The Day Obama Struck Out

[TBF]

The greatness of a president can be measured by his concern for the animals

By Michael Mountain

Dear Mr. President,

A lot of us are in shock today about what you said yesterday to the owner of the Philadelphia Eagles about Michael Vick. This was the third (at least) in a series of really bad calls in relation to the suffering of animals.

And for those of us who look to you for leadership, it could be a case of “three strikes and you’re out.”

First strike

The first strike was soon after you came into office and had to choose a family pet. You’d had thousands of letters and petitions from people across the country encouraging you to go to one of the shelters in D.C. and adopt a dog or cat who really needed a home.

...

Second strike

In November 2009, just before Thanksgiving, you did the traditional “pardoning” of a turkey on the South Lawn of the White House.

It’s a touching moment. Millions of turkeys live miserable lives so that we can celebrate Thanksgiving. The ceremony at the White House is an opportunity to say a few words on their behalf – to recognize their sacrifice and to acknowledge their suffering. This is the occasion for a word of thanks and a note of appreciation. Sort of like saying grace before the meal.

Instead, you just threw out a series of off-hand, off-base jokes:

...

Third strike

And now we have your comment about Michael Vick. Here it is, as told to NBC News reporter Peter King by Philadelphia Eagles owner Jeffrey Lurie:

“The president wanted to talk about two things, but the first was Michael . He said, ‘So many people who serve time never get a fair second chance.’ He was … passionate about it. He said it’s never a level playing field for prisoners when they get out of jail. And he was happy that we did something on such a national stage that showed our faith in giving someone a second chance after such a major downfall.”

Of all the thousands of people who have slipped up in life and who can benefit from a helping hand and a second chance – like the shoplifter who was trying to keep her family afloat or the drug addict who’s now working his way through rehab – why this man?

Why on earth would you choose to give a Presidential shout-out to a man who has tortured and killed dogs by the dozen… who has yet to acknowledge what he did… who has never talked about those dogs… and who has yet even to offer a single word of apology for his horrific behavior?

Much more at the link: http://www.zoenature.org/2010/12/the-day-obama-struck-out/

Note: Michael Mountain is one of the co-founders of Best Friends Animal Sanctuary, and was still president at the time that they took in several of Michael Vick's dogs for rehabilitation. Now he runs the web site "Zoe".

[highplainsdem]

1. K&R

[hlthe2b]

2. K&R to counter the unrecs. BOTH sides deserve to be heard, DUers

It is ONLY fair.

[BzaDem]

3. I was going to respond, but then I asked: why respond to an article that has so many lies?

Surely if Michael Mountain wanted to lie, he could have found more subtle ways to do it than "who has yet even to offer a single word of apology for his horrific behavior."

[TBF]

4. What lies? nt

[BzaDem]

5. I already quoted one. n/t

[TBF]

8. When has Michael Vick offered up an apology for his treatment of the dogs? nt

[BzaDem]

12. Multiple times.

http://globalgrind.com/channel/news/content/912587/michael-vick-blogs-my-heart-hurtsto-think-of-what-ive-done/

[TBF]

13. This blog shows that he understands that others find his behaviors

reprehensible - by looking at them he understands that. It's a start I guess, but I find it very troubling that when he was sitting in prison he did not realize that what he did was wrong. He only realizes that by other humans shunning him - he does not realize himself that torturing and killing another living being is a bad thing to do.

[hlthe2b]

16. I guess we have different definitions of sincere "apologies"

I always thought it included admitting what you did was wrong, expressing why it was wrong and expressing some personal shame for the behavior or incident. Usually it includes a statement of how one intends to avoid doing similar in the future and to make amends.

Not simply expressing concern for oneself over the consequences one has faced for the action.

Vick may be "sorry," but he's got quite the distance to go in terms of expressing a true apology.

[BzaDem]

21. Did you read the link? n/t

[hlthe2b]

25. I just did. I thought it was what I had read before, but this does

seem both sincere, and very likely to reflect his actual words. That is a very good start. I hope he maintains.

What he saw in the eyes of those animal welfare workers and volunteers is not hate for what he did, but overwhelming grief. If he looked at me, he'd see the same. Having worked in years past with animals that were ripped to part in the fighting pits of North Georgia, this is damned personal to me. So, despite the accusations of some here who are so intent on defending Vick that they assume anyone who has expressed doubts as being "haters," it is grief for those animals that they are confusing. Very real and very personal grief.

[TBF]

26. I read it and Vick did not show remorse for what he did to those dogs -

he is upset because people have told him it is wrong.

[Skittles]

45. HE HAS NO REMORSE

that's why he CANNOT SHOW IT

and all these people twisting themselves into pretzels defending that bastard: :puke:

[Name removed]

47. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[chimpymustgo]

74. Skittles, I so often agree with you - but tell me how you know what is in Michael Vick's heart??

I find these reactions SO unfair. I think Michael Vick DOES realize what he did was horribly, despicably wrong. He spent nearly 2 years in PRISON for it. He lost his FORTUNE. And we will forever have to live with the SHAME of his actions.

Vick has expressed remorse time and again. He spends time spreading the message against animal cruelty. Why do you and so many others "see" something else? What could he do to satisfy you?

[TBF]

84. Michael Vick has expressed remorse for being caught - he has

never once apologized for what he did to those dogs.

[chimpymustgo]

87. Except he HAS apologized. Many times. And speaks and makes public appearances denouncing his awful

actions.

You and others are being WILLFULLY IGNORANT. Why?

[TBF]

89. No he has not apologized for what he did to the dogs - only

for getting caught. He has said that if he had not gone to prison he would still be doing it. The question is why you and others continue to defend Obama no matter what he says.

[chimpymustgo]

93. I am a harsh critic of Obama on his policies. On this subject, you are lying. Vick has apologized

Why do you spout such vitriol and lies?


Vick apologizes, asks for forgiveness in post-plea statement

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2993103

[TBF]

95. And again you misinterpret what he is saying - he never once takes responsibility for what he does

to the dogs - he doesn't even mention his brutal torture and murder of dogs in this statement. You are the liar.

[Skittles]

85. he is not believable

believe me, I know - he can talk and talk but the empathy, the remorse - it simply is not there

[chimpymustgo]

86. How do you know? What is the basis for your judgement?

[Skittles]

94. I'm not psychic

but there are ways to determine if someone is being truthful - and I know them - I learned them as a child - Vick is playing a role - badly, but it's paying off for him and apparently, that is all that counts

[lukasahero]

9. Can you please quote Vick's apology here?

The one that actually admits and apologizes for what he's done (not what he's lost) because I have yet to see it.

[AndrewP]

80. Nope. This article doesn't have any lies. Sorry.

[Hannah Bell]

6. "The greatness of a president can be measured by his concern for the animals" = wtf?

sorry, but that's just silly.

[TBF]

7. It is a takeoff from Gandhi's quote (you know, that silly moron) -

From later in the article that you did not read -

You may be familiar with the well-known remark of Mohandas Gandhi, who said that:

“One can measure the greatness and the moral progress of a nation by looking at how it treats its animals.”

One can also measure the greatness and the moral leadership of a president by his concern for those who are most dependent on the example he sets.

Edited because spelling errors upset Hannah Bell.

[Pancho Sanza]

10. Although I'm not a 'believer', I find these words to be appropriate:

;And the King will say, 'I tell you the truth, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were doing it to me!'

That's from Matthew in the Xian Bible...

[Hannah Bell]

11. hitler loved animals. many people who hate people like animals.

i don't care what gandhi said, gandhi was no paragon either.

the president's job has nothing to do with kindness to animals & the greatness of prsidents isn't measured by how they treat animals.

[hlthe2b]

14. I suppose both Bush* and Hitler make that point...

both were quite captivated by their dogs and treated them kindly. :eyes:

[TBF]

17. The point is that you can tell a lot about people by how they treat those

who are dependent on them. Would you want someone who abused children to be your president?

Sorry but I guess we disagree on this. That's fine, I can see that support for Vick the celebrity is far out-weighing concern for animals on this site, and I have learned a lot from these conversations the past few days. It certainly has reminded me why I walked away from involvement in politics many years ago.

[hlthe2b]

18. Yes. It was an imperfect analogy, but an apt one, just the same.

[Hannah Bell]

20. you can tell a lot about people by how they treat people who can't help them achieve their goals.

but the poor & powerless *can* often help people -- especially politicians -- achieve their goals.

so you can't tell much. especially in the age of PR.

and as for animals, animals give people all sorts of strokes.

better to judge politicians on the policies they enact.

[TBF]

27. Well I'm very sorry but I can't give Obama points on many of the policies he enacts either -

DADT being the notable exception.

[Hannah Bell]

31. nothing to do with obama. i commented only on the idea that treatment of animals is the measure of

a president.

i'm sure obama made the call to vick out of some kind of political calculation.

everything politicians do is calculated, therefore hypocritical & false.

there is no way to judge the "character" of a president from afar, since it's all theater.

there are only the policies.'

that's why it irks me when people go on about how policitian so & so is such a nice person, so generous, loving, whatever.

it's a kind of idolatry, & disgusting.

we don't know the secret hearts of public figures, just their policies.

and we know, for example, that bush is a mass murderer & a fat liar.

but he was nice to his dog. so what?

he lied & got us into a war, thereby killing hundreds of thousands of iraqis, afghanis & americans.

and obama is shaping up to be nearly as bad, for all that he has a cute dog.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

57. my apologies, but when exactly did Obama call Vick?

[Tx4obama]

71. Obama did NOT call Vick.

Obama called the OWNER of The Eagles to talk about alternative energy that they are putting in the stadium - Green Energy.
In the conversation with the 'owner' Obama mentioned that he appreciates it when ex-felons that have done their time are given a second chance at life once they are released from prison.

[jberryhill]

23. How about an adult man who sleeps naked with teenage female relatives?

Because that would be Gandhi.

[TBF]

24. got it, Gandhi under the bus as well. nt

Edited because spelling errors upset Hannah Bell.

[jberryhill]

28. Lotsa room under there

But, seriously, whether a government official does or does not continue to condemn a convict who has served his sentence is pretty far down the list of things I could get into a lather over.

[TBF]

30. In my view that is not the issue - I personally have no problem with

Mr. Vick playing football. In other professional careers (law, medicine) one might even lose their license for criminal wrong-doing, but it is more likely that you'd lose it due to negligence directly related to your client or something along those lines. I'm fine with him being employed in his previous position.

The question is whether Obama should be using his pulpit to praise this person who has clearly not shown remorse, but happens to be a very popular football player. If Mr. Obama were really looking for ex-cons to celebrate, I'm sure there are some hard-working folks out there who could've been named. But, no, of course not, it has to be Michael Vick.

[jberryhill]

33. Then you missed the point entirely

‘So many people who serve time never get a fair second chance.’ He was … passionate about it. He said it’s never a level playing field for prisoners when they get out of jail. And he was happy that we did something on such a national stage that showed our faith in giving someone a second chance after such a major downfall.”

He was making a larger point, which apparently flew right over your head.

[TBF]

34. What a deep point - a celebrity gets a second chance. Like that has never happened before. nt

[jberryhill]

35. No, you still miss the point

...because you don't want to.

Oddly, he is not talking about Vick, but about "other people" who do not get a chance and expressing the hope that this public example would do some good for those who are not celebrities.

But, don't worry, Obama will do something absolutely atrocious next week for you to froth over.

[apocalypsehow]

39. Spot-on observation. +1. n/t.

[TBF]

40. Honestly at this point I've had it with all politicians. For many years,

like many people, I completely turned away from politics and had no involvement. I showed up to vote for the democrat in national elections and that was it. I got involved again when I saw Obama campaigning and was so encouraged that I worked on his campaign.

Never again.

[jberryhill]

41. Oh, one of those

So instead of the long, hard slow slog of actual engagement in things that matter to you, politics is electing one person in the federal government who can wave a magic wand and make everyone's dream come true.

Do you think your state laws have more to do with how animals are treated than any federal law?

Yep, you can tell a lot about a person by how much they care about animals.

You might be right about that.

[TBF]

42. I didn't say that I didn't engage in things that mattered to me -

I just wasn't involved in politics. But think whatever you like ...

[jberryhill]

43. Well, obviously grown men chasing a ball around a field must matter

Personally, I just can't get worked up over a bunch of grown men playing a game with a ball - and that includes who is allowed to do it, or not allowed to do it, or worthy of doing it, or whatever.

But, clearly, there need to be umpteen threads on a political forum about whether someone involved in dog fighting is worthy to play a game that involves jumping on people in large piles.

The whole thing is just bizarre, so dragging Gandhi into some point about who should be able to play a violent game which involves the use of an inflatable animal hyde is perhaps a symptom of how moribund irony has become.

Yeah, Gandhi wouldn't want Michael Vick to play football, because he's more of a Steelers fan, or something.

[TBF]

48. The problem is not Mr. Vick playing the game - as you would know if you

actually read my responses. The problem is Mr. Obama singling out this man for a presidential nod. But go ahead and circle your president at all costs, no matter what he says or does.

[jberryhill]

50. What got the "presidential nod" was hiring people who have had a criminal conviction and served time

If you want to pretend that the president approves of or endorses dogfighting, then you go right ahead.

And if you want to pretend that Gandhi would give a shit who plays QB for the Eagles, that's fine too.

Silly, but fine.

[TBF]

66. I didn't say any of those things - but I know people make up shit everyday to defend Obama. nt

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

97. Just as this thread is making shit up to tear him down.

[TBF]

101. Nope, I'm just an advocate for animals. I know these aren't important political issues -

but they are important to me. And I would note that Obama stays true to form even in this occurrence - he is going to bat for a brother coming out of prison (which ordinarily would be commendable) - but true to form it's a millionaire brother with a great arm. And the NFL owner who contributes to his campaign. Obama is nothing if not consistent.

[Tx4obama]

72. It wasn't a 'presidential nod'. It was a private conversation that should have stayed private n/t

[blueamy66]

100. I'm with you.

I've had it with people too.

No one should be trusted....No one.

It's sad, but true. :-(

[Skittles]

46. this one flies over yours

[PaulaFarrell]

59. so explain why he has pardoned so few people

and of those, only for very minor or ancient things? and only after nearly 2 years in office? it doesn't jive with his sentiments as stated above. just all seems political to me. afraid to pardon those who really need it, prasiing someone who really doesn't.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1210/45943.html

"Granting the first pardons of his presidency, President Barack Obama on Friday gave clemency to nine people — most of whom were small-time criminals convicted at least a decade ago and who never served time behind bars in the first place.

Some of the convictions that Obama effectively swept away were for offenses that seem almost comically trivial, including the case of Ronald Lee Foster of Beaver Falls, Pa. He was convicted back in 1963 of "mutilation of coins," served a year's probation and paid a $20 fine. "

[Hannah Bell]

32. it's GANDHI, not GHANDI.

[jberryhill]

36. Gesundheit

[Bobbieo]

15. No, the greatness of a 'MAN ' can be measured by his concern for animals.

[lumberjack_jeff]

51. Exactly.

[Safetykitten]

19. Taking the phone away from him would help a bit. Seems to be a starting point

[TBF]

29. No I think it's better to let him talk - just as it is important for me to read these responses

and see what kind of folks make up this website.

Cruelty to animals - who cares?
Michael Vick - awesome football player

[jberryhill]

38. I don't watch or follow football

So I wouldn't know Michael Vick from a cough drop.

If the sentences are not long enough for whatever he was convicted of, then you need to lobby the appropriate legislators.

[Name removed]

22. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[apocalypsehow]

37. Delighted to UnRec. n/t.

[Catherina]

44. Delighted to recommend. n/t

[TBF]

49. Current president of Best Friends is waiting for his call from the president -

December 29, 2010 - By Francis Battista -

Now that President Obama has jumped on the Michael Vick bandwagon with an official call to Eagles’ owner Jeffrey Lurie to congratulate him for giving the quarterback another chance, all of us here at Best Friends are waiting for a call from the White House to congratulate us for giving Vick’s dogs a second chance. I’m quite sure that the other organizations that also took on some of the canine survivors of the football star’s dogfighting operation are similarly poised.

The conventional wisdom on this is that the president’s people have put their finger to the wind and decided that Michael Vick has been sanitized for political consumption by his success. (It’s interesting to speculate how he would be perceived if he were having a lousy year.) Personally, I’m kind of tired of hearing and reading about Michael Vick and wish that the media would lose its obsession with the man, especially since any mention of or concern about the dogs who managed to escape with their lives from his care is conspicuously absent from his public statements.

While we no longer wait by the phone for a call from Mr. Vick asking after his dogs, the likelihood of a call from the president has brought new esprit to the switchboard team and I’ve put together some notes on those we call the Vicktory dogs in case someone puts the historic call through to me by mistake. The conversation will go something like this:

“Mr. President, what a surprise! Thanks for taking the time out of your busy schedule to commend us for giving the Vicktory dogs a second chance. Sure, I’ve got a few minutes to fill you in … kind of a presidential briefing, I guess...

Much more at the link about how the dogs are doing: http://blogs.bestfriends.org/index.php/2010/12/29/when-the-president-calls-about-the-vick-dogs/

[cottonseed]

52. Sounds like Francis is in it more for the 15 minutes then for the dogs.

I'll bet those dogs see the inside of an oven before it's all said and done.

[TBF]

54. That statements shows you know absolutely nothing about Best Friends and

welcome to my ignore list of 5.

[cottonseed]

69. My statement shows I've been paying attention to that asshat.

[Tx4obama]

73. Obama might call them when they install GREEN ENERGY like the Eagles owner did

OBAMA DID NOT CALL THE OWNER OF THE EAGLES TO TALK ABOUT VICK.
Obama called to TALK ABOUT GREEN ENERGY AT THE EAGLES STADIUM !!!

p.s. Honestly after seeing your 1000 posts on this issue I am starting to wonder ................

[CatWoman]

53. Hard to believe you guys are still on this shit

but then again.....

[TBF]

55. As long as Obama's shit continues I intend to comment on it. nt

[AndrewP]

82. Sorry we don't like dog torture

[BoWanZi]

56. He struck out only because of 3 animal stories? Geeez.

Why the heck are these animal stories considered more important than a lot of other issues that Obama might have struck out on?

I mean really? Someone thinks that Obama "struck out" because he made a funny about eating a turkey? Guess our troops in Iraq still means nothing to them but a stupid turkey does.

Some peoples' priorities.

[TBF]

58. If you read the article you would understand - Michael Mountain

only commented on animal issues because that is his area of expertise. He was president of the sanctuary who took in Vick's dogs when his kennels were raided.

Believe me, there are any number of discussions we can have on Obama striking out - most recently with his decision to give tax breaks to the wealthiest of our country, while beginning his discussion on cuts to social security.

As much as I love animals, there is much more to talk about that is absolutely appalling from Mr. Obama. Feel free to start threads on the other topics and I will chime in - I just started this one because the issue is important to me.

[Name removed]

60. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TBF]

64. thanks -

I have come a long way since we met three years ago. Thank you for the rec.

[earth mom]

70. Thank you for telling me that...

it's not easy being the bearer of bad news.

Believe me, I'd love to live in denial about so many things myself!

Which is probably why I'm not on DU as much these days. It all just makes me so sad and I often just don't want to deal with any of it...which is a sort of denial.

But....NGU-Never Give Up-fighting the good fight! :grouphug:

[LynneSin]

61. Except one problem - THAT'S NOT WHY OBAMA CALLED JEFF LURIE

:grr:

I mean the concept that a major NFL stadium could be run 100% on a combination of Wind/Solar power is a pretty major thing and btw Jeff Lurie has been a major Dem contributor to both Barack Obama and Joe Sestak. Think of the impact if we could get other major sports team owners to do the same thing with their stadiums & arenas.

http://www.newsmeat.com/sports_political_donations/Jeffrey_Lurie.php

[tallahasseedem]

92. Facts don't matter in this case...

keep up LynneSin! ;)

[TBF]

96. Evidentally they don't matter at all - noone heard about the "alternative energy" story until

the call about Vick was in the press. Sounds like a cover story to me.

[SidDithers]

62. ...

Sid

[DFab420]

63. He made fun of turkeys!!!

And accepted a gift from the Kennedy's in form of a puppy!!

Evvvvvil. :sarcasm:

this article is shit, literally some sat over a keyboard and shat this out.

[TBF]

67. Michael Mountain is twice the person Barack Obama will ever be -

he has dedicated his life to rescuing animals, while Obama is rescuing rich folk. We each have our own priorities.

[DFab420]

77. That has to be one of the silliest comparisons

I've ever heard.

President Obama has dedicated his life to the leading our nation. I'm going to go ahead and say Obama's priorities are pretty right on.

This is the sort of comment about the President that sounds straight out of a republican spinmiester.

I wouldn't say Mountain's life mission isn't important, but he is defiantly NOT twice the man the President is. I understand you want to make your point but come on.

[TBF]

98. President Obama has dedicated his life to serving the wealthy -

he doesn't pay much attention to the rest of us and his priorities in office illustrate this constantly. There are a few things he has done along the way that I'll certainly give him credit for - the Lilly Ledbetter Act is good, repealing DADT major, amd good picks to the Court. Other than that I see a lot of pandering to the wealthy.

[AndrewP]

81. You are 100000% correct on that remark!

The lack of compassion on DU from the Obama cheer squad for the dogs that suffered at that criminals hands is amazing. And sickening.

[Cali_Democrat]

65. "The greatness of a president can be measured by his concern for the animals"

Really? Let's look at past great Presidents. How do they stack up when it comes to concern for animals? If this is such an important factor in determining the greatness of a President, then surely all past presidents are ranked according to their concern for animals.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

68. It gave me great pleasure to unrecommend this garbage! n/t

[Bluebear]

75. Of course it did.

[SidDithers]

99. Me too...nt

Sid

[COLGATE4]

103. +1

[Tx4obama]

76. President Obama has been an ADVOCATE for dogs for a long time

As if we didn’t love him enough already, now we can add this to Obama’s resume: Three Legged Dog Lover and Anti-Puppy Mill Advocate!

Visit “A Rare Breed of Love,” and learn more about Baby, an abused puppy mill survivor and “national spokesdog” raising awareness about cruelty in the dog breeding industry

http://tripawds.com/2008/05/31/three-legged-dogs-bark-for-obama/

[TBF]

83. Complete BS - when it came to a dog for his daughters it came from a breeder -

and I could care less if that breeder was blessed by Ted Kennedy and the pope himself. He went for the designer dog.

[NYCGirl]

78. If "the greatness of a president can be measured by his concern for the animals,"

what do these pictures say about Teddy Roosevelt and LBJ?

[MrScorpio]

79. Will someone please think about the poor turkeys?

No what did I do with that mayo and dijon?

[TexasObserver]

88. unrec

[Scurrilous]

90. Garbage. n/t

[tallahasseedem]

91. Oh FFS...

the melodrama is getting out of control.

unrecommend.

[Arkana]

102. Yes, fuck Obama for choosing the pet he wanted.

And fuck Obama for not taking the pardoning of the turkey in the completely-serious vein that it's obviously meant.

And fuck him even MORE for being a big football fan, because most Americans just fucking hate football. That out of touch fuddy-duddy.

Jesus Christ, can we PLEASE get the FUCK over this?!

E: Oh, by the way? My last two dogs were from breeders and they were the sweetest, kindest animals I've ever had the pleasure of owning. I fucking dare you to tell me that I have no concern for the animal world. Go ahead. Do it.