Reply #50: Good; but can we define "Catholic church says" more carefully?

[IndyPriest]

I understand its usefulness as a handy short-cut for saying "the pope and his cabinet officers of the Catholic church." But, really, the phrase functions a lot like "the U.S. says" when the meaning is "officers of the executive branch of the U.S. government."

A lot of us wince at phrases like "the U.S. says" because WHAT is said is often really abhorent to what many of us believe. The C. Church is a HUGE group of people, and to ask about what "it" says, you also have to ask what part of it you're talking about, otherwise you get weird recults. Example: besides gays, look at the birth control issue. The hierarchy condemns it while more than 80% of Catholics use it. So when we say, "The Catholic church condemns the use of birth control," it's truly misleading.

This can seem like a weasling technical point, except when you get into discussions like these. People have been truly hurt by actions of some Catholics who use their positions of leadership and supposed sanctity to do real violence to others. When Catholic leaders use their positions to say "the Catholic church says (or does)", they can give the distinct impression that most if not all Catholics agree with them. So it becomes REALLY important for the rest of the church to say: You're not talking for us! Because then it becomes MUCH easier to figure out how power works, who's speaking for whom, who's on what side of what issue, whom you can count on and form alliances with, and whom you have to watch out for.