GOP Urges Catholics To Shun Kerry - Boston Globe

[WillyT]

<snip>

WASHINGTON -- The Republican Party is attempting to convince Roman Catholics that Democratic nominee John F. Kerry is "wrong for Catholics" and at odds with his church.

Earlier this month, the Republican National Committee launched a website called "KerryWrongForCatholics.com" that takes the Massachusetts senator to task for voting against the Defense of Marriage Act, favoring civil unions for gays and lesbians, opposing vouchers for private schools, and taking stands on abortion and other issues that are contrary to church teachings.

The GOP site points out where Kerry, a Catholic, is at variance with the Vatican. A section on Kerry's stance on same-sex unions, for example, is headlined: "Kerry Said Vatican Should Not Instruct Catholic Politicians, Calling It 'Inappropriate.' "

The site suggests that Bush, a Methodist, has a stronger record on Catholic values.

<snip>

Link: http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/09/26/gop_urges_catholics_to_shun_kerry/

Wow... how 'Christian' of them.

:evilfrown:

[FlavaKreemSnak]

1. Just when you think the Rethugs can't get any stupider

I have a feeling this is going to back fire on them big time.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

2. Do these idiots think GOP stands for God's Own Party?

[Maccagirl]

3. La La La La La (fingers in ears)

This Catholic ain't listening!

[WillyT]

6. LOL !!! - I Think I'm In Love !!!

:yourock:

[Starlight]

46. http://www.catholicsforkerry04.org/ n/t

[donco6]

4. This type of thing used to make my Dad crazy!

If he hadn't died last month, he'd be on the phone talking to me about it. He hated it when someone told him how to vote as a Catholic.

[WillyT]

12. Sorry About Your Dad...

I lost mine in '75 when I was 20. Still hurts, but he'd be real proud of all of us here. And he'd be a staunch supporter of Kerry\Edwards.

Peace!

:hi:

[donco6]

21. Thanks.

He was a great guy. Only regret was that he didn't get to VOTE! :)

[fearnobush]

5. Here, let em' have it: [e-mail]

Wow, I guess the media forgets how much the Pope fears Bush as the Anti-Christ. "Kerry Said Vatican Should Not Instruct Catholic Politicians, Calling It 'Inappropriate.' "
So then is is appropriate for Bu$h co. to instruct Catholics how to vote?

[mitchtv]

48. the vatican says pretty much that also

they did so and it was completely burried by the Media. The Vatican doesn't want any more problems than it has already with US Catholics.And of all people to tell it to; New Yorkers, Massachusetts Catholics ,Latins. Catholics will not take orders from their bishop, the Pope, maybe, but that's not gonna happen

[madrchsod]

7. bush is not a methodist

[Roy]

8. Kerry should not let tis go unanswered....

He should publicly state that if republicans cared so much about catholics they should ALL convert to Carholicism. Start executing policies that are not hostile to the poor, and stop the vicious personal attacks on anyone with differing political views.

Remind all Catholics that if these people will slander and smear genuine war heros, they will not hesitate to slander, smear and destroy Catholics or anyone else who execises independent thought.

[Melodybe]

10. Pope is anti-Bush and as far as I know what the Pope

says is pretty important to Catholics. The Pope didn't approve of the war or the way Bush treats America's poor.

So na na na repigs, you ain't getting the Catholics vote!

[Cha]

17. The Pope should not let this go

unanswered. I think it would be really a good thing if he came out and said more what he thinks about this and other Scourge decisions the bush inc have made.

[catbert836]

25. The Pope is senile.

Sorry for any of you that I just offended, but it had to be said.

[FatSlob]

53. Piss off, he has Parkinson's.

Way to make fun of the leader of a great religion. Don't lie and try to pretend to be sorry.

[GoldenOldie]

24. Hypocrites for Bush

These are the very same individuals that denigrate the Catholic church and the Catholics when they are amongst their brethren.

I have seen and heard this my whole life and I have had a looooong life. During my Mother's funeral, in the early 80's, in the middle of the Catholic Mass for my Mother, I heard the whisperings of a couple who have been longtime friends of my Mother and our family, but were members of The Church of God, giggle during the service and belittle my Mother's faith. But I have encountered this very same behavior from paternal family members who react the same way to the Catholic religion.

Time marches on but some things do not change. The George Bush's,
Jerry Falwell's and the Pat Robertson's of this country will do whatever it takes to obtain what they want. They will use those Catholic's who are anti-abortion, anti-gay, etc., as being united with them, but only until they fill their needs. In private they consider Catholics not much different than the Muslim's.

Again George uses divisions of our Nation to feed his greed.

[catbert836]

28. Their common terms for us Catholics

include "mackeral-snappers" and "Mary worshippers".

[Malva Zebrina]

9. So now Bush is a Catho-methodist?

I think they are overplaying the religion thing and since Kerry has not played the religion game, they seem to be taunting him to make some statement about it.

This does not work and Kerry is right and wise to avoid religious sparring. It would only give them a platform they desperately want==as it is, it fizzles-- especially with this particular, Bush is a better Catholic than Kerry absurdity, and the West Virginia "Kerry wants to take away the bibles, thing. They look desperate and no one is paying attention.

[chaumont58]

11. To me, this is another sign that the repukes are desparate

This is beyond the pale, as were the mailings in West Virginia and Arkansas. I tell you, January 20th, 2005 can't get here fast enough.

[napi21]

13. I wouldn't worry about this. Any Catholics who were for shrub still will

be. Any that weren't won't be after this either.

Somebody on CNN (I think) said that there is no "Catholic vote". Catholics no longer vote in a block. I believe that, as a practicing Catholic myself.

There are things on each side that are against what Catholics believe.

Most will vote for or against the current President because of what he's done, or not done.

[Liberal Veteran]

14. Methodists were against the war....so Bush must be wrong for Methodists.

:)

[murielm99]

49. Methodists are also pro-choice.

They were one of the sponsors of the March for Women's Lives.

The bishops of the United Methodist Church have expressed concern that * has not yet met with a delegation of their bishops. Every President since Reagan has met with a delegation of United Methodist bishops at the White House. Yet, * has met with the Southern Baptist Convention three times.

On the whole, the United Methodists are a rather liberal denomination. If * thinks he is one of us, he needs his head examined. Well...he needs that anyway.

[TheFarseer]

15. I'm Catholic and the GOP can go F*** themselves

[catbert836]

27. Yes!

The republican part was the first to embrace ant-Catholicism in 1880 when 2 Presbyterian ministers meeting w/ the Republican candidate James G. Blaine labeled the democratic part as the party of "Rum, Romanism and Rebellion".

[Dogmudgeon]

57. No!

It was the Native American Party -- the "Know-Nothings" -- in the 1840s-1850s that were the primary Catholic-bashers.

Anti-Catholic rhetoric had been building since about the time of Andrew Jackson's populist insurgency, though AFAIK, "Old Hickory" (Jackson) wasn't anti-Catholic.

Certainly, the Republicans and Democrats alike have suffered some politicians who were anti-Catholic bigots.

http://www.aquinas-multimedia.com/stjoseph/knownothings.html

http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/Quad/6460/dir/850amer.html

--bkl

[prodigal_green]

33. just as long as they don't use birth control!

I'm a Catholic too and the issue of the war both in Iraq and on the poor in this country is much higher on my moral agenda than anything the chimp promotes.

[Peanut Gallery]

16. There are many liberal U.S. Catholics

who are "at variance" with the Vatican on issues like birth control and divorce and still practice their faith with a clear conscience. To many U.S. Catholics, what comes out of the Vatican is a guideline and not an absolute directive.

This latest idiocy from the GOP is going to fall flat on its face, imo.

[alcuno]

19. Welcome to DU, Ravenswood.

I am a Catholic from a staunch Catholic family. You are so right. The things that bind us are the practices and beliefs of our faith, not the GOP talking points.

I find what they are doing to be absolutely disgusting.

[Peanut Gallery]

23. Thanks for the welcome

:hi:

[catbert836]

18. Hee Hee

As a Catholic myself, I find it funny that last time a Catholic Democrat from Massachussetts with the first name John and the initials J.F.K. ran for president, the Republican smear machine tried to paint him as taking all his orders from Rome. This time, the very same smear machine is trying to paint the current one as not taking all his orders from Rome.

[WillyT]

32. Great Point !!!

:hi:

[catbert836]

20. Hee Hee

As a Catholic myself, I find it funny that the last time a Catholic with the initials JFK from Massachusetts ran for president, the Republican smear machine tried to paint him as taking all his orders from Rome. This time, they're painting him as not taking all his orders from Rome.

[catbert836]

22. Oops. Posted it twice. n/t

[NewYorkerfromMass]

26. 'Thou Shalt not Kill' includes capital punishment

Mr. Texas Execution King. Get thee a mirror.

[catbert836]

29. To them,

"Thou shalt not kill" means especially embryos and except for mentally ill, criminals, Democrats and anyone else who gets in their way.

[prodigal_green]

36. I'm not at all opposed to capitol punishment

if by Capitol, you mean the Republican House and Senate.

I am, however, opposed to capital punishment.

(sorry, spent ten years as an english teacher...)

[BootinUp]

30. Who the hell do they think they are!!

This fundie crap is soooooooo out of control.


I was raised a Catholic, ones faith is a personal issue, not something to be played in politics. Disgusting.

[Jade Fox]

31. Kerry can't "instruct" Catholics, but the GOP can?

Is there a similar GOP website instructing Jews who to vote for? How about
one for Buddhists? Muslims?

There is something very condescending about this.

[njdemocrat106]

34. A few days ago...

There was a thread on one of the board's here about how a priest flat out said "Vote for Bush" during a Mass. Well, when I went to church today, the priest who gave the sermon today pretty much endorsed Kerry. He didn't flat out say "vote for Kerry", but he said we should be "dubious of one candidate's smearing of another's military record", and that "on November 2nd, it's time for a change". Doesn't sound like a Dubya supporter to me!

[BayouWoman]

35. Liberal Catholics/Conservative Catholics

It's great to read so many comments from liberal Catholics. It's a great counter to my experience with Catholicism.

I was raised Catholic but have been an atheist for more than 20 years. But my family is still all Catholic. My mother is a self-proclaimed "Sunday Catholic" who votes Republican, but who I think I may be able to convert before the election. My father, sister and brother-in-law are very conservative Catholics--I call them cultist Catholics. They vote on one issue and one issue only--abortion. I could talk until I'm blue in the face but they won't budge. So I'm going to put all my efforts to working on Mom!

[NewYorkerfromMass]

37. Tell your folks you can be Pro-Life AND pro-choice at the same time

because mothers are people too.

[BayouWoman]

39. With Mom It's Not Abortion...

which is why I think I may be able to convert her.

She's old-fasioned, and she was furious with Clinton's sex scandals. But it's also about $ with her. Which is another reason why I think I can convert her. She hasn't been earning as much interest since W has been in power, and when I pointed that correlation out to her, she smiled in acknowledgement. So that's the angle I plan to use with her. Also, she's truly concerned about her kids and grandkids and making sure they have a good future. So I'm going to work the 'bankrupting the future' angle.


Whatever it takes.

[sr_pacifica]

47. There's hope

Unfortunately, my mom is dyed in the wool conservative Republican. When I was younger she was a Democrat! She hated Reagan when he was governor of California. Somewhere in the early 70s she switched (or should I say flipped?) She can't even see how the Bush administration is doing her wrong. For me, alas, there is no hope for conversion.

[MasonJar]

38. The GOP no longer has any validity has a reasonable party.

They may find themselves alone in the good old USA. Let them get grease on their hands. I do NOT like this country with them in control. If Bush wins, I may leave.

[onenote]

40. flash! GOP Declares Bush More Catholic Than the Pope

What a bunch of morans..

onenote

[noahmijo]

41. This proud liberal Democratic Catholic says GO FUCK YOURSELVES GOP

You don't speak for the Pope or for God for that matter, NO ONE but God speaks for God.

BTW GOP we Catholics don't forget little things like Bush kissing the ass of Bob Jones University and pandering to an institution that decries the Catholic religion as witchcraft.

Oh God Bless DU by the way
O8)

[Kimber Scott]

42. The Methodist Church opposed bombing Iraq. So who's at odds with

their church?

I would caution any one of any faith - beware the false prophet.

[vetwife]

51. AMEN..I remember Bush's own church denoucned his actions !

[Kimber Scott]

52. Another thing... I don't know a lot of Methodist going around saying

they're "born again." I used to be a Methodist. I'll admit not a very active one, but I never heard that term used in the Methodist churches I went to. Has anyone else?

[fearnobush]

43. Catholic New Times - Yes a Liberal Catholic publication.

Letters to the editor

Great editorial

“Summer gleanings.” (CNT Sept 12) was great.

If only the bishops of the world would weigh in on the evils the current Bush administration represents. The church has not exercized its role as the conscience of society. Evil is evil, no matter how it wraps itself up in the flag.

Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel, French writer Hilaire Belloc said.

Pray for this country below you. We need to change a lot of things in order to get the U.S. back on track and in line with the true message of the gospels. Fundamentalism is not the answer. George W. does not have a direct line to God, even though he thinks he does. The Christian Right has hijacked our government and unleashed forces of ignorance and arrogance.

CNT, keep going strong; we need your voice.

<http://www.catholicnewtimes.org/>

[proud patriot]

44. Now there's a grassroots effort (end sarcasm)

:eyes:

[Neshanic]

45. Our doors, our minds, our nasty little hearts are open.

As a Gay Methodist told to take a hike by my church, which has been taken over to an extent by the wave of sick puritanism, my solution would be this.

A very public, very loud rebuke from the Methodist church telling Church Monkey to shut the fuck up, and he does not speak, or represent them.

Instead, alot of head shaking and whispers. Very sad from a denomination that used to pride itself on activism.

[AngryOldDem]

50. Not Surprising At All -- Catholics are Sheeple, Too

Just another example of Bush's "I'm a uniter, not a divider" BS.

I'm Catholic, and in August I had one of those Catholic Answers tracts that the Globe mentions left on my car during a Mass, because of my Kerry/Edwards sticker. I complained to the church, and found out that someone anonymously called them and said that he "was out to get" such cars whenever he saw them in the lot. You bet I take that as a direct threat -- and I have reason to suspect it is a parishioner, because he also took the priest to task for not speaking out on Bush over Kerry.

Between now and November, I fully expect to come out after Mass some weekend and find some offensive note left under my windshield wiper, or my car keyed, or worse, my windshield cracked. I also suspect that I will be confronted by one or more of those "good Catholics" who can't see beyond the one-note issue of abortion to the much bigger social justice questions that the Church asks, and that Bush fails to answer.

Someone else posted about the irony between the two JFKs. I'd like to add another one: The president has little or no say in the abortion question -- yet to hear most pro-lifers talk, you think he could outlaw it tomorrow. They keep saying..."one more federal judgeship..."
conveniently overlooking the fact that there is no guarantee that a judge appointed by a "conservative" president will in turn be "conservative" on the bench. Another irony is, the Church makes no distinction in the quality of life -- that is, the life of a convicted murderer is just as sacred as that of a newborn. A life is a life is a life. We have no "goodness warranty" that runs out when we reach adulthood, or do something bad. Hence, as the Church points out and that many also choose to ignore -- it IS against capital punishment. There are other ways besides death that society can protect itself from dangerous criminals. Bush should lose the Catholic vote on that issue alone, as he should for the war, because it fails the Just War theory in every sense. But, the pro-lifers again choose to split hairs -- the death penalty and the war are "different."

I think the Church had better tread lightly here. If politics begins to edge its way into the liturgy, it may be buying itself a lot of trouble.

[eriffle]

54. In my church's monthly newsletter

Our priest said that he wants people to look past the catch phrases and look into the policies and actions of the candidates. He went on to say that for example we should look at which candidate in all aspects is more pro-life. This sounds to me like an endorsement for Kerry because the Conservative's idea of Pro-Life ends at birth. It really gets me that there are Catholics like Hannity and O'Reiley out there spouting out Conservative view points and they forget that Catholics were lynched in the south by these very same people.

[NVMojo]

55. for some reason

I am picturing a very desperate group of idiots with KKKarl Rove at the head sitting around each night desperately trying to find another group to appeal to for the Bushchild's re-election. Who is next? Chicago Pollacks for Bush? Eskimos for Bush? SanFran Trannies for Bush? I can't wait...

[mrbassman03]

56. Yeah, Catholics for... umm, non-Catholics!

That'll go well...

[DemBones DemBones]

58. We all need to tell people about a site called

http://www.votingcatholic.org

They have a great little quiz which shows you how much you agree with the US Catholic Bishops, GW Bush*, and John Kerry. Very informative for who said what on a variety of social justice issues, even if you're not Catholic.


BTW, I hope everyone knows that the Vatican said it's only/b] a sin for a Catholic to vote for a pro-choice candidate if the candidate's pro-choice stance is the only reason the Catholic is voting for him/ her. If there are other reasons, it's OK.

[truthisfreedom]

59. this'll backfire. stupid self-rightous idiots.

go to hell, 'thugs.