GOP backs abortion bill

[tomm2thumbs]

Source: San Antonio Express News

Republican lawmakers in Austin, including San Antonio Rep. Frank Corte, have proposed legislation that would require doctors to perform an ultrasound on the fetus of women considering an abortion, with the volume turned up on its heartbeat.

<snip>

It also says a pregnant woman 'may avert her eyes from the ultrasound images'

<snip>

Unfortunately, the moral fervor some GOP lawmakers display on the abortion issue doesn't always extend to children who are actually born. According to the Dallas Morning News, a budget plan on track for approval in the Senate would deny a Child Protective Services request for 175 additional caseworkers. Those new hires could help the agency meet a federal requirement to visit each month 95 percent of foster children.

Anyone familiar with the sometimes nightmarish state of Texas foster care knows what that means. Recent horror stories at state schools for the mentally retarded show once again that the state hasn't adequately supervised children in its care.

Read more: http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/columnists/scott_stroud/GOP_backs_abortion_bill_averts_its_eyes_from_CPS.html

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Isn't it nice that they will let women 'avert their eyes' - how nice that they will not hold their heads and pin their eyelids back - this is crazy psycho babble from the Texas GOP - with a state as big as Texas, we need to take this back from the Far Right and bring Texas back into the 21st Century from this woman-domineering old-men's-club place it is now in.

[WillParkinson]

1. Avert your eyes...

But have the sound turned up. Counterproductive and ignorant.

[saigon68]

34. And once the kid is born-- they will turn their backs on it

Like in "You're poor--- It sucks to be you".

[Lorien]

35. Exactly. The GOP only "cares" for those in the womb

or human vegetables. Once a human being has a conscious and a will of it's own they have no more use for it!

[TankLV]

67. "Love Affair With The Fetus"...so aptly named by our wonderful Surgeon General...

[roguevalley]

61. someone needs to do an ultrasound on his head, see if there is

anything there.

[and-justice-for-all]

2. You can hear cells in an ultrasound??

Uh, this is not a decision for any religious or governmental body to make.

[RC]

3. No, it's the 'Beating Heart' of the future canon fodder they want you to hear.

[Redwraithvienna]

21. When ... exactky does the Heart start to beat ?

Isnt that fairly late in a pregnancy ?

[jmowreader]

38. It's at eight weeks

But the neat thing is, even at one week of embryonic development the mother's heart is beating, and even one of those cheap-ass Chinese ultrasound machines should be able to pick that up. This is what they're counting on: if someone with a real fancy diploma from a Sonography School tells a scared pregnant teen that sound is "your baby's heart beating," not too many of those scared pregnant teens will ask, "how can a heart the size of a pebble make a sound that strong?"

[tandot]

40. it starts to beat in Week 5 or 6 in pregnancy

We had our first prenatal appointment at 6 weeks and we could see the pulsating on the ultrasound. However, we couldn't hear it yet.

[uppityperson]

46. And here we get into "weeks" confusion. Do you count from when fertilization occured, or

are you counting from your last menses?

Hence EDD is 40 wks from lmp (last menstrual period) or 38 wks after fertilization. Or, a fetus could be considered 6 wks or 8 wks at the same moment, depending on which way is measured.

[tandot]

62. My OB/GYN (as most others) use gestational age (first day of your last period)

since a lot of women don't know when conception happened. Since our pregnancy was planned (ovulation strips) we know the possible days it happened.

We conceived Connor between September 21st and 23rd in 2008 and our first prenatal appointment was on October 22nd, where we saw the pulsating (although we didn't hear anything) on the ultrasound.

At that time he was a little over 4 weeks fertilization age (actual date of conception) and a little over 6 weeks gestational age (first day of last period)

My EDD is June 14 but I am not sure if we'll make it this far. I am on bed rest right now due to high blood pressure.

The whole thing of using different methods to calculate the fetus' age is very confusing.

I hope that clears it up :)

[ejpoeta]

4. maybe we should pass a law....

requiring all of these idiots to have to listen to the sounds of crying children ALL DAY LONG. the sound of hungry children maybe some pictures of them living in the poorest of conditions. because these jerks want to force all babies to be born, and yet don't want any of the social safety nets or social services that would make it possible for a lot of these women to choose to keep the baby. if they can try to guilt a woman into having a baby she probably cannot afford to take care of, then these idiots should have to suffer the consequences of forcing that woman to have that baby. How many kids are in foster care in this country today??? HOW MANY!!!

[KansDem]

36. I agree...

I'd even suggest the sound of girls screaming when acid is thrown into their faces because all they wanted to do was go to school, or the sound of a young woman screaming as she's being flogged because all they wanted to do was marry the man she wanted, not the one "issued" to her.

Or maybe the sounds of 12-year-old boys being raped by Catholic priests.

I imagine there are a whole lot of sounds the Religiously Insane would not want us to hear...

[annabanana]

5. She may "AVERT HER EYES"???. . not acceptable..

She must LOOK at it..

[tomm2thumbs]

8. OMG! that picture

[annabanana]

15. Clockwork Orange. . . . good movie.. . . .n/t

[whopis01]

50. Except they left out the last chapter of the book entirely. n/t

[jmowreader]

43. And they'll use THIS...

http://www.medetzsurgical.com/233.html

If you look online at the stories of people who had LASIK surgery, they generally say they felt like Alex in A Clockwork Orange during the procedure.

[O-Town Blue]

6. That's fine by me...

...So long as they give equal time to the extremely bitter single mom who had had to give up her dreams of college and med school in order to raise her child after baby-daddy bailed the hell out and now strips to make ends meet at that real seedy place off of the interstate and snorts blow off the top of the toilet tank in the ladies room in between feature dances and two-for-ones.

I mean, it's only fair and they shouldn't have any problem finding women like this in Houston.

[SkyDaddy7]

7. Again...This is a job for the so-called Moderate Christians!

If there is such a thing as a moderate Christian, you have all heard them scream "don't lump all religionists in one group" yet they do nothing about their Bronze Age brothers in in GAWD for fear of being labeled an ATHEIST!

These Bronze Age Thinkers could care less about life! This is a front to control women! Here is a pre "SHUT-UP to anyone who says otherwise! If these Bronze Age thinking knuckle draggin Christians really cared about life they would be against war before diplomacy; torture; the death penalty; helping the sick and terminally ill; and every other issue that involves life...However, it is only abortion they cry about because it the only issue involving so-called life in which a women has full decision making authority.

For once I would like to hear a so-called group of moderate Christians step up on the public stage and denounce their Bronze Age brothers in GAWD for such barbaric legislation...Of course we won't hear a peep because there is no such thing as a moderate Christian, period!

The only time you hear from so-called moderate Christians is when someone like Richard Dawkins steps up and points out the "delusion" of religion. If you don't like folks like Dawkins speaking the truth about your Bronze Age beliefs then speak up and redefine your religious text in public! Otherwise us Mean Angry Godless Heathens will have to do it for you!

[polmaven]

11. Grow the H up and look around you!

You are absolutely wrong! I, for example, am a very active Christian who strongly believes in a woman's right to choose an abortion for ANY REASON she sees fit. It is HER body. I also am of the opinion that banning legal abortion will not stop abortions. It will only cause the deaths of more women seeking illegal abortions. I am also very strongly in favor of full marriage rights for my GLBT sisters and brothers.

Because the GOP backs this crap does not mean it will become law.

Yes....There are many, many "moderate" Christians, and many of us are actually LIBERAL Christians. I do not want "religion" meddling in my government any more than I want government meddling in my religion. Get over yourself and your hatred of anyone and anything religious, open your eyes and see the real world.

You have every right to be atheist. Do not I have the right to be a person of faith?

This is one of the more insulting posts I have read here in a long time.

[JerseygirlCT]

64. Can I just second that? nt

[I Have A Dream]

18. Have you ever heard of...

Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice?

This group works very hard to separate church and state and completely supports a woman's right to choose.

[54anickel]

23. Yep, and they offer plenty of opportunities to get involved. (Shameless plug here)

Anyone interested in helping out, and getting involved is encouraged to vist their website http://www.rcrc.org/

They have local affiliates in over 25 states now. http://www.rcrc.org/getinvolved/affiliate.cfm

Please check out the Action Center and get involved - there's always something going on http://capwiz.com/rcrc/home/

Here a sample of current action items:


Give Our Youth the Facts!

Tell Your Representative to Co Sponsor the REAL
Give Our Youth the Facts!

Tell Your Senator to Co Sponsor the REAL Act
An Important Victory for Reproductive Justice

Contraceptives Again Affordable for Low Income Women
Support Prevention First for Women and Families (Senate)

Tell Your Senator to Co Sponsor Prevention First
No More Money for Abstinence-Only Programs

Fund Comprehensive Sex Education Click Here.
Support Prevention First for Women and Families

Tell Your Representative to Co Sponsor Prevention First

[I Have A Dream]

44. Yes, they're a great organization that does important work.

Thanks for posting the additional information.

:thumbsup:

[54anickel]

47. No problem. Thank YOU for the set up to my shameless plug!

[SkyDaddy7]

49. Thank-you for what you do...BUT...

Hate my post PLEASE! As long as it motivates you "Moderate Christians" to build a voice that is louder than those running the "Christian" show right now! Christianity in America does not stand for what you claim to support!

Feel free to label us Angry Atheist but let me defend myself...We see Christianity hurting our secular country! We see 41% of Americans in 1994 thinking Evolution is a LIE grow to 63% today...What impact will that have on future American Scientist?; We see hate campaigns funded by Millions of Christian dollars...The utter sadness these people have to go through because of a religion called Christianity; We see $30 million Bronze Age Creation Museums teaching kids that dinosaurs played with children 6000yrs ago...Just like the Christian Bible teaches; We see women's rights being attacked on a daily basis and a US Supreme Court being stacked for the next decade with Christians; We see millions of Christian Dollars going into court case after court case to teach Bronze Age Creation Myths as science in our Public School System...As if our education system is not already screwed up enough; We see "In God We Trust" on our secular money and endless attacks on those of us who want it removed; We see medical research being held up for almost a decade due to Christian Values! I could keep going!

If we are not emotionally attached to such ideas then we see this religion, Christianity, as serious threat to the future of America...You can't "honestly" say we don't have every right to be MAD AS HELL!!!

I won't question WHY or HOW you manage to label yourself a "Christian" but I am here to tell you your label is not associated with WOMEN's RIGHTS, equal rights for GLTB; promotion of true science in schools; rational foreign policy; supporting the Separation of Church and State; Helping the poor; supporting scientific research; etc.

[I Have A Dream]

57. I never said that I was a moderate Christian.

I'm someone that people hate even more here. :)

This group does do really good work though, and I do contribute to them.

I'm white and not a racist. Are there white people who are racists? Of course. I hope that doesn't make me guilty in anyone's eyes of being a racist just by association. The same goes for Christians, at least in my eyes.

[SkyDaddy7]

58. Racist?

I never mentioned racism did I?

[I Have A Dream]

66. Oh, no... I didn't mean to imply that you had.

I was only using that as an example that I felt was similar to considering moderate Christians in some way guilty by association.

Sorry that I wasn't more clear.

[Lerkfish]

32. wow, way to completely misdirect your anger

most moderate christians are already working for women's right to choose.

maybe if you actually knew some, you'd know that already.

btw: what exactly is YOUR involvement in the issue? I've marched and worked behind the scenes for choice. How about you?

[jaxx]

9. When the going gets tough the rightwing drags abortion out of the closet

and uses it to fire up the base. This will ensure they ignore the torture and anything else the GOP wants shut up. Wingers don't have a long attention span.

[a la izquierda]

10. There was some tripe like this in Oklahoma

it's being challenged. The doctor can't force a woman to look at the image...but there you go.

And, several other states have strange, sick laws like this either in the pipeline or on the books.

[mrs_p]

12. damn, i read "abortion pill"

obvious brain fart

[Joe Bacon]

13. Deep in the heart of Tex Ass

Please, Tex Ass, go ahead and secede! Just go away and take every biblebeating idiot with you!

[Lady Effingbroke]

59. I see you posted your comment from deep in the heart of Californica,

which overwhelmingly voted down Proposition 8.

Oops!

Please, Californica, hurry up and fall into the ocean! Fall into the ocean and take all the Prop. h8ers with you!


Splinter, plank, all that.

[mwb970]

14. I guess I'm out of step on this one. Stand by to flame!

What is actually wrong with showing the woman an ultrasound? Who does it hurt? Yes, she might change her mind. What's so bad about that? Do you want more abortions? That baby might be the next Barack Obama!

I am pro-choice. I believe that abortions should be safe, legal, and rare. If this makes them rarer, it's OK with me. It's still the mother's choice.

OK. I asked for it. Ready, aim, FIRE!

:hide:

[Robb]

25. I won't flame you, but

...an ultrasound is a medical procedure. Mrs. Robb and I just sort of went through this.

There is an unverified, slight possibility that too many of them can be harmful to the fetus. Fretful future parents like the two of us looked at the studies and decided not to overdo it on "vanity" ultrasounds, and stick with the ones our docs wanted.

This is reckless, IMO.

[LeftyMom]

52. Early ultrasounds are vaginal.

I'm opposed to any state mandate for sticking a large, phallic foreign object in a woman's vagina. After all, many women have past trauma that would make that difficult, such as rape or abuse by medical providers. Unless there's a question as to the age of the pregnancy it's needlessly traumatic.

Further, the rarity or lack thereof of abortions doesn't particularly worry me, as long as they are performed on fully consenting patients by competent and caring professionals. It's a medical procedure with no more moral weight than any other, the whole "safe, legal and rare" meme implies that they're naughty and to be avoided, which is stupid and still mired in religiously-based nonsense.

[LeftyMom]

60. I should add that mandated ultrasounds also drive up the cost of the procedure

which is a significant impediment since most patients have to pay out of pocket.

[JerseygirlCT]

65. Because it's intended to do nothing more than be emotionally

manipulative, and add to the time and expense necessary to receive the medical care she's decided she wants.

If the woman would like an U/S first, I'm sure she could be accommodated. It's the *mandating* of a medical procedure for no medical reason that's the problem.

[Vinca]

16. And this law goes for the unsuspecting women knocked up by these

same lawmakers cheating on their spouses, even when they threaten to knock on the front door and have a chat with the wife.

[gabby garcia]

17. what if she's deaf?

will they have special rules for that?
is there no end to their self righteous stupidity?
never mind, I think I know the answer to the last one.

[mac56]

19. "Unfortunately, the moral fervor some GOP lawmakers display on the abortion issue...

"....doesn't always extend to children who are actually born."

As I often say: they love the babies until they're born.

[Downwinder]

20. Is this a funded or unfunded mandate??

Politicians practicing medicine without a license.

[Orrex]

22. I'm actually fine with this, as long as it's applied consistently

That is, the GOP should require the media to report on all of the Iraqi civilians aborted by American military action, with the volume turned up on the shrieks of agony. The GOP can even "avert its eyes."

And then the media can report on the countless American lives likewise decimated by GOP-touted policies.


If these sanctimonious assholes are really as pro-life as they claim, they should applaud an unambiguous revelation of the lives that they've worked so hard to destroy.

[gtar100]

24. The party of personal liberty strikes again

I find it hard to believe people even think up this stuff. They live in a dark, dark world.

[slackmaster]

26. Can anyone deny that the goal of these 'tards is ultimately to criminalize abortions?

Fuck that.

[ejpoeta]

45. their goal is to control women and their bodies. period!! they want

to be left alone with their guns and do what THEY want, but damned if a woman can make choices for herself or a gay or lesbian to make choices for themselves either. it pisses me off. frankly.

[MissMillie]

27. Yeah, like this won't raise medical costs

these guys don't think too often, do they?

[surrealAmerican]

33. They will see that as an added bonus.

It might raise the cost enough that some women will not be able to afford it.

[Jefferson23]

28. Insane and pathetic attempt to control women.

"According to the Dallas Morning News, a budget plan on track for approval in the Senate would deny a Child Protective Services request for 175 additional caseworkers."

This the GOP has no problem with, once born, who cares what happens to them, who cares if they have health care, who cares if they are abused or neglected,who cares if they don't have enough to eat, THIS is what the GOP averts their eyes to...fucking schmucks.

[Triana]

29. guess who gets to pay for that mandatory ultrasound? the woman, of course. n/t

[Lorien]

37. Insist that the father of the fetus pay for it and they'll

back off the idea right away!

[Triana]

39. ah yes, the sperm donor...

...there's an idea - make him responsible for something. That'll put the kaibosh on that idea right quick. GOOD idea!

[Maven]

30. Unconstitutional.

The ACLU will be all over this.

[Dappleganger]

31. Next on the list...

shove the remains into the mother's face and call her a baby killer.

/s

These people are despicable. :puke:

[Arugula Latte]

41. So, basically it seems the Republicans' plan to regain power is to become the Taliban.

Fuck you, you misogynistic rightwing freaks!

[tandot]

42. Disgusting pieces of shit.

They have no right to meddle in medical decisions.

[question everything]

48. You hit the nail on the head

these bastards. There are as many women as men who oppose abortion. But I think that only men could think of such a torture.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

51. Why not just fucking waterboard them while they're at it?

Fuckers.

[FudaFuda]

53. Does this have a chance? Or is it like outlawing Barbie in WV?

This is some downright cruel shit. I'm personally not too thrilled about how many abortions happen in this country, but I've got enough sense to know its not the government's business whether a pregnant woman chooses to have one. I've got high hopes for the eventual mainstreaming and improvement of the abortion pill as a means of mostly eliminating the conventional abortion procedure.

[high density]

54. Glad Texas has no more problems beyond women who want abortions

Must be a near perfect place down there, considering this is what they're worried about.

Maybe when they secede they can make a law where people who propose stupid laws get an ultrasound machine shoved up their ass.

[ProudDad]

55. I Am A Friend of the Foetus - Carole Rose Livingston

The USAmerikan Taliban Anthem...

I am no friend to the fathers and mothers
And I am no friend to the sisters and brothers
And I am no friend to the weak and distressed
And I am no friend to the poor and oppressed... BUT

Cho:
I'm a friend of the foetus, a friend of incomparable worth
I'm a friend of the foetus, right up to the moment of birth

Oh, once it's a baby, I will not go near it
I will not fead it and I will not rear it
And when it is crying, I won't even hear it
For I have no room in my heart for a human... BUT --- Cho

I will not weep for it, I won't lose sleep for it
I will not care for it, I won't be there for it
I'll back away from it, I won't go grey from it
I will not pray for it, and I won't pay for it... All together now

CHO;
Let it get a job,
Right up to the moment of birth!

[truthisfreedom]

56. More republican torture techniques.

Leave it to the party of torture to come up with this shit.

[JerseygirlCT]

63. I was thinking exactly what you were - how kind to allow women to

avert their eyes while they legislate what she can do with her womb.

[w4rma]

68. Now that they've come out in favor of torture on non-Americans, they're moving towards torture for

Americans. Vile.