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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:19 AM Original message |
Would someone please riddle me what the fuck is so awful about the federal reserve? |
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FSogol (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:22 AM Response to Original message |
1. It is a complex organization that the GOP doesn't really understand. Very easy to |
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xchrom (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:24 AM Response to Original message |
2. Recommend |
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Nye Bevan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:27 AM Response to Original message |
3. Good points. When it comes to the Fed there are a lot of Ron Pauls on this board. (nt) |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:29 AM Response to Original message |
4. We elect Congress to run our economy -- and set employment policy -- not a private bank -!! |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:32 AM Response to Reply #4 |
6. So, you'd rather they hand over the reigns to Boehner? |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:11 AM Response to Reply #6 |
19. That's debate? No, I'd rather that Sen. Bernie Sanders and liberals made those decisions ... |
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Rex (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:11 AM Response to Reply #19 |
21. Agree...very lame response. |
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treestar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:24 PM Response to Reply #21 |
89. It is not a lame response, because it is possible for |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:14 AM Response to Reply #19 |
25. We can't even get our party to act liberal, what makes you think we can get the entire congress... |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:46 AM Response to Reply #25 |
63. But you think there is less elite/corporate influence over the FED...??? ROFL |
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truedelphi (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:53 PM Response to Reply #63 |
140. Oh but it is all about to change - Geithner just promised us that |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:52 PM Response to Reply #140 |
176. We agree -- Geithner should be in jail -- !! And, I'd add, pretty much all of Obama's "team" -- !!! |
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Rex (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:11 AM Response to Reply #6 |
20. Lame reply. |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:13 AM Response to Reply #20 |
22. Does he not call the shots in the house of representatives? |
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Rex (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:15 AM Response to Reply #22 |
26. Not forever, try refuting what the poster said instead of a lame comeback. |
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fascisthunter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:52 PM Response to Reply #6 |
156. dumb |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:40 AM Response to Reply #4 |
10. As much as I detested Greenspan, I'd trust him or Bernanke with the feds power a lot more... |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:15 AM Response to Reply #10 |
27. Democracy and economic democracy are based on officials we ELECT and can UN-ELECT .... |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:28 AM Response to Reply #27 |
43. You aren't going to convince me that the fed, or something like it, isn't a necessity. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:39 AM Response to Reply #43 |
57. When the FED makes political decisions -- which is does -- we are effected .... |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:05 PM Response to Reply #57 |
77. You don't even realize how much you are contradicting yourself. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 03:02 PM Response to Reply #77 |
120. There is no contradiction -- all of our government, its agencies -- and hierarchies.... |
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Volaris (479 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 01:30 PM Response to Reply #43 |
111. I tend to agree with you on all points, but wanted to ask you a question... |
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treestar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:25 PM Response to Reply #10 |
91. Exactly, at least they know what they are doing. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 03:23 PM Response to Reply #91 |
121. All of Obama's "team" and appointees are responsible for the meltdown .... |
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lumberjack_jeff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:30 AM Response to Original message |
5. Galbraith |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 03:25 PM Response to Reply #5 |
122. Love James Galbraith --- and loved Kenneth Galbraith --- |
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WingDinger (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:32 AM Response to Original message |
7. The problem with the Fed: They print money, and expect the in terest to be covered by expansion. |
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Fumesucker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:39 AM Response to Original message |
8. Err, we have *none* of the goals you said were integral to the Fed's charter.. |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:47 AM Response to Reply #8 |
12. Their tools are limited and as I mentioned above that "some would say balance" the three goals |
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Fumesucker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:53 AM Response to Reply #12 |
17. Excuses make no never mind to me.. |
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jwirr (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:22 PM Response to Reply #8 |
87. He also may have talked about the reason all of that is happening. |
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Historic NY (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:40 AM Response to Original message |
9. There is no gold its all gone..thats what they say on the TEE-VEE tube. |
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begin_within (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:43 AM Response to Original message |
11. They don't operate for the public interest or in the best interest of the country. |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:48 AM Response to Reply #11 |
13. Can you substantiate your accusation? |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:23 AM Response to Reply #13 |
37. Have you looked at the nation recently? |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:25 AM Response to Reply #37 |
40. Greenspans capacity at the fed was merely to adjust interest rates, your beloved congress... |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:32 AM Response to Reply #40 |
49. This was Greenspan's idea .... |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:34 AM Response to Reply #40 |
52. The question was: "Have you looked at the nation recently" ??? |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:00 PM Response to Reply #40 |
70. Greenspan led the commission that made the recommendations to raise FICA taxes |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 02:12 PM Response to Reply #70 |
116. No argument from me that Greenspan is an evil Randroid fuck, but as head of the fed... |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 03:32 PM Response to Reply #116 |
123. Nonsense ... Greenspan influenced FICA rates, controlled interest rates, JOBS... on and on .... |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 09:37 PM Response to Reply #123 |
171. That was the decision of our elected officials to follow his wishes. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:46 PM Response to Reply #171 |
174. Greenspan wasn't elected and couldn't be un-elected . . the concept on FICA came from him... |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 10:53 AM Response to Reply #174 |
192. Donald Duck wasn't elected and couldn't be unelected, and if politicians decided to consult him... |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 08:52 PM Response to Reply #192 |
199. But members of Congress are Elected and UN-ELECTED ... that's the difference ... and |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:04 PM Response to Reply #199 |
201. Are you intentionally not reading? Let me make this perfectly clear |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:32 PM Response to Reply #201 |
204. Greenspan was an insider in the decision to increase FICA for poor and middle class ... |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:46 PM Response to Reply #204 |
207. Yes, and like I've been saying and you've been ignoring THAT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THE FED! |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 10:44 PM Response to Reply #207 |
213. You're really out of debate -- Greenspan was the FED -- serving the rich -- !!! |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Oct-16-11 12:04 PM Response to Reply #116 |
220. Congress enacted the recommendations of the Greenspan Commission. |
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Volaris (479 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 01:49 PM Response to Reply #40 |
112. what if interest/inflation were never a problem? |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Oct-16-11 12:06 PM Response to Reply #40 |
221. Greenspan's commission made the recommendations to do so. Congress enacted their recs. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Oct-16-11 03:52 PM Response to Reply #221 |
224. Exactly....think Q about this OP should be why so much work to try to redeem the FED...??? |
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the other one (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:49 AM Response to Original message |
14. Because of the Fraction Reserve System |
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FarCenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:08 AM Response to Reply #14 |
18. That's not how it works |
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the other one (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:15 AM Response to Reply #18 |
28. It is how it works. This is the Feds own page: |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:22 AM Response to Reply #28 |
36. Another page people should read. This stuff is not unique to the US at all |
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the other one (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:24 AM Response to Reply #36 |
38. Yes the whole world is in on the scam. Not just our Fed. |
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woo me with science (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:38 AM Response to Reply #38 |
56. Yes, they have impoverished other countries first. |
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FarCenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:28 AM Response to Reply #28 |
42. Note that the Fed page says that the reserver requirements are for deposit liabilities |
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unblock (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:14 AM Response to Reply #14 |
24. you write as if the fed is not part of the u.s. government. |
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the other one (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:17 AM Response to Reply #24 |
30. The Fed is a quasi-governmental |
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unblock (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:22 PM Response to Reply #30 |
88. i could say the same thing about the supreme court. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 03:58 PM Response to Reply #88 |
125. And you might be correct -- Supreme Court has usurped power/authority it was not given ... !!! |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:25 AM Response to Reply #14 |
39. Fed exists by usurping power which belongs with the Treasury and Congress .... |
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woo me with science (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:35 AM Response to Reply #39 |
53. +100000000 |
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Spider Jerusalem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:11 PM Response to Reply #39 |
78. JFK did no such thing: |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:53 PM Response to Reply #78 |
141. JFK Treasury Notes still exist ... Question really is WHY the attempts to deny it -- ???? |
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Spider Jerusalem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 06:23 AM Response to Reply #141 |
185. Fucksake. DId you even read the link I provided? |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:19 AM Response to Reply #185 |
187. Are you denying the existence of the TREASURY NOTES put in play by JFK? |
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Spider Jerusalem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 10:42 AM Response to Reply #187 |
191. They aren't "Treasury Notes", for a start |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 08:46 PM Response to Reply #191 |
197. You're wrong ... LOOK again, your bill says: "Federal Reserve Note" with Green Seal .... |
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Spider Jerusalem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:07 PM Response to Reply #197 |
202. It says "United States Note", not "Treasury Note" |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:36 PM Response to Reply #202 |
205. You are LOOKING in the wrong place .... LOOK the bill over from top to bottom ...!!! |
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Spider Jerusalem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:54 PM Response to Reply #205 |
209. You're wrong |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 10:40 PM Response to Reply #209 |
211. Look at a $20 -- right side -- top line --- and what's that they say... "Phoney as a $2 bill" -- ? |
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Spider Jerusalem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 11:04 PM Response to Reply #211 |
217. There were no United States Notes issued in the denomination of $20 |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Oct-16-11 03:43 PM Response to Reply #217 |
222. CAN WE GET SOME HELP FOR THIS POSTER ...??? ANYONE HAVE A $20 BILL? |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Oct-16-11 03:45 PM Response to Reply #217 |
223. Meanwhile .... |
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Volaris (479 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 01:55 PM Response to Reply #39 |
113. I agree,and even Justice SCALIA has said basically that the Congress |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:25 PM Response to Reply #113 |
146. Interesting ... |
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Volaris (479 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:01 PM Response to Reply #146 |
172. agreeing with Scalia is not always as difficult as some would think... |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:42 PM Response to Reply #172 |
173. Haven't actually been reading the full TEXT of the |
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woo me with science (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:33 AM Response to Reply #14 |
51. "If our government wants to do something it can't just create the money. It must borrow it |
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RegieRocker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:15 PM Response to Reply #51 |
129. Don't waste your time these folks don't have even the slightest idea |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:29 PM Response to Reply #51 |
148. Agree --- and also agree JFK tried to end this system -- and they were not happy with him! |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 03:44 PM Response to Reply #14 |
124. Banks also took BAIL OUT $$ at 0% -- and bought Treasury notes with it at 3.5% and 4% !!! |
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banned from Kos (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:27 AM Response to Reply #124 |
188. you have no idea what kind of gargage you are spewing |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 08:48 PM Response to Reply #188 |
198. You're denying that banks used bail out money at 0% to buy Treasury notes at 3.5% and 4% ...??? |
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Azathoth (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 06:11 AM Response to Reply #14 |
184. self-delete |
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Major Nikon (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:50 AM Response to Original message |
15. The fed's Board of Governors is a government agency |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:27 AM Response to Reply #15 |
41. William Greider is very clear on the evils of the FED ... See: "Secrets of the Temple" --- |
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Major Nikon (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:58 AM Response to Reply #41 |
67. You mean the non-economist who has been saying the sky is falling |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:03 PM Response to Reply #67 |
73. don't know about you, but the sky *has* been falling slowing for 15 years, imo. |
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RegieRocker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:54 PM Response to Reply #73 |
142. There is a exact opposite of chicken littles in the opposite universe. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:35 PM Response to Reply #73 |
150. ... amazing that we have to point that out to him ... what does he think OWS is all about ... ??? |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:33 PM Response to Reply #67 |
149. ROFL ... We'd be lucky to have Greider for president -- FED is about politics .... |
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the other one (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:50 AM Response to Original message |
16. This video will help explain it. |
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trotsky (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:13 AM Response to Original message |
23. Thank you for this. |
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closeupready (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:16 AM Response to Original message |
29. Unreccing for your pervasive antagonistic tone. |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:18 AM Response to Reply #29 |
32. Putting you on my ignore list for your antagonistic unreccing. |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:59 AM Response to Reply #32 |
68. Deleted message |
Rex (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:17 AM Response to Original message |
31. Nothing. Once again I use the gun analogy. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:30 AM Response to Reply #31 |
44. We've seen nothing but manipulation of the economy for benefit of the rich .... |
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Rex (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:42 AM Response to Reply #44 |
60. It is a tool, just like any other. How people decide to use it is reflective |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:51 AM Response to Reply #60 |
64. GUNS are created as weapons -- to do violence -- |
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Rex (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:23 PM Response to Reply #64 |
145. It is a tool, just like any other created by humans. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:37 PM Response to Reply #145 |
151. You're saying that a lawnmower is like a gun -- ???? ROFL |
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Rex (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:49 PM Response to Reply #151 |
155. Oh? Running away because you lost an argument |
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fascisthunter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:55 PM Response to Reply #155 |
157. no.... not about cowardice but instead about talking to a fanatic |
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Rex (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:58 PM Response to Reply #157 |
159. Of course they are. |
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fascisthunter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 06:00 PM Response to Reply #159 |
160. lol... crazy |
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Rex (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 06:01 PM Response to Reply #160 |
161. lol...ignorant. |
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librechik (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:19 AM Response to Original message |
33. every cent collected in income taxes is used to pay interest to the Fed for printing our $ |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:21 AM Response to Reply #33 |
34. You have a link to this info? |
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librechik (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:30 AM Response to Reply #34 |
45. altho govt sources claim otherwise, I suppose, the documentary film America: Freedom to Fascism |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:31 AM Response to Reply #45 |
47. I really prefer something to read. I don't have time to watch movies. |
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librechik (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:36 AM Response to Reply #47 |
54. that's why I included the wikipedia link to the film--it's got everything you need |
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banned from Kos (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:33 AM Response to Reply #33 |
50. you have it all backward - the Treasury prints our money and sells it to the Fed |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:04 PM Response to Reply #33 |
74. i don't think that's correct & i don't think russo's flick is a reliable source for that claim. |
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librechik (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:25 PM Response to Reply #74 |
93. do you have a source other than the Fed itself which debunks that point in Russo's film? |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:48 PM Response to Reply #93 |
103. you must have missed the post that linked to the same post of yours i did. |
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girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 06:13 PM Response to Reply #33 |
162. This. |
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some guy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:22 AM Response to Original message |
35. short and simple |
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coalition_unwilling (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:45 PM Response to Reply #35 |
137. How would Congress 'create money' any differently from how the Fed |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:42 PM Response to Reply #137 |
152. And you think the FED is a democratic institution -- not under control of Elites ??? ROFL |
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coalition_unwilling (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:59 PM Response to Reply #152 |
177. Um, the FED is only as democratic as the culture within which |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:17 AM Response to Reply #177 |
186. FED is in no way committed to democracy nor economic democracy ... run by elites ... |
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coalition_unwilling (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 10:22 AM Response to Reply #186 |
190. After the financial panic and resultant recession of 2008-09, I saw |
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girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 06:15 PM Response to Reply #137 |
163. No, money is not created when banks lend money to borrowers. |
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coalition_unwilling (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 10:51 PM Response to Reply #163 |
175. Not true, but I doubt I will be able to change your mind. Let me |
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girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 05:30 AM Response to Reply #175 |
183. The government is the sole issuer of our currency. |
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coalition_unwilling (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 10:18 AM Response to Reply #183 |
189. In confusing and conflating 'currency' (a physical entity), 'money' (an |
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Hippo_Tron (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 10:50 PM Response to Reply #35 |
214. The Fed's profits are returned to the US Treasury |
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LadyInAZ (149 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:31 AM Response to Original message |
46. Time for a change is long over due |
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dameocrat67 (442 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:32 AM Response to Original message |
48. strawman since it is not the fed vs the gold standard |
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woo me with science (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:39 AM Response to Reply #48 |
58. Well said. |
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banned from Kos (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:42 AM Response to Reply #48 |
59. It was the progressive Greenback Party that won the argument to create the Fed |
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dameocrat67 (442 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:01 PM Response to Reply #59 |
72. I dont see where the article says what you are saying it says |
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banned from Kos (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:35 PM Response to Reply #72 |
98. I posted it above - from a Wikipedia source on Federal Reserve Notes |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:57 PM Response to Reply #59 |
106. greenback party circa 1870s-80s. Fed created 1913 in the wake of the panic of 1907. |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:43 AM Response to Reply #48 |
61. I've seen no consensus among anti-feds on how to replace the fed, so it isn't fed vs. greenbacks |
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Major Nikon (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:11 PM Response to Reply #61 |
79. Not only that... |
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dameocrat67 (442 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:14 PM Response to Reply #79 |
83. on one program, which was the tarp |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:25 PM Response to Reply #83 |
92. TARP was the least typical fed undertaking of our lifetimes. |
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dameocrat67 (442 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:26 PM Response to Reply #92 |
94. as if paulson did not push both Obama and Bush into tarp |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:29 PM Response to Reply #94 |
96. Once again we have a staffing vs organizational structure thing going on here. |
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dameocrat67 (442 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:35 PM Response to Reply #96 |
99. that might means something if federal reserve bank members were |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 01:06 PM Response to Reply #94 |
110. Wait. Paulson was secretary of the treasury. |
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dameocrat67 (442 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:28 PM Response to Reply #110 |
147. paulson has worked for it in the past so it is just revolving door. |
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dameocrat67 (442 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:24 PM Response to Reply #79 |
90. A new study released today by the Center for Media and Democracy |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:03 PM Response to Reply #90 |
179. +1 --- we also have to look at what the banks did with the bail out $$$ ... pretty much sat on it .. |
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dameocrat67 (442 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:13 PM Response to Reply #61 |
81. the board is appointed by the president but the board does not |
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Hippo_Tron (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 10:52 PM Response to Reply #48 |
215. The interest is then returned to the US Treasury, so it's not really wasting billions of dollars |
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On the Road (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:36 AM Response to Original message |
55. I Think a Lot of It's Distrust Combined with Ignorance |
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Harmony Blue (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:46 AM Response to Original message |
62. They can't accept |
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moondust (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:55 AM Response to Original message |
65. Just another easy gubmint target for the GOP. |
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Harmony Blue (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:15 PM Response to Reply #65 |
84. One of the largest employers in the world |
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RegieRocker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 08:00 PM Response to Reply #65 |
168. You got the mint part right nothing else though. |
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Octafish (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:57 AM Response to Original message |
66. Zero Transparency |
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banned from Kos (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:59 AM Response to Reply #66 |
69. The Fed is audited by Deloitte and Touche per the GAO every year |
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Octafish (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:05 PM Response to Reply #69 |
76. No offense, I'll take Bernie Sanders' word over yours. |
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banned from Kos (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:18 PM Response to Reply #76 |
85. Yes, Deloitte and the GAO audits are limited -- they don't allow Congress |
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Octafish (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:35 PM Response to Reply #85 |
97. The record is clear: Deloitte & Touche are part of the problem. |
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banned from Kos (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:40 PM Response to Reply #97 |
100. Fine. Congress may fire Deloitte at any time and hire someone else. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:44 PM Response to Reply #76 |
154. Right -- but we shouldn't ignore this great effort here to deny FED as tool of elites ... |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:12 PM Response to Reply #69 |
80. which guarantees nothing. |
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Octafish (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:14 PM Response to Reply #80 |
82. Deloitte & Touche also were the accounts of Bear Stearns and Fannie Mae. |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:46 PM Response to Reply #82 |
102. big 4 auditing firms were in the heart of the action in the mortgage crisis. fraudsters all. |
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Octafish (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:56 PM Response to Reply #102 |
143. Lying for Fraud and Profit. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:09 PM Response to Reply #143 |
180. ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ K/R for posts above ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ |
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fascisthunter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:56 PM Response to Reply #82 |
158. good lord... thanks for that info! |
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McCamy Taylor (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:01 PM Response to Original message |
71. Right now, it is because front runner Cain used to work for it. Lots of politics here. |
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neoconn (135 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:46 PM Response to Reply #71 |
101. Hogwash.... |
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Capitalocracy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:04 PM Response to Original message |
75. I disagree with the Fed for very different reasons from Ron Paul. |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:50 PM Response to Reply #75 |
104. i agree. seems to me the paulites & jonesites & their gold standard/anti-fed stuff are |
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Capitalocracy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 01:00 PM Response to Reply #104 |
108. I think it's just a disagreement among the rich on that point |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 01:03 PM Response to Reply #108 |
109. could be. a lot of public issues seem to boil down to just that. with us the pawns in their game. |
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MFrohike (210 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 02:04 PM Response to Reply #75 |
114. Well |
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Capitalocracy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 02:19 PM Response to Reply #114 |
118. I think there's too much conflict of interest in the Fed. |
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MFrohike (210 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 02:27 PM Response to Reply #118 |
119. Your last paragraph |
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Volaris (479 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 02:08 PM Response to Reply #75 |
115. what you said (about currency) |
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NNN0LHI (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:22 PM Response to Original message |
86. People don't like things that can't be explained in a few short sentences |
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tritsofme (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:26 PM Response to Original message |
95. Most opposition to Fed stems from ignorance. |
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EdMaven (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:51 PM Response to Reply #95 |
105. the fed is not a transparent institution, so if people are "ignorant" it's the fault of the fed. |
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Hippo_Tron (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 10:55 PM Response to Reply #105 |
216. Congress just passed substantial legislation to audit the fed |
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Odin2005 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 12:58 PM Response to Original message |
107. There is a lot of ignorance about the Federal Reserve. |
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RegieRocker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:07 PM Response to Reply #107 |
126. Sure. Our monetary system is a scam. Money from nothing (fiat) |
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Capitalocracy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:12 PM Response to Reply #126 |
128. I would argue gold-based isn't the same as asset-based. |
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RegieRocker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:23 PM Response to Reply #128 |
130. I am not a proponent of gold either. |
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Capitalocracy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:25 PM Response to Reply #130 |
132. That makes sense, although there's a lot of room for tricky accounting there |
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RegieRocker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:30 PM Response to Reply #132 |
133. Money will always be a part of politics whether the fed is abolished |
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Capitalocracy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:35 PM Response to Reply #133 |
134. Exactly. Elections are for the people, and we should pay for them. |
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RegieRocker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:48 PM Response to Reply #134 |
138. I suggest |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:14 PM Response to Reply #133 |
181. Agree -- we almost have to uninvent dollar bill, but at least limit immense wealth -- !! |
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Odin2005 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 06:40 PM Response to Reply #126 |
165. LOL, you sound like one of those gold standard fanatics ignorant about how fiat currencies work. |
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RegieRocker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 07:55 PM Response to Reply #165 |
167. You sound like one of those ooorah corrupt government lovers |
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BzaDem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 02:18 PM Response to Original message |
117. K&R. |
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mmonk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:10 PM Response to Original message |
127. I think $16 trillion to those that collapsed the economy and cutting |
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RegieRocker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:25 PM Response to Reply #127 |
131. Yes but one thought all they do is control interest! Lol |
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RegieRocker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:42 PM Response to Original message |
135. Ok here is your riddle |
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wildbilln864 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:42 PM Response to Original message |
136. government borrows money from the fed... |
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RegieRocker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 04:51 PM Response to Reply #136 |
139. I swear it's like someone not wanting to know their spouse is |
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wildbilln864 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:43 PM Response to Reply #139 |
153. It is! eom. |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 05:19 PM Response to Original message |
144. Deleted message |
girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 06:37 PM Response to Original message |
164. Where should I start? |
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banned from Kos (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 08:35 PM Response to Reply #164 |
169. When was the last time the Fed embarked on QE? (i.e., before 2008 and the Credit Crash) |
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girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 09:16 PM Response to Reply #169 |
170. Where did I blame the housing or tech bubbles on QE? |
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roamer65 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 11:27 AM Response to Reply #169 |
194. There was a bit of QE around the 1958 and 1960-61 recessions. |
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BzaDem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 04:21 PM Response to Reply #164 |
196. You really believe that interest rates should be higher? n/t |
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sfpcjock (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 06:42 PM Response to Original message |
166. I know, thanks. The Fed can do some Keynesian things, like creating a small business loan bank |
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OxQQme (694 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:03 PM Response to Original message |
178. Please see this DU thread: |
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Chan790 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Oct-14-11 11:17 PM Response to Original message |
182. That's rather astute... |
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roamer65 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 11:11 AM Response to Original message |
193. Read up on how the Federal Reserve was created. |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 08:59 PM Response to Reply #193 |
200. And the very same people who have been engineering rececessions/depressions for their |
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Laelth (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 11:45 AM Response to Original message |
195. Agreed. The Federal Reserve system is very useful and beneficial. |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:11 PM Response to Original message |
203. Ok, so I guess I'll have to add the following to the list |
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TNLib (683 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:39 PM Response to Original message |
206. Quantitive Easing is basically fucking the American people in the ass. |
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JVS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 09:50 PM Response to Reply #206 |
208. How do you figure? |
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girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 11:15 PM Response to Reply #208 |
218. I've written about this extensively. |
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TNLib (683 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Oct-16-11 07:17 AM Response to Reply #208 |
219. Quantitative Easing is used against Deflation and causes inflation. |
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bluebuzzard (98 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 10:01 PM Response to Original message |
210. Fed = money to 1%ers |
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defendandprotect (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Oct-15-11 10:42 PM Response to Reply #210 |
212. EXACTLY ..... !!! |
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