Look at all these countries calling for their own protest now:

[dixiegrrrrl]

Twitter is reporting the folloing:

Algeria:

Reports coming in that internet there is not down.

36-year old Algerian dies today after setting himself on fire in Eastern Algeria.
Algerians have been protesting due to the repression of freedom of speech, poverty and the #Bouteflika regime's corruption.
8 Protesters dead, 800 wounded, resorting to teargas and rubber bullets.
To follow, use #Algeria

Morrocco calling for protests Feb. 20th

Iran calling for protests #Feb. 14

Yemen: Thousands in streets, a 24 y/o man set himself on fire and died. #Yemen on Twtter.
http://armiesofliberation.com/archives/2011/02/12/taiz-the-sleeping-giant-protests/

Libya revolution planned for #Feb17 is called "Mokhtar Revolution" (after famous martyr "Omar Mokhtar
# Libya

[canoeist52]

1. You can blow out a candle But ...

"You can blow out a candle
But you can't blow out a fire
Once the flames begin to catch
The wind will blow it higher"

-from the song "Biko"

[Tx4obama]

2. You missed a couple

Also Syria and Bahrain
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4730603#4730665

[dixiegrrrrl]

5. Thank you. Adding to my Twitter watch.

[tekisui]

7. And Jordan.

[Lifelong Protester]

3. when can we add the USA?

[SidDithers]

What's stopping you?...nt

Sid

[tekisui]

10. Cheap food, so far.

[girl gone mad]

26. Free Speech Zones, kettling..

reality TV.

Americans may never take to the streets, but change is coming, nonetheless. You will see more and more drop out of the system, take their money out of banks, stop paying their debts, etc.

[dixiegrrrrl]

43. I agree.

[RegieRocker]

38. Maybe his fellow man watching his back. Doesn't sound

like that would be you.

[eilen]

41. It's fracking freezing out here. nt

[joshcryer]

9. You're going to protest a democracy?

OK go right on ahead. You're allowed to. (San Fran has protests every other day.)

[ArcticFox]

37. That's funny

You still believe that shit about this being a democracy?

[fascisthunter]

44. you would think that

because it isn't true

[bdamomma]

we have to hit rock bottom before that happens

[Mira]

19. We have to come together as a country firstand we have to unify what the "Uniter" divided. n/t

[tex-wyo-dem]

33. +1000...exactly!

I know this is hard to realize sometimes, but most teabaggers and freepers, along with moderates, independents, libertarians, and those falling under all the other political labels are one of us...at least economically speaking. Everyone in the commons needs to find common ground and work together for change.

Until we get a true, big majority thinking on the same pages, we're all going to continue throwing poo at each other while getting nowhere while the power brokers continue business as usual.

[madokie]

35. Thats what the money man is counting on

[Paper Roses]

39. Some of us already have. If we have not yet sold any assets

we might have, it certainly is in our thoughts.
I've put together what little I have to scrap or to sell in a consignment shop. After that? Who knows.
I know there are many, many worse off than me but this is how it now stands.

Sad days for all of 'the rest of us'.

[demosincebirth]

31. You go first, Ok?

[Posteritatis]

52. I dunno; when can *you* add it? (nt)

[tekisui]

4. Amazing. knr.

[bobbolink]

I heard something about Italy wanting to be rid of their wonderful Burlusconi, too.

[Tx4obama]

11. Italy already has open elections. Italians are just mad at Berlusconi cause of sex scandal. n/t

[bobbolink]

14. Yeah, so? They are demonstrating to get rid of him.

That's still allowed, right?

[Tx4obama]

16. But it's not like a whole regime change

Getting rid of Silvio Berlusconi is like protesting to get rid of Bush ;)

[bobbolink]

21. They. Are. Demonstrating. To. Get. Rid. Of. Leader.

[Tx4obama]

28. Italians have booted him out of office twice in the past. And then reelected him.

The politics of Italy is much different than the dictatorships in the Middle East.
You are comparing apples and watermelons.

[bobbolink]

29. Geeez. ALL the countries in the Middle East are different, too. I stated a fact.

What are you getting out of arguing?

Argue with yourself. The fact stands.

Bye.

[bobbolink]

6. I heard something about Italy wanting to be rid of their wonderful Burlusconi, too.

[WhiteTara]

18. they're sending him to jail. n/t

[bobbolink]

25. I would certainly hope so. At least that much. After all, the Italians have a bit more

integrity than 'Murkins, when it comes to holding leaders responsible for breaking laws.

[Fuzz]

8. The setting themselves on fire thing isn't the best way to go about it, but I wish them all the luck

in the world, and then perhaps we can get true freedom as well.

Wouldn't it be something if the Middle East teaches the West how to do it right? I hope someone does soon.

[tekisui]

12. The self-immolation shows how desperate their lives have become.

They feel they have nothing left to live for and as a final act of protest they expose the gravity of the situation.

[bobbolink]

23. Exactly. And I have heard homeless people in this country say the same thing.

They want their deaths to mean something, to get people to wake up and pay attention.

Can anyone here listen to them *before* it comes to that?

[coalition_unwilling]

34. Back in 1965, Pennsylvania Quaker Norman Morrison self-immolated

outside then-U.S. Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara's Pentagon office to protest against the U.S. War in Vietnam.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Morrison

In early November 2006, Malachai Ritscher self-immolated at the Ohio exit of the Kennedy Expressway in Chicago to protest against the U.S. War in Iraq.

http://www.chicagoreader.com/TheBlog/archives/2006/11/07/malachi-ritschers-apparent-suicide/

************************************


Not sure why I feel compelled to reference these two unsung heroes. Their sacrifice reminds me how paltry my own sacrifices have been in protesting against the travesties and obscenities of the past 10 years and challenge me to a more full commitment to social justice in my lifetime.

[dixiegrrrrl]

45. and how many buddists did the same in viet Nam around the same time?

the news would actually carry film of that, but the Americans who did it ( copying the Buddhists)
I do not remember seeing on the news.

What blew the lid off the peace demonstrations was Kent State, if memory serves.

[coalition_unwilling]

46. The Buddhist monks in Viet Nam who self immolated (I believe there were 2) did

it in the summer of 1963 to protest the autocratic tyranny of Diem and his wife and brother. Morrison's self immolation in November of 1965 was one of the first protests against U.S. combat involvement in Viet Nam. While I do not believe it received much media attention at the time, Morrison's death has achieved something of 'martyr' status in the annals of anti-war protest against the Vietnam War. I see passing references to it in various accounts of the anti-war movement of the time. Morrison is also credited with inspiring the anti-war movement, if memory serves.

Ritscher's death in November 2006 was similarly unsung in the mainstream media but accounts of it made it into various anti-war print media I regularly read. Because it occurred 3.5 years into the Iraq fiasco, Ritscher's death will probably not have the historical impact that Morrison's did.

Kent State (and Jackson State) cast a pall over the anti-war movement, from everything I have been able to read on the subject. For one thing, students came to realize that their own government would now turn on them for exercising their right to peaceful assembly.

[dixiegrrrrl]

47. My memory of the Kent State aftermath is that it spurred more civil protest.

( I was pretty active around that time)

Wiki agrees:

Shortly after the shootings took place, the Urban Institute conducted a national study that concluded
the Kent State shooting was the single factor causing the only nationwide student strike in U.S. history;
over 4 million students protested and over 900 American colleges and universities closed during the student strikes.
The Kent State campus remained closed for six weeks.

The shootings led to protests on college campuses throughout the United States, and a student strike, causing more than 450 campuses across the country to close with both violent and non-violent demonstrations.
A common sentiment was expressed by students at New York University with a banner hung out of a window which read "They Can't Kill Us All.


On May 8, eleven people were bayonetted at the University of New Mexico by the New Mexico National Guard in a confrontation with student protesters.<31> Also on May 8, an antiwar protest at New York's Federal Hall held at least partly in reaction to the Kent State killings was met with a counter-rally of pro-Nixon construction workers organized by Peter J. Brennan, later appointed U.S. Labor Secretary by President Nixon, resulting in the "Hard Hat Riot".

Just five days after the shootings, 100,000 people demonstrated in Washington, D.C., against the war and the killing of unarmed student protesters. Ray Price, Nixon's chief speechwriter from 1969–1974, recalled the Washington demonstrations saying, "The city was an armed camp. The mobs were smashing windows, slashing tires, dragging parked cars into intersections, even throwing bedsprings off overpasses into the traffic down below. This was the quote, student protest. That's not student protest, that’s civil war."<8>

Not only was Nixon taken to Camp David for two days for his own protection, but Charles Colson (Counsel to President Nixon from 1969 to 1973) stated that the military was called up to protect the administration from the angry students; he recalled that "The 82nd Airborne was in the basement of the executive office building, so I went down just to talk to some of the guys and walk among them, and they're lying on the floor leaning on their packs and their helmets and their cartridge belts and their rifles cocked and you’re thinking, 'This can't be the United States of America. This is not the greatest free democracy in the world. This is a nation at war with itself.'"<8>

[coalition_unwilling]

48. I was knee-high to a grasshopper then, so don't have any

personal memories or experience from the time. So all of my knowledge comes from books and articles.

I do agree that in the immediate aftermath of the Kent State massacre (May 4, 1970), there was a surge in student anti-war activity, specifically the student strike. But the war dragged on past the 1972 elections and into 1974, even as Nixon drew down U.S. combat forces in-country. I think if you are honest you will admit that the student anti-war movement stalled out and went into hibernation in 1971 and beyond, partly as a realization that students could die, even if they peacefully protested against the war. I don't have secondary sources readily at hand to support my point, but I assure you they do exist.

This is not to take away one iota from your generation's courage or what members of your generation accomplished.

[dixiegrrrrl]

49. I am honest and I cannot admit the hibernation meme you suggest.

So it comes down to my memories, my experience, versus your statement sans any quoted sources.
Here is a source I can suggest:

from Wiki:

Jane Fonda went to Hanoi in 1972, when Nixon escalated the war by bombing Hanoi.
"In 1972, Fonda helped fund and organize the Indochina Peace Campaign.
It continued to mobilize antiwar activists across the nation after the 1973 Paris Peace Agreement,
through 1975, when the United States withdrew from Vietnam."
( 1975 is mentioned because: As an anti-war and peace movement organization, the Indochina Peace Campaign (IPC) operated in such cities as Boston, New York, Detroit, and Santa Clara, Calif., from the years 1972 to 1975. Founded by the social activist Tom Hayden, the organization's professed aims included the mobilization of dissent against the Vietnam War, the formation of a broad-based campaign demanding unconditional amnesty for U.S. war resisters, and the dissemination of educational information on a wide variety of subjects connected to U.S. domestic and foreign policy.)

Many of us were active on and off campus after Kent State, encouraged by Ellsberg's Release of the Pentagon papers.

List of Protest marches on Washington DC:(AFTER 1970 Kent State)

# April 19, 1971 - Operation Dewey Canyon Three by the Vietnam Veterans against the War.
Over 2,000 veterans camp on the Mall, protest all over the city. John Kerry testifies in front of Senate.
# April 24, 1971 - Vietnam War Out Now rally. 500,000 call for end to Vietnam War.
# May 3, 1971 - 1971 May Day Protests. Mass action by Vietnam anti-war militants to shut down the federal government.
# January 20, 1973, Anti-war protest demonstration. Includes the Yippie-Zippie RAT float & SDS "March Against Racism & the War" contingent.

and, btw, even after the last troops left Viet-Nam in '73, citizens were active:

# April 27, 1974 - Ten thousand marched in Washington, D.C., calling for impeachment of President Richard M. Nixon.

[coalition_unwilling]

53. OK, I think I may be suffering from a bit of false-memory syndrome.

Going to dig through my books and articles and see if I can find some sourcing for my assertions about post-Kent State protest torpor. Otherwise, I concede your point. Did not wish to imply that you were in any way dis-honest, btw.

[coalition_unwilling]

57. I think I may have been wrong about this, as I simply cannot find

any source that backs up my assertion. In fact, in looking into it, it appears that Kent State may have caused an increase in U.S. military desertions and insubordination.

If I did read something saying that Kent State sent the anti-war movement into decline, it was probably in a source like William Manchester's "Glory and the Dream." Manchester did not approve of the counter-culture, as witnessed by his treatment of the trial of the Chicago 8. So his assessment that Kent State spelled the decline of the anti-war movement, if that is where it came from, should be taken with a grain of salt.

Thanks for sticking with me on this while I went back and checked. Funny how memory operates.

[gateley]

17. I think the Egyptians were quite the example to follow. They never

let themselves get provoked, and no matter how frustrated and angry they became -- like the roller coaster "He's going to resign!" "Uh, he's not going anywhere" -- they maintained their cool and their focus. Absolutely textbook perfect.

Not sure we could pull it off. The RW would be fighting the rest of us, plus, we have guns!

[bdamomma]

20. yes plus they were united and came out

and were persistent. they lost 300 and they didn't need those "goon squads", but they came out victorious.

[Desertrose]

22. I agree...all our guns would be the end of any kind of peaceful revolution here.

There is also too much hate between the citizens here. TPTB did a great job of turning us against each other. We are (and would be) too busy fighting each other ...make that shooting each other, to agree on anything....

Not to mention that so many here think they are not that poor or oppressed...that there would still be a chance for the "American Dream" to happen to them if they just tow the line. sigh.



Watching the Egyptians...damn...that was really a thing of beauty!

[bobbolink]

24. As much as I deeply respect the Egyptians, that is not completely true.

They did set fire to the party headquarters building, after all.

And burned a few cars and trucks, etc.

I don't fault them for that... being provoked, as you say, especially when you know the chances are you could die, drives people to do things they wouldn't otherwise do.

However, they made up for it in so many other ways.

Walk like an Egyptian!

[gateley]

30. Yeah, I was actually surprised when I saw the headquarters aflame. But those

were probably the "bad seeds" -- bound to be a few, and the others just get caught up in the emotion.

I remember hearing about a man who got caught up in looting after some tragedy (maybe 9/11?). He said "and here I was running down the street with a TV set in my arms!" He was shocked at himself. We don't know how we'd react until we're put into a particular situation, as you say -- until we walk in their shoes.

[bobbolink]

32. And we can't dismiss the possibility of provacateurs, with people who follow along

in the heat of the moment.

You're right.... its so easy to judge.... we just don't really know how we would react to provocation.

[lunatica]

27. I believe it's a cultural thing we don't understand

death and the way it happens is a very different thing in some countries and religions. We don't believe in martyrs so we don't get it. The Arab countries believe in martyrs and obviously not just in terrorist martyrs. That's something we should try to educate ourselves about before we judge them.

[eilen]

42. People here are doing it. They are just using guns.

and not just taking out themselves but also family members. Then there was the guy who flew a plane into an IRS office...

it is not just "isolated incidences"

We lack a voice, a network that puts it together and keeps putting it out there. Partly because the Democrats are in charge and they have the Left cowed with the fear of the BSC Teaparty and Mostly Mean Republicans. Even here the left is quickly piled on and shut down when they are critical. There seems to be a lack of will or energy to put an alternative out there. The fear is palpable that it will not work. We also lack a public square where free speech is protected. Instead we have malls and bigbox plazas that are "private property" with security forces to clamp down on any activity that may interfere with commerce. The corporate takeover of our public spaces is one of the worst unreported crimes of our times. Now our internets have become a public square but those avenues of transmission are also patrolled and owned by corporations and others with agendas like this site. If they don't like a message it is removed.

The people are too distracted. We are freezing and it all we can do to keep our jobs. Once we can't keep our lights on and our jobs get cut, you will see more people in the street.

In the inner city you see many people in the street (when it is warm out, not 140 inches of snow winter); in the suburbs, not so much. It takes a longer, harder times, and some leadership--organizations created that are willing to help others and spread their message. Look at the Great Depression. The communist and socialist organizations were very vocal, gave out their newspapers, had meetings offered food. Out of those rose liberal or more left wing politicians who took their message and democratic principles and inspired people. They went on the radio, they held free lectures, they had outreach. They organizes strikes and demanded worker rights at a time when people were told they "were lucky to have a job".

There was no internet yet they managed to do it. What is our excuse?

[Safetykitten]

13. I hear the Smurfs are unhappy. Since the President has addressed them they seem ready for a change.

[d_r]

15. Its the Islamic Caliphate!

Panic! End of the World!

[glinda]

36. we need to run the Koch Bros and a few others out of the Country.

[WillyT]

40. K & R !!!

:kick:

[boston bean]

50. Can you add the US?

[Tx4obama]

51. Breaking News - Algeria - the next anti-government rally will be held February 19

The next anti-government rally will be held Saturday February 19

Clashes in Algeria as opposition plans new protest
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4731969

[Kolesar]

54. Singapore and China...in my dreams...eom

[Fire1]

55. Yeah, everywhere but here. I guess we're living the life. n/t

[DeSwiss]

56. "The whole world is watching." - n/t