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CrisisPapers Donating Member (271 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 09:55 AM
Original message
The Fix is In - Again!
| Ernest Partridge |

Better get used to the idea: John McCain will probably be the next President of the United States.

The fix is in, as it has been in every election since 2000.

This follows from two overarching facts that the corporate media will not report, and the Democrats choose to ignore:

1. The ruling oligarchy can not allow a reformist Democrat to occupy the White House.

2. They have the means to prevent it, as they did in 2000, in 2004, and as they might do again in 2008.

All other aspects of this "election" - issues, personalities, media blitzes - are secondary and perhaps even irrelevant.

The Stakes

What "oligarchy"? It's the "military-industrial complex" that Dwight Eisenhower warned us about in 1961, now expanded into a "military-industrial-academic-media-congressional complex." These include corporate CEOs who earn more, in half a day, than their median workers earn in an entire year. These are among the one-tenth of one-percent richest Americans (annual income of more than $1.6 million) whose income from 1980 to 2002 increased two and a half times, while the median family income was essentially unchanged; the same super-rich 0.1 percent that received 15% of Bush's tax cuts. These oligarchs sit on each others' Boards of Directors, and on University Boards of Regents. They own the mass media and thus control the "news" that is fed the general public. (See theyrule.net). And they fund political candidates before elections and, quid-pro-quo, dictate policy after elections.

To be sure, the super-rich (and getting richer) include a few progressive individuals such as Warren Buffet and George Soros, but they are the "mavericks." However, by and large, the "hyper-rich" (David Kay Johnson's term), own, operate and control America.inc.

And they have benefitted enormously from both Democratic and Republican administrations, but most notoriously, from the administration of Bush the Lesser. They have looted the U.S. Treasury, increased the national debt to almost ten trillion dollars, hollowed-out and exported the manufacturing base, promulgated foreign imperialistic wars and sent the bill to future generations, and they have installed a tax structure that systematically draws the national wealth "upward" from the middle class that creates the wealth, into the pockets of those who own and control the wealth.

The oligarchy's surrogates in Washington have, in defense of this corporatocracy, effectively put themselves above the law. Acts of Congress, when found inconvenient to "the unitary executive" President, are nullified by "signing statements." Citizen rights, enumerated by the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, have been swept aside, as have numerous international treaties which have the force of law. The list of illegal acts by the current administration is long and agonizingly familiar. (See Dennis Kucinich's 35 Articles of Impeachment). And the Congress has steadfastly refused to apply the Constitutional remedy of impeachment.

The oligarchs are not about to give up all this ill-gotten loot, and in some cases find themselves before the bar of justice, by submitting to something called "reform," instigated by "the will of the people."

And they are quite capable of preventing such reform, and frustrating the people's will.

Because, you see, they also own the privatized enterprises that count the votes with no independent means of validation.

Hidden in Plain Sight

The undisputed facts about "direct electronic recording" (DRE) voting machines should add up to a scandal. Instead of a scandal, we get a yawn.

These are the facts: the software that records the individual votes, and the software that "compiles" (collects) the vote totals, is "proprietary" which means, in a word, secret. It is known only to the private companies that write the codes, and these companies are owned and managed by Republican partisans. Accordingly, if the software is programmed to "fix" an election, there is no direct way to expose the fraud. Conversely, even if the vote tabulation is entirely accurate and honest, there is still no way to validate the vote. It is, as some have called it, "faith-based voting." (See my "The Greatest Story Never Told").

Last April, the Democratic Congress attempted to pass a bill that would fund state efforts to replace DREs with paper ballots. The GOP members, at the request of George Bush, defeated the measure.

Now why would they want to do that? With all the suspicion of GOP election fraud at large in the public, one might suppose that the Republicans would be eager to require means of validation. Yet somehow they are not.

For while there is no direct means of validating DRE totals, there is abundant statistical, circumstantial and anecdotal evidence that numerous elections, including the past two presidential elections, have in fact been stolen. (Because I have presented this evidence in numerous articles on the internet, I won't repeat it here. But for documentation of these allegations, see my "Where's the Outrage?" and "Evidence? We Don't Want Your Stinkin' Evidence!," then follow the links therein).

We've heard the rebuttal from the right: "These allegations of election fraud are paranoid fantasies. The Republicans, and their friends in the voting machine industry, wouldn't dare fix a national election. Such a conspiracy would be too massive to keep secret, and once it came to light, it would destroy the GOP."

Quite frankly, I once believed that eventually the truth would out, and that it would devastate the Republicans.

But if the truth of election fraud were revealed, who would report it? The corporate media? Gimme a break!

In fact, the truth has come out, and from the inside of the DRE industry. A programmer, Clint Curtis, has testified under oath that he was asked by Congressional Candidate, Tom Feeney, to write a program that would fix an election and leave no trace of the crime. He replied that it would be a simple matter to do so, but refused the offer. Curtis later lost to Feeney in an election that posted totals at odds with post-election surveys. (The Democratic Congress declined to investigate). In California, word processor Steven Heller released confidential legal documents proving that Diebold violated state law by installing uncertified software in state elections. For this act of civil disobedience, Heller pled guilty to a felony and was fined $10,000. And finally Steven Spoonamore, a McCain advisor and security researcher, disclosed that Diebold tampered with the 2006 Georgia gubernatorial and senatorial elections, in which the Republican candidates overcame huge polling deficits to win the election. (Follow this link for the first of an eight segment interview with Spoonamore).

So the evidence of stolen elections, some from inside whistleblowers, is "out there," reported by citizen groups and by the progressive internet. But not by the corporate media. And amazingly, the victims of this fraud, the Democratic Party and its candidates, are also silent.

So the system remains in place: In the November election, 80% of the votes will be cast or tabulated by computer, including 38% on DRE machines with "proprietary" software.

Will the announced vote totals be accurate? Will the oligarchy-friendly manufacturers and programmers be tempted to "fix" the results? You can count on it. Will they in fact yield to the temptation, facing no legal consequences if they do? Unknown and unknowable.

But given the evidence from past elections, I have grave forebodings about the next.

The Diebold Zone

If, as in previous elections, the GOP friendly privatized election industry is up to its undetectable dirty tricks, then John McCain need not tally a majority of votes in key states to win the election. All he needs is to gather as many as 45% - into "the Diebold Zone" - and the DRE's and the proprietary software codes will take care of the rest. Just as, arguably, Bush and the Republicans did in 2004. In a stunning essay, read by very few, Michael Collins explains how they did it. The DRE machines switched and stuffed millions of GOP votes in the big cities, where they would be least likely to be noticed. Collins' evidence is compelling.

Again, not a word about this in the corporate media, and no investigations by law enforcement or by the Democratic Congress.

And so, to put the matter bluntly, McCain does not need a majority to win. Just plausibility. As in 2000 and 2004, a plausible win is a win.

The media will not dispute it, much less investigate it.

But what if, once again, both pre-election polling and exit polling indicate an Obama victory, only to be overcome by a McCain "upset."

When this happened in Ohio in 2004, the media and the GOP came up with "the reluctant voter theory," whereby it was suggested that Bush voters were somehow less inclined than Kerry voters to talk with exit pollsters. No independent evidence was offered to explain this remarkable phenomenon, which seemed to be confined to precincts with DRE machines.

This time, if John McCain achieves a stunning upset, there will be a more plausible explanation on hand to deal with any discrepancy with poll projections: "the Tom Bradley effect." This phenomenon, which gets its name from the 1982 California gubernatorial race between Tom Bradley and George Deukmejian, indicates that a sizeable number of white voters who tell pollsters that race is not a factor in their voting choices, will in fact vote against a "person of color" when alone in the voting booth.

"The Bradley Effect" is extremely accommodating to the Republicans, since there is no way whatever to gauge its extent, if any. Thus almost any imaginable degree of "upset" can be explained away by this "effect."

If McCain does win in a stunning upset, count on the corporate media to grab onto "The Bradley Effect" in an instant. The pundits will deplore the "fact" that racism still plays such a large part in our elections. But it will all be a charade.

Just remember: thanks to "faith-based" voting and compliant media, for McCain and the GOP a plausible victory is a victory. And "the Bradley Effect" provides the plausibility.

Is There Any Hope?

Due to the aforementioned circumstances, an Obama victory in November is unlikely. But it is not impossible.

The election is three months away, and the party conventions are just ahead. Three months in politics can be an eternity.

First of all, the oligarchs might decide that a Democratic win might not be all that troublesome, and thus might tell their friends in the voting machine industry to cool it and let the voters have their way. After all, there is an economic shit-storm in the offing, and the corporatocracy might be more than willing to see it happen on the Democrats' watch.

Besides, as Matt Taibbi has argued this week, the corporatocracy pretty much owns Barack Obama anyway, and as the aftermath of the 2006 Congressional elections has proven, even when in control the Democratic party can be tamed and contained without much strain.

Second, the Obama campaign might come up with a brilliant strategy, though there is little indication so far of any such development. The Democrats have had four years to study the 2004 debacle and to plan a counteroffensive. For sure enough, 2008 is turning out to be 2004 redux, as Karl Rove and his acolytes dust off the old playbook and proceed accordingly. They know full well that McCain can not win legitimately on his merits, so instead, and predictably, they are attacking Obama: "an elitist," "a celebrity," "not one of us" (i.e., he's black and maybe a Muslim), "he's posing as 'The One'" (i.e., he's the anti-Christ). As in 2000 and 2004, the Republican campaign is attempting to define its opposition. And once again, they appear to be succeeding.

So has the Obama camp at last come up with an effective way to deal with the Sigretti-Atwater-Rove brand of gutter politics? To date, they have largely responded by being "positive" and concentrating on "the issues." They should ask John Kerry how all that worked out for him.

It won't do. It's time for a Willie Stark moment. During his week-long retreat, Barack Obama should read Chapter 2 (in particular, pages 136-144) of Robert Penn Warren's "All the King's Men," wherein Stark throws away his wonky, issue-clogged speech, speaks from his anguished and angry heart, and turns his fortunes around.

Strange to say, in this strangest of political years, Paris Hilton has shown the way. John McCain has to be taken down, and with ridicule. He is, after all, a ridiculous figure, spewing forth gaffes and errors almost daily, thus revealing his incompetence each and every time.. The McCain campaign, with its smears, innuendoes and outright lies, has given Obama the license to go negative. McCain has reversed himself on so many issues that his stand on any of them is not credible. So show video clips of McCain vs. McCain. He is tied to the despised Bush regime, so show those images of the Bush-McCain hug, and do so repeatedly as the media did with the Clinton-Monica hug at the rope line. Collect damaging video clips from You-Tube and let McCain speak his own refutation and condemnation. Then offer something better: an "audacity of hope."

Can Obama and the Democrats overcome a rigged voting system and a hostile corporate media?

Unlikely, but not impossible.

The public clamor for change combined with the widespread disgust with McCain, Bush and the Republicans, must become so enormous as to overwhelm the propaganda of the corporate media and the finagling of the voting machines. Recall that despite all the media slander of 2000 ("inventing the internet," "discovering Love Canal"), Al Gore received a half million more votes than George Bush. And there is good reason to believe that in 2006, the Democratic Senatorial candidates in Montana, Virginia, and Missouri overcame GOP "fixes" in those contests.

In short, to win at all, the Democrats must win big. A close contest within "The Diebold Zone" will likely go to John McCain.

And that is reason enough for progressives to stay in the fight and to redouble their efforts.

-- EP
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screembloodymurder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 10:07 AM
Response to Original message
1. K&R
This time we must be ready! A loss is not acceptable. Whatever it takes, the people must regain control.
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EV_Ares Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 10:08 AM
Response to Original message
2. Great Write and thanks for that post even though is takes you down a lot,
Edited on Tue Aug-12-08 10:08 AM by EV_Ares
have to head to the gym to work off the depression. Regardless, it pretty much sums it up, something I think most of us have known but when you put it all together and right out there with those words, it hits pretty hard. After reading, seems pretty much the only thing that can be done is for the people to vote and to vote for Barack and as it says, win big enough they can't tamper with it. It also goes to show you how both ruling parties are culprits in all of this which makes sense because they can all stay in their high profile paying jobs and continue on playing the game at our expense.

We can always keep up the hope but time is running out for people to wake up. K&R.
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caledesi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 10:09 AM
Response to Original message
3. Not this time! - B, Obama NT
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Lugnut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
4. K&R n/t
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Kablooie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 10:25 AM
Response to Original message
5. If the Dems has brought some of them to justice the balance might have been shifted.
But they chose to keep Rove, Cheney, et. al. free to override the system once more.

There has to be a reason that the path to justice was not followed.

It must be that either Pelosi and others are part of the oligarchy or they are being
blackmailed.

Either seems possible. With Bush's self-granted freedom to wiretap anyone the blackmail angle
seems very plausible.

Even Conyers, who I believe would love to throw the bunch in jail, doesn't do anything
but spout empty threats. They must have ahold of his throat too.

Until someone in power stands up to them, we are doomed to see the country and world
continue to decline.
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fasttense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 06:13 AM
Response to Reply #5
60. There IS something we can do.
"Until someone in power stands up to them, we are doomed to see the country and world continue to decline."

We Americans have the power. We voters can stand up to the powers that be. We can march on Washington and Live there for a month. We can stay there until something is done. We don't need to watch another theft be whitewashed. We could do it. We could organize on the internets and organize the homeless and unemployed.

We Americans don't have sit on our hands, wishing and hoping, and getting kicked in the teeth yet again. We The People Have the Power.
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MasonJar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 11:13 AM
Response to Original message
6. They will also try to steal elections for Congress too. They do NOT want
a bigger Dem majority, which might actually have the power to do something. I think that the corps might want to elect to let a dem win with all the turmoil the next pres will have to contend with. However, the Bushistas can never let that happen; they are responsible for too many crimes. The dems will probably never pursue them (the anthrax killer is still out there IMHO), but they might. Bush/Cheney cannot take a chance.
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DirtyDawg Donating Member (594 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
7. I've complained to my friends...
...in 'leadership' positions in the Democratic Party in Georgia for years - since the '02 Diebold theft of the Senate seat (Max Cleland) and the Office of Governor (Roy Barnes). They don't seem to want to hear it. What in blazes? Were they in on the deal? Do they not want to admit that they allowed themselves to be 'duped'? Whatever the motivation, it has brought me to the belief that until Democrats, and, indeed, all Americans say this is abso-'effin'-lutely the worst thing that could happen to whatever is left of what this country is supposed to stand for, things will never change. By that I mean that evidence of direct tampering, aka theft, should result in the maximum penalty - hang the bastards, or in the case of Karl Rove, pillory the piss-ant for a couple of weeks until the crows peck out his eyes. Then we'll see now 'cavalierly' these guys will be in their commitment to steal another election.
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bagrman Donating Member (889 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 12:01 PM
Response to Original message
8. Happiness is the smell of burning voting machings in the morning.
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OnTheOtherHand Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
9. I think you misread Collins
What Collins actually reported was that the official returns give Bush fewer votes in the big cities than the exit polls say he got. (The table that Collins analyzed has too many votes in the big cities, period, so it implicitly gives both Bush and Kerry more votes than they received in the official returns.)
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BlueCaliDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 01:22 PM
Response to Original message
10. I really, REALLY hope you're wrong...
...and will the American people stand for it seeing the popularity with which Obama is burning trails throughout the USA?
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tinkerbelle Donating Member (5 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 01:49 PM
Response to Original message
11. Agree completely, the system's rigged...
but even with all the documented crimes perpetrated by this group of evil-doers, the lack of outrage is mind boggling. Fighting for a Democratic win in November is essential. But if McCain "wins," leaving the country is starting to look better and better.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 08:14 PM
Response to Reply #11
42. Tinkerbelle, but no one knows it.
The mainstream (upchuck) media won't touch the issue as it is 'tinfoil' stuff. It has been characterized as tinfoil stuff. We are fucked.
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Arugula Latte Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 11:11 PM
Response to Reply #11
54. I once throught that people would be outraged once they
figured out the Republicans had stolen Florida. I remember flipping the TV channels in futility, waiting for the media to record any outcry. Hah! What a naive idiot I was then... That was what drove me away from the mainstream corporate media to the Internet.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 03:02 PM
Response to Original message
12. What reformist Democrat?
:)
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Jester Messiah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 03:34 PM
Response to Original message
13. I fucking refuse to accept it.
And if this country gets another Republican after 8 years of dismal failure, then it deserves to go down the tubes.
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Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #13
36. You're going to get it.
In 2003, I was part of the Voting Machine Task Force in Florida, and we spent over a year finding all the evidence we could of fraud, and potential fraud. And we found a lot. We had our own computer experts, and researchers.

What we found was appalling. And actually, it was even worse than we thought. We took our findings to Senator Bob Graham's staff and made a presentation. Senator Graham subsequently introduced legislation requiring a paper trail in all federal elections. The Republicans never let it out of committee, where it died.

In 2004, some of our staffers saw evidence that looked like they were preparing Ohio to be the next "Ground Zero" in election fraud. We warned the Ohio Democratic Party, and they pretty much just yawned.

In 2006, Florida again became Clusterfuck Central. While the Jennings-Buchanan race got all the press, 4 other races didn't add up either. One was Clint Curtis-Tom Feeney. Another was John Russell-Ginny Brown-Waite. The other two, I have brain-lock right now.

Disclaimer: I was John Russell's Deputy Campaign Manager.

The Russell and Curtis campaigns picked several precincts in each district, and sent out volunteer canvassers, door to door, to interview voters. They all signed affidavits as to how they voted. Some people swore that they did NOT vote, but were recorded as having voted. The survey's showed that results in some precincts were off 30 percent!

I wasn't involved in the "recount" or further actions, but I was kept abreast of developments by candidates, attorneys, and volunteers.

I'll just say, that deals were made with the Democrats in Washington, for the whole mess to be dropped. Promises were made, and then promptly ignored.

The mess continues.

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Stevepol Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #36
51. Thx for this info Dr. It substantiates what I suspected was true re FL et al.
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maxomai2 Donating Member (17 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 08:40 AM
Response to Reply #36
65. And so now we have THE question
Your group seems to have had pretty good luck finding where the next huge fraud will be.

Where will the next huge fraud be?

Ohio again?
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Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #65
70. We're not together anymore.
A couple of us have moved away. One died (old age). I'm personally fed up. A few others have just moved on.

A gut feeling tells me that Ohio and Florida are going to be in play again. And I'd keep an eye on Virginia and Missouri. No evidence. Just things look a little funny there.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 08:16 PM
Response to Reply #13
43. It will go down the tubes
The working man's standard of living will go down the tubes. The Republicans will continue to characterize the economy as wonderful.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 08:29 AM
Response to Reply #13
64. Not enough people have demanded change to our voting system in these 8 dismal years
...and if we go down the tubes it will be the fault of every person who has not done their share.
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AndyTiedye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #64
73. When You Make Your Demands and No Media Reports Them, Do They Make a Sound?
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-14-08 12:53 AM
Response to Reply #73
74. i hear ya
it is an existential nightmare
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pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 03:40 PM
Response to Original message
14. I have always said that the only way McCrazy can win is
to steal the election.
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 03:40 PM
Response to Original message
15. Absolutely and the Corporate wing of the Democratic Party is in on it-imho.
Note how the Clintons and their DLC lackeys have been acting raising the hopes of the PUMAs. Corporate media have latched on to this and you can bet when the fix occurs they will blame it on the hesitant Clintonistas.

We will have to win by over 10 points-to have a margin so big that everyone doesn't believe it. I believe Obama realizes this and it's part of the reason behind his Voter Registration strategy.
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 04:27 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. Why is that the magic number?
As I said earlier, in computerland, it makes no difference if 10,000 votes or 10,000,000 votes are flipped. The only thing they need to do is make this look like a legitimate horse race between the two candidates and poof, fix is in. I don't know if you noticed, but they're already setting that one up. No one wants McCain, but the media is making it look like Republicans are aligning lockstep behind him and that our side isn't marching behind our candidate. Easy as pie.
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Nay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #19
31. Hell, all they have to do is throw 10% of the Dem vote to Bob Barr--
and poof! the Pubs win again!
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Auggie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 03:52 PM
Response to Original message
16. "Democrats must win big" -- get the word out: VOTE!
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klyon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #16
29. but tell them not to give information to the polls or lie and say McCain
confuse the polls as much as possible is our only chance
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 04:08 PM
Response to Original message
17. It will be a miracle if Obama wins and can actually take the oath of office.
Our party has had almost six years to make our election system honest and above board and yet nothing has hardly been done except in a half assed way where the more egregious election cheating went on.

WHAT THE HELL IS THE MATTER WITH US THAT WE COULDN'T FIX OUR BROKEN ELECTION SYSTEM BY NOW?????
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bowens43 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #17
39. some people think it isn't broken......
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #39
44. It works like a well oiled watch. nt
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 04:22 PM
Response to Original message
18. Here's something no one ever seems to talk about:
In computer land, it is no more hard to flip 10 million votes as 10,000. Sure, we have exit pollers but they have proprietary information and can make the polls match the numbers fairly easily and can undermine the faith in the system (remember the elusive "shy Bush voter"?).

So, ending your discussion with the stirring call to keep it from being close doesn't make sense to anyone who programs for a living.
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tbyg52 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 04:58 PM
Response to Reply #18
24. Yep. If people don't believe or know about the evidence that's already there
why expect it's going to be any different in 2008? Depressing but true. Those electronic monstrosities are the worst thing that's happened on the BushCo watch, and that's saying a lot.
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OnyxCollie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 04:30 PM
Response to Original message
20. K&R. nt
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OwnedByFerrets Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 04:42 PM
Response to Original message
21. Ive been saying this for a long time......
"First of all, the oligarchs might decide that a Democratic win might not be all that troublesome, and thus might tell their friends in the voting machine industry to cool it and let the voters have their way. After all, there is an economic shit-storm in the offing, and the corporatocracy might be more than willing to see it happen on the Democrats' watch."

They set McSame up for the loss. The ONLY flaw in my ointment is that if a repug is in the whitehouse, the chances of any prosecutions is zilch. However, the chances of any prosecutions if a democrat is in the WH is almost nil, so it evens out.
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kimmerspixelated Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
22. Touche'!
Really, why should they give up now?! They've got everything the way they want it, and the media is completely bought. I have always secretly hoped that the media would just display a major raspberry and strike, just so they could save their own dignity, but I'm positive they are being very well-paid, and money seems to talk!

Yes, we've had a lot of time to come up with the prevention of another theft. I don't believe the current polls are correct. Tainted by the media! I think even good ol' rethugs are saying, "enuf is enuf", and have snubbed McCain't. I think the general audience of voters are really not going to be buying any claim of a McCain victory. Not going to buy it!... I DO think that there were a lot of votes for Bush last time simply becasue voters didn't want to change prez's during a war.I knew a few of them. Because that factor is not involved( well, not unless you see McBush for what he is,)there IS a chance it will be different, in the fact that a theft will be harder to cover up. Still, Rove and co., have probably been working awhile on a smoother way to burglarize votes, so there is that!

One thing for certain, IF they get away with stealing it again...it is OVER for the US!
Over for voters, over for the hope of anything good to achieve at all. There will be a major depression, but it won't be monetary.

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Pooka Fey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
23. Stolen - 2000, 2002, 2004, 2006, and maybe 2008?....K&R
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DUlover2909 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 05:05 PM
Response to Original message
25. What a bummer
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keepCAblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
26. Today's AP article -- "The Bradley Effect" has begun....
I think they must have read Ernest' editorial and then wasted no time in setting the stage for Obama's defeat by predicting "The Bradley Effect", just as Ernest discussed in the OP...

Race questions cast doubt on presidential polls

SNIP:
In the not-so-distant past, the consensus was a clear yes. Today, however, there is widespread disagreement about whether Obama is subject to the predicament known as the Wilder or Bradley Effect — whether in the privacy of the voting booth, white people will actually pull the lever for the first black man to come within shouting distance of the presidency.

Given that surveys can have trouble uncovering the truth about many things besides race, plus the massive technological, demographic and cultural changes in play, this question is contributing to an almost unprecedented air of uncertainty surrounding this year's polls.

SNIP:
The reason for these disparities? A significant amount of white people did not admit that race played a role in their voting decision, pollsters and academics say. Another factor: When the person asking the questions was black, respondents were more likely to say they favored the black candidate.

In the recent Democratic primary, exit polls in 28 states overstated Obama's actual share of the final vote.

Andrew Kohut, president of the Pew Research Center, doesn't think people are lying to pollsters today about their support for Obama ...

...But he did see potential for error based on the people who decline to participate in polls, whom he describes as largely lower-income whites more likely than the population at large to have racially intolerant views.


FULL STORY: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080812/ap_on_el_pr/obama_white_voters
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Norrin Radd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 05:11 PM
Response to Original message
27. I suspect the oligarchy wants to sit this one out. Kick back and count their filthy lucre.
Let the mess get blamed on and associated with the Democrats.
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onethatcares Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #27
32. I agree with that assessment,
they'll take their BILLIONS OF STOLEN DOLLARS and go sit somewhere while the Democrats get the shitfilled coffee mug of a war, an broken economy, a bleak job picture, the absolute need to raise some taxes, and a populace that hasn't a clue. Then after 4 years of relative peace, the pugpigs will be back clamoring about how corporations can no longer make it because of the tax rate.

Things don't look good for the future of the divided states of america to me.

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northernlights Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 08:05 AM
Response to Reply #32
62. 2 wars. 2 wars.
Afghanistan is not over.
Iraq is not over.

2 wars.
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AndyTiedye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-15-08 12:21 AM
Response to Reply #62
77. They Could be Up to 4 Wars By Winter
:scared:
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NJCher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 08:40 AM
Response to Reply #27
66. yes, let the menders be the bad guys
That is what we have going on in NJ. Democrat Corzine is trying to overcome Christie Whitman's "tax cuts," which means NJ deficit spent for years and years.

See this and look at the comments if you have any doubt as to how this works:


Corzine's continues to struggle to win voter approva

Gov. Jon Corzine’s job approval ratings continue to be upside-down, 42%-48%, a slight improvement from his 38%-52% rating in June, according to a new Quinnipiac University poll that was released this morning.

On his handling of the state budget, Corzine has a 33%-56% approval rating, and 39% of New Jersey registered voters say the state has gotten worse under his leadership. 49% say things have remained the same, and 9% say the state has gotten better.
http://www.politickernj.com/editor/22205/corzines-continues-struggle-win-voter-approval





Cher
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klyon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 05:46 PM
Response to Original message
28. I too believe they will steal this election
I think they will manipulate just as many votes as they need to win, that is why if any polls call me I plan to tell them I am voting for McCain so they don't get good data. I am also going to lie to the exit polls because I believe they will be watching those numbers very closely before they hack in and flip the vote. That is my only suggestion since our Congress is not taking this seriously.
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solara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 05:52 PM
Response to Original message
30. So, then.. why bother? I mean if a McCain presidency is a foregone conclusion
Why do anything further?


Damn

And I was really looking forward to January 2009


INVESTIGATE IMPEACH INDICT INCARCERATE :shrug:
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bjobotts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
33. Leaders of both parties belong to the Money Party. They own the media and the voting machines
The only chance we have in defeating them rests with this election. We must produce a paper trail and closely monitor all election processes as they are happening. Demanding moment by moment accounting. What I fear is that the majority of all our leaders are already complicit in the dishonest deceitful arrangement of the money party willingly or unwillingly accepting it as the only means of obtaining or remaining part of our so called "elected" leadership. We still have a chance this election of getting by them but after this the consolidation of power will turn our nation into a corporatocracy.

The leadership of today is committed to making sure our children's children have no memory of what a democracy really is.
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Mnpaul Donating Member (754 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 06:15 PM
Response to Original message
34. Monica Goodling admitted to felonies committed
under oath. We have copies of the voter caging emails. It is a felony and the Republicans promoted the felon to US Attorney. The Dems did nothing. It will come back to bite them in the butt.
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BeatleBoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 06:42 PM
Response to Original message
35. Sounds like this place will be abuzz with 2 excuses if
the Dems lose in November:

1) "The Fix was in"

2) "It was all the Clintons' Fault"


Bravo! Defeatism at its best!

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CJCRANE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-15-08 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #35
79. I actually think that with Hillary
as VP the neocons might let the Dems win...because "it takes a Clinton to clean up after a Bush" but also because it takes a Clinton to cover up after a Bush.
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Robeson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 07:21 PM
Response to Original message
37. Elections have been fixed, since the dawn of this nation. The question....
...is what can we do to ensure we come out on winning this one.
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Joanne98 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 07:45 PM
Response to Original message
38. We keep getting sold out. What to do about that?
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janicefromohio Donating Member (2 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 08:10 PM
Response to Original message
40. TAKE ACTION NOW!!!!!!
Exceptional article . . . the biggest story not being told.

Highly respected Columbus Ohio Attorney Cliff Arnebeck is preparing a RICO suit against Karl Rove based on many of these allegations . . . and everyone can/must help now!! They need to get the word out . . . they need you to petition your congress person and THEY NEED MONEY (any amount can make a big difference).

All the info and necessary links are below:

“Rove is orchestrating a fix for the 2008 election, using the same methods by which he stole the 2000 and 2004 Presidential elections, according to a tipster at a strategic level within the McCain campaign, the reliability of which has been confirmed by one of our experts,” according to Ohio Attorney Cliff Arnebeck.

The nation’s foremost private internet security specialist, Stephen Spoonamore (bio below), a lifelong Republican and consultant to The Pentagon and FBI, has just come forward with important new evidence proving that our current electronic voting system is eminently hackable if the election in November, 2008 is at all close.

Click here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jy1sz-xBxf8&feature=related

On July 17, 2008, Ohio attorneys Cliff Arnebeck and Robert Fitrakis held a press conference detailing their current suit in federal court in which they plan to prosecute Karl Rove and his team.

SAVE 2008 NOW.

1. TELL CONGRESS to investigate Karl Rove’s cyber strategy to illegally manipulate elections. Click http://www.velvetrevolution.us/prosecute%5Frove/#mailformto to send an email to your Congress Members demanding the Department of Justice hold public hearings and assign a special prosecutor to investigate the on-going pattern of electronic voter fraud, dating back to 2000.

2. EDUCATE YOURSELF by visiting http://www.velvetrevolution.us/prosecute%5Frove/ and http://www.bradblog.com/?p=6189

3. DONATE to the legal defense fund at http://www.velvetrevolution.us/donate.php earmarked to support the “PROTECT ELECTIONS, PROSECUTE ROVE” campaign. No amount is too small or too large!

4. GO VIRAL and spread the word . . . alert your local media, write letters to the editor, and forward this email far and wide.

(For full bio on Stephen Spoonamore bio, go to: http://www.linkedin.com/in/spoonamore)






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Agent William Donating Member (628 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 08:12 PM
Response to Original message
41. Many nights ago...
I had a dream that Obama won the election in a land slide. A 350 electoral point victory. As I awoke I knew that was the closest I will ever get to a democratic victory.

I so disparately want to get my hopes up about an Obama victory... but I can't. Its so crushing to watch my guy go down in November, watch the democratic give a gracious concession speech, and watch the conservatives act all smug about it. In November you'll find me at the bottom of a bottle.
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trickyguy Donating Member (461 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
45. Progressive worker here. Directly involved in three campaigns including Obama's.
I'm not sure what more I can do. Probably a lot.

Even got myself deputized so I can register voters in my city.

But when it comes to illegaly tampering with votes then I'm dead.

This has to be a land-slide victory for all Democrats.

I don't want to think about the consequences of a McCain victory.

I just don't.

:evilfrown:
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maxomai2 Donating Member (17 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 08:46 AM
Response to Reply #45
67. Here's what you can do
Talk to your local party and demand that they sue for the source code for these voting machines.

And if they won't supply it, they should sue for relief in the form of plain paper ballots.

Really, your only other option is to actively destroy the broken machines before election day comes. Which is, btw, completely illegal, will get you a lot of jail time, and will probably get you sued blind as well. So I strongly recommend the first option.
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janicefromohio Donating Member (2 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #45
69. What you can do
See "Take Action Now" above . . . there's a suit pending going against Rove that you can help with -- thanks so much:


Click here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jy1sz-xBxf8&feature=related

On July 17, 2008, Ohio attorneys Cliff Arnebeck and Robert Fitrakis held a press conference detailing their current suit in federal court in which they plan to prosecute Karl Rove and his team.

SAVE 2008 NOW.

1. TELL CONGRESS to investigate Karl Rove’s cyber strategy to illegally manipulate elections. Click http://www.velvetrevolution.us/prosecute%5Frove/#mailformto to send an email to your Congress Members demanding the Department of Justice hold public hearings and assign a special prosecutor to investigate the on-going pattern of electronic voter fraud, dating back to 2000.

2. EDUCATE YOURSELF by visiting http://www.velvetrevolution.us/prosecute%5Frove/ and http://www.bradblog.com/?p=6189

3. DONATE to the legal defense fund at http://www.velvetrevolution.us/donate.php earmarked to support the “PROTECT ELECTIONS, PROSECUTE ROVE” campaign. No amount is too small or too large!

4. GO VIRAL and spread the word . . . alert your local media, write letters to the editor, and forward this email far and wide.

(For full bio on Stephen Spoonamore bio, go to: http://www.linkedin.com/in/spoonamore)


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tdog8 Donating Member (24 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 07:55 PM
Response to Reply #45
72. no one wants to think
about those consequences...

All this talk of it being a foregone conclusion makes it seem not worth working for the goal.

But it is.

I am not able to get even my friends to show up for a (free) event for our local candidate. They all say, "I'll vote for him but I don't want to come to the party."

The thing is we can't win unless we get thoughtful folks from the 'other' side to cross party lines. We'd be able to do this if OUR SIDE would just show up... and then talk about the guy.

Sorry.

Keep registering voters. It'll be a disappointing day if we can't win the election but there's no use in giving up now.

We'll only be disappointed longer and it will become a self fulfilling prophesy.

In voting and campaigning,

The decisions are made by those who show up.

If my friends would show up, we'd be stronger than the few rich folks running things now.

I know it's corny but:

Less than three months to go...

Let's get out there and make the difference!

Please?!?!?!?!
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zeemike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
46. I am just as cynical about it as you Crisis
But the real question in my mind is what will we do if it is again stolen?
There are only two things I can think of
1) revolt against the system and take ot too the streets. But who is prepared to face Blackwater security systems, and possible material law?
2) Learn to love big brother and accept the rule of the oligarchy. and go back to a normal life of consumption and become just as greedy as they are.

The latter is most likely to happen.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 08:45 PM
Response to Original message
47. What about the states that have..
legislated mandatory audits after every election? Are their votes more protected? Would it be worth our while to ask our state governments to supply us with accurate voting systems?
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Montypython Donating Member (12 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 08:45 PM
Response to Original message
48. What a buch of buzz kills!
Don't stress it. Obana is too big. He can't be beaten, especially by a numbnut like McCain. These are fine times we are living people. Enjoy the ride. Think of the legislation we will pass. Think of the Supreme Court. With a united White House and Congress we will crush our enemies. Think about who WE will put in Gitmo!
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cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #48
55. You might want to spell 'Obama' correctly before you post here, sparky.
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happygoluckytoyou Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 08:55 PM
Response to Original message
49. what holds us together.....THAT THERE IS NO HONOR AMONG THE THIEVES...when the shit hits the fan..
they will turn against each other....
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BlueJac Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 08:58 PM
Response to Original message
50. Fuckem'!
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minnesota_liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 10:00 PM
Response to Original message
52. When in the Course of human events...
it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, etc.

Without fair and verifiable elections, there is no democracy and the whole idea of trashing the status quo becomes conceivable.

That's all I'm going to say about it.
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-12-08 10:25 PM
Response to Original message
53. Why pick on only DREs when optical scan is as big a scam.

Sure you can recount the paper ballot, but half the trouble is that rarely happens. And if it does there's the question of chain of custody.

Then there's "proprietary" software. I'm not sure non-proprietary software would be any less hackable and undetectable.

It's a mess.

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judasdisney Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 03:37 AM
Response to Original message
56. What if they fixed the vote IN FAVOR of a selected Democratic scapegoat patsy?
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frogcycle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 05:26 AM
Response to Original message
57. Glad to see someone state so well what I have been saying for years
Ike's warning was spot-on.

The only dems who have been elected since Ike are JFK (assassinated), LBJ ("I'll give you your war"), Carter (ridiculed out of office for warning of the oil dependency and trying to do something about it) and Clinton, the only one with two terms, who was hounded over sex scandals and trumped-up investment improprieties from day one, and handed the "Contract on America" congress to stop pretty much anything he wanted to do.

The naive optimism that Obama will win because he is the good guy is, frankly, pathetic. You hit the nail on the head when you put the word "election" in quotes.

Yes, they may opt to let Obama win, only to play pin the tail on the donkey over the aftermath of their mismanagement. Whether McCain or Obama wins is almost irrelevant. They have probably just about sealed the deal. Only an awakening by the masses to what you wrote can have any affect, and then only through extra-constitutional means.

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georgecolombo Donating Member (86 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 05:49 AM
Response to Original message
58. WTF?
the corporatocracy pretty much owns Barack Obama anyway


To tell you the truth, I have no patience for anyone who makes any variation of the argument that there's little difference between Obama and McCain. This year, of all years, there is simply no place for this kind of juvenile, absolutist thinking.

I'm sure there's value in the rest of this post, but you lost me with this quip.
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pnorman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 06:02 AM
Response to Original message
59. SURRENDER! RESISTANCE IS FUTILE!
n/t

pnorman
(Elderly Farts for Obama)
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unpossibles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 07:36 AM
Response to Original message
61. K&R n/t
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tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 08:13 AM
Response to Original message
63. A kick for the sad truth...
n/t
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OneBlueSky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 08:48 AM
Response to Original message
68. here's what I don't understand . . . (then again, maybe I do) . . .
Edited on Wed Aug-13-08 08:49 AM by OneBlueSky
hard evidence of fraud in both the 2000 and 2004 presidential elections (and the 2000 off-year election) has been readily available and published estensively on the net for at least the past six years . . . the failure of our "representatives" in Congress to address these crimes and to ensure that they can't/won't happen again this year means either

a. they don't believe the evidence, or

b. they believe the evidence and have other reasons for not acting.


whatever the reason, the failure of Congress to act virtually ensures that what happened in 2000 and in 2004 can and will happen again in 2008 . . . and, knowing this, they STILL refuse to act . . .

which leads one to conclude that what we are facing in 2008 is indeed a "military-industrial-academic-media-Congressional complex" . . . in other words, with a few notable exceptions, they're all in on it, i.e. they can't be part of the solution because they are all part of the problem . . .
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nikto Donating Member (414 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-13-08 05:06 PM
Response to Original message
71. OBAMA/DEAN or OBAMA/FEINGOLD
If America were truly sensible.
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classysassy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-14-08 02:09 PM
Response to Original message
75. The crooks
if this election is stolen,take cover,there will be riots like this country have never seen.
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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-14-08 10:01 PM
Response to Original message
76. Hmmm....well if I were that oligarchy
I think the easiest way to assure 'my man' was sitting in the government's highest office
would be to own all the horses in the race.

The voting machines would just be backup.
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pjbourque Donating Member (1 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-15-08 03:38 PM
Response to Original message
78. A Moderate's Questions
I'm totally new to this blog but a friend sent me the link subsequent to a conversation.

Here are some points from a life-long Democrat who still has some faith in the system and doesn't feel that everyone is corrupted:

1. Why would the Democrats at the top, who have a lot of money, power and
access to the media, not make this a big issue? Why wouldn't they just
pound it if it meant their guy would become president? After all, it's the
difference between victory and defeat, which is on their minds 24/7/365.
Surely they have been alerted to all this. What DO the Dem bigwigs say?

2. I don't buy it that all the media are just patsies for the Republicans.
FOX, Rush Limbaugh, etc. --of course. But, I see scandals exposed and people extremely critical
of Bush and Republicans all the time on PBS and even network news. Lots of criticism.
Look what has come out about Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo, Justice Dept hirings,
the lies about going to war, etc. The point is well taken than nobody has
been prosecuted for any of this but that's not the media's fault.

3. Much of what the author says is an argument many progressives make (and
have been making for along time) about the System--how the rich get richer,
oligarchy, etc. And that argument could say that it doesn't matter whether a
Democrat or a Republican wins (I disagree) because of the system that ain't
gonna' change. Okay. But do you really believe that Obama, Clinton and all
the super hard core Dems are bought off? That they're so much a part of
this corrupt System that they won't expose election rigging and are all part
of a big conspiracy?
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 02:02 AM
Response to Original message
80. good luck with logic, cp nt
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 08:04 AM
Response to Original message
81. Shouldn't We Be Petitioning, Etc. for Paper Trails?
Just too sophisticated for me to lay out the problem without telling us what we can do about it.

These things are decided at a very local level. Your mayor, town council, etc. How about starting a local media blitz, drawing up a petition insisting on paper ballot verification, volunteering as a poll watcher, etc. I am not sure what all we can do and the article sure did not tell us, but I am sure we can do something. Call your state legislators. Call your town or city hall. Get your neighbors together. Don't just let this one go, too. And yes, a decisisve victory is also great, but how about rising up against corrupting the one thing that makes us a democracy?
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Ronnie Roach Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-18-08 06:29 PM
Response to Original message
82. Some GOP troll or Freeper posted this!
If there is a heavy turn out for the election then every voter machine would have to be made by DIEBOLD. Election fraud in one state wouldn't even matter! Ignore these defeatist posts!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SljeOKpoKsk
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