Reply #56: Just pointing out that geography is the key to borders and Rivers united people

[happyslug]

That is a central theme when looking at Countries, Geography more then anything else sets up the borders. Geography sets up trade and trade unite people. Once you accept the fact that the United States between the Appalachian and Rocky Mountains had a overwhelming need to be one Country, the push to unite will be strong (As will be the pull to stay united AND to re-unite if it breaks up). How the country unites will vary over time. Canada right now is an independent state but it is clearly the same country and nation as the United States ("State" being a Legal entity as is Canada and the United States today, "Nation" being a group of people who see themselves as one people. while Canadians tend to deny this when push comes to shove they support the United States, and "Country" being a geography term that indicates one part of the planet that others sees as one country and they own people see as one country).

Thus, with maybe the exceptions of the French in Quebec and Louisiana, the United States and Canada has been one Nation since before the US Civil War (Which saw massive recruits from Canada to put down the South and make sure the South stayed part of the United States while England was supporting the South short of actually sending in troops). This was driven by the above water systems that tends to united everyone in the middle of North America as one Country. Now, Canada has stayed an independent State, but do to the fact England gave up controlling Canada without US permission during the 1860s AND given that situation it was NOT worth the effort to annex Canada formerly. Thus Canada stayed an independent State, while clearly being more and more part of one Nation and Country with the United States.

As to the East and West Coasts, once the Middle of the Continent was united, they had to part of it. They saw this in Colonial days and given the low population of Native Americans bu Colonial times saw the Middle of the Continent ripe for the taking, but once taken becoming dominate (While the East Coast retained its Leadership through trade and commerce, it has been more leadership then control). The same with the West Coast, but starting from a weaker and later position (And with a much smaller population in the part of Central North America next to the West Coast).

In any breakup, the Middle of North America (another name for the Mississippi River System) will re-unite sooner or later. It may be re-united by one of the states/countries on the coast, but it will be re-united and once re-united will expand to include the East Coast, Alaska and the Puget sound and Columbia River systems. The Rio Grand and Colorado river systems may end up with Mexico (again) or may end up with the Mississippi river system That is the one wild card and that depends on what happens in Mexico. If Mexico, during any breakup of North America, stays united or re-unite before the Mississippi river system, then the Colorado and Rio Grand will become Mexican again. If the Mississippi River re-unites first then to the Mississippi river system.

Southern California will go with the Colorado River. The San Francisco bay will go with Salt Lake City. If the Great basin (Where Salt Lake is on) goes with Mexico, so will San Francisco, if Salt Lake City goes with the Mississippi so will San Francisco for the best way to the Mississippi from San Francisco is via Salt Lake City. Unlike the Colorado and Rio Grande River Systems, Salt Lake City had a natural tendency to go with the Mississippi, simply because it is that much nearer then the Mexican valley AND Salt Lake City is on the best route between Denver Colorado (And the Mississippi River system) and San Francisco.

Now, just like today, we may see some parts of North America Independent States from the Mississippi River System but once the Mississippi River is united they will become part of the new Country and nation even if they stay independent states (aka Canada today). Only time will tell, but the tendency to stay united may make this whole debate moot, the United States may go through hard times, but stay united even as the rest of the world breaks up. We will have to see what happens for it will be more a product of how the country stays together and/or reunites then any other factor.