LAT: Democrats Split on Bush Guard Story

[kskiska]

Some see rough justice after attacks on Kerry’s Vietnam-era record and welcome a comparison, but others say it distracts from pressing issues.

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The renewed controversy over President Bush's National Guard service has opened a fresh divide in the presidential contest — among Democrats who disputed the wisdom of keeping the 3-decade-old story alive.

Many partisans relish the sight of the White House and Bush aides struggling to answer long-ago questions about Vietnam, after watching Sen. John F. Kerry being forced to defend his combat duty and subsequent antiwar activism.

"If you're going to have Swift Boat Veterans for Truth running around out there on the loose, it's only fair to have Texans for Truth running around out there on the loose," said Bill Carrick, a Democratic strategist, referring to the groups behind anti-Kerry and anti-Bush TV spots, respectively.

But others worry that the fracas over Bush's service is distracting Democrats and voters alike from more consequential issues, hurting Kerry in the process.

more…
http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/2004/la-na-guardpols12sep12,1,4507250.story?coll=la-home-headlines

[swag]

1. I side with both camps

[otohara]

2. Yeah, Don't Be Pussies

that's what they expect and if Bush's numbers went up after that hatefest they threw in NYC - then I say spit toads back at them.

[JoFerret]

3. Fine. Just fine

...and it won't stop either side from voting Bush out.

[Voltaire99]

4. Revealed: Centrists in another tug of war. . .with their own minds!

Right-Leaning Centrist Lobe: "Eek! Should we be tough on Bush?"

Left-Leaning Centrist Lobe: "Yeah, but not *too* tough!"

Centrist Central Brain Control: "You both have fine points, and I'll have to spend the next few months thinking them over."

[fearnobush]

5. As I recall, Many republicans too were worrried that the SBVT stuff

would hurt Bush. If any Dems want to keep their job, they unfortunately have to fight dirty like the Repukes.

[JoFerret]

7. The difference is....Bush AWOL is documented and TRUE.

But you are right that some decent republicans (I know, a bit of a stretch that oxymoron) were dismayed at the lying Rovian sleaze of the Smear Boaters and thought it would have a backlash effect. It may have had among certain types of voters.

[truthisfreedom]

6. do everything, all the time. Kerry has enough advisors and certainly

enough volunteers to keep everything going on all fronts at once. who cares if we are divided... there's enough of us to keep the momentum on all fronts going full bore for the next 7 weeks... WE ARE THE MAJORITY.

[goclark]

13. Yes,keep um batting at THE TRUTH

We are allowing them to continue to tell LIES about us.

They are still framing the debate. It is now entirely fixed. Other than Dan Rather, and they are framing that one as if he is totally crazy,there is not a soul with a BIG VOICE that is speaking for us.

They need one solid James Carville that gets on the news and socks them with the TRUTH.

John Kerry, IMO, has been much more direct and forceful in the last two weeks. I can notice the improvement of his message but they are NOT letting his message get out.

Immediately after he says anything,they have 5 rethugs beating it down. Without the media,they know we are in a tail spin.


I woke up this morning to NOTHING being positive said about Kerry.
On MSNBC they just had two Rethugs views on and no one to discuss Kerry...""Kerry is losing," "Bush tells it like it is" from Pat Buchanan and on and on.

I was talking with a Democrat/friend yesterday. He said,"we shouldn't talk about Bush and call him a LIER because " they will get mad at us!"

So what! We are mad as hell at them.
This is a WAR to the Ballot Box and our opponents have decided that they want to fight dirty. Let's RUMBLE!!!!!!

No more of this Mr. Nice Guy stuff! No more.
:mad:
With all this said, I still believe that we will win. I believe that the TRUTH will set us free this time. I believe that the real people and the numbers of new voters are on our side. But we must fight like hell to win this one. Let's Rumble!

[w4rma]

8. JUST DO IT! Quit analyzing it. (nt)

[Guaranteed]

9. Exactly. WAY too much thinking, here, folks.

Your first reaction to the Smear Vets- which should be to INCINERATE Bush's character- is the correct one.

Hit em back, hard.

[Piperay]

10. I think it is a distraction but

the media has the final say on what they are going to cover and they like controversy. :shrug:

[Guaranteed]

11. Yes.

In other words, the media doesn't cover the issues anymore, because they don't get ratings.

So, if we're going to bludgeon Bush, we have to do it in a way that's going to get some attention. I think it did the trick.

[slojim240]

12. If God couldn't fine ten honest, righteous men on earth, how do we expect

to find one?

[robbedvoter]

14. I vote for TRUTH - past AND present - can we handle that?

Expose old lies, new lies - what's the big deal here?
The National Guard story is not some sort of personal revenge, it' goes to the heart of all the macho image," he says what he means " BS image they constructed on their little fascist. It has to be punctured in as many pointa as possible. Can we manage MORE than one talking point?

[inmania]

15. US News jumps into the fray

This story has potential to be huge - it undercuts one of the WH central arguments, that Bush should be judged on whether he attended enough drills.

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/issue/040920/usnews/20guard.htm

[Gloria]

16. It doesn't have to distract from issues...because it IS an issue that

should be incorporated into questions about Bush's character and CREDIBLITY as a "leader" which seems to be the point B/C are running on!!

Throw in what Clark said at Johns Hopkins on Thursday...that it's a choice been continuuing war as the foreign policy of choice vs all the other tools, with war as a last resort...mainly, it's PNAC, stupid vs.
sanity; clarifying the vote for IWR authority; and hammering Bush creciblity, and you have a campaign.

To add spice, hit the Saudi ties a la Graham and Bushco back to BCCI and tie it all up.

I just get the feeling that "broad stroke" politicking isn't the answer--we need a few key points to hammer, concrete stuff...Forget the
"American Can Do Better" it's so wishy washy...........

[leesa]

17. LA Times....once again making it appear as though the Dems are divided and

weak. Every time, their headline touts problems for Dems no matter what the content of the article is about. LA Times SUCKS...pure shill for the GOP.

[DemoTex]

18. Just because we wimped-out on AWOL in 2000 is no reason to do it again.

Show strength. Go for the throat. The truth to this story should have ruined Bu$h years ago.

[AnnInLa]

19. Everyone agrees, "Negative Campaigning Works"

In EVERY discussion by the "talking heads" about the Swift Boat Crap, they all agreed on that point: Negative campaigning works.

We know that it worked against Dukakis, McCain, Cleland, and to some extent, Kerry.

If the repugs find a method that works, why would they stop? Because the Dems stop? Nonsense. Now that is has been proved that it works, they will continue to work it on the national, state and local levels.

It won't stop until Dems fight back, fire with fire. Why would they give up a proven method? EVEN IF WE DON'T WIN THE PRESIDENCY THIS YEAR, we must continue to fight fire with fire, or we will cease to exist as a separate, Democratic party. The one true aim of rove is to have a one-party America, with the Dems as only a token party.

Why in the hell wouldn't we fight to stay alive?

[Kimber Scott]

20. Difference between us and them. They pick a story and stick to it,

whether it's true, or not. We debate the intracacies of every situation. It's like, if we were playing a game of football, they'd be crushing us, while we checked to see if the ball was the right shape.

[IndianaGreen]

21. When it comes to Vietnam, even Tom Harkin also lied about his record!

Only last week, voters were treated to the spectacle of Kerry point man and Iowa Senator Tom Harkin fulminating about the Swift Vets' ads. Yet Harkin is himself an exposed fabulist, having once claimed to have jousted in his F-4 Phantom with North Vietnamese MiGs.

The truth? He never saw combat, spent his war ferrying military planes from Japan to the Philippines for routine servicing, and apologized for his fictions when subsequently exposed by fellow Senator Barry Goldwater.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5797120/

I am sick of hearing about Vietnam! I hated that war. There was nothing heroic or noble about a war in which a superpower bombs a third world country back to the Stone Age. America's role in Vietnam was as disgraceful and criminal as the French role in Algeria and Indochina, or the British in the Middle East, or the German military in World War II.