WP: Document Experts Say They Warned CBS of Doubts

[RamboLiberal]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A21675-2004Sep14?language=printer

A document expert retained by CBS News for the disputed "60 Minutes" story on President Bush's National Guard record said yesterday that she had warned the program that the memos involved "had problems" and that she had questioned "whether they were produced on a computer."

Asked whether CBS had taken her concerns seriously, Linda James, a forensic document examiner in Texas, told The Washington Post: "Evidently not."

A second document expert, Emily Will, told ABC News correspondent Brian Ross that she had cautioned CBS in writing that there were "significant" problems with the documents, which were used in a "60 Minutes" broadcast last Wednesday as evidence that Bush received favorable treatment while he was in the Texas Air National Guard.

"I told them that all the questions I was asking them on Tuesday night, they were going to be asked by hundreds of other document examiners on Thursday if they ran that story," Will told ABC. A third document consultant, Marcel Matley, told The Post on Monday that although he vouched for the signature of Bush's former squadron commander, the late Lt. Col. Jerry B. Killian, there was "no way" he could authenticate Killian's purported memos because they were copies.

[PROGRESSIVE1]

1. Discredit this post. The article is by Howie "Ho" KKKurtz!!!

:puke:

:grr:

[IndianaGreen]

13. Read it and weep!

Kurtz is not the only one that has punched holes in CBS's credibility large enough to drive a semi through it.

Dan Rather did not check out the story properly, and he has now become the story. Two cardinal sins of journalism!

[Jim Sagle]

24. Chickenshit bullshit. Rather RAWWWWWWWWWKSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!

[Media_Lies_Daily]

33. Kurtz has been a lying sack of shit for as long as he's worked at the....

...Washington Post. His show, "Reliable Sources" is VERY far from reliable, to say the least.

[liberalmuse]

2. To hell with the memos!

I'd like to see the goddamned media focus on Bush's CURRENT record. (Which is only a continuation of his past record.)

[Mace]

37. I agree

It's taking way to much time away from the real issues.. like health care and the war in Iraq.

There was an explosion in baghdad and it was barely reported on the tv.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

3. Right. So CBS News presses ahead knowing that the documents...

...were forgeries? I don't think so.

I bet for every one of the experts noted in the WP article, CBS has at least five stating that the documents are real.

FratBoy could settle this question once and for all, but he's gone AWOL again. Besides, nobody believes a word he says anyway.

[Obamarama]

4. "...a forensic document examiner in TEXAS..."

What more do we need to know?!

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

22. How about one from North Carolina?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x827466

A pattern evolving? :shrug:

[jdj]

31. For what it's worth (from opensecrets.org)

JAMES, LINDA
PALESTINE,TX 75801
4/9/1999
$500
Bush, George W

this is for the 2000 cycle, it's such a common name, but it could be her.

[KoKo]

5. Howie the Whore is very busy with this story. He was on with Blitzer

late today, and I guess he and his wife the Repug Op Sheri Annis are burning the midnight oil talking to Rove about what the next step is..

[DBtv]

6. Stop wasting bandwidth with this publican bullshit propaganda!

Thanks for helping busholini destroy America.

[RamboLiberal]

12. Don't beat up the poster - it's front page on the WP

For me the jury is still out on these memos - there are holes in them. And some media whores are out there pimping.

But if these memos surfaced and the name was Kerry, wouldn't we be trying to pick them apart.

Whatever, we still need the full intel on what is going on in the media.

Biggest outrage tonight was Zahn having Freeper on as a "document expert".

[DBtv]

16. Then leave it sitting there like the steaming pile it is.

If you need intel, choose one of the fifty other bullshit chicken little threads like this.

[RamboLiberal]

19. Because posting stuff here some of you pick up good stuff

See post below from girl gone mad. I think some DU'ers are acting like Freepers cause CBS may have been had.

Personally I think Rove set this all up! Let's dig that up!

[Media_Lies_Daily]

21. Personally, I think your opinion is out in left field.

[RamboLiberal]

26. Then hit ignore

eom

[Media_Lies_Daily]

34. Sorry, but I have the right to express my opinion, too....

You don't like it? Too bad.

[RamboLiberal]

40. And I expressed my opinion

At least you didn't accuse me of being in right field :evilgrin:

[girl gone mad]

7. There's nothing..

in the memos that is scandalous enough to warrant this level of hype over them being a possible forgery. So, what's all the fuss about?

Wonder if this is the same Linda:

JAMES, LINDA
PALESTINE, TX 75801 BUSH, GEORGE W (R)
President
BUSH FOR PRESIDENT INC. $500 04/09/99

http://www.newsmeat.com/fec/bystate_detail.php?st=TX&last=James&first=linda

[Justice]

8. Amazing

send that to the Washington Post.

[yardwork]

9. This article is already being discussed on another thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x827466

[readmylips]

10. Guy who wrote, Rove bush's Brain...said..

If the documents are a forgery, only Karl Rove would have put those papers out there. It is consistent with his trickery. In the 2000 campaign, Rove put out braking news, the same day of the first debate, of a tape sent to him of Gore's debate strategy. No one ever saw the tape because it was all a lie placed by Karl Rove to steal news time away from the debate. Rove has played many of the same tricks in the past.

Notice how the papers where put out there just when the Swifters were proven to be liars, and bush's ratings began to drop. Rove wanted to change the issue, but an issue that could be blamed on the democrats.

I hope CBS investigates and gets to the bottom because the trail will lead to Karl Rove and the White House.

[yardwork]

17. I remember when that happened

Rove made sure that BushCo got credit for being so "honest" in not using the tapes. It made BushCo look angelic and also suggested that some in the Gore camp were disloyal. It was a truly evil piece of garbage.

This time Rove messed up, though. Whether he faked the documents and leaked the response to his minions, or just leaked the response to his minions, the outcome has made the story bigger, not smaller.

Anything that keeps Georgie's TANG records in the news is bad for BushCo. They don't have anything good to tell about Georgie's service, because his service was shameful and the records, if they still exist, reflect that.

[Just Me]

11. This is WAR!!!

A WAR worth fighting!!!

A WAR for integrity and honesty and truth!!!!

FIGHT!!!

THIS IS A WAR THAT MUST BE WON!!!!

[IndianaGreen]

14. You got to have the facts on your side in order to win

CBS does not have the facts, the fell victim to a forger!

[yardwork]

18. Ah, but the facts ARE on our side

Our side being those who want the world to learn the truth about George W. Bush.

As Clinton said at the DNC, Democrats don't have to lie. The truth is on our side. It's the Republicans who have to lie because if people knew what they were really doing, nobody would vote for them.

Whether these particular documents are real or fake is not the issue. The issue is

WHERE WAS BUSH IN 1972 AND 1973 AND WHY CAN'T THE PENTAGON FIND HIS RECORDS?

[IndianaGreen]

Neither Vietnam nor Bush's adventures in TANG are relevant issues today!

Whether these particular documents are real or fake is not the issue. The issue is

WHERE WAS BUSH IN 1972 AND 1973 AND WHY CAN'T THE PENTAGON FIND HIS RECORDS?

The real issue is what Bush has done, or failed to do, since January 20, 2001. Everything else, from Vietnam to TANG, are totally irrelevant to the issues our country is facing today.

Now, if you guys want to consume all of your spare time talking about a criminal war that ended 35 years ago, Bush's adventures in the TANG, and Kitty Kelley's latest muckraking masterpiece, then be my guest. I will caution you that none of that will gain you one vote in November, and may in fact lose you some.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

23. No, it's your OPINION that CBS doesn't have the facts...

...and we all know what people say about opinions, don't we?

[TankLV]

27. CBS didn't fall for anything - the documents are REAL.

THEY ARE NOT FORGERIES!

We've all explained how they were done.

CBS stands by their story - that's good enough for me.

THE DOCUMENTS ARE REAL!

[IndianaGreen]

35. LTC Killian's secretary disputed the authenticity of the memos

in a breaking story in the Dallas Morning News, posted elsewhere in DU, and alluded to tonight by Keith Olbermann on his MSNBC show.

[TankLV]

36. And those of us with PERSONAL EXPERIENCE have proved otherwise - along

with CBS.

I'll trust my OWN EXPERIENCE and CBS over people with a political grudge.

DMN is just an opinion.

They haven't disproved ANYTHING!

[yardwork]

38. Um, no she didn't. I disagree with your assessment of what she said

She said that they didn't look like anything she had typed, BUT they reflected what people had been saying about W at TANG at the time.

The secretary just confirmed the truth of the documents.

[PurityOfEssence]

15. We have to vigorously investigate these documents and the methodology

First off, we're members of the goddam human race, and truth should mean something; otherwise, we're no better than primitive Republicans. Secondly, the Kerry Forgeries (if you haven't heard the term yet, you will if we back off) cannot be trumpeted repeatedly as further proof of Democratic criminality.

Thirdly, I believe that they're genuine; admittedly, I'm biased as hell, but the missed space after the three and the usage of both superscripted and non-superscripted "th"s fits the bill for a typewriter, not a word processor. Showing that we're also very concerned about the veracity of this is precisely what the Repubs don't expect: they're firmly convinced that we cave in at any sign of adversity.

The burden of proof when offering these documents is on us; we're the ones claiming they are what they purport to be. If, however, they start trumpeting (as their mouthpiece on "Crossfire" did today) that they've definitely fake, then that burden is on them. We would have little ground to demand them to prove their contention if we don't attempt to prove ours.

To let this drop is to let the swine run with it: they'll scream over and over that we've forged and lied to bring down the wartime hero godking, and it'll stick.

With any luck, they'll get cocky with a perceived advantage and then get sandbagged by the original or matching examples from the CYA file. Others from TANG will be called too, and that won't be all that cheery for Junior in the long run.

We can't ignore this, and we must righteously push hard. The whole issue is to their disadvantage if pursued.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

28. Interesting logic. CBS News and Dan Rather produce a set of...

...documents which they have vetted to the nth degree, the rightwing attempts to destroy it in their usual manner without ANY proof that the documents are fakes, and suddenly the burden is on us to prove the documents are genuine?

Huh?? Does anyone else see the fallacy in this poster's argument?

Tell you what...until the rightwingers can actually prove the the documents are fakes, they're the ones that have to "push hard", not us.

Get a grip.

[Julian English]

20. Weird--USA Today: The documents were fake but the information was real

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politicselections/nation/president/2004-09-14-memos-forgeries_x.htm

The former secretary to a Texas Air National Guard officer who purportedly wrote memos critical of President Bush's pilot service said Tuesday that the documents are forgeries but they appear to reflect memos her boss wrote and kept in a locked desk drawer.

Marian Carr Knox told the Dallas Morning News after viewing copies of the disputed memos, "These are not real," and that "the information in here was correct, but it was picked up from the real ones." She declined to be interviewed late Tuesday, but her son, Pat Carr, confirmed her comments.

(Snip)

Another former Texas National Guard officer, Richard Via, also said that the documents were fakes but that their content reflected questions about Bush that were discussed at the time in the hangar at Ellington Air Force Base, where he had a desk next to Killian's.

Via said he and others he worked with "remember the physical, and him going to Alabama was an issue." He said Killian "made notes and put them in his files about things like that."

[Ron Green]

25. It's all good! No matter how this particular authenticity story plays out,

it keeps Shrub's service (or lack thereof) in the spotlight.

[leesa]

29. Howie the hore strikes again!

[grasswire]

30. looks like CYA time..

...for document examiners.

[grasswire]

32. Is there any law...

...against sending cat poo in a candy box to a journalist? I just feel like doing it, Howie.

[Carolab]

39. Bill Safire

My mother said she read an article in the paper today that "the memos are forgeries"...I asked her who wrote it, and she said, "oh, never mind, it's William Safire".