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Rhiannon12866 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 01:42 AM
Original message
The gay marriage 'debate'
Published: Friday, April 24, 2009

When you argue against gay marriage, you don't have much ammunition.

What can you say? You might as well frown and be silent.

You just don't like it.

That is what it comes down to. You don't like it.

Religious arguments are nonsense, because we're talking about civil marriage. Churches can marry, or not marry, who they want. Allowing civil gay marriage will not force unwanted changes on any religious ceremonies, including marriage ceremonies.

In a secular state, such as the United States, civil laws govern society, not religious edicts. What the Bible says or doesn't say about same-sex relationships is irrelevant to the debate over gay marriage.

Arguments that gay marriage encroaches on straight marriage are silly. Gay couples exist now and, when you see them, you do not know if they are married. Your ignorance of the status -- married or not -- of gay couples that you see at the mall or in the post office will continue, even if New York legalizes gay marriage.
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 02:45 AM
Response to Original message
1. yup
they don't like it = homophobia
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Rhiannon12866 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 03:39 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Exactly. The reason I was motivated to post this
Is that it was an editorial in my local small town paper. I was kind of surprised, but extremely pleased. And, IMO, it's very well reasoned, totally refutes the ridiculous arguments that the RW keep spouting... :eyes:

I imagine it's a reaction to criticism of Gov. Paterson's efforts to legalize gay marriage here in NY. Both senators, Schumer and Gillibrand, support it, as well. Welcome to the 21st-century, New York! :patriot: :hi:
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 04:44 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. it's gonna get harder and harder for these phobes
their excuses sound silly to the masses and I honestly believe the bad economy helps - when people have other things to worry about, divisive wedge issues like gay marriage lose a lot of appeal until it's only the hysterical rightwing nutjobs barking. Cannot come soon enough, I say. :hi:
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Rhiannon12866 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-28-09 02:59 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. I certainly agree.
People, especially in small towns like mine, have been hit hard by the tough economy. The signature issue of Scott Murphy, our new congressman who is (finally!) going to D.C. to replace Kirsten Gillibrand, was job creation. He won decisively in this area of the district. People have a lot more to worry about these days than what their neighbors are doing, like it was any of their business in the first place... :eyes:

This article refuted all the major illogical arguments that these benighted folks have managed to come up with, and made them sound as ridiculous as they are. I'm hoping that it resonated both with folks who were swallowing these RW talking points and those who hadn't given it much thought before. :-)

The fact that he made these excuses sound laughable also helps. I agree. I was saddened to learn that it took Obama's election to make so many black people finally feel like equal Americans, 140+ years after the Civil War. It's way past time that all American citizens enjoy equal civil rights. Seeing this in a small town paper gives me hope that we're getting there... :hi:
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LittleOne Donating Member (156 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 03:49 AM
Response to Original message
3. Why do we keep forgetting that homosexuality is natural?
Homosexual activity as been documented in most mammal species. Everyone likes giraffes and they are way gay.

If we didn't have marriage like other mammals this wouldn't even be an issue. We would mate with whomever we wanted to and not pay taxes.

Shit that would make us rich Republicans.
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ejpoeta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-26-09 07:29 AM
Response to Original message
5. i agree. there is no factual basis for any anti gay marriage argument.
the only thing they have is their religious beliefs. but this country is supposed to treat everyone equally. and there are many who do not ascribe to religious beliefs. there was a reason why this was not how this government was founded. the forefathers saw other countries changing religions with their leaders. how can a country survive like that!! no one is forcing relgious people to enter into gay marriages or to participate in them in any way. in this country, gay couples should have the same rights as the rest of us!! if i want to get married, i don't even have to think about it!! i just go down to the town building with my fiance and fill out the form and pay my fee. then i go to a JP or a church and get married. I don't have to even think about it. And as a married person I enjoy a lot of protections that otherwise i would not.

I think of my dad's girlfriend. They have been together for like 20 years. After my mom died, he met her and eventually they moved in together. They were never married. Now, the sunday before easter my father died. I had wondered how my other family members would be towards my dad's girlfriend if that ever happened. She has absolutely no protections in a court if any of my siblings or myself wanted to make trouble for her. My dad owned the car. he owned the trailer. We get all the money, though there really isn't much of it. And if we wanted to make things difficult for midge, we could.

But we don't. and it is not because she has a legal right to any of his things, but because we want her to have them that she has them. and in many ways that is wrong. I am glad we all want to take care of her, but hers is the same situation gay couples would encounter. their fate rests on the whims of their partners family and how they view that person. that is not a good place for anyone to be. with no legal standing. even if they've spent twenty years with someone, helping them to have a good life. sharing memories with them. in my dad's case, i don't know if he would have made it as long as he did without midge. and her fate is in OUR hands, in a manner of speaking. at least i can say i am proud of my family and how they are handling all of this. but i worry about other families that find themselves in this situation. partners need rights. legal rights. gay or straight!!
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