Evangelicals are strict, not stupid

[T_i_B]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,3604,1297010,00.html

The impression is often given that evangelical Christians are de facto bigoted, ignorant and, not to put too fine a point on it, downright stupid. Their protests against what they regard as unorthodox developments in the church are seen as boorish and, sometimes, fuelled by hate rather than love. Obscurantism rules OK.

But as we all know if we stop to think about it for a moment, things are rarely as simple as they appear. Even evangelicals come in varying shades of opinion and emphasis. And the fact is that some are only too sensitive to the complexities and subtleties of the issue.

Many evangelical church leaders are involved in intense and sometimes agonising pastoral care for those in this kind of situation. I know; I speak from my own experience as a local minister. To pronounce on a topic in a theoretical way is easy: rights and wrongs are there for all to see. But when you are confronted, say, with a young person whom you have grown to love and respect over the course of many years as their pastor and friend, things appear rather different. You may have been present with the family when the young person was born; you may have seen them go through Sunday school and youth meetings; you may have seen them profess adult faith in Christ and become a "practising Christian". And now you find yourself sitting with them and trying to help them through a moral and spiritual maze. No one who has been there can be under any illusion that the issues are simple.

There are, no doubt, many things wrong with evangelicals. But if one thing can be said in their favour, it is that they remain consistent in their allegiance to Christian tradition. They resist the tendency to sway with the prevailing wind. Who knows, perhaps they are actually right on this as on other issues? Whatever, it would be good if more of a hearing were given to the best rather than the worst of their representatives.

[coloradodem2005]

1. I can see your point.

Maybe we could hear from someone who is more normal than the Tim LaHayes, Jerry Falwells and Pat Robertsons of the world. Though, having spent 3 years in an evangelical church, even the best of them have their idiosynchracies. Not that they are not good people at heart, but there are issues. The best evangelicals tend to approach things from a more nuanced perspective than the worst of them. Which is probably why I hung around at the church as long as I did before I left. I agree, though the best of them leave something to be desired. That might be because I disagree with them on a lot of things.

[T_i_B]

2. Are you just agreeing with yourself here?

I agree, though the best of them leave something to be desired. That might be because I disagree with them on a lot of things.

Well I didn't say that and neither does the article. Personally my experience with Evangelicals has tended to be OK.

That said, I'm currently trying to read up on Calvinism and I am having difficulty trying to grasp some of the theological points in that approach to Christianity. The best reading I've found on that subject so far is Pilgrim's Progress by John Bunyan which is allegorical fiction. Make of that what you will.

And I doubt I would be able to discuss issues such as Calvinism on DU given the quite frankly bigoted anti-Christian leanings of many on this board.

[ixion]

3. not stupid, to be sure, but I would debate ignorant

because their 'faith' commands they be ignorant.

It doesn't matter what you've done, or who you are, or even what you will do, only that you accept 'Jesus Christ' as your personal saviour.

And it is precisely this rationale that allows the current administration to get away with so much, simply because the pResident has strong faith. :eyes:

Ignorance, by defintion, is ignorning the truth in lieu of some other belief in the light of conflicting information. Ironically, that is also a close proximity to the definition of faith.

So I will argue that while they may not be stupid, the are, by defintion, ignorant.

Just my opinion.

[sage1]

4. evangelicals...

come in various stripes and depths. The press portrays them as one way, extremists, and thus, the public perception.
Of course Christianity has many streams. The problem is that it's easier to paint them with a broad stroke- ignorant and fanantical.
Just as liberals are painted. But that's the deficiency in the press. And most folks believe what they are told.
Real Christianity demands that you don't leave your brain at the door.
The word "evangelical" literally means: telling the good news.
It doesn't mean that you are a right-wing dummy.
It doesn't mean that you "accept Jesus as your personal savior."
Which in fact is a simplification of scripture. Better theology says: Jesus accepted me. That is the theme thoughout scripture: God accepts us, forgives us, and always waits for us. Sermon over.

[enki23]

5. bullshit. most of them absolutely *are* stupid

an even higher percentage than the already sky high proportion of the general population.

and those who aren't quite as unintelligent as the rank and file, most of them are still stupid enough to believe some portion of their own incredible bullshit.

[T_i_B]

7. This is what I mean by anti-Christian bigotry

Accusing people of being stupid for following a certain religion contrary to your own views is pure bigotry.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=bigotry

bigotry

\Big"ot*ry\, n. 1. The state of mind of a bigot; obstinate and unreasoning attachment of one's own belief and opinions, with narrow-minded intolerance of beliefs opposed to them.

2. The practice or tenets of a bigot.

It's rife here on DU, usually towards Christians (just look at the incessant use of the term "fundie" on this board as an anti-Christian slur) but also towards other faiths, as can be seen by the flame wars in the I/P forum.

We liberals like to pretend that we are more elightened the the rest of the population but this I'm afraid this is nothing more than a pure fallacy.

[The Zanti Regent]

6. I have seen what this garbage did to my family

In 1980, ALL of my family was hard core Democratic. Then the 700 Club infected them one by one and by 1984 they all became Reagan Democrats and they all joined the GOP. They all spout the lies uttered by the ASSemblies of God.

The latest scare I got from them was their watching the GOP convention in their church.

Now, their ASS of G Pracher is leading prayers for the DEATH of BILL CLINTON. They are rejoicing over Clinton's illness...

You can take this Xtian garbage and stick it