[Dappleganger]

18. When churches have marketing directors instead of ministers to the poor...

there's a serious problem here.

One of numerous reasons we left organized church a few years ago.

True story: a few days ago dh and I went to a nearby historic town for lunch where we overheard a pastor, assistant pastor and music minister (we know them, they didn't know we overheard their conversation) discussing the fact that they *must* increase the numbers of people who come each week and donate money or the church was poised to go into foreclosure.

It was sad and ironic all at once.

[blondeatlast]

22. Me too; I won't patronize the "fish" bizzes, and I consider myself Christian too. nt

[Stevenmarc]

33. Yeah, if I see that damn ChristianSingles commercial one more time

[Beartracks]

34. LOL - Same here. On both counts. n/t

[slay]

4. Good stuff - and I'm not religious

but this guy is right on 100%. K&R.

[sufrommich]

6. I'm not religious either, but I respect the pastors understanding of

his beliefs.

[nichomachus]

5. He's mistaken

The WBC isn't protesting the funerals of "gay soldiers." They're protesting the funerals of all soldiers. In fact, officially, there aren't any gay soldiers. They're still being forced into the closet.

[RaleighNCDUer]

42. That is a hard conce[pt for rational people to get -

that WBC is protesting all the funerals because those deaths are god's punishment of America for America not burning gays at the stake. Like, if we only killed off all the gays, nobody would die.

That level of irrationality is simply beyond most peoples' grasp.

[cilla4progress]

7. United Methodist --

one of the more progressive Christian sects.

[xmas74]

69. It makes me proud to be a member.

I chose this church for my child and comments like what is stated in the OP make me feel as though I've chosen correctly.

[eagertolearn]

72. If I ever went back to church it would be to this one. In our conservative rural

Town they are very supportive of all people. My grandpa, who grew up going to two church services every Sunday, told me that religion was invented to control a wide body of people.....wow he was right.

[cilla4progress]

74. I agree -

most more like a country club, than anything else! I believe un-aligned is the new largest group of self-identified in U.S.? That is, in terms of religious practice, or association?

I am a Unitarian Universalist. We have our own good record on acceptance and open-mindedness. Some Christians refuse to even consider us a real religion!

[eagertolearn]

90. we don't have that here but that would be my first choice.

[The Backlash Cometh]

8. I've been seeing this for sometime.

The right-wingers have been using iconic figures to push and shove their agendas. Everything from the American flag, to military service, to Christianity.

[pipi_k]

9. So far the only ones I can stand...

are the Mennonites.

We have a bunch of them scattered around our small rural towns.

They appear to actually LIVE their faith. Don't know any personally, but I am pretty fond of them as a group.

:)

[Dappleganger]

19. Mennonites come in all flavors...

we used to be neighbors with quite a few. The old ones tend to really live their faith while the younger ones unfortunately are all over the spectrum.

[pipi_k]

21. I think the ones near me...

the young ones, I mean, are probably as stable as their parents and grandparents are. They appear to be, anyway...

[RayOfHope]

25. Around here they seem to sexually abuse young girls and also run puppy mills n/t

[sulphurdunn]

63. Once upon a time

I worked for the Peace Corps. I spent a lot of time working with a Mennonite rural development worker. He told me that the work I was doing was training for the real work that would begin when I came home. He was right.

[Scuba]

10. The right wing hijacked Christianity much like Arab extremist hijacked Islam. n/t

[Scuba]

11. The right wing hijacked Christianity much like Arab extremist hijacked Islam. n/t

[Lydia Leftcoast]

14. Not all of it, but the fact that they use "Christian" to refer exclusively to themselves

has confused a lot of people from outside the faith. (In the minds of the right wing fundamentalists, Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholics and Lutherans and Episcopalians aren't "Christians" because they're not American-style fundamentalists, even though they existed for centuries before American-style fundamentalism sprang up in the late nineteenth century.)

[Hardrada]

37. I've been pissed about this since about 1980.

It's like saying you're from Minneapolis but you really mean only Edina or Plymouth. And my family was Lutheran (CHRISTIAN!) for centuries. The Hopperstad stavekirk is in our backyard in Norway.

[Diclotican]

68. Hardrada

Hardrada

http://no.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hopperstad_stavkirke

:hi:

Diclotican

[Hardrada]

82. Hopperstad Church

Takk! Min familie name i Norge var Hopperstad (Hoprekstad). I Vike i Sogn. I Telemark min famile var Dahlen. Great (I have used up my Norsk for now) great granduncle was Sondre Norheim of the Telemark skis! I was going to visit Norway this summer but we discovered everyone is in vacation in July so we will visit next June. My wife's family is Rodland fron near Bergen. How have you been? :D

[Diclotican]

89. Hardrada

Hardrada

Hey, iM Fine.. Have lurked on DU for some years now.. A lot of things is happening too Your family is from the west coast of Norway I see, thats a nice place. Even tho it might have been a hard place to live when your ancestors desided it was time to leave for better life over the atlantic.

You can wisit Norway in the summer to, even tho your family might not be there then.. July is often the time when most norwigians is out traveling, one way or another..Many is also traveling to other parts of the world, to get some sun, and experiences other country's But many also are traveling inside our country to discover other places than they do on a regular basis.

Ah, you are also in the familiy of Sondre Norheim, who made telemark ski famous.. Great;)

Bergen is a nice city, thats for sure. Even tho it can be little wet there, as it is in the west coast.. But it is still one of the finest City's in Norway I would say.. Also a old capital of Norway, before Trondheim and then Oslo get that role (sinde 1200s Oslo have been the capital in Norway)..

ps, your norwigian is maybe little rusty but I got your message;).. English and norwigian is little different as a friend of me is learning, as he is trying to learn norwigian, from England:P But he does great, he can get a few sentences now, after 2 weeks, in norwigian.. So I guess everyone CAN if they want;)

Diclotican

[sufrommich]

55. I think there is a huge Catholic presence in right wing politics.

I'll have to go look for it, but I remember reading that there are as many Catholic right wingers as there are Baptist.

[roamer65]

15. I like Christ, but I don't like Christianity.

Gandhi was right and I agree with him.

[johnroshan]

86. I think the actual quote goes something like this..

"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."

[sofa king]

16. "Those who beat their swords into plowshares will work for those who don't."

No particular point, here. Just an observation I remember reading on a file cabinet somewhere.

[RainDog]

31. so religion is about dominance to you?

I guess all those working class folks who are getting screwed over by the bankster bailout, etc. just haven't been fussing loudly enough (or voting) based upon religious beliefs they want to impose upon others.

religion as dominance does explain the hatred toward females that has been demonstrated by the religious right in regard to health care issues.

the reality is that some people will be hurt but the larger reality is that the majority of the American public supports a woman's right to make medical decisions without any interference from any religious group.

I think the ballot box will bear this out in the next election.

[sofa king]

59. Heh. What?

Okay, I don't care if you were replying to someone else, I'll respond to that.

I think religion is a natural consequence of a basic conflict between our biological mission to survive and reproduce, and our wonderful predictive abilities, which tell us that we're going to fail in at least one of those two things, no matter what.

As for religion, well, each one serves itself first, and builds a shell of conservatism around itself to protect that line of profit. I think so many religions hate women because women have a sort of immortality that men do not have--it is they who reproduce, while men just deliver a payload.

I think religions' preoccupation with reproduction--whether for or against it--has everything to do with asserting their imaginary power over the very real power of childbearing.

Childbearing, and the personal decision whether or not to do it, is a tangible power that women have that we should be venerating. Unfortunately it conflicts with religion's need to get rich, tell people what to do, and hold a wrathful magical sky pixie just out of reach.

Who would put up with that bullshit if they figure out that there are three and a half billion goddesses walking the earth right now?

[RainDog]

77. I think religion serves different purposes

depending upon how a person chooses to use his or her beliefs.

explaining the unknown was a long-standing reason - what's now called "god in the gaps." before we had the tools to understand a lot of the workings of the physical world, god was a convenient catch-all.

explaining human actions was another purpose. to call something sin, however, is far less useful for most people these days - our understanding of motivation is much more sophisticated than stone-aged descriptions - but we, as humans, seem to universally recognize such characteristics as greed and hatred and their opposites in community and compassion. - cultures may define exact instances differently, but it seems that there is no religion that finds it is good to penalize the poor for their circumstances or to reward the rich for the fortunate circumstances of their lives.

all religions that I can think of at this time require that the rich give to those who have less - the exception to this would seem to be right wing religious groups in the U.S. at this time - which is a reality that leads me to believe that their heresy is akin to a blasphemy of the holy spirit - an unforgivable sin in the view of some - that stems from using god as a bludgeon to hurt those with less power, rather than lift them up.

religion provides a way to exert control over others by creating taboos and "in groups" and "out groups" - religion provides a way to define enemies beyond not liking someone or some action - it allows groups to claim their view is beyond human reason because they claim their god says do this or that. such thinking is antithetical to the foundational statements of our form of govt and those who used their human reason and wisdom to form it.

the relationship between fear and religion is a really interesting aspect of human behavior, seems to me. fear of want, fear of death, fear of strangers, fear of alienation from others - of not belonging to some group - again, the capacity to cite an omniscient authority allows some to use greed and hatred rather than compassion and community as a way to function as a group and make their way of being "normal" while the other is "abnormal."

just as women are not the bringers of evil or sin - they are also not goddesses.

the power that men find and fear in women is the same power that women find and fear in men - a desire for one another.

that's about our reality as carbon-based life forms with an imperative to attempt to reproduce - whether we actually want to reproduce at that moment or not - our basic drives exist because we were formed over millions of years of lives on this earth - their success is ours.

[tavalon]

17. When I complain about false Christian's and true Christians,

the one's he's talking about I label false and he seems to be real.

[Angry Dragon]

20. 'Pastor Minor needs to come out of retirement.'

That is the kind of religion that most people could live with

[polmaven]

57. Actually, that is more prevalent than it appears.

You'll note the pastor said Christians should "quietly" go about doing the the work the bible tells us to do. .....THAT is the difference. The Westboro types get the attention from the press because they broadcast their intentions so loudly and widely.

Those Christians who quietly, but ACTIVELY go about such things as on-site relief efforts in places such as New Orleans, Nicaragua, Haiti, North Carolina, Alabama, and now Joplin and Oklahoma....and many more missions, do not get, nor do they want a lot of publicity.

[lfairban]

23. Being a Christian is like being a leader.

If you have to tell people you are, you aren't.

[Curmudgeoness]

24. Finally, we have found a Christian.

They are all running around spouting out that they are Christians, but this pastor understands it.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

26. From the N.S. Sherlock Research Institute.

[penndragon69]

27. I don't trust them.

The righteous right will try to destroy anything that opposes them.
It's better to let their cult die and go away like it should have
done over 1000 years ago.

[silverlib]

28. Being a rather "non-active" Methodist...

who has ordained friends in different places, both active and retired - the general consensus is that you cannot speak like this while you are still in the pulpit. It's still all about money and what pulls it in - and unfortunately, in today's environment, this man's words would run off monetary supporters. The UMC is very liberal with Social Principals, but conservative in the pulpit. Even with some progressive principals, gays are still not recognized as pastors and pastors are not allowed to perform civil ceremonies. The Methodist Church has some growing to do, as does all organized religion. It's rather like democracy - if it revolves around money and panders to those who have it, it will not work.

[xmas74]

71. It does.

I chose this for my child instead of the church I was raised in but I still feel that there is some growing to do. I think that many members would have no problems with expanding LGBT recognition into all areas of the church. The only problem is some of the oldest members with the most money and the biggest mouths have the most pull.

I live in a small town. A few years ago my local newspaper published what was basically a gay engagement announcement. (The two men didn't say they were engaged but said they were having a ceremony announcing that they would spend their lives together. Same difference, imo.) Anyway, the Baptist churches in town lost it. The head pastor wrote an LTTE, as did 20 of his congregation members, stating that unless the paper printed an apology they would never buy another copy and that they were cancelling their subscriptions. Two days later, my pastor wrote an LTTE in support of the two men and mentioned that there were more important things to worry about in our town, listing a few dozen things for people to involve themselves with instead. Over the next week 50 members wrote positive LTTE, congratulating the couple and making a pledge to do something for the community in their honor. ( I wish I could send links to all of it but the local paper online is now subscription only!)

I was proud to be one of the letter writers. I'm also proud to be a member of the church. I think in the near future the tide will turn-it already is.

[FourScore]

29. I always liked the Methodists. n/t

[Javaman]

30. the Bible has always been a book with which to bludgeon people. nt

[MrMickeysMom]

32. In other words.... religion doesn't work...

However, mythology teaches us about the universe and how people on planet earth can get through each day.

Ah, if we could only get past the non-taxed messengers competing with each other's version of it whilst asking for our money.

[divvy]

49. Yes .... they are a tax-free Republican PAC

Tax them all and put them on the same footing.

[liberation]

35. It is always those false Scotsmen the ones who make the true Scotsmen look bad...

Funny thing, that all powerful, omnipresent invisible guy up in the sky of theirs seems to be waaay too busy to show up for five minutes to let us know directly who are the real and who are the fake ones. Eh?

It has to be a bitch being so camera shy in a world full of cameras...

[Joe Bacon]

36. Sorry, but I'm not into ¢hri$tianity!

I've just seen the Crystal Meth Cathedral go into receivership here in California. Reading all the articles, everyone quoted in the articles spoke about MONEY. Not a peep about Jesus, but there was plenty of BSing about Je$u$...

I'd like somebody to take the ¢ and $ out of ¢hri$tianity and return it to plain old Christianity, but I doubt that will ever occur.

[dballance]

38. Yeah! for Him

He's the kind of minister I learned from. You help people out.

[enki23]

39. yeah, blah blah blah. their faith is just as good as yours. they're just assholes too, is all.

.

[Viking 1]

40. I say, without irony, Amen

K&R

[rationalcalgarian]

41. The man is obviously a Communist

Lefty, liberal Commie! Hah! Using christianity to help people?????? Jeebus would stomp his pinko face into hamburger!

Only white wealthy males are worthy of christian blessings! After 23 years as a christian huckster, hasn't he figured that out?

It's a good thing christianity is bullshit, otherwise this would be serious. But since it is all fairy tales and make-believe, who gives a shit what this guy thinks. Why not do "good works and charity" because it's THE RIGHT AND HUMAN THING TO DO and fuck religion.

[calimary]

43. When I see rare items like this one, it does give me a little encouragement.

Pastor Minor has it completely nailed.

Hard to find any statement more true than this one:


"Minor bemoans that the Bible has become a book with which to bludgeon people."

A real keeper! Thanks for posting this, sufrommich!

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/features-the-religion-world/2011/05/25/retired-pastor-knows-why-people-dont-like-christians-any-more

:yourock:

[skepticscott]

50. When has the Bible NOT been used

to blugeon people? As well intentioned as Minor seems to be, he's still a bit too much of a "nice Christianity" cherry picker, assuming that his interpretation of scripture is more accurate than that of the people he decries.

Why not just concentrate on doing what he thinks is right, and not worry about injecting religious baggage into the process?

[calimary]

80. Point well taken. I'm a Catholic. And we have a very long tradition of using the Bible

to bludgeon, torture, scourge, hang, screw, burn alive, mutilate, decapitate, impale, dismember, and all kinds of other atrocities.

I went to Catholic school and sat through a ton of catechism classes and never once did I find ANY mention or quote from Jesus about how the rest of us must follow His example by doing any of those things to our brothers and/or sisters.

[Pubs_R_Racist]

44. Raping Boys, Killing Women and Drs

Tend to not shine a good light upon Christianity and exposes it for what it really is.

[Corruption Winz]

45. While I can understand where he is coming from...

at the end of the day, the Bible isn't the best plowshare. The people within the religious community that do the "strangest things" to outsiders, can easily find justification for their actions if they we're to even scan the pages.

It's simply not a decent moral barometer. Not accepting gay people, for example, is in the book. Clear as day. I could go on, but I think you get where I'm going with this.

[Corruption Winz]

46. While I can understand where he is coming from...

at the end of the day, the Bible isn't the best plowshare. The people within the religious community that do the "strangest things" to outsiders, can easily find justification for their actions if they we're to even scan the pages.

It's simply not a decent moral barometer. Not accepting gay people, for example, is in the book. Clear as day. I could go on, but I think you get where I'm going with this.

[divvy]

47. Don't get me started .......

There is NO way to fix Christianity because there is NO definition of what a Christian is. The KKK is a fundamentalist Christian outfit for crying out loud. You are a Christian only because you say you are. Nothing else is required. There is NO discipline therefore NO disciples.

[peace frog]

48. "...the Bible has become a book with which to bludgeon people"

I will believe the pastor's sincerity when he wields his influence to enlighten Christians whose hearts and minds have hardened against anyone different from them.

[sufrommich]

60. "I will believe the pastor's sincerity when he wields his influence to enlighten Christians"

How could you possibly know that the pastor wasn't doing that thoughout his career?

[peace frog]

64. That was then, this is now

Easy to decry the current situation, and good on him for speaking out publically, but as a *man of God* he could do more. He has the influence to presuade, to open parishioners' hearts and minds to the error in their interpretation of the bible.

[sufrommich]

65. Um, I think that's what he's doing with the editorial. nt

[peace frog]

67. Um, I think I applauded his editorial

but it's not enough to change the hard-hearted Christians of which he speaks.

[myrna minx]

51. Amen. n/t

[reggie the dog]

52. sorry, the key to reversing the trend is to completely abandon religion

[sufrommich]

54. Sure ,that's going to happen. nt

[reggie the dog]

66. over a third of us in France have abandoned religion and no loger

believe, in denmark it is over 40%, so about a 25 to 30% gain in athiests in the past 30 years. we are headed in the right direction.

[NorthCarolina]

53. Hate and anger feed the Po-Box better than compassion and good will. nt

[moondust]

56. "using religion as a sword"

And sometimes as a shield to hide behind when they do evil.

[Populist_Prole]

78. I notice this so VERY often

People who are overtly christian with a capital "C" are some of the most bellicose, mean, nasty, selfish 1-way SOB's I've ever met. Thoroughly insufferable. Oh, they'll express outrage and righteous indignation at all the right things that anybody else would; Little old ladies getting robbed, bags of kittens being tossed in the water etc, but mostly act as if since they all ready belong in the "good people" club, as if in a fully-paid lifetime membership and thus are "good people", that anything they do is OK. Some pull the "we are all imperfect" horseshit when called on their rotten behavior.

I'm thoroughly disgusted with them.

[moondust]

79. American Exceptionalism

"We can do whatever we want because God is on our side!"

I think Jesus would probably condemn most of them for their greed, selfishness, arrogance, and indifference to the plight of others.

[Mosaic]

58. Fighting wars in the name of Christ

Killing and genocide for hate, greed, ambition, and corporatism/fascism. That's what manifest destiny and american exceptionalism are all about. Total bullshit!

A true loving God will strike all these haters down figuratively or literally eventually.

[mikekohr]

61. Pastor Minor Sounds A Lot Like A Community Organizer, Like Jesus.

Who knows, with a mindset like this Pastor Minor may become president one day.

[sendero]

62. Christianity in this country..

.. is about property rights and nothing else. This guy is right, but he's dreaming if he thinks anything is going to change - most "Christians" could care less about anything Jesus actually said.

[Bluenorthwest]

70. Minor still sees the people who do wrong as Christians

and the rest of us as 'the other'. This is a declaration that his own kind are his own, although flawed. This is more 'you are the other' crap, gussied up for the Methodists. A Christian is a person who quietly does good works, self labels are, according the Jesus, of no value. The apple tree is the tree with apples on it, not the tree with oranges and a sign that says 'Apple Tree'. These people Minor castigates are orange trees, the atheist at the soup kitchen is an apple tree. What each tree thinks it is, that is not the point nor the truth. As one does, so one is.
The second you tell me that which should be self evident, I know it is not true, but just a thing being said. By declaring a 'faith' the entire concept of living that faith is flushed down the drain.

[veganlush]

73. Yes..n/t

[jimmy_dun]

75. I just sent this to my Mom

Dear Mom,

It's Sunday, so maybe its appropriate that I send along this article that really struck a chord with me...I've always thought of you and Dad, and the Methodist Church in general, as the perfect example of "people of faith to quietly go about the good works and charity that is at the essence of the Bible's teachings". I was very happy to hear your comment at Grandma's house the other day when you said that the Church should be "leading the way" by reducing the amount of disposable dishes used for meals. Its sad to think that the quiet parts of the Christian community do so much good in the world, while the more vocal parts spend their energy denying basic scientific facts (evolution, climate change), trying to limit access to women's health care, keeping non-whites and homosexuals in their place, blindly supporting wars that serve no purpose, and supporting politicians/corporations who are in this life for money and material goods. So therein lies the great paradox: although my own family is not active any any church, we strive to emulate the quiet parts of the Christian community, while supporting the exact opposite of what the vocal part represents.

OK, my email is now longer than the original article, so its time to stop preaching. Have a great day. Love, (Jimmy_dun_smoked_it_all)

[RainDog]

76. my sentiments, too

very nice email.

[RainDog]

81. kick - b/c it was reposted n/t

[Aerows]

83. You know why people are tired of Christians?

Because the people on TV that rant about Christians overwhelmingly are the least example of Christianity. I'm sick of religion, period, because it has just turned into a tool to control people and disadvantage them. The only people that seem to benefit off of being "Christian" seem to do the most harm to our society.

Religion is as much of a racket as war is. Both do nothing but condition people to believe in authoritarianism, and continually, fervently do things that are not good for themselves.

[coalition_unwilling]

87. If the Jesus of Nazareth actually returned to earth, the people who

call themselves Christians would be the first to call for his execution, preferably extra-judicially. See Dostoyevsky's "The Brothers Karamazov" and, specifically, "The Grand Inquisitor."

[Jakes Progress]

84. This was what I remember as a Methodist from my youth.

I've tried finding a church. All around me, the best are barely moral. The worst are hypocrites and liars.

[Duct Tape]

85. Although I'm

an Athiest and I would like to see all religion vanish, Pastor Minor is correct. If religion today was closer to his vision, the world would be a much better place.

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

88. Sadly, the vast bulk of U.S. churches are just part of the Republican GOTV machine these days

When I was a kid, I remember the elderly folks in my baptist church (of the WWI generation) would get angry if anyone brought up politics in the building. They didn't want to hear about it and considered it the kind of thing that can corrupt religion.

How times have changed.