GM to pull the plug on Pontiac

[eppur_se_muova]

Source: CNNMoney

By Peter Valdes-Dapena, CNNMoney.com senior writer
Last Updated: April 24, 2009: 3:08 PM ET

NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- General Motors is preparing to announce that the Pontiac car brand, once marketed as GM's "Excitement division," will be killed off, according to a source familiar with the decision.

An official announcement is expected Monday. GM spokesman Jim Hopson declined to comment on Pontiac's fate, saying the automaker has no announcements to make at this time.

In its most recent "viability plan" - which will be updated to reflect this new brand cut - Pontiac was not named as one of GM's four "core brands." Those are Chevrolet, Buick, GMC and Cadillac. But Pontiac was also not to be killed or sold off, as were Saturn, Saab and Hummer.

Instead Pontiac was to continue on as a "niche brand" focusing on just a few models.



Read more: http://money.cnn.com/2009/04/24/autos/pontiac_obit/index.htm?postversion=2009042414

[Taverner]

1. This will piss off a lot of people

Pontiac Grand Am's have their devotees...

[meegbear]

13. I bought a 2006 Grand Prix last September ...

love that car.

[Taverner]

22. Most Pontiac owners I know love their cars

I have rented the Grand Am on occasion, and I like it.

The Vibe also impressed me - mainly because for a dinky ass car its pretty sweet.

[Dinger]

78. We Have Bought Two Grand Ams In A Row

Love 'em!

[GoddessOfGuinness]

62. I had one of those as a rental car a couple of years ago...

It was a great car.

[PatrynXX]

25. or Knight Rider fans

the original ones. ie Pontiac Trans Am Pontiac Firebird. Yeah I'll think GM as a bad boy now. Pontiac would be the only one I'd buy from specifically a Trans Am, yes the model has been dead for awhile, (no thanks to the stupid remake)

I'll make me consider another company. Always dreamed of owning a Trans Am, Killing off Pontiac would be worse than killing the Saturn brand.

[saracat]

2. How sad. I remember when my parent's "only" bought Pontiacs.

I guess I am very old fashioned. I STILL can't make myself buy a foriegn car. My hubby has a Mistzubishi but I still have a old Chrysler.

[Blue_Tires]

19. for 15 years, my mom only bought oldsmobiles

and my dad cadillacs...Not only that, but for whatever reason, a lot of my mom's friends drove Olds as well...If mom had some kind of women's club meeting, our house would look like an Olds dealership...

[Toucano]

3. All good things must come to an end. n-t

[lazyriver]

4. ...and in garages across the nation, hundreds of classic GTO's

quietly wept.

[williesgirl]

29. My first car was a 1969 GTO and I sure loved it! This is sad. What happens to their

dealerships? I know of several in NVA that only carry Pontiacs.

[and-justice-for-all]

80. GTOs are HOT! nt

[Hugin]

5. So, uh... What exactly is left at GM?

Other than GMAC and it's Home Mortgages?

[Captain Hilts]

6. Why they're axing Pontiac and keeping Buick is beyond me. Sitting in a Buick is instant menopause.

[Roland99]

7. Buick is a hot seller in China.

They should spin that off *and* kill off Pontiac.

[Hugin]

8. But, then what would be left?

A crater?

[Roland99]

44. Chevy, GM, Cadillac. I think they should keep Saturn, personally.

[SpartanDem]

11. Because Buick is selling

off the charts in China. Not to mention they have some very hot cars like the 2010 lacrosse coming soon

[amandabeech]

47. Nice!

Are the Buicks sold here made in China?

I would think that the Chinese Buick and the U.S. Buick would have some differences due to emissions and crash safety standards that have not been harmonized.

[underpants]

53. Yep the Chinese LOVE Buicks

[jmowreader]

61. That car won't sell for shit for one reason only

It's got "Buick" written across the ass end of it. Way too many Americans associate the Buicks sold today with the one Grandma had. Unfortunately, Grandma died in 1978 and new Buicks aren't like hers.

What am I thinking? That car is COMPLETELY unacceptable here on DU because it has OnStar. You know they can spy on your every move with that?

[blue_onyx]

66. People bought the Buick Enclave

so I don't see why they won't buy the new LaCrosse.

[TheCentepedeShoes]

69. I love my Buick

purchased before that OnStar thingy

[TheDebbieDee]

63. That IS a sharp looking car!

[lithiumbomb]

12. they sell more buicks

That's the bottom line, boring as they may be. The only unique Pontiac in the lineup is the G8 and while it's a good car it just hasn't done very well in the marketplace.

[WriteDown]

26. Good?

Its actually an unbelievable car. But some would rather buy anything from Japan before touching a car made with union hands.

http://www.edmunds.com/pontiac/g8/2009/review.html

[lithiumbomb]

35. oh i agree

I hope there's still a place for it in the US lineup. If there isn't, I suspect Holden won't last as an auto manufacturer much longer and will just be a nameplate for GM cars sold in Australia.

[liberalpragmatist]

39. They could rebadge the G8 as a Chevy

Maybe make it the new Impala, which hasn't been updated for a few years.

[tabasco]

67. Yeah, right. Keep telling yourself that.

It's the customer's fault when a business fails.

YOU'RE GM MANAGEMENT MATERIAL, MAN!

[WriteDown]

76. Its ignorant people who tend to be highly susceptible to

advertising and who don't read actual car ratings and review. Are you in that category?

[customerserviceguy]

38. I rented a G8 last fall

and found it terribly uncomfortable. My 1982 Pontiac Phoenix was what soured me on GM forever. Ford can have my business.

[DainBramaged]

56. "My 1982 Pontiac Phoenix was what soured me on GM forever"

You are sure living in the present. :eyes:

[customerserviceguy]

65. I suppose you'd want me to marry the ex-wife

that I had in that year, too?

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Or am I supposed to act like an abused spouse about this whole thing?

[WriteDown]

77. You should have bought have bought a 1977

Toyota Celica. Woefully underpowered. You would have never bought a Toyota again for sure.

[canucksawbones]

28. consumer reports

actually has Buick as the most reliable marque in their recent reliability tests, the only GM marque in the top ten.

GK

[Toucano]

31. Instant menopause!

So true. My ex-mother-in-law ALWAYS drove a Buick!

[Captain Hilts]

33. She wouldn't have been nearly as much trouble if she drove a Firebird or a Sunbeam. nt

[blue_onyx]

41. Actually the Buick Enclave

has an average consumer age around 50, which is much better than the brand overall (around 68, I think). So with the right design, which I think Buick is moving toward with the Enclave and the new LaCrosse, Buick as a lot of potential.

[onehandle]

46. That is SO amazingly accurate.

Whenever I see a Buick, the driver's head barely clears the steering wheel.

[Odin2005]

70. Odd, I've always thought Buicks were rich people's cars, not old people's.

:shrug:

[John1956PA]

9. I have owned a 1966 Bonneville convertible for 25 years.

However, I am really not old car enthusiast, and the Bonneville has not moved out of my garage for years. From about 1995 through 2004, I was token member of the "Pontiac Oakland Club International" ("POCI"), and I received the organization's monthly "Smoke Signals" magazine. In reading the magazine, I tried to determine whether the membership had a Republican or Democratic bias. In the 2000 election, the sentiments of organization's officers were that Al Gore was a threat to the hobby, since he supposedly wanted old gas-guzzlers removed from the roads and he supported clean-up of idle junkyards where vintage cars could still be found. However, I do not have any information as to what political leanings the membership-at-large held. The monthly magazine, in addition to featuring specific vintage and antique Pontiacs, touted the new Pontiac cars as well. Th allegiance to the Pontiac name brand runs deep in many circles, and I offer those aficionados my regards. As for me, I became a Ford man over ten years ago.

[ardvark]

32. that's a beautifull car - nt

[John1956PA]

34. Here is a photo which I snapped a few minutes ago.

Thanks for the compliment on the year and model, but my car needs a small amount of restoration.

[mdmc]

72. nice pic!

:toast:

[John1956PA]

74. Thanks, mdmc.

If I had been sarcastic, I would have posed with a banner reading "RIP Pontiac. 1926 - 2009". But doing so would not have been kind. Anyway, such a banner would not be the truth, since there will probably always be Pontiac lovers, and nicely restored old models will dazzle at car shows long after I am gone.

[mdmc]

75. car buffs will keep it alive

Me and my dad are big AMC wagon fans. I love that car.

[kskiska]

10. I guess "Body by Fisher" is now a dead body

I once met a (very rich) girl from the Fisher family.

[OhioChick]

14. I really liked Pontiacs.

:(

[SnowCritter]

15. Best car I ever owned

was a '70 Grand Prix Model J. Sweet ride!

[Alcibiades]

24. You have to post a photo

Most folks don't remember what one of those looked like.

[Abq_Sarah]

58. One of my employees has one

That he's been lovingly restoring. Damn thing's like a tank. :D

[Blue_Tires]

16. R.I.P.

to a once-great American brand...At one time, this was the true renegade soul of Detroit, until they ran DeLorean off for shaking the boat too often...

I was really looking into the new G8 if i ever got any $$$$

[high density]

17. Good idea. GM needs less "niche" and more "mainstream"

They've already got niche products up the yingyang and that is part of their problem.

[yellowcanine]

18. Oh man - there goes the brand behind the best car song ever.

G.T.O.
Ronnie and the Daytonas
Written by John Wilkin

Little GTO, you're really lookin' fine
Three deuces and a four-speed and a 389
Listen to her tachin' up now, listen to her why-ee-eye-ine
C'mon and turn it on, wind it up, blow it out GTO

Wa-wa, (mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO") wa, wa, wa, wa, wa, wa
(mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO")
Wa-wa, (mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO") wa, wa, wa, wa, wa, wa
(mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO")
Wa-wa (mixed with "Ahhh, little GTO") wa, wa, wa, wa, wa, wa

You oughta see her on a road course or a quarter mile
This little modified Pon-Pon has got plenty of style
She beats the gassers and the rail jobs, really drives 'em why-ee-eye-ild
C'mon and turn it on, wind it up, blow it out GTO


Wa-wa, (mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO") wa, wa, wa, wa, wa, wa
(mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO")
Wa-wa, (mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO") wa, wa, wa, wa, wa, wa
(mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO")
Wa-wa (mixed with "Ahhh, little GTO") wa, wa, wa, wa, wa, wa

<instrumental break>

MIXTURE
Gonna save all my money (turnin' it on, blowin' it out) and buy a GTO (turnin' it on,
blowin' it out)
Get a helmet and a roll bar (turnin' it on, blowin' it out) and I'll be ready to go
(turnin'
it on, blowin' it out)
Take it out to Pomona (turnin' it on, blowin' it out) and let 'em know (turnin' it on,
blowin' it out), yeah, yeah
That I'm the coolest thing around
Little buddy, gonna shut you down
When I turn it on, wind it up, blow it out GTO


Wa-wa, (mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO") wa, wa, wa, wa, wa, wa
(mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO")
Wa-wa, (mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO") wa, wa, wa, wa, wa, wa
(mixed with "Yeah, yeah, little GTO")
Wa-wa (mixed with "Ahhh, little GTO") wa, wa, wa, wa, wa, wa

[fujiyama]

20. GMC should be gone too. I'd say the same about Buick, but I suppose they're big in China

They should have got rid of all these extra divisions years ago and brought it down to their most recognized and best selling brands - Cadillac for luxury vehicles and Chevrolet for the rest of its cars and trucks. Pontiac and Chevy should have been merged long back and redundant vehicles competing within GM should have been eliminated.

The company was just too large and it kept expanding and buying crap like Hummer. The problems were just long in the making. GM just became too big to manage.

Ford at least always had the foresight of not expanding to the same extent. Sure they had Land Rover and Jaguar, which they sold for a huge loss (though they were smart to sell it when they did when they did). Still those foreign brands Ford did have a stake in like Volvo and Mazda were smart buys and they have wisely integrated the technology into other Ford models. I get the impression GM never made the same effort with Saab and others.

[and-justice-for-all]

37. That is true, I have a Chinese friend that told me that recently...

I told her "I just don't understand that, because Buicks are some real shitty cars." But she says they love'em over there.:shrug:

[amandabeech]

48. Consumer Reports says that Buicks are among the most reliable U.S. cars.

CR recommends many Buick models as good choices in used cars. Seriously. Check it out.

Things have changed big time since you last examined the Buick record.

[Old Hob]

54. Buick's aren't shitty. They just aren't exciting anymore.

A family member has a supercharged Buick Park Avenue Ultra that is super nice inside and out and it hasn't had any issues. It easily competes with the avergag Benz or Jaguar for thousands of dollars less.

[fujiyama]

60. I get the impression Buicks are pretty nice.

Both JD and CR rate them highly for reliability (at least short term, not sure about long term). Overall, I've heard good things about the quality.

But people also have this impression that they (and Lincoln for that matter) are "old people's cars" and for that reason alone people stay away from them.

I still don't know why GM needed two higher end divisions. Rolling Buick models into Cadillac would have been one way, but I understand it's easier said than done, considering all the dealers out there. Still, a much more organized elimination of brands would have hurt much less than the current sudden bloodletting.

[and-justice-for-all]

79. I have just never been impressed by Buick at all..nt

[iamthebandfanman]

21. join the club pontiac owners,

i own a saturn.

[laureloak]

23. We bought our son a Vibe and we all love it. n/t

[ardvark]

27. GM really screwed itself, pontiac was the 'hottest' thing they ever made

the 1960s-1980 cars are still collected - there was a time when people wanted a pontiac, and nothing else would do

the one line that really made it into the culture

but they blew it, with stupid stuff like hummer, and an suv craze that could never last

there's nothing at GM lest that's really unique

some incredible cars they made, my favorites

1966 - Grand Prix

1967-1973 - firebird

1966-1969 - GTO/Lemans (had a 67 le mans convertable)

1969-1980 grand prix

1970-1972 ventura

[Old Hob]

50. Tne Trans Am was actually pretty hoy right upuntil 1979 IMO.

I had a 1979 TA back in high school. I really wish I still had it. It's now worth about 3x what I paid for it back in 1989. If they stop producing cars altogether, who knows what these old legends will be worth some day.

[tabasco]

73. I agree.

A culture of greed and mismanagement ruined a good company.

[DebbieCDC]

30. I'm glad my dad isn't here to see this day

He was a Pontiac man his whole life...and I learned to drive on a '66 Grand Prix. After that he had a '69 LeMans.

But the one I really remember was the Bonneville, 1962 or '64. Oh man, that car was as big as a house. White with red leather interior. Now that was an American car!

[and-justice-for-all]

36. My 01 Grand AM GT is the best car I have ever owned..

and now that it is paid for, its bloody smashing!!

[liberalpragmatist]

40. Sad but probably necessary

Pontiacs barely sell these days and although the G8 is awesome, the rest of their lineup is entirely interchangeable with other GM products.

Really, GM could probably do with just Chevrolet and Cadillac. Buick, however, is a big seller in China and has some good new models coming out - it could work as a small, niche, near-luxury brand in the U.S.

The one I don't really understand holding onto is GMC. I realize that GMC is profitable, due to the SUV craze, but GM is axing tons of their SUVs in coming years - Chevy is going to go from 6 SUV's to just 2. The Chevy Suburban/GMC Yukon is being axed. Really, GMC is going to wind up with a small lineup that is entirely interchangeable with Chevrolet. Of course, their current lineup is entirely interchangeable with Chevy, but at least SUVs and trucks have sold well - GM's own projections have SUV sales tumbling long-term, and it's not at all clear to me there's going to be much of a market left for trucks that are just obviously rebadged Chevys.

The other stupid move that I think GM is making is selling Opel, their European division. I realize they're short on cash, but one of the prime reasons that GM was deemed worth saving is that they have a global presence and more potential than, say, Chrysler. Selling Opel will take a giant chunk out of GM's international business and it's a brand that has been in relatively good shape, too.

[Old Hob]

51. Pontiacs sell like crazy. They're all over the place.

this is a dumb move.

[lithiumbomb]

57. I don't think they're selling Opel, exactly

They could be, if the Fiat rumors are true. I think at a minimum they're going to have less direct ownership in Opel, much like Ford's current relationship with Mazda. They share platforms, engineering, and are part of the family, but actual ownership is in the 20% range rather than the 51%+ range.

But true, they might outright sell Opel to Fiat. I'm not sure this is such a hot idea, but I don't think Opel is a first tier brand in Europe, though they make some great cars (outsold by Volkswagen and Fiat I think) If GM really has to get to a bare minimum configuration to survive, their long term future might be better spent focusing on the US, which for better or worse is still a core market, and Asia. There's GM-Daewoo out of Korea, badged as Daewoos or Chevrolets depending on the market, and of course Buick in China.

GM has a secondary presence in Europe with the former Daewoo brand, now badged as Chevrolets for the European market. They will still be in Europe, but minus Opel, and Vauxhall in the UK.

[FarCenter]

42. I don't understand how the Chevy, Buick, Cadillac dealers work?

Seems to me that there are a lot of Chevy-Cadillac dealers. Pontiac, Buick, and Olds (formerly) varied in term of which combination of brands they sold.

Does it work to have your top and bottom brands sold by the same dealer?

Other companies have them separate: Acura and Honda? Lexus and Toyota? Lincoln-Mercury and Ford? Audi and Volkswagon?

[lithiumbomb]

59. trying to get similar varieties of vehicles under one roof

Pontiac-Buick-GMC is basically one distribution channel currently. That gives you a dealership that has entry level, mid-range, and trucks across those brands. The total sales of each of those brands doesn't really warrant them having a single dealership for each one (though they certainly exist) so they throw them together.

So today, you can walk into your Pontiac-Buick-GMC dealer and have a full range of vehicles from economy, mid-grade, to trucks and SUVs. If you have a combined Chevrolet-Cadillac dealership (which are less inter-related as far as sales channels goes), same idea. You have economy, mid-grade, suvs and trucks, and luxury cars under one roof.

I'm not saying it makes sense, it might in some regions that may only have one GM dealership of any kind, but I believe that is the general idea.

[Old Hob]

43. Pontiacs are quite popular in my neck of the woods. The G6 is especially popular as is the solstice

the Grand Am, and the Trans Am.

[Codeine]

45. I'm the Grim Reaper of car brands.

I've owned a lot of Plymouths and Pontiacs, and now both are gone. Will the Corolla be next? Stay tuned. . .

[amandabeech]

49. I've had two Opels, a Renault Encore and a Jeep pickup.

None of them made or imported any more.

My current ride is a tricked out Taurus. It has the bigger engine and goes vroom-vroom really well.

[defendandprotect]

52. GM's needs to pull the plug on gas-guzzlers and GM's alliance with the oil industry . . .!!!

[madrchsod]

55. one of the best cars i have ever owned...72 formula 400

400 cubic inches,4 barrel,open hood scoops and side pipes. sounded like a sprint cat and handled like one. one thing it could`t do was go over a 110 because the car would start to lift. i guess that`s why the trans am had vents in the fenders.

at 55 mph it made 15 miles to the gallon over that around 10-12. gas was 60ct and i was making over 10 an hour....

[lib2DaBone]

64. Goodbye 'lil GTO.. I had a '66... bucket seats..Hurst 4 speed...

tri-power...arrrrrr matie.. she was a fine car....

[Odin2005]

68. NOOOOO!!! Not Pontiac!!!

:cry:

[mdmc]

71. MAKE ROOM FOR MORE HUMMERS!

I love union labor, made in America.... but every-time I think of GMC I see that hideous Hummer and get :mad:

[blonndee]

81. This is too bad. I love my Grand Am, and I loved the little Sunbird I had before it.

Good cars. :(