Assange Lawyer: U.S. Wants to Get Their "Mitts" on WikiLeaks Founder (Grand Jury Empaneled in VA)

[Hissyspit]

Source: CBS News

December 12, 2010 9:21 AM
Assange Lawyer: U.S. Wants to Get Their "Mitts" on WikiLeaks Founder

Posted by CBSNews.com staff

Julian Assange's lawyer, Mark Stephens, discussed the fate of the jailed WikiLeaks founder with Sir David Frost on Al Jazeera TV, maintaining that U.S. authorities are trying to get custody of his client.

"We have heard from the Swedish authorities there has been a secretly empaneled grand jury in Alexandria...just over the river from Washington DC, next to the Pentagon," Stephens said. "They are currently investigating this, and indeed the Swedes we understand have said that if he comes to Sweden, they will defer their interest in him to the Americans. Now that shows some level of collusion and embarrassment, so it does seem to me what we have here is nothing more than holding charges...so ultimately they can get their mitts on him."

Last week, U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder said, "We have a very serious criminal investigation that's underway, and we're looking at all of the things that we can do to try to stem the flow of this information."

WikiLeaks Full Coverage

The House Judiciary Committee will hold a Dec. 16 hearing on the potential application of U.S. espionage laws in relation to WikiLeaks, the committee announced on Friday, marking the first such hearing to address the website's recent release of classified U.S. diplomatic cables.

Read more: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503543_162-20025418-503543.html

---

@GregMitch
Greg Mitchell
Assange atty tells David Frost a grand jury empaneled in Alexandria VA to get Assange.

@jeremyscahill
jeremy scahill
RT @WLLegal: Assange's lawyer: "secretly empaneled grand jury" in VA seeking indictment of #Wikileaks

[madmax]

1. Psssst Holder - over there, bush and cheney.

Remember those guys?

[Billy Burnett]

4. Investigation the past admin's crimes would be dangerous for this one.

If we were to have indictments of members of the past admin for various Geneva Convention violations, indictments for this admin would be entirely consistent - and justified.

[EFerrari]

31. Has Holder ever been on the right side of anything?

He was on the wrong side of the Chiquita case when he defended their use of paramilitaries against the families of the victims of death squads.

[boppers]

84. If we were going by Geneva, we'd also have to go after Clinton, GHWB, and Carter too.

The only reason Reagan wouldn't be involved is his death.

[Arrowhead2k1]

6. Makes me sick. There's no justice in this world.

Huge double standards between "big guys" and "little guys".

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[24601]

77. I was reading the original story and wondered how long it would

take until someone changed the subject to Bush - apparently not long at all. Gawd - no wonder the Congressional losses we so large if we can't get out of the past.

Congress, run by Pelosi and Reid, had every opportunity to act and chose not to. That's no reason to ignore appropriate charges relative to Assange.

And BTW, my French is a bit rusty - does "Assange" translate to "prison bitch?"

[boppers]

86. Pelosi knew about the waterboarding, and did nothing.

She knew full well that she was complicit... that's why she took it off the table.

Remember when a big deal was made out of her being briefed on it?

[crikkett]

152. & I wonder what she knew about Turkey.

Remember Sybil Edmonds & Denny Hastert's quick resignation...

[go west young man]

The congressional losses wouldn't have occured if Dems had the balls

to prosecute the past criminals instead of rolling over. we lost because we rolled over.
We were weak. We still are weak obviously when DU'ers like yourself revel in thinking
of a truth seeker like Assange as a "prison bitch". With you on our side we will always be fucked.

[24601]

113. I'd love to see the polling that indicates that further ignoring the

economy and going after Bush (and now Obama for the drone strikes) would have changed the mid-terms.

It was three things - the economy, the economy, and the economy. And specifically within that, it was government spending and the debt.

Assange as a truth-seeker? ROTFLMAO!!! Thanks for the chuckle.

[ProudDad]

115. So the Dems ignored the economy AND ignored the bushite crimes

[go west young man]

123. Your problem is you have no true understanding of the Wikileaks mission.

They have been shining the light on nefarious deeds since 2006.
All countries are exposed. Not just the U.S. They have received numerous
awards from international organizations that believe in freedom of information.
The Economist and Amnesty International among others. Judging from your post
you are like most Americans who see them as bad because they exposed "your
crimes". Here's a link so you can read up. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WikiLeaks
I bet ya loved em when they exposed documents from Iran or China though.

[24601]

165. I'll be sure to let you know if/when I have a problem understanding

the Wikileaks "mission." And don't patronize me by presuming you have the slightest inkling about my feelings when Iran and China are targets - you don't have a clue about how I feel or why.

Information is property - just ask those with large judgments for illegally downloading/sharing. Just who chartered this so-called "mission", it's not even the UN. Wikileaks is completely self-defined and "big information" is no better than "big pharma", "big agriculture" or "big oil." Now they will find out what's in store for those who traffic in stolen information.

[go west young man]

104. dupe

[molly77]

79. When Scooter Libby and his boss, Dick,

were being tried for outing a CIA agent, it just didn't seem to have the air of emergency and anxiety that the Julian Assuange hunt has.We never did get to hear the verdict. I forget the legal term but ..was it sealed? We never got to know if Scooter and Dick were guilty of anything. Maybe it is time to break the seal since our govt is so darn interested in keeping secrets.

If not , we have sure got a Totalitarian regime going on. Looks fascist to me.

[ProudDad]

119. Scooter was found guilty of lying to FBI agents...

Not for outing Valerie Plame...

[Name removed]

160. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

161. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[kestrel91316]

2. Betcha some dumbass RW prosecutor tries to charge him with treason, lol.

[EFerrari]

3. Well, that's pretty stupid. It's a case they can't win

and they will look like bullies.

[Pavulon]

5. I agree. The potential threat to my civil liberties

justify the handling of this case as a military matter. The problem should be solved in the field where it started.

Assange has no protection and should be granted none, he is running an intelligence agency disclosing information. It should be dealt with.

[ixion]

22. No, handling things as a military matter is bad, and is the paradigm shift deployed in the

'war' on terror.

If you're concerned about your civil liberties, I'd be more concerned about your own government.

[Pavulon]

26. By military I mean clandistine

the problem should be dealt with outside the US court system.

[14thColony]

72. Exactly! What's the point of God-Given American Exceptionalism(tm)

if you can't whack people that cross you whenever and wherever you please? Seriously, I'm with you on this one. Really. I mean it.

[go west young man]

106. Can you believe we have DU'ers like that one?

It stuns me to read his typing.

[14thColony]

151. That's why I don't hold out a lot of hope

I think the "yearn for authoritarianism" in the US is too strong now to be denied. An increasing number of Americans seem entirely comfortable with the idea of us becoming an authoritarian state.

[msanthrope]

98. If it's Alexandria, then he's in the rocket docket....n/t

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

135. In which ways, for example? -nt

[go west young man]

144. So Amnesty International and The Economist gave awards

for journalistic integrity to an intelligence agency is what your saying?

[Billy Burnett]

7. They'll push for a military tribunal.

As some pukes have stated, civilian courts cannot guarantee convictions. Military tribunals can. :puke:

[EFerrari]

12. And they'd be wrong. The civilian courts have gotten more convictions

than the tribunals. Idiots.

[Billy Burnett]

49. Illogic roolz

Didyaknow, tax cuts increase revenue. :crazy:

[EFerrari]

52. Protecting criminals is national security!

lol

Billy, what was the name of that twitter viewer dealy that has three columns and you posted about it? I've lost the name and it was the best one. Do you remember?

:hi:

[Pavulon]

59. You people are myopic. Read this cable, the person here brought uranium in

to the embassy. Their name is redacted. The DATE is not redacted (because they are FUCKING MORONS). So the video tapes of the US embassy taken by myanmar will identify this person.

This person will not be treated kindly.
http://cablesearch.org/cable/view.php?id=08RANGOON749&hl=Burma

[elias49]

78. Pavulon, you just did what you want Assange wrung out for

you posted a classified cable on the internet!
Nice work. Off to Guantanamo Bay with you!

[Pavulon]

83. Actually that is published by someone else. A hyperlink

is not publishing. Now the person named in that document, any thoughts?

[elias49]

90. My first thought was: "What's this guy doing w/uranium?"

He's in a high stakes game. I'm surprised he wasn't snuffed by someone some time ago.
I'm guessing he's not your average farmer.

[Pavulon]

91. Working on a project to develop it? Who knows, that document was not stolen

and dumped. There is a good bit of information on rangoon in the cables. And yes his government will kill him for anything he discloses to the US

[ProudDad]

120. Gawd...

is p**v**n still here?

All I see is ignored...

[boppers]

87. Oh, by all means, protect people trying to sell supposed bomb materials!

Especially when they're trying to extort the US government with it.

Yeah, I don't have a lot of pity for extortionists.

[Pavulon]

88. Not what the cable stated and the expat giving information on shipments

of materials from north korea. you got any pity for him? Though not.

Give me one reason these cables should be in the clear. Please, what is served by this disclosure.

[boppers]

94. One reason for this specific disclosure, or disclosures in general?

After all, why shouldn't the government be allowed to only filter the information to us that they want us to know?

:sarcasm:

As far as the individual stating that he was refining Uranium from a large rock, and threatening to sell it to other countries if we didn't buy it, he's clearly a kook, or crook.

[Pavulon]

109. clearly, because with all this data, you got the context as well.

thats the worst part of this is the gaggle thinks this has empowered them. you now have what assange wants you to have.

[boppers]

117. Assange isn't picking which cables to vet and release.

Boogy-men are fun, though.

[Pavulon]

121. No others involved in his orginization are..

there is no way they can vet cables and still make money on that click through. cant remove to much detail. Will be interesting to see if manning testifies against him.

[boppers]

128. That's not how it works.

The media go through and select cables, redactions are determined, stories are vetted, and when the media story is broken, the supported cables are (sometimes) published by the media, and also released on the wikileaks sites and mirrors... the media makes their money on their stories (and ads), wikileaks makes their money from donations and support by press agencies.

[Pavulon]

132. ANd a comspiracy works when one person is breaking the law

with assistance and guidance from others. If manning and assange communicated, he is fucked.

[boppers]

149. "If"? IF? Wow, maybe you're a bit behind on your information?

See:
http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2010/06/wikileaks-chat/
and
http://www.dailytech.com/UPDATE+ManningLamo+Chat+Logs+Released+Lamo+Claims+Wikileaks+Betrayal/article18841.htm

----
(12:26:09 PM) bradass87: lets just say *someone* i know intimately well,
has been penetrating US classified networks, mining data like the ones
described... and been transferring that data from the classified networks
over the "air gap" onto a commercial network computer... sorting the data,
compressing it, encrypting it, and uploading it to a crazy white haired
aussie who can't seem to stay in one country very long =L
(12:27:13 PM) bradass87: im here
(12:27:24 PM) Adrian: Depends. What are the particulars?
(12:31:43 PM) bradass87: crazy white haired dude = Julian Assange
(12:33:05 PM) bradass87: in other words... ive made a huge mess :'(
----

----
(1:45:00 PM) Adrian: what kind of scandal?
(1:45:16 PM) bradass87: hundreds of them
(1:45:40 PM) Adrian: like what? I'm genuinely curious about details.
(1:46:01 PM) bradass87: i dont know... theres so many... i dont have the
original material anymore
(1:46:18 PM) bradass87: uhmm... the Holy See and its position on the
Vatican sex scandals
(1:46:26 PM) Adrian: play it by ear
(1:46:29 PM) bradass87: the broiling one in Germany
(1:47:36 PM) bradass87: im sorry, there's so many... its impossible for
any one human to read all quarter-million... and not feel overwhelmed...
and possibly desensitized
(1:48:20 PM) bradass87: the scope is so broad... and yet the depth so rich
(1:48:50 PM) Adrian: give me some bona fides ... yanno? any specifics.
(1:49:40 PM) bradass87: this one was a test: Classified cable from US
Embassy Reykjavik on Icesave dated 13 Jan 2010
(1:50:30 PM) bradass87: the result of that one was that the icelandic
ambassador to the US was recalled, and fired
(1:51:02 PM) bradass87: thats just one cable...
(1:51:14 PM) Adrian: Anything unreleased?
(1:51:25 PM) bradass87: i'd have to ask assange
(1:51:53 PM) bradass87: i zerofilled the original
(1:51:54 PM) Adrian: why do you answer to him?
(1:52:29 PM) bradass87: i dont... i just want the material out there... i
dont want to be a part of it
----

[Pavulon]

159. (1:51:25 PM) bradass87: i'd have to ask assange , Lets see how conspiracy works..

that will be the easiest charge to make stick.

[go west young man]

107. Truth.

[Pavulon]

108. So a persons life is worth "truth" you are of course aware that coded

messages were used in the revolutionary war and by our government since its founding.

[go west young man]

127. You offer a false dichotomy.

In the future lives will be effected, altered, and saved by the revealing
of the truth now. People may die if the truth doesn't come out.
Paradoxically lives may be lost by revealing the truth. There is no
win or lose. Only the truth. The planet is better served by revealing
the truth. And you as an American citizen should (if you are one) should
be a true patriot and work like Assange to expose injustice and reveal the truth.

[Pavulon]

131. So should all truth be revealed? or just some.

i spent time working on feed water and cooling loop pumps for submarines, should that be in the clear. Reactor designs, line item budgets for the NSA?

Lets be real NO NATION IN THE WORLD uses this model. The US will never use this model. It is not realistic.

I am a citizen and had access to classified information at 2 points in my life. None of that information should be in the clear, it does not serve anyone, well no one who I care to serve.

[go west young man]

136. I love how you always drop your military credentials in these debates.

Hell half of DU is ex military. I'm a former marine myself.
1st btl, 6th marines, 0311 infantry from 85-88. In 2010
nearly all military hardware info is out there for those that want to see it.
All countries world wide can see the specs of your sub. However
thats not what is really at stake. Wikileaks has and is exposing
corruption. Get that through your head. Corruption on all levels in all
governments worldwide. The human beings at the top tend to fuck
us all over and they hide it afterwards. They send our young soldiers to
die for lies for money and power. You wrap yourself in the flag and call
yourself a patriot. I don't see it. Dissent in the face of injustice is true
patriotism. Assange is a greater U.S. asset than you will ever be. Watch
the future unfold and see then that you were wrong on this issue.

[Pavulon]

137. Yeah, the systems that track all that hardware in realtime

that needs to be out there. What is on and offramped globally, should be hosted on a public web site.

Why the fuck should china get a free ride when we spent hundreds of millions (edit:on one subsystem) to make subs that are quiet? How does that help anyone.

And no the g code to cut parts is still classified.

A dd214 does not matter in the discussion at all. Plenty of civilians have access to classified information and plenty of them sold that info leading to people's death.

Assange is an asses to Assange, thats it.

no nation operated under open conditions, never have, never will.

[go west young man]

140. Hardware isn't the issue.

Corruption is.

[Pavulon]

142. That can be addressed without compromising people

who dont need to be compromised. People who help up should not have their names out there.

The decision making process leading to the Iraq war is conspicuously absent. The Iraq war should be the focus. Huge mess with decades of implications.

[go west young man]

145. Give it time. Wikileaks may blow the lid off that one too.

Something our own media refused to do and was actually complicit in.
After all they minimized the antiwar demonstrations leading up to it.
Then cheer led the whole thing while supplying us with "military analysts."
AKA propagandists. Wikileaks is your best hope for exposing the Iraq
debacle. If your holding out hope from the U.S. media I have some nice
real estate for sale for ya on the moon.

[Name removed]

162. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dipsydoodle]

8. The lawyer Assange has now got here in th UK

will hopefully ensure he doesn't leave the UK and the US can go whistle.

[EFerrari]

11. We have the death penalty and our torture problem.

I hope that's enough to block it.

[dipsydoodle]

13. Would be.

:hi:

[EFerrari]

14. Do you think so? After watching one country after another

fall in line last week to persecute Assange and Wikileaks, it doesn't seem so certain. :(

[The Backlash Cometh]

17. remember Iceland?

[EFerrari]

20. In what respect? Did they reject our bullying

because if they did, I don't know that bit of the story. :)

[The Backlash Cometh]

24. You fight where you can have the most impact:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4655516

[EFerrari]

27. Oh, yeah. That's very true.

And Iceland is doing great work.

But their situation is a little bit different from the UK and I was asking pretty narrowly if the British government would fold to the Obama administration on the matter of Assange's extradition. I'd feel much better if he was in custody in Iceland but then, I doubt he would be in custody in Iceland after all Wikileaks did to help them against their corrupt financial sector.

[The Backlash Cometh]

28. Britain has always had their head stuck up the ass of Uncle Sam.

So, I couldn't help you there. The only thing that might make a dif, is that they have a strong socialist core and will not suffer fools.

[EFerrari]

30. And maybe that London has been on fire.

Extraditing Assange would likely make that worse, too.

[ProudDad]

122. But Sweden is doing the extradition first

to ask him about broken condoms...

and consensual sex...

THEN pass him on to the Empire...

[bhikkhu]

32. ...death penalty, torture, prison w/out trial, no firm habaeus corpus, inhuman prisons

and a number of political figures who seem to advocate summary execution as a way around legal technicalities.

I hope the Europeans take all that into account.

[EFerrari]

37. It just occurred to me that Assange was picked up in England

on an EU warrant. That may give the Brits the extra support they need to turn down the extradition.

I hope so.

[Pavulon]

41. You think they want that?(nt)

[muriel_volestrangler]

68. My gut feeling is the British courts would say the Swedish charges take precedence

partly because, as you say, they are on an EU warrant; and partly because it's on a fairly specific accusation (whatever it's called, if the accusations are true, they're some kind of sexual assault, and they happened in Sweden), whereas any American charges would be more controversial - Assange isn't American, the publishing was international, and there are arguments about whether Wikileaks has done any harm, or whether any form of journalistic privilege applies. And the Swedish warrant was issued first.

Gary McKinnon is still fighting extradition to the US over hacking into Pentagon computers. Part of that case is that he's got Asperger's, and his defence are saying that being in an American jail with no contact with his British family will destroy him; but it shows that US 'state secrets' extradition cases don't just get a free run through the British courts.

[EFerrari]

70. That's reassuring, thank you, muriel.

I don't mean to impugn the British system, it's more that recent events has made me wary of anyone besides Hugo Chavez saying no to the State Department. lol

Thank you.

[muriel_volestrangler]

73. Oh, I didn't think you were impugning it; and the above was my amateur guess

and shouldn't be relied on - in theory, it's very easy for the US to extradite people form Britain now; it's only the continuing delay for McKinnon that makes me think the British courts (or some of the judges involved, anyway) aren't keen on how easy the treaty Blair passed made it. Britain, in common with most countries I think, gives its own charges precedence over extraditions, I think, if they are made first; so I guess they would use the order of extradition requests too.

But some say Sweden might allow the US to extradite him from there. I've now idea if that might happen.

[dipsydoodle]

74. I don't think he'll leave the UK

until his new defence council goes to the European Court of Human Right assuming he doesn't get a result in our own courts.

Off topic - I wasn't trying to wind you up yesterday. Its just that in some respects I think the students are fools to themselves by losing control of their own protests.

[coalition_unwilling]

146. "Our torture problem" -- I hereby nominate that for Understatement

of the Year (or maybe Euphemism of the Year).

Reminds me of that joking line: "what do you mean by 'we,' white man?" :)

[EFerrari]

147. I know.

Don't get me started, kimosabe. :)

[Gregorian]

9. Karl Rove is such a darling.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiX7GTelTPM

[silver10]

10. What have we become, China?

Oh, wait a minute, China has money.

[Pavulon]

16. Guess you've never been to china.(nt)

[Hissyspit]

18. You are right. We are not China.

Just seemingly aspiring to be like them more and more every day.

[Pavulon]

19. The pure market crazyness or the communisim?

when you go to jail for tweeting you support for these two asshats then we are like china. Until then it is just something people say to sound dramatic, but in the end just look ignorant for posting.

[silver10]

33. Yes, I was being overly dramatic - a hyperbole

But what does this mean? - "The pure market crazyness or the communism?" How can China be communist if they are very capitalist? Maybe they are a dictatorship or an oligarchy, but how can a communist country have a stock market, really? Not sure what you mean by pure market crazyness.

I was alluding to the censorship, the loss of real freedom of speech, which we are drastically losing. The mainstream media does not report real stories because corporations own them and because they would be scared to offend their corporate advertisers and masters. We have to depend on the internet. Didn't China ban Google, or throw them out of the country because they weren't restricting info. on the internet enough, and doesn't China have severe limitations on freedom of speech and restrictions on information on the Internet?

I know we are a long way off from really being China, but if we remain complacent on infringements of the First Amendment, we will end up losing it. Come on - Master Card, Visa AND Pay Pal stop transactions of contributions to WikiLeaks for no legal reason, and the founder of WikiLeaks gets thrown accusations at him for rape and thrown in jail - sounds really convenient. This happens right after he reports he will soon publish secret documents from some big bank? Is this true democracy and freedom of speech. This is scarier than fiction.

[Pavulon]

34. He has a right to disclose bank information. In fact

i would be happy to see that. disclosing cables with the names of people in myanmar who provided uranium to our embassy is not his right. That has nothing to do with the war, its just stupid.

As for visa mastercard they have no legal obligation to provide him with a service. He has not disclosed any bank information yet.

As for his rape charges (plural, two women) he is entitled a trial.

[silver10]

39. I guess there is really no threat to freedom of speech, it's all just one big coincidence.

[Pavulon]

43. Espionage is not covered under that clause

nor is criminal conspiracy. Manning broke the law and if they conspired assange can be charged. That can carry 25 years if memory serves.

[silver10]

53. Understood.

But the sh*t didn't really start to hit the fan for Assange until we heard about the bank information looming - he was running around free for a long time after the information on the wars was posted. But once we got whiff of the bank info...the rape chargeS were made, and the credit card companies stepped in. Very interesting.

[laylah]

21. Posted on my FB page

to get this story OUT there. Bush, Cheney, et al, going free for the TRUE crimes against this country and they are going after a truth teller? I vaguely remember Daniel Ellsburg's actions, but I DO remember my parents lauding his actions...as I laud Assange's! Knowledge IS power...and that is what "they" fear!

Jenn

[Creative]

23. Whether or not he should be charged is unknown, but clearly, he is going

going to have to answer some questions.

If he takes the 5th, it will be up to Justice to provide the evidence. Otherwise, they will be forced to release him.

[Pavulon]

25. Material Witness can be held

as long as needed.

[Creative]

35. That is true, but holding him without evidence could be an untenable situation.

On the other hand, if others are implicated, the back and forth of the interrogation process could provide the necessary evidence.

I hope the Justice Department doesn't bungle this.

[Pavulon]

40. Conspiracy or Racketeering seem to present the

most reasonable charges without using laws that could have broad implications for the US.

[Creative]

61. I think they are going to have more than that to avoid a public relations nighmare.

I believe they are going to have to provide evidence of a direct link between Wikileaks and the other parties, if they are to prosecute Assange.

[Pavulon]

If they can prove death they have a real case..

because the players only see one side they do not understand the impact of the information.

Take this cable.. Name redacted, but not the DATE. So now all the junta has to do is pull that days tape to find suspects.
http://cablesearch.org/cable/view.php?id=08RANGOON749&hl=Burma

[Hissyspit]

29. "clearly, he is going to have to answer some questions."

Why?

[Pavulon]

36. To determine if he conspired with manning, if he did, he can be charged

in the US.

[Hissyspit]

45. He doesn't have to answer any questions.

[Pavulon]

46. No he does not. I would assume signal intelligence

has him surveilled acting in a conspiracy with manning. I would assume manning may want to avoid the death penalty.

[Hissyspit]

48. You assume all kinds of stuff.

Poster said clearly he would have to answer.

No, clearly he does not have to answer.

[Pavulon]

50. You are never forced to be a witness in your own trial..

many people are convicted in federal court without taking the stand.

[Creative]

38. Because serious questions demand serious answers.

Don't you want to get to the bottom of this?

[EFerrari]

42. The bottom of what? A free press? Freedom of expression?

The 1st Amendment?

What?

[Pavulon]

44. Wikileaks is not press. It is an intelligence agency

acting with an agenda using information that was certainly illegally obtained. It anyone worked with manning (as his chat logs hint) then there is a conspiracy charge.

[Hissyspit]

47. WikiLeaks is not intelligence agency. It is a Press organization

publishing leaked info as journalists have been doing for centuries.

This is fun!

[Pavulon]

51. They are not press, they do not act as press, and have said they are not press

therefore I believe them. they are working their agenda like the KGB did, like MI6 does and that is the role they have chosen.

[krabigirl]

54. Lmao, keep cheerleading for your beloved empire.

[Pavulon]

56. Here is a gun, this information is lethal. Read and weep (you will not because you dont care)

http://cablesearch.org/cable/view.php?id=08RANGOON749&hl=Burma

Name is redacted. However the DATE is not. Most nations surveil embassies. So now all they have to do is pull the tape and see who walked in the door.

I would really like to know if this person is dead. You?

[go west young man]

139. I guess your also curious about those Nigerian children

Pfizer may have killed? Link here: If your brave enough to look. :sarcasm: :
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2010/dec/09/wikileaks-cables-pfizer-nigeria

[Pavulon]

143. They should be charged. I am NOT suggesting crimes be covered up

but that sources should not be compromised.

[go west young man]

150. In other words...we should never have found out in the first place?

Skewed logic.

[silver10]

55. If they act like M16 and the KGB,

Then that means they have Internet sites that also have reams of documents published on the Internet - we would love to read them if you have the links?

[girl gone mad]

76. An intelligence agency for whom?

Maybe you should go back on your meds. :shrug:

[Pavulon]

82. For themselves. Meds really, thats what you have...

you guys are ridiculous. Why would anyone publish information on people assisting the US in places they can be killed.

[girl gone mad]

95. Intelligence agency for themselves = news organization.

No military branch, no power, no central government, no "intelligence agency".

[Pavulon]

110. The do not claim to be news, they are brokering secret data stolen from the military

and are therefore an military problem.

[Creative]

57. This is not journalism, it is espionage. It is very questionable if a 3rd party

has the legal right to release classified information it obtained from a security breach. It depends on how they obtained it.

If it can be proven that Assange solicited this information, he has committed espionage.

[EFerrari]

58. Baloney. Wikileaks is a media organization.

They work with media organizations, not with foreign powers.

[Pavulon]

60. Hey XXXX is a dead man. Read this.

see they redacted his NAME but not the date. Every nation films the people who come and go from embassies. Now they just need to go find that days tape.

This is real, this person will suffer because of this. How the FUCK is this related to Iraq or Afghanistan?

Bunch of fucking children playing games in a space they do not understand. Any cable similar to this with unredacted dates will have the same impact where the subject is FILMED.

http://cablesearch.org/cable/view.php?id=08RANGOON749&hl=Burma

[silver10]

63. I'm no saint,

But I sure hell wouldn't go around soliciting uranium to a list of countries - especially without knowing full well what it will probably end up being used for - and without knowing there is some amount of danger doing it. Uranium is used for nuclear weapons - they are an abomination. International law or no international law, the average person knows the difference between right and wrong, and this is gross.

[Pavulon]

65. This person was discussing joint efforts with the North Koreans

and could be killed for passing this information to the US.

[silver10]

67. OK, if you say so, but I didn't get that from that link to that cable report.

[Hissyspit]

69. Someone coming and going in public?

Are you serious?

[Pavulon]

71. They have date and time of person providing nuclear materials to the US

so yea I pretty fucking serious. Can you give me one reason this should be in the clear?

.
M) (S//REL TO USA, ACGU) Interview occurred in a consular interview room (used for walk-ins) at the U.S. Embassy RANGOON.

[elias49]

85. There you go again.

Post the cable link on Twitter if you're that anxious for everyone to read it!

[Pavulon]

89. The people who actually act on these cables have already seen it.

any more likely have the unredacted versions from medial sources.

[elias49]

92. That's weak. "HE DID IT FIRST"

Guilty.
Next case.

[Pavulon]

93. Sorry I missed the part where you explained how disclosing this information

serves any purpose. Lots of information in those documents "redacted" by newspaper guys.

[Creative]

62. I disagree, but let's assume for a moment that they are "media organization."

If it can be proven that they conspired with those responsible for the breaches, it is still espionage.

Media organizations are not exempted from the Espionage Act.

[EFerrari]

64. Maybe you need to review what espionage is.

It is not against the law to commit journalism in this country. Yet.

[Pavulon]

66. Depraved Indifference murder is illegal.

if one body can be tied to this dump of data they are all in very deep shit.

[ProudDad]

126. And of course you have proof of this, right!?!

"it is espionage" ????

Oh yeah?

Prove it...

Otherwise, ....

[Pavulon]

133. That happens in court. Hey who proved gerry bull's death penalty case

otherwise...

[ProudDad]

125. Crickets - eh, Amigo?

These people make one's head hurt...

The EU WARRANT was an INSANELY rare one for QUESTIONING Assange... No charges of a crime filed!

It's obviously a ploy to get him into USAmerican hands as quickly as possible...

But, those of us who actually pay attention already know that, don't we? :hi:

[EFerrari]

129. You bet. Now, how is our government going to extradite him?

How can they do it with all the legal obstacles? I agree, that's what they're trying to do. But, how?

[ProudDad]

138. We'll see. It might be harder than they think...

But I think the plan was to quickly extradite him to Sweden for "questioning"...(keeping him in jail in the interim)...

As soon as his foot hits Swedish soil, USAmerica petitions for extradition...

Sweden declines to press charges but, well howdy, they have to deal with the USAmerican extradition claim for <insert favorite bullshit 'conspiracy' charge here>...So, of course, he must be held in custody...

Sweden honors USAmerica's extradition claim and...

Once USAmerica has their meat hooks into him -- he's declared an "enemy combatant" and whisked away to Gitmo...

In the meantime, he's in custody and a prime mover of Wikileaks taken out of action and other folks' ardor for action "chilled"...

At least I believe that's what the minions of the Empire are planning...


The result of the world's first major cyberwar might be surprising to them though...

[EFerrari]

141. It's illegal for Sweden to extradict him to a country with the death penalty.

But maybe, after they were nice enough to help with rendition, they have forgotten that.

[ProudDad]

124. Have you forgotten about the execrable "patriot" act?

If USAmerica gets its meathooks into Assange, he will be immediately declared an "enemy combatant" by the current resident and zipped off to Gitmo or worse...

No "justice". No 5th. No, zip, nada, none of those quaint "Civil Rights" for an inconvenient foreigner...

[Matilda]

75. How can a secretly empanelled grand jury be legal?

Does a defendant have no right to hear the charges and make a plea?

I'm disgusted that Obama should be a party to this - I would have hoped this sort of thing had gone out with Bush.

[glinda]

81. Secretly empanelled grand jury means death or life imprisonment, isolation, torture,you name it.

If he is handed over the total reality is that they will make an example out of him. No matter what the facts are.
Why are they not releasing the information if it could help him?

[msanthrope]

97. It is entirely legal. And there is no 'defendant' per se.

[Matilda]

102. But this is truly awful.

It's like an absolute ruler of old where a king would just say "off with his head", and it was done.

No case brought, no open trial, no defence. It's like -- you really want a conviction, set up a dummy court to do your bidding. I don't see how it can be justified in modern times.

[ProudDad]

134. That's pretty much the way the USAmerican criminal-injustice system works...

[ProudDad]

130. "How can a secretly empanelled grand jury be legal?"

Here in the USAmerican Empire, all kinds of shit is "legal"...

But, yes, a grand jury empaneled and operating in secret can bring any charges the DOJ wants to get...

[ProudDad]

157. Not in any Grand Jury in this country...

It's a persecutor's game...

No defense allowed...

That's one reason I told my local superior court to shove their grand jury summons up their ass...

[sarcasmo]

80. The World Police want this guy to push their Internet Kill Switch,.

[SILVER__FOX52]

96. U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder is a ......

God damn embarresment to this nation. Fuck him and fuck the main street media whores.

[fascisthunter]

99. what a pathetic government we have

[Downwinder]

100. Given the lack of security on the State Dept. network and the wide

distribution of the data, one has to assume that the cables were meant to be leaked. From the pressure on Assange it would appear that the US is trying to force the opening of the insurance file of un-redacted information.

[Pavulon]

112. Let him drop it. Stop teasing info, driving up click through dollars.

drop his chips and see what happens. Whats the worst that could happen?

[EFerrari]

148. Dan Ellsberg said there were 600,000 users on that network. n/t

[lib2DaBone]

101. Mr. Obama does not have the best interests of Dems...or America..as his program.

DEMS (and America) are in serious deep trouble.

[lovuian]

103. The DEMOCRATS are in the White House now

are we going to torture him and take him to Guatanomo

[Pavulon]

111. Because a Democratic President would approve of espionage

as a matter of fact the president is ready to commute pollard and ames because he just likes their style. What the fuck do you guys think he is going to do with someone brokering information stolen from a secure military network?

Guess he should just join the assange groupies..

[Bolo Boffin]

105. I thought we couldn't try high-profile people like this in the United States.

The security and threat of retaliation is just too much.

ETA: I just realized some might think I'm saying Assange is a terrorist. I don't think that at all. However, plenty of people are. And so if he can be tried in a U.S. criminal court, he can't be that bad, can he? Or if he can be tried and he is actually a terrorist, then why not Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and the rest of the GTMO prisoners?

To be absolutely clear, I don't think Assange is a terrorist, far from it. He and Wikileaks are dedicated to keeping any globally-impacting government from hiding in the shadows. And good on them for so doing.

[ProudDad]

114. Yep, the fix is in...

First Sweden gets him...

Drops the charges and hands him over to USAmerica...

Then he's declared an "enemy combatant" and flown to Gitmo or some other secret prison...

[Pavulon]

116. No he will stand trial in Northern Virginia

on charges of conspiracy at minimum based on communication with Manning, that is my bet. If manning dimes him out to avoid the death penalty and there was a conspiracy they could both be serving time in florance.

[go west young man]

153. Your high.

Do you seriously think Australia will allow an innocent citizen
to go to jail in the U.S. for publishing the truth? The U.S. may want the witch hunt.
And you may believe in that witch hunt till your last dying breath but it doesn't make it so.
You opine often Pavulon. Does Der Spiegel or The Guardian also get tried? Where
does it stop with your government arse kissing? The countries only as good as the people
who run it and ours is pretty fucked up right now.

[Pavulon]

158. Yes. I do believe they will allow him to stand trial if evidence supports conspiracy

because he is not press.

[go west young man]

164. Your right about one thing. He's not the press. He's better than the press.

The press are in the pocket of the gov't which is corrupt. He's publishing
the raw truth which any truly patriotic soul would embrace. You seem to
prefer to be lied to and convinced that your country is the bee's knee's when
it's all a sham. The veil has been pulled back yet you choose to accept the lie
rather than the unvarnished truth. Yourself and the country as a whole must
do one of two things now. Continue to accept the lie yet live a false existence
all the while wrapped in your flag. Or deal with the unraveling reality that is
now at hand. It seems the NYTimes and the U.S. media as a whole have decided
to choose the false reality. They are content with not knowing the truth. They are
worried about being tried for treason. Fear has won out. Lieberman fear which is
the most pathetic kind. The Guardian UK and Der Spiegel are giving us the truth.
You choose delusion it seems. The paradox is that the only way for the U.S. to
redeem itself is to seek true justice for the crimes and corruptionlaid out in the
Wikileaks cables. The country can only go backwards by not doing so. The thing
that is destroying the U.S. is not without. It's within. It is corruption. It's not terrorism.
It's the entrenched greedy bigwigs at the top. They are your enemy. Not some guy
with an AK in the desert. Fascism always comes wrapped in the flag.

[go west young man]

154. Letter from Australia media conglomerate as of 12/13/2010

The leaking of 250,000 confidential American diplomatic cables is the most astonishing leak of official information in recent history, and its full implications are yet to emerge. But some things are clear. In essence, WikiLeaks, an organisation that aims to expose official secrets, is doing what the media have always done: bringing to light material that governments would prefer to keep secret...

It is the media's duty to responsibly report such material if it comes into their possession. To aggressively attempt to shut WikiLeaks down, to threaten to prosecute those who publish official leaks, and to pressure companies to cease doing commercial business with WikiLeaks, is a serious threat to democracy, which relies on a free and fearless press.

[Pavulon]

118. glitch in the matrix(dupe)

dupe

[Javaman]

155. Isn't it amusing that the US wants to be judge jury and executioner against Assange

yet, believes that if investigations show that moron* and chaney are guilty they should be held accountable. But then we find out that Obama pressured Spain into stop pursuing charges against them.

Just like the pigs Animal Farm.

[EFerrari]

156. I'm afraid this DoJ is just as much of a joke as the previous one.

Of all the horrible stuff Obama had to deal with, I was really looking forward to a clean DoJ. Oh, well.

[Name removed]

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