People without health insurance are taking fish antibiotics

[CoffeeCat]

I began reading the stories on the 99 percent website, and more than a few people
mentioned that because they have no health insurance--when they get sick and need
antibiotics--they go to pet stores and buy antibiotics that are for fish.

I was curious, and I Googled "people taking fish antibiotics" and "fish antibiotics"
and I got more than a million hits. Apparently, many people do this. The antibiotics
in fish medicine are the same antibiotics given to humans (tetracycline, amoxicillin, etc.)

People who know they have a sinus infection or strep throat are buying meds at the pet
store. These are people who are poor, without health insurance and unable to afford
going to the doctor.

One website even mentioned that many people stockpile these fish antibiotics, to have
them on hand.

I am just beside myself. What has happened in our country? This is unbelievable.

Our society is collapsing.

You can Google for yourself and read all about it. Here's one of the articles, among
the million, that I found: :(

http://www.consumer-health.com/services/cons_take30.php

[Rhiannon12866]

1. I went to the doctor today and was given a prescription for antibiotics.

I was told I have "acute bronchitis." I tend to put these things off, since I no longer have insurance. The prescription cost me $27.46, while the doctor's appointment cost me $60, and that's with a discount for cash. :(

[SoCalDem]

10. and in Mexico you could buy the antibiotic without a doctor visit

I used to get bladder infections, and it always pissed me off *pun intended* that I knew EXACTLY what medicine worked for me, and yet I would have to go to the doctor (take time off work), spend money for labs, and then go fill the damned prescription that I would have had in half the time and for half the cost..

[Rhiannon12866]

11. Well, I didn't know exactly what was wrong with me, just that I couldn't breathe.

But a doctor's visit used to cost $43, but it's recently gone up. I try and think of anything possible that I might want to bring up as long as I'm there. :(

And I'm sure you knew what you were doing, but not everybody does. I once took an elderly visiting friend to a walk in clinic, very handy, that was next to my office. He was give an antibiotic, but he'd just take it until the symptoms went away, then save the rest for the next time. x(

He must have done something right, though, since he lived a very active life until age 101. :D :hi:

[SoCalDem]

13. My husbnad's meds went missing in the mail and we had to buy some

since he was out..we could not wait until the RX & post office quit blaming each other.. He actually refused one of them.. Our copay for it is $75.00 for 90 days..and the replacement scrip the Dr wrote for him was for $30 days.. Rite Aid wanted $265,00 for it,.. My husbands said no thanks.. Luckily in a few days the RX order place replaced his order and we had his meds..

That mail fiasco cost him for an additional office copay, and $75 out of pocket for meds

[Rhiannon12866]

16. Holy ....!!!

I used to get my prescriptions at Rite Aid, but when I lost my insurance, my doctor told me that they have a huge mark-up. My Advair (inhaler) was among the most expensive, $30 with insurance, but without it's around $250!!! I just use the rescue inhaler now... :(

My doctor said that the least expensive pharmacies around here are K-Mart, Price Chopper, and Wal-Mart. :eyes:

Your poor husband! This really is just crazy... :crazy: x(

[NickB79]

23. Buying antibiotics without a doctor's visit is a very bad idea.

Antibiotics are already seriously over-prescribed, and most antibiotics are starting to lose their effectiveness as resistant forms of the bacteria they were designed to treat are spreading.

Making antibiotics even more easily accessible would render then useless in short order as everyone with a cold or flu starts downing the stuff indiscriminately.

[coalition_unwilling]

38. Dieing because you are too poor to afford a doctor's visit and prescriptiions

is also a very bad idea.

[Codeine]

32. Overuse and misuse of antibiotics is a huge problem.

I'd like to see people using them far less rather than making them OTC for casual use.

[IndyPragmatist]

35. I agree, this is not good.

[SoCalDem]

41. That is true, but if you live close to the border, and you have a prescription

for medicine you cannot afford to fill, you might need to explore other options..

[Liberal_in_LA]

81. Tijuana has pharmacies block after block. Teen girls in white coats

selling every kind of drug.

[Xithras]

89. Gotta be careful with those "teen girls in white coats".

There's a pretty well known scam with those border pharmacies. U.S. prescriptions aren't actually valid in Mexico, and legally you're supposed to have a Mexican prescription to buy any "controlled" drugs. Many pharmacies will sell them to you anyway, but there's a danger. There's a known scam where those "teen girls in white coats" will sell you the medicine on an American prescription and then call the police as you walk out the door. The police pick you up, and inform you that you've committed a felony that carries a six month sentence in Mexican prison (which is true, it really is a felony with a 6 month maximum sentence). The officer then offers to let you go in exchange for a "cash gift". You fork over the pills and cash, and go back to America a bit poorer. The cop kicks a small percentage of the "gift" back to that "teen girl in a white coat" for her cooperation, and to encourage her to help out again with the next unwary American.

Always know the laws before trying to buy drugs in another country. If you're buying drugs in Mexico, make sure you stop by one of the many doctors that specialize in rewriting American prescriptions to comply with Mexican law. It will cost you a bit of money, but it'll protect you from possible harassment and shakedowns, and in the worst case from a possible 6 month stretch in a Mexican jail (it's rare, but it HAS HAPPENED).

[Liberal_in_LA]

92. good to know

[tammywammy]

65. +1 agreed! n/t

[LWolf]

44. I went to the doctor

the day before my health insurance expired and moved down to catastrophic coverage only.

I'd put it off several days, but couldn't stand it any more. Shingles.

I paid $200 for the office visit and the meds; the office visit upfront, copays on the meds. That hurt; the entire $200 will be coming from my food budget for October. A food budget for one person. That leaves little for groceries.

If I'd gone the day after, the meds alone would have been $354, plus the $155 for the office visit.

[vets74]

82. Did you check Wal-Mart ? For example, Wal-Mart is cheaper than fish meds for amoxycillin 500mg.

Seriously, the Fish-Mox sells for $16/100 pills in the 500mg. strength.

Wal-Mart is $10/90 pills in the 500 mg. strength.

Yes, you need a prescription. Try a CHC/FQHC for that. Try Bernie Sanders's site for how to use the CHCs.

Of course having shingles, going shopping for health care options wasn't doable. Sorry about that.

[StarsInHerHair]

86. dollar stores now have fresh fruits & veggies, as well as milk cheese meats

fish breads & bagels. Look around & see if there is a Dollar store or Dollar General.

[LWolf]

90. that's a good idea. nt

[I Have A Dream]

2. That is very sad.

:(

It makes me think of people who are reduced to eating cat food.

[Prisoner_Number_Six]

3. I've done it myself.

They're identical drugs at a fraction of the cost, plus no prescription is needed. It's called Survival.

[Luminous Animal]

15. Me too. I've also stitched myself and pulled my own stitches

I once removed my own drainage tube which made me throw up but saved me $300.

[SoCalDem]

43. I put in my own stitches too, but mostly because I did not want to

waste a ton of time sitting around in Urgent Care

I soaked some thread (green) in alcohol.. went next door so my neighbor could thread the needle (bad eyes here), I dabbed alcohol on the owwwwie, and then sewed it up.

Took pics for my son:)

[shanti]

61. yikes!

my sister has cut herself a couple of times and wouldn't go to the emergency room (had a few too many). she didn't stitch up, but just used butterfly bandages and watched it for a few days. i wouldn't recommend this though, because now she can't extend a finger due to cutting tendons :(.

[Liberal_in_LA]

80. that's intense!

[xmas74]

52. I've stitched myself up too

and have also superglued wounds over the years.

[ixion]

19. Yep, me, too...

and they work just fine at a fraction of the cost.

[Xithras]

88. The claim that they are identical is often false, but the sources do vary.

I own some of this stuff, and did some digging a while back. Generally, the over the counter pet antibiotics fall into one of four categories:

1) Antibiotics that have expired and have therefore been resold by the manufacturer to a third party for pet consumption. These are usually safe, but expired antibiotics will be less effective than pharmacy bought antibiotics.

2) Antibiotics that have failed quality control tests for some reason. While the FDA regulates the quality of human antibiotics, no equal regulation exists for pets. Drugs that can't be sold for human use are often sold to vets and packaged for OTC sale instead of being destroyed.

3) A LOT of the cheap pet drugs on the market today are made overseas, especially in China. Some are the same drugs that Chinese people get from their pharmacies, but they can't be sold in the United States for human use due to various regulatory issues (some of which are bad for us like questionable fillers or purity, and others that don't matter, such as a company that isn't interested in marketing in the U.S. and dealing with the regulations and paperwork involved). Some people might consider Chinese made antibiotics a bad thing, but most of them are just fine for human use.

4) Excess production capacity. A manufacturer makes more pills than required for the market, and simply resells their pills for pet use. This isn't that common, but it does happen. More often though, excess production is donated or sent overseas. It's uncommon for an American pharma company to make new human-grade antibiotics available for pet use.

[DocMac]

4. My friend's dog had seizures.

He got 30mg phenobarbital for his dog. Well a 90mg would be for humans.

Say what you may, but we may have to self medicate....we have the information on the web.

Symptoms and remedies.

[kas125]

5. Ha, I had an infected tooth last month and ordered fish antibiotics.

I'm still here...

[RebelOne]

53. I have bought Tetracycline online from Pet stores for years.

They are a lot cheaper than a prescription from the doctor.

[eridani]

6. That's an oldie but goodie. Did it myself in the early 70s

Cheap tetracycline.

[jberryhill]

8. Apparently you caused the apocalypse

[jberryhill]

7. Our society is collapsing?

People have been doing this for decades without causing a collapse of society.

I did it back in the 1980's. It's not as if there is some separate production line for the capsules packaged as aquarium chemicals.

[WinkyDink]

14. I believe the reference is to the desperation people feel today, whether or not you "did it" in your

past.

Sorry, but I'm 62 and have never heard of this.

[jberryhill]

45. ...but have you kept an aquarium?

That's probably the key question.

The fish don't care what color the capsules are:

http://aquarium-filters.org/1824-fish-cycline-100-pk.html



Pharmaceutical grade tetracycline for your aquarium fish. Tetracycline is a broad spectrum, bacteriostatic antibiotic that is effective against some of the bacterial ailments that commonly afflict fishes, particularly fin and tail rot, popeye, gill diseases, dropsy, columnaris, mouth and body open sores/ulcers, and livebearer disease.

http://www.drugs.com/tetracycline.html

[SoCalDem]

9. The eye meds our vet uses for our kitties is the exact same as mine

If we ever lost our insurance I would use their meds:)

[flpab]

28. vet meds 1/2 the price

and they are made by the same people.

[jannyk]

12. When I broke my toe, I took my dog's Tramadol.

He was done with it, having recovered from having a lump removed a month earlier. Did the trick - I felt no pain.

[RebelOne]

76. I have a full prescription of Tramadol that I used to give my dog for pain.

Unfortunately, she had cancer and I had to send her to doggie heaven last July. But I still have the pills, which are good until November. Should I need a pain pill, the Tramadol will come in handy.

[blogslut]

17. Been doing it for almost 30 years

:hi:

[RebelOne]

85. Me too. Buy though pet websites. n/t

[JCMach1]

18. Open the damn pharmacies

And lower the prices to world levels.
Americans screwed by pharmacies, pharma and docs.

Why do we need prescriptions for non dangerous drugs...

[Maraya1969]

20. I've taken my dog's prednisone when my asthma has flared up.

Same stuff.

[Lasher]

21. Just curious, did you ever get an urge to chase cars or anything like that?

I'm considering this myself and want to know about possible side effects.

[Maraya1969]

67. No but I sometimes want to lick myself.

[lonestarnot]

68. Glad you've never developed the poop eating thing!

:7

[Lasher]

75. Hee hee, reminds me of an old joke.

I'll bet you've heard it. The punchline is, "Because he can."

[999998th word]

83. Ha-ha-one of my favorites. Heres another-

'You can eat a bowling ball if you have to' -sorry couldn't help it.

[Uben]

22. It isn't all bad, my wife came down with the shingles......

...and called her doctor yesterday. Her doc's daughter was getting married today, so she was not in the office. So, the gal that works the desk in her office said she would call the doc and see if she would prescribe some topical cream for the lesions that were appearing. The doc said since she was a breast cancer patient (8 yrs ago)she would like to see her and asked if we could come to her house. HAve you ever heard of a doc doing that? We went to her home out in the sticks. There were people coming and going preparing for the wedding at their home. The doctor affirmed it was shingles and called in some scripts for meds. No charge! (for the visit)

This is small town Texas. We also got a walkthrough of their rural home which has the best view in the county, and we visited for about 30 minutes (she's my doc, too). You won't get this kind of service in the city. It just doesn't happen. She's a dem, too!

[ellisonz]

25. They make a semi-effective shingles vaccine.

My 91 year old grandfather came down with it August. He's been pretty miserable. But it's now clearing up.

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd-vac/shingles/vacc-need-know.htm

[NickB79]

24. The replies on this thread are seriously scary

I understand that people have to do what they must to survive, but with the level of self-medication going on out there, it's no wonder most of our antibiotics will be worthless in a decade or so.

[HereSince1628]

33. I'm guessing that agricultural use in livestock feed has swamped

self-medication as a contributor to anti-biotic resistance. Antibiotics were incorporated into commercial feeds for decades and fed to millions (probably many hundreds of millions of chickens alone) of animals just to get faster weight gains.

While it's true that overuse of antibiotics contributes to undesirable selection for bacterial resistance, the human use of over-the-counter antibiotics intended for pet fish is just tapping into an existing larger use of antibiotics in pet markets.

[jberryhill]

46. You can't get any of the newer broad spectrums for this

Erythromycin, Amoxycillin, Tetracycline... that's about it.

[Sanity Claws]

26. I will keep this in mind for next time

I just got over cellulitis, a deep tissue infection, in which my right eyelid became inflamed and swollen.
When it developed, I went to a doctor, cost $100 (new patient cost; usually $80 a visit).

She gave me a prescription for an antibiotic to take for seven days. The pharmacy charged $114 and change for the antibiotic. I couldn't believe it!

I couldn't pay it. I called the doctor and asked her if there was a more cost effective med available. (I couldn't bring myself to ask for cheaper meds.) She had me come to her office and gave me samples of a similar antibiotic.

Thank goodness that this doctor had enough heart to understand that people really can't afford the pharmaceuticals these days.

It hurts my pride to acknowledge that I couldn't afford basic medical care and had to rely on the sympathy of a doctor.

[flpab]

27. Feed stores are the best-Central Tractor

You can buy the best antibiotics at the feed store. Some is injectable but they sell needles also. They also sell this stuff called Vetericyn. It is the best. You can use it on wounds, pink eye, throat, ears, up your nose. It kills bacteria and not an antibiotic. We are getting immune to them. Try raw organic manuka honey for strep. It will heal burns and wounds also.
I have a vet that will write a prescription for antibiotics for the dogs that can be filled at the grocery store for 4.00. I send away for b-12 shots in Canada since I was anemic and still feel the effects if I don't do b-12 shots. I get restless leg syndrome and my fingers go numb. It is cheap but just found it at Central Tractor so might buy it there but it was a big bottle. I have insurance and still the co-pays and drugs are crazy. I have to take hormones that are not listed as drugs you must have to survive or some bs. It cost me 85.00 for a prescription but ed drugs are medically covered? Some man is in charge of that. I would like to know how many men are getting their ed drugs covered but women needing change of life drugs are not.

[emilyg]

40. You mentioned two things I'm

never without. Manuka honey and Veterycin.

[TorchTheWitch]

49. you can make your own Veterycin much more cheaply

It's just bleach in a basic saline solution. I found a "recipe" to make it on the internet which is exactly like the bottled Veterycin you buy. Ridiculous how much they charge for a bottle of that stuff when it's just very simple household ingredients.

[emilyg]

70. Thanks. I'll google.

[XanaDUer]

29. Yet another reason we need comprehensive healthcare in this country

overuse of antibiotics are now causing superbugs that cannot be cured with standards antibiotics.

Seriously, it's getting to the point where I envision this scenario : The US does not have healthcare, citizens are self-medicating with all sorts of stuff like this, a superbug is created, wiping out most of the Earth's population.

Thank you, Capitalism.

[Tesha]

31. There are days when I feel like a good dose of Captain Trips would solve a lot of...

...the Earth's problems.

Tesha

[nc4bo]

30. There's a lovely black market for these also.

Don't ask me how I've come to know all about it.

Single Payer!! Public Option!! Healthcare is a basic human right, not a privilege.

[HipChick]

34. I've done it too...I was between jobs...no healthcare and had a bad sinus infection

The lady at the petstore told me they had a hard time keeping it on the shelf, because it would sell out

[Manifestor_of_Light]

36. Mexican pharmacies can be your friend.

And a lot cheaper.
It's usually easy to figure out if you have a bacterial infection.

If your snot is clear or white, it's an allergy or a cold virus. All you can do is do symptom relief and wait.

If it's yellow or green, you have a bacterial infection and need antibiotics.

Pretty simple.

[OneGrassRoot]

37. I never knew this. Good to know, though beyond sad at the same time. :( n/t

[Manifestor_of_Light]

42. People can read about this stuff, any disease or condition, on the internet.

And figure out what they have. People who ask the doc for antibiotics when they have a virus are stupid.
I don't know what you would do about them.

People are doing this because a lot of doctors don't really give a damn if you feel bad, or sleep too much, or whatever. They just want to give people happy pills like that will give them energy, when they probably have a metabolic problem.

I have an internist who I have seen for 25 years. If I had a stroke, or a heart attack, I would trust him with my life. But as far as metabolic problems, he does not listen to me at all. He is a brilliant man, but he and his NP refued to address my request for more blood tests.

[Liberal_in_LA]

79. The internet changed the world.

[JoeyT]

39. I hope no one in the government notices.

I have like six different kinds. I actually thought that's what they were for. Kind of a "Now these aren't made for people, even though they're conveniently in human doses." *wink* "So don't take them." *wink*

The solution our useless politicians will seize on won't be making access to the human kind easier or more affordable, it will be banning the stuff without prescriptions. Sure it might kill a few poor people that can't afford the doctor's visit, but if they wanted to live they shouldn't have been poor, obviously.

[glinda]

47. I really wished you would not have mentioned this.

[CoffeeCat]

54. Why?

Are you worried that others will do this now?

[glinda]

60. New person appointed to regulate even natural products might take a serious

look at more regulation on these. This will make it near impossible for people who need them to get them possibly.

[unblock]

48. you can get FREE or dirt cheap antibiotics at some supermarket pharmacies.

http://dealseekingmom.com/prescription-transfer-coupons-where-to-find-free-antibiotics/

FREE Antibiotics Programs:
Giant Eagle
Giant Food
Meijer
Publix
Schnucks
ShopRite
Stop & Shop

In addition, Kroger, Target, and Walmart all currently have $4 generic prescriptions programs

[undeterred]

56. Not without a prescription.

[unblock]

57. true, but there are free clinics for that.

though i recognize that not everyone lives in an area that has these.

that said, people shouldn't be treating themselves.
bad enough people can't afford the meds, it's worse if they can't afford the office visit.

medicare for all, please!

[undeterred]

62. Please. Don't be ridiculous.

I know a person who went to the supposedly low income clinic near me and ended up with a bill for $450. She might as well have gone to an urgent care. I've never lived anywhere where there is an actual free clinic for either medical or dental care. In fact I've never even heard of one. And if I didn't treat myself I might be dead now.

[unblock]

64. manhattan has free clinics that are genuinely free.

like i said, i understand that not everyone lives near a free clinic, but they do exist.

[undeterred]

66. Great- right where some of the richest people in the world live.

Manhattan is also one of the most expensive places in the world to get to and stay at.

[unblock]

72. manahattan also plenty of extremely poor people.

the free clinics are obviously not for the richest people.

[MedicalAdmin]

69. Target shifted my pain med from their list.

It went from $4 to $200 overnight.

That was a bad day.

[Marrah_G]

73. But you have to get a prescription from a Dr.

That is not 4$

[undeterred]

74. If you are a new patient somewhere, its more like $400.

[sarcasmo]

50. Worst industrialized nation on the Planet.

[grasswire]

51. I haven't found the Fish Mox available locally.

Only by mail. I'm going to buy some when I find it. Shortages of antibiotics (and other meds) scare me, and no M.D. today is going to give you a scrip so you can have some antibiotic on hand.

[undeterred]

55. http://www.mexmeds4you.com/

Here you get the human meds with no prescription for antibiotics. You will wait 3 weeks and pay a little more for it.

Some of us can't afford to go to a doctor or dentist right now so we self-medicate. Save your preaching for somebody who wants to hear it.

[Juche]

58. I've done it

Luckily I'm not currently in a situation where I can't afford the $50-100 to see a doctor or NP anymore. And many antibiotics are on the $4 list now. But if the choice comes down to spending $100 on a doctor and a prescription or $10 at the pet store and using the other $90 for food and rent, people do what they have to do.

I'm just glad we are the freest country on earth and all other nations admire our health care system.

[Cleita]

59. Well back when I didn't have health insurance, couldn't afford a doctor's visit,

got a bad case of bronchitis, I couldn't shake, I got cow penicillin at a feed store in Idaho to cure it.

[Mr Deltoid]

63. Welcome to Republamerica

[Manifestor_of_Light]

71. I'm NOT paying over $200/month for Advair and Spiriva either.

I looked up the active ingredient in Spiriva, which is in micrograms (MILLIONTHS of a gram, not milligrams).

I calculated that at $200.00 per box per month, that it came out to $12,666,000.00 per POUND.

That is insane.

I can get it for $9 a month.

[StarsInHerHair]

77. I advocated this very thing when I read of that guy who died of a toothe infection

so sad.....going to the pet store is all people have now. The 1% have made certain of that, & Obama too-where was his vaunted health insurance mandate thingie when this guy was dying from a toothe infection?

[Liberal_in_LA]

78. if the "authorities" get wind of this, pet antiobiotics will be locked up, requiring prescription

they'll do what it takes to remove this option from the people.

[StarsInHerHair]

84. I hope the Hell not! People will be irate that their fish are dying because of

unnecessary government intrusion

[999998th word]

87. Thanks-good to know. If 'my pet' gets sick I can't afford a vet.

[a la izquierda]

91. That's a squatter punk rock remedy.

My husband worked in the music industry for a long time and most of the guys he worked with a) didn't have insurance or b) wouldn't go to a doctor. They'd just run to the pet store. Seemed to work just fine for them!