Protesters Warned Before Mass Arrests on Brooklyn Bridge, Police Say

[formercia]

Source: DNAinfo




October 2, 2011 2:42pm | By Tom Liddy, DNAinfo News Editor


MANHATTAN — New video released by police shows an NYPD supervisor warning members of Occupy Wall Street that they would be arrested if they did not leave the Brooklyn Bridge roadway Saturday during an hours-long standoff that resulted in hundreds of arrests.

Thousands of protesters had packed onto the span as part of their demonstration against Wall Street greed, which began on Sept. 17.

Some jammed onto the pedestrian walkway, but others took to the roadway, where they were not allowed to march.

"Take the bridge! Take the bridge!" protesters can be heard repeatedly chanting while the senior NYPD officer, dressed in a rain coat, shouts at them to clear off the roadway at the entrance to the bridge on the Brooklyn-bound side.

--snip--


Read more: http://www.dnainfo.com/20111002/downtown/protesters-warned-before-mass-arrests-on-brooklyn-bridge-police-say

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My bullshit-o-meter is pegged on this one.

Check out the video and examine the people involved in the front line. I smell a provocation.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

1. I don't have to much trouble believing they were told to use the walkway personally

there are always a number of people who if somebody in authority says something then they will opt for the opposite. aka, being told not to use the road but walkway would make them use the road as to 'take the bridge' as some chanted.

[leveymg]

2. I'd go with the misled by the NYPD and provocateur theory. Avoid following both.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

4. mislead by the police how tho?

as for provocateurs thats possible since they went against the wishes of the organizers, tho i know enough people in real life to know they would have done what i mentioned in my previous post.

After all if you have a large group and you 'deem' the police a tool/arm of wall street, would you obey them if they told you not to do something, or would you defy them?

and out of curiosity, how are those chanting 'take the bridge' being mislead?

[leveymg]

8. Here's the link to the (instructive) NYT rewrite of the lead to that story. Very instructive

NYT initially reported the NYPD led the protesters onto the roadway. Within 20 minutes, the NYT police blotter editor rewrote the online story. Here's that thread: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=2040805&mesg_id=2040855

[formercia]

11. George Orwell would be proud.

History changes to fit the narrative of the moment.

[No Elephants]

20. And Democrats rush to make up things to defend the narrative of the moment.

Unreal.

If someone told me Democrats were doing these things, I would have a hard time believing them.

But, I read LBN almost every day.

[formercia]

28. Make up what things?

Be specific. Being nebulous doesn't help the conversation.

[Riftaxe]

9. Ignoring the videotape of the NYPD

shouting instructions over loud speakers?

I would be careful of basing decisions on what supreme space lord Giygafurmeox says to you when you have your tin foil hat off.

[leveymg]

18. Without resorting to invective, I would remind you there's video showing the NYPD leading the

marchers onto the roadway, and then there's later video showing the NYPD with bullhorns "warning" the protesters in the roadway on the bridge that they will be arrested.

I assume the space lord Giygafurmeox is a personal acquaintance of yours, since you're on a first-name basis with each other?

[coalition_unwilling]

26. There's a real simple term for it: "entrapment." The NYPD led

people onto the roadway and, in so doing, enticed othrwise law-abiding citizens into breaking a law many would not otherwise have violated.

It's really quite simple and so it is VERY DISTURBING to see so many on DU lock-step defending the NYPD's outrageous and egregious behavior.

[No Elephants]

21. Thank heaven overdubbing of police videos to fit a police narrative is simply not possible!

[formercia]

3. There are certain lines that should not be crossed.

It's surprising how a few people drew the rest of the crowd in like they were a bunch of Lemmings.

Next time, let the provocateurs go it alone. Let the Police arrest their own for show.

Personally, I think it was a victory because it got M$M's attention. People need to learn not to get sucked into an obvious trap.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

6. Some part might be that the provocateurs/troublemakers route

seems more exciting then walking in a long line on the gangway, after all they are pushing back against people wanting to 'stop' them from protesting as they wish. Must admit i wish the organizers had simply gotten a free permit tho, would have made things a lot easier

Edited to add: reason I added in troublemakers is that just because somebody defied the organizers gangway protest and decided to take the road instead and convince others to do so as well does not make them agent provocateurs

[No Elephants]

19. Speculation.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

25. just as its speculation that those who decided to use the road was agent provocators

There are enough people here on DU claiming that, both are valid opinions in my eyes tho i lean more toward my speculation then theirs.

[Magoo48]

5. I say

Horseshit in a hand basket

[formercia]

7. Please explain

With what part do you disagree?

[plumbob]

10. The horror! Taxpayers walking on an actual bridge they paid to build!

God! What's next??!! Education for your kids, just because you paid for it??!!!

What fucking nerve!! Good thing they also pay enough taxes for politicians to use paid policemen against them!!!


There are rating agencies that said junk securities were AAA, crooked dealers who sold the securities as such, and then bought derivatives to vote against those same instruments, making money off each step, laughing all the way, taking huge bonuses, and THEN had us bail out the losers who paid THEM!


But walking in the road???!!!! EMERGENCY! DANGER WILL ROBINSON!!! HAWNK! HAWNK!


Why didn't they just shoot the bastards!!?? They're sure to re-offend!

[MADem]

13. We don't walk on highways, and we pay for those too.

It's a motor vehicle roadway, there were cars on the bridge.

If they wanted to walk on the roadway, they could have gotten a permit, and NYPD could have closed a lane with portable barriers, and slowed traffic so they could walk safely.

[justiceischeap]

14. Tell that to this guy (who I bet didn't have a permit either)

[MADem]

15. Look at that magazine cover!!! Notice anything?

They're all....on the SIDEWALK.

As for the Selma to Montgomery march, they had something better than a permit--they had a COURT ORDER. http://www.history.com/topics/selma-montgomery-march

A Historic March

King himself led another attempt on March 9, but turned the marchers around when state troopers again blocked the road. That night, a group of segregationists beat another protester, the young white minister James Reeb, to death. Alabama state officials (led by Walllace) tried to prevent the march from going forward, but a U.S. district court judge ordered them to permit it. President Lyndon Johnson also backed the marchers, going on national television to pledge his support and lobby for passage of new voting rights legislation he was introducing in Congress. Some 2,000 people set out from Selma on March 21, protected by U.S. Army troops and Alabama National Guard forces that Johnson had ordered under federal control. After walking some 12 hours a day and sleeping in fields along the way, they reached Montgomery on March 25.

Nearly 50,000 supporters--black and white--met the marchers in Montgomery, where they gathered in front of the state capitol to hear King and other speakers including Ralph Bunche (winner of the 1950 Nobel Peace Prize) address the crowd. "No tide of racism can stop us," King proclaimed from the building's steps, as viewers from around the world watched the historic moment on television.

[plumbob]

17. Well, here in west Texas, we walk, ride bikes, and drive on the roads.

There are no sidewalks on most roads. But that's really not the point.

On the other hand, this IS a protest, right?

Or should we just stay in our little free speech zones, get signs pre-approved and not yell, but just speak quietly what we want?

Perhaps you should disavow those damned guys who threw all that tea into Boston Harbor. And I'm sure George didn't have a boat license when he crossed the Delaware, either.

Millions unemployed, millions had their savings stolen, millions had their houses stolen, all by banks, and we're supposed to politely let them know that we disapprove?

Really?

[MADem]

33. That's Texas.

Please don't give me, yet again, the "free speech zones" whine. I have heard it from a dozen or more people already.

This is my point, I will phrase it simply--don't cry about getting arrested when you engage in civil disobedience.

You break the law, you suffer the consequences. The suffering brings publicity, which is what was sought.

Stop complaining about the police, they aided and abetted the goal of publicity for the cause by making the arrests.

If no one bitched about the tea being thrown in Boston Harbor, we wouldn't have had a revolution, now, would we have? Just suppose a bunch of patriots dressed as Indians tossed the tea in the harbor....and no one said anything. The owners of the tea took the loss and didn't complain, the crown just ignored it, and everyone went home and went about their business?

The protesters WANTED to get arrested. If they sat on the bridge for a few hours, and the police just rerouted traffic and shrugged their shoulders, this wouldn't have gotten more than two lines in any paper.

Good grief--I sometimes wonder at the inability or unwillingness to pull the damn string around here!

[plumbob]

35. So we're really hoping the cops shoot someone?

More publicity, right?

Well, lessee...

[MADem]

36. What in hell are you babbling about?

The police have been extremely restrained in NYC, save one or two idiots (and those idiots helped the cause and garnered the protests some publicity).

Who is shooting ANYONE? From what dank recess did you pull that overly dramatic load?

GAWD....hyperbolic nonsense. The police, with their methodical catch-and-release, have done more to help the protesters than you ever will, I'm quite sure.

[MADem]

12. Are you saying you think the people in the front line were set up artists?

The woman with the striped bag seems to be lining everyone up and urging them on.

[No Elephants]

24. And she couldn't be doing that because she thought that's what the cops wanted the crowd to do?

Police barricades were all over that area of Manhattan.

People heading for the protests followed the route outlined by them, ended up concentrated, then got nets thrown over them and got arrested.

http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runninscared/2011/09/ben_koatz_17_de.php



The crowd may have grown too large for the area the police had confined them to.

Point is, unless you were there, you don't know what happened. Neither do I. But, based on what I have seen and heard, I will give the protestors the benefit of the doubt. And, even if I am mistaken in that, I am in solidarity with them.

I would have thought every Democrat would be. Shows how much I know.

[MADem]

32. The linked arm bunch have a plan. I think they knew what they were doing,

and I think they clearly knew that they weren't supposed to be on the bridge. YMMV.

I'm just giving my opinion. You aren't forced to concur. None of the people commenting here were there--what, everyone's supposed to shut up and cheer? Propaganda sucks. Discussion brings sunlight. I don't demand that anyone agree with me.

Turns out, though, that I was right about RADIOHEAD--and did I take shit for that, too. But whatever.

I support the goals of ending Wall Street corruption, I just don't think lying and bullshitting to achieve ends is a good tactic. I also think competent leadership is needed in this movement. Maybe the Unions should send down some experts who know how to organize.

[formercia]

34. The two skinheads were probably Undercover Police

One was posed in a threatening manner, while the other was urging the crowd on like a Bandmaster. Then there were the people in the crowd yelling "Take the Bridge." Were they all legit protesters? The Lady with the Bag was suspicious as well. The Bandito masks were a nice touch.
In the end, it doesn't mean much, but I feel for the protesters who were caught up in the gaggle and would not have been there if they had known they would be arrested. Some may face undue consequences as a result.

[MADem]

37. I am not convinced of that, and I will tell you why.

The only way the police would WANT to start arresting people en masse is if they were in cahoots with the goals of the protesters. I don't think they are on the side of corrupt government and corporations, but I don't know if they're sufficiently wired in to the point where they'd coordinate this kind of action. And I certainly don't think they did it just to be dicks.

If all those people sat down on the bridge and the police just "ate it" and got the traffic rerouted, there would have been no tv coverage. NONE. The only time coverage happens is if there are pictures of people being put in cuffs and marched away.

Someone wanted arrests, to garner media attention and galvanize the 'fight the power' crowd, and that's why that RADIOHEAD hoax happened, to swell the crowds to a point of critical mass.

The police are not the bad guys here. Deliberately (unlikely), as stooges/pawns (possibly), or as inadvertent servants of the people (most probable), they aided the goals of the protesters. Without those arrests, the OWS people would not have gotten a badly needed boost.

The people arrested are going to end up with the equivalent of a jaywalking ticket. We're not talking jail and hard time, here, we're talking small fines/court costs, and/or probation/go and sin no more.

[watajob]

16. Even if it was a set up...

... it's called "civil disobedience" for a reason. Bravo to the OWS 700!

[No Elephants]

22. Solidarity with the demonstrators.

[formercia]

31. Me too

There was never any question in my mind about that.

[pnorman]

23. Spotted on DU earlier:

[formercia]

27. That's what I was referring to

when I said that History changes to fit the narrative of the moment.

[pnorman]

29. Yes, I spotteed that after I made that posting.

Sorry!

[formercia]

30. No problem

Just trying to clear up any confusion. There are some that think I'm criticizing the protesters, but getting thrown in jail is counterproductive from an individual standpoint.
Like in guerrilla warfare, one must be careful to chose the time and the place of battle and not let the opposition decide for you.