One by One, Iraq cities become No-Go Zones

[annxburns]

While Bush is exploiting 9/11 - missing is the fact that he is "losing" the war in Iraq. Iraq will soon become a fundamentalist regime like Iran, and Bush will be responsible for it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/05/weekinreview/05filk.html?hp

[manic expression]

1. probably not like Iran...

because of the different ethnic and religious groups, Iraq will probably become fractured into different regions. Civil strife is a probability, as well.

[annxburns]

2. Yes, your right ...

the majority of Shites will probably go with a Islamic regime. Sunnis will probably fight back and the Kurds will attempt to break off.

I especially shook my head at the line in the article that said places like Falluja were becoming havens for terrorists - Bush said Iraq was harboring terrrorists, it wasn't true then, but it is now.

[DeepModem Mom]

3. Hello, American "liberal" media -- we are losing Iraq. NYT...

is practicing journalism here. Where's the rest of our media, who call themselves journalists, especially TV? Where's the "most trusted news source"? This adventure cost American taxpayers billions, and, so far, a thousand lives, and we're losing it. Not a story?

[barb162]

4. hey, flyboy on the aircraft carrier said we won

and that means we won. Who cares if people are dying there, pipelines are being blown up, there may be civil war, terroists are being recruited, created, etc.

One of my favorite pictures is of him in that flightsuit STRUTTING on that carrier off San Diego. That STRUT!!! Mr Boffo all the way.

[Lizzie Borden]

5. Yeah, sure reminded me

of a cocky little Bantam rooster.

[catmandu57]

6. Whack a mole

You want the cities? okay we'll blow up the pipelines. You want the pipelines? we'll kill americans in the cities.
It doesn't take a super computer to figure out that we're stuck in gumbo here, makes you want to scream.

[pfitz59]

20. Perfect connection.....whack a mole!

Our brave leaders are doing it by proxy! "Insurgent moles" have the upper hand, its their HOMELAND they're defending. We can never "win", notby any reasonable standard.....

[necso]

7. And trying to take those cities "back"

will look like Najaf... or Hue.

And one just might want heavy weapons to do so.

So what was this talk about moving to lighter forces again?

Wasn't that the plan when we weren't going to get into messes like this, or say, the ones in Iran or NK that are looming?

Oh, and speaking of Najaf, has anybody googled the news recently?

Just beating our heads against the wall, I guess.

[quaoar]

8. Does anyone remember Fallujah?

That's the city where even the Marines won't go now, where American collaborators are beheaded and videos of the execution are sold on the street.

What kind of hell on earth has that place become?

[anarchy1999]

12. The hell I predicted in April of 2003 when our troops fired upon protest.

All they wanted that day was for the troops to remove themselves from the school where they had set themselves up. They just wanted their kids to be able to go to school. Many dead and many more wounded that day.

That day I predicted to my sweetheart that before it was over, Fallujah would be wiped out.

[anarchy1999]

19. Deserves a kick up to the top.

more people need to know and a serious discusssion needs to take place. IMHO. Sorry.

[realFedUp]

9. don't really control most parts of Afghanistan either...

warlords, burkas and opium oh my....

[rustydog]

13. America (Karzai) controls only Kabul...the rest is in chaos

That is why the joke title for Karzai is "the mayor of kabul"
not president of afghanistan.

[Pastiche423]

10. "Leave us alone, and we will sort our own problems"

Such a simple solution.

Well, if the neocons din't want to steal their oil, it would be.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

17. Short. Sweet. And spot on.

[girl gone mad]

11. Kick.

This should be getting more attention, IMO.

From the article:

The calls are rising for the Americans to pull out of even more areas, notably Sadr City, the sprawling neighborhood in eastern Baghdad that is the main base for the rebel cleric Moktada al-Sadr. There, leaders of his Mahdi Army are demanding that American soldiers, except those sent in to do reconstruction work, get out.

Negotiations with rebel leaders foundered last week on precisely the issue of the freedom of American soldiers to enter the area; the Iraqi government, possibly with American backing, refused to accept the militia's demand. Even so, the point seemed clear enough: where Iraqis once tolerated American soldiers as a source of stability in their neighborhoods, they increasingly see them as a cause of the violence. Take out the Americans, the Iraqis say, and you take out the problem. Leave us alone, and we will sort our own problems.

...

In places like Falluja, Samarra and Ramadi, on the other hand, the Americans and the Iraqi government appear to have forfeited their influence. Residents of all three places say insurgents are in charge.

Falluja, for instance, has become a haven for insurgents and terrorists, including, the Americans believe, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the Jordanian thought to be responsible for a number of car bombings that have killed hundreds of civilians. In Falluja, the insurgents are free to carry out their own brand of justice, like the public lashings of people suspected of theft and rape, and the videotaped beheading last month of Suleiman Mar'awi, one of the city's National Guard commanders.

...

Most significant of all, the withdrawal from these cities calls into question the practicality of nationwide elections scheduled to take place before the end of January. At the moment, the Americans appear to be prepared to hold elections without cities like Falluja and Ramadi. But excluding the largely Sunni Arab areas from the elections would raise serious doubts about their legitimacy. Already, one of the country's leading Sunni groups, the Sunni Clerics Association, boycotted the selection of the National Council, which serves as a de facto Parliament here.

[Disturbed]

15. Will al Sistani...

stop being a pacifist and call for a mass uprising?

Al Sistani is the unofficial leader of Iraq. He has the power to end the Occupation. Will he step up?

[PATRICK]

16. How about a pacifist uprising

and deny the occupation anything without fighting? Of course there will still be violence and collaborators but the situation is particularly vulnerable to passive resistance. First they have little to lose from the unproductive reconstruction efforts. They can actually swallow up the violence just as Sistani has rescued and overwhelmed Sadr.

Does it occur to their mindset? Do they even want to? I think they are still tempted by the carrot of waiting Bushco out and getting power as the majority fairly.

If I were them I would ditch that last idea real fast. People are dying for nothing over there and the Americans cannot even neutralize the Sunni
resistance which would make Sistani a lot more comfortable.

Meanwhile Bushco is crippled into playing the situation for the American political scene. A nneither fish nor fowl strategy that is weirdly unrtelated to Iraq as Iraq. The Occupation may never be so vulnerable again and the march on Shia Iran is stubbornly going ahead unabated.

[paulk]

23. no, Sistani wants an election

he doesn't want a civil war any more than the coalition. In that regard, he the occupation is ok with him - up to a point.

Sistani believes that the 1920 Shi'ite revolt against the British occupation is what lead to the British backing of the Sunni, and hence the Sunni domination of the country. With the Americans being the predominant military presence in Iraq, he's not going to make the same mistake twice - he won't alienate the Americans by leading a revolt - he wants to make sure the Shi'ites, because of their majority, get their rightful place in Iraq this time around.

It's why he hasn't wholeheartingly backed Sadr's uprising.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

14. Bill Mahr said essentially the same thing on his show Friday

I think it repeats several times this week for those of you who haven't seen it.

[goforit]

18. You mean Bush and Cheney are loosing this war????

No mission accomplished , eh???

[AtTheEndOfTheDay]

22. No, losing.

[grasswire]

21. look at this!

"At the moment, the Americans appear to be prepared to hold elections without cities like Falluja and Ramadi. But excluding the largely Sunni Arab areas from the elections would raise serious doubts about their legitimacy."

A national election excluding whole cities?

Pay attention, America. Cue Jimmy Carter.

[Gloria]

24. CNN just reported about the 7 killed today...and added that

Fallujah is no longer under our control and is now a base for building bombs and launching attacks......I never watch CNN, so I was surprised to see them admit it....have they been characterizing Fallujah in those terms before now?