Fla. Senators Question Gore's Comments

[Snellius]

MIAMI (AP) - Florida's two Democratic senators defended U.S. Senate candidate Alex Penelas on Monday, a day after Al Gore's published comments calling Penelas ``the single most treacherous and dishonest person I dealt with'' during the 2000 election.

Sen. Bill Nelson questioned Gore's decision to inject himself into the race, saying it hurts the party's ability to keep retiring Sen. Bob Graham's seat and threatens a key state for presidential candidate John Kerry. Graham called Penelas, the mayor of Miami-Dade County, ``a good Democrat.''

Both Graham and Nelson have said they will not endorse a candidate in the Democratic primary but that they felt compelled to come to Penelas' defense in light of Gore's remarks.

``This slash-and-burn politics has gotten us to the point that it is causing gridlock in America,'' Nelson said.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-4179625,00.html

[JohnLocke]

1. Gore was a total ass to attack Penelas.

He's inexplicably backing Deutsch the douchbag, a do-nothing jellyfish conressman who's taken the most money from outside Florida. Mark my words here today: if Betty Castor or Peter Deutsch is our nominee, we will lose.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

3. If only you knew what you were posting about...

...but obviously, you don't.

[JohnLocke]

5. Could you be a bit more specific? What "don't I know"?

I live in this state. I have heard all three canidates speak. I know what they stand for. What exactly do you have a problem with about that?

[Zhade]

18. Hey, I think you know what you're talking about...

...how to cover-up the Cuban right's grip on politics in Florida.

I lived there for 25 years, and I'm certain you're saying what you feel you should say. Too bad it's wrong.

[JohnLocke]

34. Penelas is part of the **right** of Cuban politics? Excuse me?

[Zhade]

37. Yes. Even with a 'D' after his name.

You really don't realize that?

[JohnLocke]

39. Give me a fucking break.

http://www.alexpenelas2004.com/issues.htm

[Media_Lies_Daily]

48. And what does that prove, exactly?

[JohnLocke]

52. That Alex Penalas is a true Democrat, unlike Deutsch.

[dolstein]

71. You have to understand -- many DU'ers assume the worst

about the motives of Cuban Americans. Frankly, the slurs about Penelas being some right-wing corporate whore are reminiscent of the slurs that have been used against Joe Lieberman. The funny thing is, Peter Deutsch is at least as pro-Israel as Lieberman, but he gets a pass because he's bashing a Cuban American. I guess we now know what the pariah pecking order is.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

80. Right. I think I'll take Gore's word on this one.

[AlGore-08.com]

63. Back in 2000, Penelas was accused of working to end the recount

http://www.nytimes.com/2000/12/01/politics/01DADE.html?pagewanted=1&ei=5070&en=e15542e22d190da8&ex=1086753600

December 1, 2000

Miami Mayor's Role a Riddle in Decision to Halt Recount
By DON VAN NATTA Jr. and DEXTER FILKINS

MIAMI, Nov. 30 — In the hours before and after Miami-Dade County's hand recount was halted last week, Democrats and Republicans believed that one man had the power to determine its fate: Alex Penelas, the 38-year-old Democratic mayor of Miami-Dade County and a rising star of South Florida politics.

Last Tuesday, as the county's hand recount racked up dozens of new votes for Vice President Al Gore, the mayor had lunch at the Governor's Club in Tallahassee with a Republican state legislator. Later he met with other Republican lawmakers, who are significant to Mr. Penelas because Florida's Legislature will draw new Congressional districts in 2002 and Mr. Penelas, political observers say, has hopes of running for Congress.

The next day, the three members of the Miami-Dade County Canvassing Board, one of whom works for Mr. Penelas, voted to stop the manual recount and canceled plans to review the 10,750 ballots that voting machines said had no presidential preference. The vote came despite the Florida Supreme Court's ruling that recounts could go forward.

Not long afterward, Mark Fabiani, the Gore campaign's communications director, said, Mr. Gore called Mr. Penelas and asked for his help in reversing the board's decision.

The mayor promised he would issue a statement calling for the recount to resume, Mr. Fabiani said.

But Mr. Penelas's statement said nothing supportive about the recount. Instead, it said that he had "no jurisdiction over that board's decisions."

(snip)

"The whole community is very suspicious of what happened surrounding the decision to close down the recount," said Representative Carrie P. Meek, a Democrat from Miami-Dade County. "People are suspect. Wouldn't you be if there were 10,700 votes that were not counted?"

(snip)

But Mr. Penelas stayed in constant contact with David Leahy, the Miami-Dade supervisor of elections and a member of the canvassing board, speaking to him as many as three times a day, Mr. Penelas said. Deputy County Attorney Murray Greenberg said that at one point during the canvassing board meetings last week, he passed a note from Mr. Penelas to Mr. Leahy. Mr. Greenberg said the note contained a request from Mr. Penelas for Mr. Leahy to call him.

Mr. Leahy acknowledged receiving a note from Mr. Penelas and said it contained a message to call him. When asked for a copy of the note, Mr. Leahy said that he could not find it.

After the Miami-Dade board voted on Nov. 22 to stop its hand count, Mr. Leahy explained the decision this way: "We simply can't get it done. There was this concern that we were not conducting an open, fair process."

(More... )


http://www.evote.com/features/insider/insider02062001.asp

Is That a Knife in My Back, or Are You Just Sorry to See Me?
february 6, 2001

(snip)

If you recall, after Election Day 2000, Miami-Dade County was one of the three key battleground counties in which Al Gore hoped to pick up enough votes in a recount to swing the election to the Democrats.

So, on the day after the Election, when it looked like there was a good shot at pulling out a victory, Gore made calls to various party people in Florida, and most especially, called Alex Penelas in Miami. Gore's key request was to make sure that the Miami Dade County election workers would have the full support of the city government -- especially in terms of getting enough workers to do the recounts, and in getting whatever else was needed to make the recount go forward.

Penelas assured Gore that he would do everything possible to help him, and Gore reported to his close advisers that whatever else happened, they could count on the City of Miami and Alex Penelas.

And then, Alex got on a plane and went to Barcelona, Spain for a two-week vacation. Miraculously, overnight, all of the support for Gore in Miami vanished, and the Miami-Dade County Election Board found itself with no extra budget money, no volunteers from the city government, and in fact, were so short-handed that they couldn't even call county employees over the weekend to come and help them with the count because they were denied access to the home telephone numbers and call lists that the city of Miami kept in readiness for emergencies.

(More, but not about anything connected to the 2000 Florida election)

[mulethree]

67. Thanks, that explains Gores viewpoint

[AlGore-08.com]

70. Gore's comment could be based on more than that

The Florida recount has never really been investigated the way it should have. (The "bourgeious riot" is a case in point - - these jerks committ assalt and battery on live TV, most of 'em have their names printed in the Wall Street Journal, CNN, etc... and none of them have ever been charged with anything.) Regardless, whatever bombshell Gore is going to drop later, it's a 99.99% certainty that he will be able to prove his charge. Because Gore has always been extremely careful about what he says in public.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

83. Bingo. I hope Gore tears them a new one.

[BeachBuckeye]

82. Obviously, you know nothing about dear Alex!

He was most definitely a traitor to the Democratic Party during the 2000 election. I thought Al's words were much too kind. Castor OR Peter can win the race.

[madfloridian]

2. Give Gore a chance to get the rest of it said.

He said he will clarify this issue more. I know for sure the Democrats here let him down.

[JohnLocke]

Delete.

Nevermind...

[madfloridian]

6. No, he should not.

Gore should not shut up. None of us should shut up ever again when we see things are wrong.

If you do not believe me, look at the attitude since Reagan died....shhhhhhhh, don't hurt the feelings of the right wing.

Look how the media is showing nothing but Reagan, covering up who knows what else.

It is past time for people to speak up loudly.

[JohnLocke]

8. This is a baseless attack aganist Penelas.

Deutsch is trying to degenerate the primaries into I-supported-Gore-more-than-you-did-and-Bush-is-all-your-fault ‘debate.’ Deutsch cannot win if the Republicans put up Martinez, and even if he did, what will do for Florida? He didn't do anything of note in Congress.

[madfloridian]

12. I trust Gore enough to believe there is more to this.

I think we should allow our elected president to speak out, and we should give him time to get it all out.

[Zhade]

20. Baseless? See, you DON'T know what you're talking about.

Penelas promised Gore he would ensure the recount went as smoothly as possible - then immediately left for a two-week trip to Spain.

Baseless? Only what you're trying to sell here, pal. The guy fucked all us Democrats by abdicating his legal responsibilities. He was negligent, and that helped allow b*sh - unelected, mind you - to seize the White House.

Really, you should try to know the facts before you open your mouth. Gore knows. We know. You don't.

[goforit]

75. Yah working for the penelas campaign, eh?

I'll take Gore any day over one damn US senator(Dem or Repug)much less
an unpatriotic Cuban-American mayor of Miami.

Yah...Let's open those borders to Cuba...Let the real freedom ring!!!

[JohnLocke]

11. The chairman of Florida's Democratic Party doesn't agree with Gore.

"That's not the experience I had with Alex," said Florida Democratic Party Chairman Bob Poe, who led the party during the 2000 election. "Anything I ever asked him to do for the party, he did."

[madfloridian]

13. Well, I trust Bob Poe as far as I can throw him.

I don't mean he has done wrong, I don't know that. I do know he was extremely ineffective before he stepped down.

I will wait for Gore to clarify. He is NOT an impulsive person, and I firmly believe there is a lot to come out yet.

[goforit]

76. Florida Dem Chairman gave Bush the F#$^ing White House!!!!

[BeachBuckeye]

85. Bob Poe was useless as well

Never did we have a worse state party chairman.

[bluestateguy]

4. How dare they question the president

He is the president, and we don't question him, or his vision for the country.

[Bandit]

62. Question all you want ~ but it is nice if you provide a counterpoint

instead of just bashing someone. Wait and hear Gore out then make your condescending remarks.

[loudsue]

7. I have total confidence in Gore's opinion....

He knows where bodies are buried, and he's too ethical a person (as well as being prophetic about many things) to say something without knowing and believing seriously about what he's saying.

If he says Penelas is a bad guy, I believe him.

:kick::kick::kick:

[JohnLocke]

10. Penelas is not a bad guy.

Gore is a great man, but he's wrong on this one. Penelas is by far a better choice:

Deutsch voted...

* YES on the constitutional amendments prohibiting flag desecration
* NO on funding for alternative sentencing rather than prisons
* YES on making federal death penalty appeals harder,
* YES on more prosecution and sentencing for juvenile crime,
* NO on replacing death penalty with life imprisonment
* NO on withdrawing from the WTO
* YES on authorizing military force in Iraq

[Media_Lies_Daily]

49. That's YOUR opinion.

[MasonJar]

9. I know nothing about the mayor but I believe Gore. Emily's List

is backing Betty Castor. We heard her in D.C. and she was quite credible. Of course I know very little except I know Gore was screwed and Miami was part and parcel of that. And look what has happened to our great country.

[nolabels]

14. More bush lite ?

No thanks, I gave up beer and wine and now just drunk on plain hypocrisy :nopity:

[Cocoa]

15. Gore didn't coordinate this with the FL dems?

silly mistake, I hope it doesn't do any serious damage.

[Malikshah]

16. Florida Dems?? Puhleeze

I hope you don't mean those fools who put McBride up against Jeb and to this day still have the temerity to defend that position.

As someone who was in Miami during the Elian fiasco-- Penelas was and is a tool.

By the way-- I'm sooo happy this is my 666th post-- Mark of the Beast!!!!:evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :headbang: :headbang:

[WillyBrandt]

24. As a native Floridian, I'm barely holding back spilling

the bad things about sleazy Alex...

[Occulus]

55. spill away...

...if you can corroborate it in this little flamefest. :eyes:

[crossroads]

28. Rockon Malikshah!

:headbang: :yourock:

[madfloridian]

41. Florida Democrats are actually mostly Republicans.

Sorry to say that, but that is the way it is. That is how they got elected, by sounding just like them.

Graham only became outspoken about the war, the rest of the time he seldom spoke out.

Nelson is only now realizing that we voted for him as a Democrat,not a religious right person.

[goforit]

77. Bada bing!!!.......Tell it like it is. No wonder Lieberman was so popular

[dolstein]

17. Is Gore trying to supplant Ralph Nader as arch nemesis of Florida Dems?

Sorry, but injecting himself into a senate primary contest whose rhetoric (thanks to Deutsch) has already reached near toxic levels is not a smart move. It's a selfish move. Gore has put his own personal interests in political payback ahead of the interests of both John Kerry and the state party. One of two things is going to happen in the senate primary -- either Alex Penelas is going to win, in which case Gore has preemptively declared the Democratic nominee to be a lying, trecherous bastard (just imagine what the Republicans can do with that), or Alex Penelas is going to lose, in which case Gore has greatly increased the likelihood that Penelas will become exhibit A in the Republican campaign to solidify support among the Cuban American community. And he has made it far more difficult for the party to unite behind the eventual nominee.

No matter how you look at it, Gore has done something incredibly stupid.

[maryallen]

22. Gore has EVERY right to say WHATEVER he wants ...

I only wish he had said it sooner.

Remember that Penelas is the guy who hopped a plane for Spain the minute Gore asked him to secure the votes in Miami during Election 2000. Quite the turncoat, isn't he? Or is Republican-lite more descriptive?

And no, Gore is NOT like Nader. Contrary to what some dubiously democratic DU posters reflect, Gore is attempting valiantly to return the Democratic party to its roots ... with no help, I might add, from its so-called Democratic senators.

[JohnLocke]

27. Republican-light?

You mean like Representative Peter Deutsch, Newt Gingrich's favorite "Democrat"?

[crossroads]

30. Right on!

:yourock:

[dolstein]

32. Gore has the right to f*ck over Kerry and the Florida Democratic Party?

Ok, sure. He can do whatever he wants. Just like Nader. That doesn't make it right. It certainly doesn't make it wise. Perhaps one day Gore and Nader will release that THIS ISN'T ABOUT THEM.

[goforit]

78. Yes ...It is about us!!! We don't want Bush-lights like

Kerry and the Floridian Democratic Party that can't even
march in the streets for their own damn rights!!!

Floridians Dems are weak and have royally screwed this country.

[mithnanthy]

57. Maryallen.....

YOU GO GIRL! I agree!

[madfloridian]

42. No, you have that backwards.

Florida Dems are the enemy of Florida Dems.

[2Design]

19. glad Gore continues to speak up.....we need a better democrat

to take Grahams space....and Gore knows it...

[Th1onein]

21. It is not the TIME to come against ANY Democrat, right now.

We must stand together, despite our differences, just like the Republicans have always done.

We DO a better job, period; it is just a matter of getting us in there and letting us do our job. Period.

Stop sniping.

[madfloridian]

43. Gore said last year that there was more, he would speak out later.

And he is. There is more.

[goforit]

79. Gooooooo GORE!!!!............Let them have it!!!

[lojasmo]

60. I hope I don't catch you bashing Zell

Some democrats behave badly, and should be called on it. Al Gore ROCKS!

Democrats who behave like republicans should be called to the damn carpet.

[KoKo]

61. If we have Democrats who've worked against our party, we need to speak

out against them. This is actually what the Repugs do. If you don't tow the line to the Repug Doctrine you get DeLay and Frist at your throat threatening you.

Zell Miller is an example of someone who should be kicked out. The Florida Cuban Mafia head, is probably another one. If he cost us the election in 2000 why should we support him? Kick him out.

[Th1onein]

74. You know what? You're right.

Better yet, kick Zell Miller out of the Democratic Party. Then we won't have to worry about attacking one of our own.

[WillyBrandt]

23. Penelas--What a shithead!

Jesus, what a worthless bag of puss this guy is--Gore was right!

[JohnLocke]

26. Penelas is not a "shithead."

[WillyBrandt]

33. Self-Delete in the interest of Dem Unity in these times

Deleted. I'll grant you: Compared to Jeb, et al, Penelas is GREAT

[JohnLocke]

35. Thank you.

It's all good. Yes, even Deutsch, whom I'll work for if nominated (Just like Penelas will).

[Media_Lies_Daily]

87. Okay, let's try this. Penelas is a...

...back-stabbing shithead.

How's that? Sure works for me.

[Catt03]

25. Well ...........I THINK

Gore is right but should shut up.

Gore lost Florida with a lot of help from Jeb and Katherine. However, he and the State Democratic party refused to fight in Florida. I am sure it was bad advice he received but that is how it happened.

In fact, I think the whole country abandoned us. Why didn't Democrats get really angry and insist that something else be done? Why didn't everyone march in the streets and yell like hell about the 2000 mess? The only support we had; John Sweeney, Jesse Jackson and Robert WExler. Where was Bill Nelson? Bob Graham? Peter Deutsch?
I know....I should just get over it. But I won't. As for Penelas, he is a Democrat. Maybe not one we would hold up to ideals but a Democrat.

I am voting and working for Betty Castor.

[papau]

29. I agree - n/t

n/t

[madfloridian]

44. Castor as well. BUT...Jeb and Kate were successful because of the Dems.

That is the truth. They left Gore hanging. If they had helped Gore fight, Jeb and Kate would not have won.

[Rebellious Republican]

31. If you are not from Florida or have lived in Florida recently.....

then you have no idea of the respect these two Senators command on both sides of the aisle. They are good Democrats that have to work in a republican controlled state, no easy task for any state under total Repub control, then add the fact that Jeb has a complete dictatorship on top of that. They have made great contributions to this state given our circumstances, they are Honorable politicians. I have to respect their reasons for defending Pinelas, whatever they are. You can bet it is for the good of the democratic party here in Florida, again, if you do not live here then you have no clue. As far as Al Gore, I do not know what he is up to, I am sure he has his reasons and I would like to hear more about his comments, because I also respect Al Gore. I hope that he has not got caught up in a Deaniac impersonation. I like Dean, he has helped the party in many ways, but only Dean can do what Dean does so well. Al is no Dean and it can come across in a negative way. Look, Florida politics is probably the most corrupt political atmosphere in the US. We should trust these Senior Senators, they know how to play the game down here. Now is not the time to start Dem bashing among ourselves. How about we take control of the country first and then work on the party. People, we have to get our priorities in order or do you all care for more of the same. I am sick of both Bush's and I will do what ever I can do to get rid of them. I wish I could leave this state, but I am to economically challenged, I wish I could leave this fucked up country, my personal situation will not allow for that either. I am fed up with this whole fucking country and its bullshit elite that used to just shit on us once in awhile. They seem to have developed a bad case of Diarrhea and are drowning this country in their excrement. Since I have no options, I am left only one choice, thats to fight like a cornered animal for the freedoms that I hold so dear. That means unification, all of us have to become one with each other or they win, get it! Once that has happened, then let the "Smack Down" begin, at least we will have our country back. If I have offended anyone with this rant, then vote for Nader or Bush. I will not respond to any flames to this simply because I refuse to be sucked into a non productive argument, that does absolutely nothing to promote democratic unity!

:wow:

[nolabels]

36. This Californian don't like other parts of the country picking ours either

I would like to oblige by keeping my nose out of it too. The problem is we have this thing called republicanism, quite vile and sometimes even deadly. It knows no borders and has yet to find things immune from it. Infecting the children and depriving elderly the best of their golden years. Sucking the life blood from everything it happens on with no known cure on the horizon. This is more than a war, this is for a planet to survive on.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/718474.cms

Backlash against outsourcing was overblown: Nasscom

PTI< THURSDAY, JUNE 03, 2004 11:10:18 PM >

NEW DELHI : Enthused by 30.5 per cent surge in software and services exports in 2003-04, apex industry body Nasscom on Thursday said that the entire issue of backlash against outsourcing was blown out of proportion.

The issue of outsourcing, which dominated the headlines and debates on IT for the entire 2003, had taken a backseat and the rhetoric level on this would come down, Nasscom President Kiran Karnik told newspersons here.

The backlash has had no impact on the business of IT companies in India and as IT spending in US increases and more jobs are added in view of improving economic environment the resistance against outsourcing will further reduce, Nasscom Chairman Jerry Rao said.

He added that the entire BPO-ITeS industry created 65,000 jobs in India while the US economy adds three lakh jobs per month so the statistics indicate that offshoring has had no impact on the US employment scene.
(snip)

[Rebellious Republican]

40. Uh, OK, if you say so.... and I do agree about outsourcing!

And your point has what to do with Dems uniting to defeat "republicanism". I agree it is taking hold, all the more reason to stay united and fight it, saftey in numbers ya know.

[nolabels]

47. I only served under Carter

Even though so many screwed him over as president he still served his country as president it with Honor and Dignity. My guess its more about how you do it than why it should be done. Ike and Kennedy both served but then came Nixon (navy intelligence with two out of three not being bad). We don't need more military men, but it seems we would have a way better chance with him than having this AWOL pOTUS and a draft dodger as VP.

I wasn't trying to push your buttons that much and forgot to check your handle (it was kind of true parody), but knowing I only served three, and your ribbons make it look like you're either retired or reserve but have served at least twenty years. I would like to ask you what is up with this B.S. story going around that more veterans like * and his cabal better. I am very angry and ashamed of what he has done to what was once and Honorable military. It's just so disgusting

Btw I was once a republican when I younger but left when I found out how much of a fraud Raygun was (I don't know about him resting in peace, but I am)

On edit forgot about Poppy, but he bailed the plane and everybody else died (How did that work :scared:)

[Rebellious Republican]

90. I served under Carter and both terms of Reagan....

I was in for ten years, did some time in Beirut in "83". I got around, seen some things that scared the hell out of me. Most of those ribbons are standard gee dunk. The only two that have special meaning to me are the Navy Aircrew Wings and the Navy Expeditionary Medal (issued for my service in Beirut). Those two were hard earned.
:toast:

[madfloridian]

45. RR, I respect you greatly, but do you remember Gore's 2003 statement?

There is a thread about this in GD2004, I think. He said there was more, he did not choose to talk then, but that he would address it at a later date.

I think the timing would not have been right, no one would have listened. Maybe Dean set the stage for others to get their courage back.....he has done that a lot lately, you know.

Even Donna Brazille is talking about passion, though I do not fully trust her.

I do not know what this is about, but I trust Gore that he has something.

[Rebellious Republican]

89. Hi MF, You misunderstood my rant.........

I just get so tired of so many people getting into flame wars without all of the pieces of the puzzle, Al has not given us all the pieces yet. My personal respect for Al Gore leads me to believe that he has his reasons and am willing to wait until he tells us more. I am not defending Pinelas, by any means, however I have respect for Bob Graham and Bill Nelson and understand that they have their reasons for defending him, remember this is Florida we are talking about. I just wish that we could all unite and take down this dark cloud that we live under. Why can't we wait until after the election to air our dirty laundry. We can clean house of the rotten Dem's once we have regained control. I am all for expelling some after the election, we can start in Georgia with a certain Democrat we all love to hate. Thats all I am asking, that we become united long enough to to be able to do some pest control and extermination, on BOTH sides of the aisle. :pals:

[Judi Lynn]

38. More information on Gore's remarks about Alex Penelas

on this earlier thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=605850

Some of it might be enlightening to the occassional person who has no idea what the hell happened.

[madfloridian]

46. Here is a quote from the 2003 article about Gore.

I won't link to the Miami Herald anymore. But sign up and do a search on DeFede, the author.

SNIP..."All this rancor made me wonder if Al Gore had heard about the mayor's boastful claims that he was a ''strong supporter'' of the former vice president and that he was instrumental in helping Gore gather votes in Miami-Dade County.

''I had heard that, yes,'' Gore told me when I reached him by phone on Saturday.

What did he think of the mayor's revisionist memory?

Gore paused for a moment.

''I don't have any comment on that,'' he said. ``I would just prefer not to comment on it.''

But then he quickly added: ``I don't rule out commenting on it at a later time, but I don't care to comment on it right now.''

And to make sure I heard him, he said it again: ``I don't rule out commenting on it at some point in the future.''

Well, that ought to give Penelas a few sleepless nights. Gore is holding the proverbial sword over Penelas' head, allowing the mayor to squirm, and letting him know that some day soon he might talk candidly about his old friend."

[deminflorida]

50. Gore wants the Cubans to think that Penelas is a crooked....

Democrat, plan and simple. That way the ones that are even thinking about John Kerry will stay with the GOP and cause Florida to fall and give Bush the election.

If this strategy makes it close and allows the GOP to steal another Florida Presidential election (and trust me, Jeb will see to that), then Gore can step in as an avenging angel in 2008 with a liberal, pissed-off Democratic base supporting him.

Same motive the ass-wipe had with the Dean endorsement.

[madfloridian]

51. That is a distorted view IMHO.

If Gore is out to get Dean, for example, why would the DFA be hiring on Gore's old WH staff and campaign people. That is about who is running things. Even Roy Neel was/is on board. So you must think Dean is not too bright, since he is saying ok to the hiring....nothing nefarious here.

I think you absolutely insult Gore.

[deminflorida]

53. Well Gore has absolutely insulted Florida,

so his fat ass deserves it....

[madfloridian]

54. Perhaps we deserved insulting on this issue.

:hi:

And you just insulted Gore.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

88. I'm thinking that you somehow missed this post...

<http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=608500&mesg_id=609683&page=>

Now, what was the you were saying about apologizing to Gore by kissing "his fat ass"?

[Scurrilous]

56. Gore's remarks are death blow for Penelas' bid

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/local/8864746.htm

<snip>

"Is it too late to draft Al Gore for president?

Calling Alex Penelas "the single most treacherous and dishonest person I dealt with during the campaign anywhere in America," the former vice president has not only gut-shot Penelas' senate campaign but in all likelihood ended the political career of our ambitious mayor.
And it's not because Gore's words are so harsh. It's because they're true."

<snip>

"Raul Martinez believes the real reason Penelas abandoned Gore is that he cut a deal with leading Republicans earlier in the year. The Republicans wouldn't support Penelas' main rival in the mayoral election -- Republican Miguel Diaz de la Portilla -- and in return, Penelas would steer clear of the presidential election.

Penelas has always had an alliance with Dade Republicans and has even raised money for them. But in 2000, he crossed the line.

"I'm just surprised Al Gore hadn't said anything until now about it," said Martinez, a Democrat who has yet to endorse anyone in the Senate race. "This kills Alex. The hard-core Democratic voters who are going to vote on August 31 are not going to vote for him. Whatever inroads Alex made over the last year to win them back have just been lost."

[Judi Lynn]

58. Beautiful! That's one fine article.

From the text:

Nevertheless, Penelas claims he was a true supporter. Well, if that's the case, then it should be easy enough for him to prove it and put this matter behind him. All the mayor has to do is point to an event, a statement, a single campaign appearance he made on behalf of Gore between the day he won reelection on September 5, 2000, and the day of the presidential election on November 7.

Just one statement during those 62 days. I've looked. I can't find any.

Al Gore isn't upset because Penelas gave him the cold shoulder during the summer and early fall of 2000. Folks in the Gore campaign understood, given the Elián González debacle, that Penelas had to distance himself from the Clinton/Gore White House to win reelection. But once Penelas won his race, they expected his support.

Democratic fundraiser Mitch Berger says he specifically helped Penelas raise out-of-state money to help him avoid a run-off so Penelas could help Gore during those critical 62 days.

Penelas took the money and then disappeared like a thief in the night.
(snip)

Woooo HOOOOOOOO. :bounce: Just what the doctor ordered: the TRUTH!

[nolabels]

59. Thanks for helping us get there

The DE-elected President calling people out, this is sweet. There is some real slime out there thank goodness most of it's on the republican side of the aisle. Where in the HELL is Nader, does the SOB still say they are both the same? GO TO HELL RALPH

[AlGore-08.com]

64. DeFe (the author) nails it: all Penelas has to do is show he helped Gore

If Penelas could produce one interview, one appearance, anything proving that he campaigned for Gore after Penelas won his election in September, Gore would loose all credibility. Everywhere.

But Penelas can't, because he didn't campaign for Gore.

If Penelas could produce any evidence, any witness, that proved that he helped during the recount - - not stuffed ballot boxes, but made sure that Miami had the resources to count all the ballots (as the Florida Supreme Court had ordered them to do) - - or that the Miami City Government did thing one about investigating the "bourgieous riot" and bringing the folks who committed assalt and battery on live TV to justice - - Gore's charges would disappear.

But Penelas can't, because he didn't do anything.

And because of that, Smirk is squatting in the White House now.

[wabeewoman]

65. The thing everyone has to keep in mind

is that the republicans KNEW Florida was going to be the key state and did everything in their power to make sure they won it. Remember Shrub's incredulous remark when it was said Gore won Florida. I think this scenario rings true. I've found with Gore, if you read his actual remarks and not the media spin, he is right. He was right about Dean but then he apparently didn't get the memo that Dean wasn't the 'chosen one'. I don't understand the animosity toward him from Democrats. Or why there are democrats who are closet republicans but no closet democrats.

[dolstein]

72. Yeah, just as Gore's endorsement of Dean guaranteed him the nomination

Sorry, but I wouldn't put too much faith in the ability of Gore to sway the outcome of the primary race. People around here tend to forget than most Democrats, even those who vote in primaries, aren't left-wing ideologues like the typical DU'er. If the rank and file Democrats behaved the way DU'ers did, Dennis Kucinich or Howard Dean would be our presidential nominee.

[ibegurpard]

92. Then what is your problem?

If he's a joke with no influence then what do you care what he says?

[JohnLocke]

73. DeFe has it out for Penelas -- He's a jackass.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

86. Looks like your opinion, such that it is, is not shared by too many....

...other posters.

Wonder why that is?

[goforit]

81. Yes,...If I were a Florida Dem, I'd vote repug before I'd vote for another

traitor like a Zell Miller Democrat!!!!

At least you know what's coming at you every time.

[geek tragedy]

66. I knew Penelas was a pandering shithead back in 2000

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/695171.stm


Alex Penelas, the mayor of Miami-Dade county, said there may be civil unrest if the US Justice Department continues with its threats to repatriate Elian.

"The federal government is provoking the community," Mr Penelas said.

"They are tossing fuel to the fire."

Saying that he was speaking for other mayors in the Miami area, Mr Penelas added that local authorities would hold US President Bill Clinton and Attorney General Janet Reno responsible for any unrest or violence.

http://www.cnn.com/2000/US/03/31/elian.federal.defiance/

Then on Wednesday, Miami-Dade County Mayor Alex Penelas told Washington not to expect local authorities "to assist the federal government in any way, shape or form to inappropriately repatriate Elian Gonzalez to Cuba."

And the mayor seemed to add a warning.

"We are holding the federal government responsible, and specifically (Attorney General) Janet Reno and the president of the United States, for anything that may occur in this community," Penelas said.

Those words suggested a "defiance of authority" to the White House.


He played Orval Faubus and George Wallace to pander to the right-wing Cubanos who care more about what happens in Cuba than what happens here. Fuck Alex Penelas. We don't need another Zell Miller.

[mmm]

68. This is one great thread

There are plots and counter-plots and twists and turns
and a surprise cliff-hanger ending (tune in next week
to see the exciting conclusion)!
Me likey.

[dave29]

69. Gore speaks the truth

That is why others work so hard to say he doesn't.
If the truth is slash and burn... burn baby burn.

[robbedvoter]

84. Deutsch is one of the Florida 14. Graham, Nelson were sitting on their

hands when the Florida electoral votes were challenged. And penelas was a traitor. I am not from Florida, but all these people stole my vote too.
Graham should have kept his seat. barring that, should keep his mouth. His role in the 2000 election was not exactly a shining example.

[peacetalksforall]

91. After all these years, Graham finally started speaking out - and it was

about 9-11 and little about 2000,. I've left FL, but I remember Pinelas well and he's no Democrat.

I place my faith in Gore. He has always been quite judicious - too judicious in Florida, but maybe he was a stunned and paralyzed as we were. Something went very wrong and I thank everyone who has posted about Pinelas.

I think Gore has a right to speak. I don't think he would have if he didn't think it was urgent. Do we want another Zell?

I also want to know what Janet says.