Woman spanks kid. Man comments. Woman calls people to Shoot up bus full of people.

[drpepper67]

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/local/20110805_4_held_for_trial_in_bus_strafing.html

"Riding SEPTA's Route 47 bus late on the afternoon of June 18, Lefenus Pickett couldn't sit by as a young mother spanked her toddler for running in the aisles.

"I told her, that's child abuse, that's a little boy," Pickett said.

It turned out that the woman was not interested in unsolicited parenting advice.

Pickett, 37, told a Philadelphia judge Thursday that he watched the angry woman call someone on a cellphone, then sat stunned when the bus stopped at Seventh Street and Cecil B. Moore Avenue and he saw two men with guns waiting on the sidewalk.

Pickett riveted the Municipal Court hearing as he narrated the incident - projected in court from a video captured by seven cameras on board the bus as it was hit by 13 shots, with passengers diving to the floor."

[Supersedeas]

1. the things you will learn by spending some time at the Courthouse

[Jkid]

4. Tell us more about it. Are you a courhouse tourist?

[Supersedeas]

13. tours, bystanding, and other visits

but never at a courhouse...

some people even write novels about the stories collected from courtroom testimony, and live to tell about it.

[jberryhill]

17. Philadelphia City Hall is a tourist attraction

Gorgeous old building.

Tours every hour.

[slackmaster]

24. BTDT, and Betsy Ross's house, and the Liberty Bell

And a few other famous attractions. It was a great city to visit.

[jberryhill]

25. You know how much people pay for stage coach and train "robberies" at Western-themed attractions?

Philly provides the same excitement of gunmen attacking your public transportation vehicle for FREE!

[slackmaster]

26. I spent several weeks in Detroit years ago working on a project for the Riverview school district

It was rather entertaining. Just about every day there was some kind of hostage situation or SWAT operation on the local TV news.

[Patiod]

42. Watch it, Jberry, or we'll start giving you the full LynnSinn Delaware torture

complete with jokes about state size and toll roads.

But your point is taken. I got into a debate with someone from the Gungeon a while ago where they accused me of hysteria because I said that I was worried about shootings in broad daylight in our central city area. I should have just prefaced my comments by saying I was from Philly....

[jberryhill]

46. Lol.... I'm a Delaware native

[GCP]

56. It's not fucking funny

People could have been killed. The US is a joke.

[jberryhill]

57. There are a lot of people in the US

If you have 300 million people.

And you keep track of every "one in a million" dumbshit stunt that some idiot or collection thereof pulls every day.

Then you are going to have 300 dumbshit things to be enraged about every single day.

This incident on this bus does not render the entire US to be a joke, nor even Philadelphia, nor even West Philly.

I guarantee you that next week, you are going to see some story in the paper about some idiot or collection of idiots who has done an outstandingly idiotic thing.

Guaranteed.

[Ilsa]

2. The shooters and Chapman need to spend a long time in jail.

And Chapman's child might survive his childhood if she is sentenced and he ends up with a kinder, less angry family.

[aikoaiko]

33. I would be comfortable with life in prison for that behavior.

[Blue_Tires]

3. the comments at the bottom don't help, either..

[jpak]

5. Guns are the answer

not

[FourScore]

32. But don't you see...if ALL the people on the bus were armed

they could have protected themselves!

(Do I really need the sarcasm thingy? Better put it in.)

:sarcasm:

[Baby Bear]

40. If everybody had a gun

The mother could have shot the offending bystander,
Unless he shot her first for spanking the kid,
Unless the kid shot his mother first for spanking him...
Unless the mother had already shot the kid for misbehaving.

More guns, more possibilities open up.

[FourScore]

51. Exactly! Welcome to DU, Baby Bear!

I'll can see you'll fit right in!

:hi:

[JHB]

65. And even that assumes nobody misses....

...and hits someone else.

I think that's been my most effective tack with people making the "if everyone had a gun" argument: "Why are you assuming they all have good aim?"

Hits them from an angle they're not braced for.

[Freddie Stubbs]

43. This all could have been prevented by a ban of cell phones

[Jkid]

6. There's a reason why people usually stand by when they see child abuse.

They don't want to be targeted by the perpetrators for defending someone else's life.

[Lorien]

18. And just how often does something like this happen?

No, sorry, I WON"T stand by when a kid is being abused!

[FreakinDJ]

7. That woman needs to face a very long time in prison

[Maru Kitteh]

20. And the two men with the guns, much much longer still.

She was a sociopathic dumbass for asking them to do it, but it was their responsibility to say no.

Unless she's Carlie Manson, what they did was far worse still.

[slackmaster]

8. If I didn't know that was in Philly, from the video I'd think it was Mogadishu

:crazy:

[Poll_Blind]

10. Honestly...I'm not even sure they pull that shit in Mogadishu.

PB

[Supersedeas]

15. and yet, there is it

[jberryhill]

27. Not at the rates SEPTA charges for a transit pass

I think the one month four-zone Mogadishu transit pass is something like a dollar.

[Poll_Blind]

29. LOL!

:rofl:

PB

[Poll_Blind]

9. My god- people should read that WHOLE article! OMG!

I hope all five of them or however many, along with the mom, go into the fucking hole forever.

PB

[slackmaster]

12. Me too, and it's sad that the kid who was spanked is going to lose his mother

:argh:

[Poll_Blind]

19. I sense we quibble on the definition of "mother", but I understand your point.

PB

[snooper2]

38. It's not sad, kid is better off without her

[DainBramaged]

11. The correct answer is, EVERYONE should be armed so the shooters die, simple

he who has the most guns wins.........


:sarcasm:

[denverbill]

14. An armed society is a polite society, or so I'm told.

That will teach him to disrespect her, or that guy from cutting me off in traffic. :sarcasm:

[jpak]

16. Ouchy!

:toast:

[Name removed]

22. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[hack89]

36. There is no possible law that would have prevented this

unless you think these were law abiding citizens? Want to bet none of them could legally own guns?

[Bigmack]

21. The NRA...

..always has those "armed citizen prevents crime" stories to tell us. I guess we won't be seeing this one in their propaganda.

[slackmaster]

23. Please don't conflate people who carry weapons legally with brutal armed criminal thugs

They're not the same people at all.

[Maru Kitteh]

30. Except when they are.

[jberryhill]

34. Oh come on

Jared Loughner owned guns for quite a while and spent most of that time not shooting anyone. Let's not blow one unrepresentative day out of proportion.

[slackmaster]

41. Please don't conflate the behavior of sane people with that of a criminal psychopath

:hi:

[Marengo]

64. Ah, a fan of logical fallacies I see...

Well, okay then.

Have you ever driven a car?

[RaleighNCDUer]

31. You know what? The brutal armed criminal thugs and the people who

carry weapons legally believe the same thing - that guns will solve their problems.

[hack89]

35. So why has gun violence declines as gun ownership has skyrocketed?

looks like responsible gun ownership is possible so lets fix the real problem - violent criminals.

[slackmaster]

39. Please take a self-defense class some time.

Any form - Empty hand, firearm, edged weapon, exotic weapons, anything at all.

The mind-set of someone who has been properly trained in self-defense and develops fighting skills or carries a weapon legally for the purpose of defense is very different than that of a criminal.

[A Simple Game]

47. And the first thing they will tell you is if someone is pointing a gun at you

don't be stupid enough to fight them. Do what ever they say.

You can do all of the target practice in the world and still not be able to shoot a person.

Indeed the mind-set may be different, the criminal is more likely to be able to pull the trigger while aimed at you.

[slackmaster]

48. No, that is not correct

The first thing they tell you is that you must always treat every gun as if it is loaded at all times.

Indeed the mind-set may be different, the criminal is more likely to be able to pull the trigger while aimed at you.

That's also incorrect. Most criminals have had no training and very little practice, if any. Even a few sessions of practice drawing and firing from concealment give a person a huge edge over a typical armed street thug.

[A Simple Game]

54. Your right about the loaded gun part.

But I didn't know you were talking about a western style draw contest, I was talking about the bad guy walking up to you and pointing a gun at you. You don't really think you should draw on someone that already has a gun pointed at you, do you?

Being faster on the draw doesn't mean you have the ability to actually shoot a person, targets are easy, they don't bleed. Many criminals have the "I have nothing to lose" mind set. If they are a repeat offender, which they probably are, they know they are going to jail for a long time whether they kill you or not.

[slackmaster]

59. You are correct. Drawing down on someone who is already brandishing a gun would be stupid.

I'd be inclined to give the assailant whatever he or she wanted, then proceed as the situation dictated.

My comment up-thread was directed specifically at the inaccurate portrayal in reply #37 of the mind-set of people who carry guns legally for self-defense.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

28. Yes, I'm sure those shooters are NRA members

:hi:

[jberryhill]

49. If guns aren't outlawed, only in-laws will have guns

And we all know how wonderful in-laws can be.

[Fla_Democrat]

62. I read the story, and didn't see that anyone else WAS armed

so.. I guess you proved the NRA's point. Nice work. :evilgrin:








:smoke:

[NickB79]

37. What we need is a ban on cellphones

Then she couldn't have called her friends ahead of time to have them show up at the bus stop.

[WinkyDink]

44. "This happens every summer! Get some perspective!"

Just using some DU quotes here.

[dooner]

45. Unbelievable

But I guess they are used to trouble.. SEVEN cameras on the bus?

[tammywammy]

53. It was a trial program for the cameras, only two buses are equipped with them

http://www.myfoxphilly.com/dpp/news/local_news/how-high-tech-cam-got-septa-shooting-080511

[LisaL]

63. Only two buses are equipped with the high-tech cameras.

The rest just have regular ones.

[jberryhill]

58. The reason for the cameras on the bus is not about 'trouble'

It's more about how people pile onto the SEPTA buses and claim injuries whenever one of them is involved in a minor accident.

The cameras are there so that, in the event of an accident, there will be a visual record of who, among the claimants, was actually a passenger on the bus.

[slackmaster]

60. Sadly, the surveillance camera industry may be one of the best business growth opportunities

Invest in it now, or you may regret missing your boat.

[distantearlywarning]

50. And people wonder why most of us don't want to confront parents in public about anything

So many people here just a few weeks ago in the "child free restaurant" threads suggesting that restaurant staff and patrons should speak up when parents are acting inappropriately in public. THIS is why people would rather have a blanket ban than have individual people be forced to draw the line every night in a restaurant or a movie theatre or on a bus. People in America these days are off-the-deep-end fucking crazy, especially when it comes to their kids. You never know when speaking up and saying something about anything related to a child is going to get you involved in a screaming match, a fistfight, or, I guess, now a shootout.

[RagAss]

52. "and the band played on...."

[hedgehog]

55. I know this is a serious incident, but did one passenger actually climb up

on the driver's shoulders?

[tammywammy]

61. It was the guy they were targeting. n/t