Text of memos on Bush's Guard service

[Zorra]

Bwaaaahaaaahaaaahaaaa!

The Associated Press
Originally published September 9, 2004

19 May 1972
Memo to File
SUBJECT: Discussion with Bush, 1st Lt. Bush

2. Physical. We talked about him getting his flight physical situation fixed before his date. Says he will do that in Alabama if he stays in a flight status. He has this campaign to do and other things that will follow and may not have the time. I advised him of our investment in him and his commitment. He's been working with staff to come up with options and identified a unit that may accept him. I told him I had to have written acceptance before he would be transferred, but think he's also talking to someone upstairs.
snip
MEMORANDUM FOR RECORD
SUBJECT: Bush, George W. 1st Lt. 3244754FG
Suspension of Flight status

1. On this date I ordered that 1st Lt. Bush be suspended from flight status due to failure to perform to USAF/TexANG standards and failure to meet annual physical examination (flight) as ordered.
snip----

1. Staudt has obviously pressured Hodges more about Bush. I'm having trouble running interference and doing my job. Harris gave me a message today from Grp regarding Bush's OETR and Staudt is pushing to sugar coat it. Bush wasn't here during rating period and I don't have any feedback from 187th in Alabama. I will not rate. Austin is not happy today either.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/elections/bal-memotext0909,1,3440219.story?coll=bal-election-headlines

[antigone382]

1. Obviously John Kerry forged these memos in 1972

So that he could use them against GWB in the 2004 election.

(sarcasm off)

[Bunny]

2. It was a pretty clever ploy, wasn't it?

That Kerry is a wily little bugger, isn't he? (sarcasm also off!)

[City Lights]

3. And Ben Barnes parted the waters of TANG to make room

for chimpy to prevent him from having the chance to dodge grenades in Vietnam, thereby denying him the opportunity to earn a chest full of medals. Damn that Barnes!

[Drifter]

4. Actually ...

there is compelling information about the forgery of these documents. I'm not saying I believe it, but it does raise some questions.

The argument, is that the type face (font) used in these documents did not exist (or was not widely available) at the time that these documents were to have been created.

The font used is a proportional font (which means that all the letters are not the same size, like on a typewriter, which would have been used). Proportional fonts at that time was only available on very expensive printing equipment.

The advent of proportional fonts did not hit the mainstream until much later with computers and word processing programs.

What I would like to see is an explanation as to why these documents are proportionally spaced. Also, I would be interested in seeing other documents from that era to see it the font matches.

I also find the verbiage a little too convenient, since it is assumed that these documents are seeing the light for the very first time.

Thoughts?

Cheers
Drifter

[City Lights]

5. Font discussion is here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=2329624

[Zorra]

27. These memos are genuine. Don't let freepers frame the debate.

They are making up this forgery crap because they have to - the facts are right in their face. There is absolutely no evidence that these memos are not the genuine article, and the discussion ends right there.

The freeps can piss and moan all they want, the stark facts speak for themselves.

[lumpy]

6. The memos have been authenticated.

Pure Bushwah.

[SierraMtns]

7. authenticated by whom?

Do we know the source of these documents? Who passed them to CBS?

[Walt Starr]

8. From what I understand, they came from TANG microfiche

So, the TANG authenticated them.

[SierraMtns]

9. Hopefully but...

That would require a TANG spoksperson to authenticate their release to the public. Do we have this yet or is CBS keeping its source secret?

[jamesinca]

11. Would it fall under the FOIA the the AP filed

Is there a source that CBS needs to protect in that case?

[Zorra]

19. Don't worry, they are the real thing. And they are simply just backup to

all the other records that prove Bu$h was AWOL and a DESERTER.

[Bridget Burke]

16. Ask the White House

They released the same documents after the TV show.

[yardwork]

12. Have you seen the original document?

How do you know that they are in proportional type?

[jtjathomps]

13. because an 'i' is narrower than the 'w' / NT

[Qutzupalotl]

17. The IBM Selectric Composer came out in 1966

and had proportional type.
http://www.etypewriters.com/history.htm

[jtjathomps]

18. True, but no superscript or slanted single quote.... /NT

[truth2power]

40. Look at a separate document, here

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x815249#815734

Superscript in second line.

[jtjathomps]

43. ok granted. what about the single curly quote? I would like to believe

the proportional spacing both up and down and left and right, and the 13 point line spacing? Believe me, I want to believe, but I cant. My family has been in the printing business for ages... and I cant ignore what I see.

[Qutzupalotl]

46. look at this.

The line spacing doesn't match Word's default settings. The word "now" at the end of paragraph 1 would be on the line above it using Word's defaults. The fonts are different, especially the capital Y and lowercase i. The superscript in Word is lower.

[jtjathomps]

50. screen fonts vs printed fonts.

I saw this too, but if you PRINT it -- it matches. If you do a screen capture it does not... This has been discussed at length elsewhere.

[mbperrin]

49. I've been printing since 1967, and this is the work of an

IBM Executive typewriter, introduced in 1941:

http://www-1.ibm.com/ibm/history/history/year_1941.html

"IBM announces the Electromatic Model 04 electric typewriter, featuring the revolutionary concept of proportional spacing. By assigning varied rather than uniform spacing to different sized characters, the Type 4 recreated the appearance of a printed page, an effect that was further enhanced by a typewriter ribbon innovation that produced clearer, sharper words on the page. The proportional spacing feature became a staple of the IBM Executive series typewriters. "

Find one - it's easy, they sold many of them all through the 40s,50s, 60s, and 70s. Your curly apostrophe, proportional spacing and all are right there.

[jtjathomps]

51. ok I buy it

if it has the superscript th, and 13 point line spacing. thanks.

[RadioFlyer]

22. The PDFs are on the CBS website

I also noticed that the apostrophe on the CYA memo is a curly quote. I used Selectrics back then, and do not recall anything but straight quotes and apostrophes. Anyone have any experience with the IBM Executive or Selectric with curly quotes?

[Chico Man]

31. Type the memo into Microsoft Word

The similarities are astounding.

The purpose of this memo (that I am most certain is not authentic) goes much deeper , I am afraid..

[manteuffel1]

37. Just what are you suggesting?

[question everything]

41. Also the apostrophe is "curled" and the superscripts

are those of the word processing age - so they say.

I wouldn't know one way or the other.

[wkirby]

10. It's amazing that . . .

we're electing someone to be our President and he directly ignored orders. Simply amazing.

-Will

[0rganism]

14. rightwingers will point out....

...that this just means he's better at giving orders than taking them.

[Frodo]

15. Don't get yer panties in a wad yet Kirby

We ain't "elected" him yet!

[hurley]

20. well.......

Charles Johnson took the time to figure all of this out;

(Courtesy LGF's)

This is the pdf of the "original document from the CBS website


This is the same words typed into microsonft word , with no alterations.


This is the two images superimposed over each other.






There is no way a 1973 typewriter of ANY type would match EACTLY the same text auto formatted in mocrosift word.

The document is a fake.

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/

[hurley]

21. bump

*bump*

[RadioFlyer]

23. I saw that

And I also find it very coincidental that the line breaks happen at exactly the default Microsoft word wrap points.

[hurley]

24. .

yup. Its a fake.

[Qutzupalotl]

48. Nope. YOU ARE A FAKE!

:bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

[Spazito]

25. Here is a typewriter that could...

http://www.ibmcomposer.org/SelComposer/description.htm

(with thanks to LuminousX for this link)

and another on the IBM Composer

http://www.etypewriters.com/history.htm

It was out in 1966

[Chico Man]

26. I think you may be correct

I typed the document into my Microsoft word program and the similarities were just too good. The th, the line breaks, everything about them lines up, as you describe, exactly.

Why the hell did the White House release the documents?

So they could disprove them? That would surely be about the most f'd up thing I've ever heard.

This is a testament to US politics today and makes me nauseous. Are we beyond hope? Is there ANYONE we can trust?

Politicians (and politics for that matter) suck more and more every day. I'm fed up with this shit.

[Zorra]

28. Horseshit. Nice try. LOL.

CBS stood by its reporting. "As a standard practice at CBS, each of the documents broadcast on "60 Minutes" was thoroughly investigated by independent experts and we are convinced of their authenticity," CBS News said in a statement.

http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/mld/ledgerenquirer/news/politics/9622425.htm

[Demit]

39. Isn't anyone seeing the lines of type that are crooked?

The date line and the "Memo to File" are not sitting on a perfectly horizontal baseline. (Compare it to the body copy.) That simply can't happen in computer-generated copy. Happened on typewriters, and when pasteup artists made mistakes, but doesn't happen in computers--even in Microsoft Word! (I'm a Mac person.)

It's driving me crazy that no one has pointed that out.

Look at the overlay example. It doesn't match exactly. Exactly would be exactly.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

42. Posting this all over the place, are you?

Again, your source has as much validity as Drudge or FR.

:eyes:

[Qutzupalotl]

47. Wrong.

Use the full resolution in the CBS document and you'll see the differences.

[Gold Metal Flake]

29. Can you think of no-one who would benefit from these forgeries?

Rove likes to attack the strengths of his opponents.

The AWOL issue is a strength of the Dems.

Forged docs make strength go poof.

Repug weakness becomes it's strength.

Feeling punked yet?

[Chico Man]

30. Most definetly (eom)

[Disturbed]

32. Repubs will repeat faked docs...

ad nauseum but it won't change the fact that the GW Bush did not serve honorably, that he is a liar and a fraud. More info will surface and the Repubs will do anything and everything they can to get away from this topic.

[bagnana]

33. CBS has verified them. The WH passed them

on w/out questioning. There is no question the guy didn't show up for his physical examination. The guy was AWOL. So what do these memos have to do with anything? They only "prove" a known fact. He didn't show up in Alabama. He didn't show up for his physical examination. He pulled strings to get into the National Guard, then he went awol from his unit, but still managed to finagle an hnorable discharge. Even he isn't disputing this. He merely says "I received an honorable discharge so that means I served honorably."

[Gold Metal Flake]

34. Well, this looks like a second source...

...which is good!


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x780217

[Chico Man]

35. I agree with you

I just do not understand why the documents seem to have been written using Microsoft Word.

[manteuffel1]

36. Probably MS Worded later

IF the memos were typed in MS Word, it's probable they were handwritten first (in 1972-73) and then "digitalized" later. This is a no-go story.

[Citizen Daryl]

38. Good point, perhaps the originals were degraded or damaged ...

... to such an extent that they would not microfilm properly.

[Carla in Ca]

44. Karl Rove had the documents forged

n/t

[Jane Eyre]

45. I'm not convinced that Word was used

The letters don't line up evenly at the bottom. That is a characteristic of a mechanical typing process that word processing smoothed over.

That said, the documents could be forgeries even if a 70's style typewriter was used. If you were going to produce an authentic forgery of a 1972-73 document that you wanted CBS and the American public to buy into, wouldn't you go to Ebay and buy a working IBM Selectric first? What idiot would use a word processing program to forge a 1972 document, and what reputable news agency would present these documents as legitimate without doing a whole lot of forensic examination and fact-checking first?

Either CBS was set up by Karl Rove's gang, who did a lot of work forging authentic-looking documents handed over to CBS by conveniently confidential sources that CBS will not reveal, or these documents are indeed real but the right-wing media has found a convenient way to deflect the story away from the damaging information contained in the documents.

Sadly, the story being repeated over and over today on all the news channels is the possible forgery of the documents and not Lt. Gov. Barnes' statement that he got the unqualified Bush Jr. into the National Guard as a favor for his dad.