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cal04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-28-04 10:59 PM
Original message
Analyst Who Is Target of Probe Went to Israel
Pentagon official served in Israel as Air Force reservist, inquiry shows.

The FBI investigation into whether classified information was passed to the Israeli government is focused on a Pentagon analyst who has served as an Air Force reservist in Israel, and the probe has been broadened in recent days to include interviews at the State and Defense departments and with Middle Eastern affairs specialists outside government, officials and others familiar with the inquiry said yesterday.

At the center of the investigation, sources said, is Lawrence A. Franklin, a career analyst at the Defense Intelligence Agency who specializes in Iran and has served in the Air Force Reserve, rising to colonel. Early in the Bush administration, Franklin moved from the DIA to the Pentagon's policy branch headed by Undersecretary Douglas J. Feith, where he continued his work on Iranian affairs.
FBI officials have been quietly investigating for months whether Franklin gave classified information -- which officials said included a draft of a presidential directive on U.S. policies toward Iran -- to two Israeli lobbyists here who are alleged to have passed it on to the Israeli government. Officials said it was not yet clear whether the probe would become an espionage case or perhaps would result in lesser charges such as improper release of classified information or mishandling of government documents.

Officials and colleagues said yesterday that Franklin had traveled to Israel, including during duty in the Air Force Reserve, where he served as a specialist in foreign political-military affairs. He may have been based at the U.S. Embassy in Tel Aviv on those tours, said a former co-worker at the DIA but was never permanently assigned there.

One former State Department officer recalled being told that U.S. government experts considered the countries whose spying most threatened the United States were Russia, South Korea and Israel. "I also know from my time in Jerusalem that official U.S. visitors to Israel were warned about the counterintelligence threat from Israel," he said. Taking a slightly different view, others speculated that the very closeness of the relationship between the United States and Israeli governments -- and especially the tight connections between the Israelis and Feith's policy office -- may have led officials to become sloppy about rules barring release of sensitive information.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A42625-2004Aug28.html
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 12:13 AM
Response to Original message
1. I would be so fascinated to know the identities and backgrounds
of those "government experts."

So Israel is considered as dangerous as SOUTH KOREA? And Russia.

Yeah, I'd like to know whose mouth that came out of.

China not a problem, though?
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cosmicaug Donating Member (676 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Yopu are misinterpreting what was writen.
Edited on Sun Aug-29-04 09:07 AM by cosmicaug
aquart wrote:
I would be so fascinated to know the identities and backgrounds of those "government experts."

So Israel is considered as dangerous as SOUTH KOREA? And Russia.

Yeah, I'd like to know whose mouth that came out of.
They are talking about countries whose spying most threaten the U.S.. That means countries that spend a lot of effort on doing this and which happen to be good at it. Israel has always qualified as a threat on both accounts. By the same criteria, the U.S.A. is a serious counterintelligence threat to just about everyone else (if nothing else for our unparalleled signals intelligence capability).

aquart wrote:
China not a problem, though?
Only when we hand them the occasional spy plane.

On edit: Fixed spacing issues.
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Radius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 09:43 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Lee
I would like to see this person get the same consideration a egyptian muslim or indian sikh(sp).

This could be wery big or could be a wen ho lee type thing. I would hate to see someone who was innocent of espionage get massacared in the press, if they don't deserve it.
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AngryWhiteLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:05 AM
Response to Original message
4. Radical Jews in the Pentagon supporting Israel over US. What a shock!
Wolfashitz and his radical jewish gang in the PNAC have been supporting Israel's agenda over U.S. interests for YEARS! It is really any surprise that we're seeing the crows coming home to roost on their TREASON!

JB
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Radius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Proceed with caution
CNN and FBI said the evidence may not even support an indictment.
http://robots.cnn.com/2004/US/08/28/fbi.spy/index.html

Be careful painting all the jews in the pentagon as radical. Some have been there for years.

There are Egyptians and and Saudis who work there too.

It is up to the press and us (the people) to give this the same reaction if a muslim had been accused.

Wen ho lee and the imam lee cases that turned out to be unfounded are cases of jumping the gun and ruining people.

BTW the most damaging cold war agent (publicly acknowledged) was a Catholic, white American.
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AngryWhiteLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:33 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. Yeah. How convenient that evidence will "not even support indictment"...
Edited on Sun Aug-29-04 10:36 AM by AngryWhiteLiberal
GIVING A TOP SECRET PRESIDENTIAL DIRECTIVE DRAFT TO A PRO-ISRAELI LOBBY ORGANIZATION WHO THEN GIVES IT TO ISRAEL IS AN ACT OF TREASON.

Believe what you want, but the PNAC group and the radical pro-Israeli wing of the Pentagon are staffed by RADICAL JEWS. It's undeniable that we have been thrust into the Middle East (a la Iraq Invasion) on the behest of Israel and U.S. oil greed.

I have nothing against jews in general, but those who pledge a greater allegiance to Israel than the U.S. are suspect...just as any other group pledging greater allegiance to their purported homeland. If you are a U.S. citizen living in the U.S., your allegiance should be to AMERICA first and foremost.

It's funny how we heard years of Clinton/Gore and backdoor support of China, but now all the sudden it is forbidden to even consider that Bush/Cheney would have similar (if not worse) relations with Israel.

JB
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Must_B_Free Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #9
18. What is the actual term for this?
"any other group pledging greater allegiance to their purported homeland."

In America what is this called and where is the line drawn? Do we have a cword for this? Is there terminology and any legal jurisdiction?

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AngryWhiteLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #18
21. Maybe "inland dwelling expatriates" or "hypocritical squatters"
My question would be to these ill named folks, "why aren't you living in the country that you love more than the country in which you are currently dwelling?" "Do you not believe in practicing what you preach or are your allegiances split? "Are you a hypocrite"

JB
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Radius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #9
23. Apples Oranges
China and Israel are not comparable.

A federal indictment is the minimun standard that should be used before someone is even considered an agent publicly. Right now there is no indictment.

He may be guilty he may not, but this is America and he does have to be proven guilty.
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Malva Zebrina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:22 AM
Response to Original message
6. 968 of our troops dead--they were Americans--has that fact been lost here?
Edited on Sun Aug-29-04 10:25 AM by Marianne
American kids--the ones from Kansas, the ones from Oklahoma, the ones from Maine and Arkasas and the ones from all over the United States. AMERICANS And they were betrayed by--who?




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Radius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. just saying
Don't jump to conclusions. Wen ho lee and Imam Yee were examples of men destroyed in the press by accusations that never panned out.

I hate press attacks on individuals, they are one sided and when they are wrong the retraction is on a26 or not at all.
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Malva Zebrina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:29 AM
Original message
did my post get up there while I was editing?
I removed the wen ho lee part.

Yes, It is up to us to get all the information we can about the office of the OSP, the PNAC, Wolfowitz et al who are known Jewish Zionists, and all of the connections we can find to Israeli government that we can. Including all publications from foreign sources. I say all of us, including the apologists for the Likud party and Sharon. If we post it, we are not jumping to conclusions. If we post it we are not in some conspiracy against Jews.
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Radius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:39 AM
Response to Original message
11. My comment
Edited on Sun Aug-29-04 10:40 AM by Radius
Wasn't just for jews. The press loves to latch on to someone and destroy them, it sells.

Richard Jewel is an example of someone who had no political connections. The press tried him for the olympic bombing, turned out he had nothing to do with out. The retractions were buried or never happened at all.

BTW we spy on Israel, GB, and the EU. Basically we spy on everyone. They all spy back, or at least try. This is no surprise, IF it turns out to be true.

EDIT: Everyone in Israel serves in the millitary, mandatory.
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AngryWhiteLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:43 AM
Response to Original message
12. Thank you. I'm sick of knee jerk anti-semitic accusations on this board
If someone is a radical Zionist Jew, then they are a RADICAL ZIONIST JEW.

Being jewish does not insulate an individual from FACTUAL criticism and "turning the spotlight" on TREASONOUS BEHAVIOR.

We are all mindful of what the Jews went through during WWII and throughout history and are sensitive to the community's concerns, so please can the knee jerk anti-semitism accusations.

JB
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Radius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Misunderstood
Like I said, not about jews. The same standard should be applied to muslims, Buddhists, or anyone else.

The press loves to latch onto people. It sells.

Treason is a federal charge, the government has not even indicted, never mind convicted anyone. If I accuse you of a crime in public I should back it up. My point, withhold judgment until the facts are out.

If they had just trotted out an Egyptian muslim the press would be doing the same thing.
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AngryWhiteLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. And, do you think that the lack of an indictment means a lack of guilt?
There's the law and then there's justice...unfortunately, these two things are often not synonymous.

If there's a chance to reduce the embarrassment on the Pentagon and Bush's Administration by moving from indictment to "lesser charge or no charge," do you really think that this won't happen?

You want to place faith in the system and reserve judgment, which with another Administration would be reasonable. Sadly, I don't think we can trust the Bushies to let the process proceed towards justice.

JB
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Radius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. Federal Judges
Have existed befor Bush. The standards for a prima facia case for treason have been around a while. The FBI and DOJ do not like spies and will destroy this person if they are guilty, jew, christian,what ever.

My point is that I will not draw a conclusion on this until it settles and more information is released.

I trust the federal courts (judicial branch)with this, the executive branch has no jurisdiction here.
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AngryWhiteLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 11:18 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. Federal Bench in the VA district where this will be tried is CONSERVATIVE
True, the Executive Branch has no "direct" influence, but the Federal Court district covering Wash. is known to be conservative...

JB
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Radius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #17
20. Conservative
Is not bush controlled. They have to follow the law as it is written. Conservative judges do not like making new law, or changing the rules as they stand. The bottom line is judges have to follow the law.

The 9th circuit in SF is an example as a liberal court, they are continually trying to legislate from the bench and are usually overturned in the supreme ct.

Conservative and Liberal in the judicial branch are different than the same terms applied to executive or legislative branches.
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question everything Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. Being a "radical Zionist Jew" does not mean that one is a traitor
Just as being a radical Islamic Jihadist does not make one a murderer, or being a radical white supremacist does not make one a terrorist.

If the man is guilty, by all mean punish him. But drawing a wide brush about "RADICAL ZIONIST JEW" does mean anti-semitism and anti-Zionism which, I suppose, many here would like to have as part of the liberal agenda.
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AngryWhiteLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. Whatever...thanks for proving my point.
If you are a SPY for Israel working with a KNOWN group of radical Zionist Jews, then I guess that's a pretty select group of people...not a broadbrush painting of a whole race.

Get a grip and try not to let your own personal beliefs and allegiances get in the way of the cold HARD FACTS.

JB
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Radius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #19
22. And thanks for proving mine..
Edited on Sun Aug-29-04 11:44 AM by Radius
There is no cold fact yet. There is only speculation in the press. Until he is indicted by a grand jury this is all sound and fury..

edit: fix type-o
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thebigidea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. yeah, especially individuals as loveable as the Neocon crowd
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Radius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-29-04 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. All Jews? Mighty Broad Brush(NT)
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thebigidea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-30-04 05:22 AM
Response to Reply #10
24. I didn't say a thing about "all Jews" - you did. Put down the brush.
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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-30-04 05:42 AM
Response to Original message
25. Hmmm,...there's sure some weird sh*t going on at the Pentagon. n/t
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