Defining torture

[UpInArms]

http://www.bouldernews.com/bdc/editorials/article/0,1713,BDC_2489_2951368,00.html

Growing evidence indicates that the Bush administration's "war on terrorism" is fundamentally Machiavellian. As the president preaches the gospel of democracy, human rights and the rule of law, his administration opportunistically sins against all three.

The American people should be outraged by the resulting erosion of the United States' moral authority. So far, however, citizens are largely somnolent. Perhaps the revelations about the Bush team's attempts to circumvent the ban on torturing prisoners will rouse the populace. We'll see.

<snip>

Earlier, Ashcroft clumsily ducked direct questions from Sen. Patrick Leahy, a Vermont Democrat, who asked if Bush had issued any order — any at all — regarding the interrogation of detainees or prisoners.

Ashcroft responded, "The president of the United States has not ordered any activity which would contradict the laws enacted by this Congress or previous Congresses or the Constitution of the United States."

Leahy responded: "Mr. Attorney General, that was not my question. Has there been any order directed from the president with respect to interrogation of detainees, prisoners or combatants, yes or no?"

<snip>

I am reminded of something -

http://www.cnn.com/2001/US/12/06/inv.ashcroft.hearing/

Ashcroft: Critics of new terror measures undermine effort

December 7, 2001 Posted: 9:58 AM EST (1458 GMT)

"To those who pit Americans against immigrants, citizens against non-citizens, to those who scare peace-loving people with phantoms of lost liberty, my message is this: Your tactics only aid terrorists for they erode our national unity and diminish our resolve," Ashcroft told the Senate Judiciary Committee. "They give ammunition to America's enemies and pause to America's friends. They encourage people of good will to remain silent in the face of evil.

"Our efforts have been crafted carefully to avoid infringing on constitutional rights, while saving American lives."

Ashcroft flatly rejected criticism of the administration's policies, including President Bush's decision to allow the use of military tribunals to try non-U.S. citizens suspected of terrorism, the detention of hundreds of immigrants in connection with the terrorism probe, the "voluntary" questioning of thousands of men from mostly Middle Eastern countries, and eavesdropping between attorneys and their clients in terrorism cases.

Each of those initiatives, he said, balance constitutional rights against the threat of terrorism.

"Charges of kangaroo courts and shredding the Constitution give new meaning to the term 'fog of war,'" Ashcroft said.

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

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[Guy_Montag]

3. What the Geneva convention says:

The Geneva convention protects people who fight without a uniform, just as much as those that do.


Article 4:
A. Prisoners of war, in the sense of the present Convention, are persons belonging to one of the following categories, who have fallen into the power of the enemy:

6. Inhabitants of a non-occupied territory, who on the approach of the enemy spontaneously take up arms to resist the invading forces, without having had time to form themselves into regular armed units, provided they carry arms openly and respect the laws and customs of war.

Article 5

The present Convention shall apply to the persons referred to in Article 4 from the time they fall into the power of the enemy and until their final release and repatriation.

Should any doubt arise as to whether persons, having committed a belligerent act and having fallen into the hands of the enemy, belong to any of the categories enumerated in Article 4, such persons shall enjoy the protection of the present Convention until such time as their status has been determined by a competent tribunal.

[mirandaod]

2. Define torture

as something which, if done to Americans by an enemy, we would call harsh, or cruel and unusual.
You know, corny golden rule stuff.