This letter brought two FBI agents to the door.....

[Hornito]

of a rural N. California man today. The letter was published in the editorial section of the Red Bluff Daily News, on Wednesday.

<snip>

Editor:

How can it be that 41 percent of Americans fully support the Bush Administration? I've so often wondered: Do these people not know all of the horror this current administration has caused for America, and our total loss of respect around the world?

Are these voters not the least bit concerned about all the lies, deceit, and behind closed door meetings that has led to this illegal Iraqi war? Why aren't they all in a rage about the deaths of nearly 820 of our soldiers, and the maiming of well over 4500 soldiers? Yes, these soldiers have suffered lifelong wounds and death, but all in vain. That's right, it's all been in vain.

Of course 99 percent of these soldiers served with great honor and distinction. But, it's all been for an illegal, unnecessary, and private war over oil. To say nothing of the cost to us taxpayers of well over 120 billion, and still counting. What do you bet, if all the oil wells in Iraq had run dry 20 years ago, do you think for a moment the Bush/Cheney faction would give one whit about the Iraqi people? This administration has a penchant for linking "terrorism" -think 9/11 - to every comment they make. Cut taxes for the super rich and the corporations, send our jobs overseas, cut the social benefits for the poor, "hiss" the term "liberal" as if it was a dirty four-letter word. And calla program by some good sounding name, but turn around and do just the opposite. This administration has such a vile hate for anyone who is not rich and not a big contributor to the Republican Party.

But, I soon realized something. These "Bush Supporters" would elect "Attila the Hun" to our White house if he promised these features: put religion into all public schools, courts, and government offices. Remove any laws restricting gun ownership. Deport all homosexuals. Make the death penalty apply to overtime parking. Ban abortions for all reasons. And make those awful, disgusting immigrants go back to where they came from.

Well, we haven't had a "true" democracy in America for well over 100 years. Nope. Our elections are 100 percent under the control of the super rich and the giant corporations. What's next? Will it take another revolution to regain the great nation of America as we once knew it? Dare I hope?

Donald Ward. Corning

<snip>
Link to article: http://www.redbluffdailynews.com/Stories/0,1413,134~26829~2202348,00.html



Comments? Care to guess which paragraph may have brought the agents? Does it strike any of you that our 1st Amendment rights have been flushed down the toilet? I've written letters to various newspapers similar to this one, are they watching me now too?

[Walt Starr]

1. Final paragraph

broadly interpreted as sedition.

[Hornito]

7. Bingo!

n/t

[Eloriel]

43. How do you know it brought the FBI to his door? n/t

[librechik]

50. Yes--tell us more about the FBI agents

The link only leads to the letter as above. How do we know agents got involved?

[Hornito]

58. I called the guy to compliment him about his letter. His number is

in the phonebook. In the course of our conversation, he told me about his encounter. Any more questions? Sorry I was so tardy in reply, but it was dinner time out here.

On edit: I advised Mr. Ward to contact Sen. Feinstein and Sen. Boxer first thing tomorrow about his "visit", and also to contact the press about it, and the ACLU, and MoveOn. His local congresscritters are all right-wing Repugs, who wouldn't give him the time of day. Its WAY conservative in far northern CA, with a couple of exceptions (Mendo-Humboldt, and Chico). Mr. Ward sounded like a nice, normal person, albeit, a wee bit upset over his harrasment, and the state of our nation under these fascist bastards. He also mentioned that he was a veteran.

[Sugarbleus]

48. Yep, that was my guess also....

Geeeez, I've got in laws living up there. I need to call them. I'm sorry for the author's woes but I applaud his courage and convictions to write it...to STICK IT RIGHT OUT THERE IN THE PUBLICS FACE.

I'm hoping to follow that link and find out more. I wouldn't have believed someone from that area would be that "liberal". The area seems a wee bit conservative to me (outside of Chico that is).

Thanks for this post.

[Beatrix]

55. Sedition act was repealed

long ago.

[Ms. Clio]

66. And various forms of it have been resurrected

several times since.

[Hornito]

68. The Patriot Act, is nothing more than a thinly veiled Sedition Act,

with even broader interpretations, suitable for a fascist regime.

[Vickers]

2. "Will it take another revolution"

Insurrection, baby!

[kaitykaity]

3. Um . . .

"Will it take a revolution . . . ?"

[Walt Starr]

8. The weird thing about it is Freepers used much more direct

and precise seditious language throughout the Clinton administration with no consequences whatsoever.

Now the Bush is president, merely questioning whether another revolution will be necessary gets you an FBI visit.

[Octafish]

19. Odd that.

You hit the nail on the head, Walt Starr! The Reich-wing nutjobs can act with impunity -- so long as their wrath is directed toward a Liberal. Anyone questions the Establishment or the status-quo, though, and it's lights-out for Liberty.

PS: Thanks for saying what you did regarding your vote in November on another thread. It is much appreciated coming from any DUer. Knowing you through your writings here, it's personally gratifying. Thanks, DU Friend!

[givemebackmycountry]

26. Televised?

Gil Scott Heron told us 30 years ago that the "Revolution will not be televised"
Bullshit.
The cable network news channels would bust a nut if these days were like the day that I came up in.
The 60's and the 70's.
How do you think the cable network news channels would cover...let's see.

The Weathermen?
The Symbionese Liberation Army?
The SDS?
The Black Panther party?

Can you freaking' imagine seeing Bill O' Reilly bust a nut every night covering the Black Panther Party?

Can you just hear Sean Hannity and that fat drug addict Rush cover the SDS and the Weathermen!

Holy Shit...they would be dead in a week.

That's what we need.
Some people in the streets.

Problem with this theory is that I remember Kent State.
And we didn't have Gitmo and the Patriot Act back then.

You do that shit today and you disappear.

I WANT MY COUNTRY BACK!

Back in my day the FBI would never have visited this individual simply because of a angry letter.

Seems they had a thing called "free speech" back then.

What do you think would happen if someone released a song next week that contained the lyrics...

"Tin Soldiers and Nixon coming
We're finally on our own
This summer I heard the calling
Four dead in Ohio.

Indeed.

[Jazzgirl]

51. Actually I believe it was The Last Poets back in the 60's

that told us the Revolution Will Not Be Televised. It was definitely The Last Poets!

[Borknagar]

59. It was . . .

Gil Scot Heron that said "The Revolution will not be . . ." I have the CD. The Last Poets said that "Niggers are afraid of Revolution."

[davekriss]

62. When the Revolution Comes, The Last Poets

One of Gil Scott-Heron's first albums was "The Revolution will not be Televised" (great stuff, btw).

A snippet of Gil's lyrics,

You will not be able to stay home, brother.
You will not be able to plug in, turn on and cop out.
You will not be able to lose yourself on skag and skip,
Skip out for beer during commercials,
Because the revolution will not be televised.

The revolution will not be televised.
The revolution will not be brought to you by Xerox
In 4 parts without commercial interruptions.
The revolution will not show you pictures of Nixon
blowing a bugle and leading a charge by John
Mitchell, General Abrams and Spiro Agnew to eat
hog maws confiscated from a Harlem sanctuary.
The revolution will not be televised.

<snip>

The revolution will not be televised, will not be televised,
will not be televised, will not be televised.
The revolution will be no re-run brothers;
The revolution will be live.

***

A snippet of The Last Poets, When the Revolution Comes,

When the revolution comes
Jesus Christ is going to be standing
on the corner of Lennox Ave and 125th street
trying to catch the first gypsy cab out of Harlem"

When the revolution comes
When the revolution comes
But until then
You know and I know
niggers will
party and bullsh*t
and party and bullsh*t
and party and bullsh*t
and party and bullsh*t
...and party
Some might even die
before the revolution comes

[newyawker99]

76. Hi givemebackmycountry!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Richard D]

4. ?

Second to the last for spelling "Attila" wrong?

[Hornito]

12. That was my fault. Spelling has been corrected on edit.

n/t

[shraby]

5. Got a link?

[Hornito]

21. Added link on edit.

n/t

[myomy]

6. Great letter. Tells it like it is.

.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

34. Knock. Knock.

[libhill]

9. Too bad the incompetent fucks

at the F.B.I. weren`t as on the ball before 9/11, as they seem to be when tax paying citizens criticize the Bush Administration.

[Zookeeper]

37. Great observation, tx.lib! n/t

[libhill]

41. Thank ya

but something went haywire when I tried to edit- looks like the same post got put on the board 3 or 4 times- sorry-

[blackmoonlillith]

10. It's the last line...

The revolution bit. The super rich don't want another revolution. They keep us fat and happy to avoid this from occurring, so maybe they think he's out of order. They may take our kids to war once in awhile for their conquests, offer us mediocre education, and keep us begging for adequate medical coverage, but they will never let it get so bad that we'll want another revolution.

[Joanne98]

16. They keep us fat and happy

You got to be kidding.

[blackmoonlillith]

29. No, I'm not kidding...

I've been to many countries and it's not that bad here. When's the last time a country had a revolution? It's got to be really bad before people start wanting to pick up a gun and fight.

[Joanne98]

39. That was before 21st century mental torture was invented.

They should have thought of that. Hate works.........

[Ms. Clio]

36. Exactly right

We really do have it much better compared to people in countries like Mexico, for example, or Haiti, for Christ's sake. We are a fat people, literally. Regaled with bread and circuses, like fighting countries that can't put up one friggin airplane when they are attacked. Not one--essentially a 21st century attack on a 19th century nation, played out on the television screens that seem to be everywhere, these days.

Anyway, I digress! I think you just nailed it. Hell, Americans didn't even revolt during the Great Depression; contemporaries and historians have always been amazed at their passivity during such a traumatic economic and social crisis.

[Zookeeper]

45. Yes, blackmoonlilith...

That's why I think the RWers are shooting themselves in the foot with their anti-welfare crusade. Welfare is just a way to keep the poor from getting hungry enough to cause trouble. (A nice alternative would be free education or job training.) Of course, there are gated-communities now, so the really well-to-do will be able to hide from the problems for a while. But, they are very stupid and short-sighted if they think they will forever be able to avoid the problems they are creating.

[libhill]

11. Too bad the incompetent fucks

at the F.B.I. weren`t as on the ball before 9/11, as they seem to be when tax paying citizens criticize the Bush Administration.

[Hornito]

18. Not all at the FBI are "incompetent fucks" as you put it. As with all

organizations, there's some good people, and some bad. I think Walt Starr has it right though. Why isn't the FBI going after the Freppers who threaten the lives of the Clintons, and liberals, on a regular basis? Why are the right-wing whacks allowed to threaten people, and our government, and get away with it? That's the question.

[Just Me]

24. PRIME example: freepers "enemy" list with Berg's company on it!!!

In addition to the networking of actually punishing people on their list. That is freakin' criminal as all get out!!!

[libhill]

52. A question which also plagues me.

however, I lost all faith in the F.B.I. on 11/22/63. 9/11 only confirmed my opinion.

[Joanne98]

13. Fuckers

I could kill the Democrats for being soooooo stupid for getting rolled on the Patriot Act. If we get the WH back we have to clean house. grrrrrrrrrrrr

[libhill]

14. Too bad

that the incompetent fucks at the F.B.I. can`t be as on-the-ball when it comes to catching terrorists, as they seem to be at harassing citizens who dare to criticize Shrub and Co.

[Fone Book]

15. Declaration of Independence:

"That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness"
-U.S. Declaration of Independence

[Loreths]

22. ha

Great reference to the Dec. of Independence. Why wait for november? I say we storm D.C. today. I'm personally tired of hearing fright wingers telling me how liberals think, I'm tired of our government, the one that is supposed to protect us and our rights, telling us the correct way to think, and if we don't follow along the lines of government thought, they'll send the fbi after us. We voted for this?

[Just Me]

27. Uh huh,....oh, yeah,...*ahem*,...sure,...*cough*

:silly:

[havocmom]

Loreths hasn't been with us long enough to know about Agent Mike?

Shall we mention him or assume he is posting now and moving for entrapment?

[Just Me]

38. Hmmmm,...gee, why don't you make the call *grin*! n/t

[Loreths]

49. hmm?

Agent Mike?

[havocmom]

54. Bev Harris, our hero on the BBV issue, had an encounter of the federalies

sort with an Agent Mike who wants her list of people who visit her site. Agent Mike said the DU is monitored. So every once in awhile, we like to say:
Hi Agent Mike :hi:
as a reminder to our little fellowship here that the whole world is watching and if we phrase something wrong, Agent Mike's cohorts might pay a visit. One might be cautious with issues such as revloution. It seems not to be a topic some folks with badges take in the playful spirit we sometimes intend.

[Loreths]

74. Agent Mike

Hey Agent Mike, I live in Florida, so when you are down here supressing the rights of many people to vote, come stop by, I'll make lemonade.

[Ms. Clio]

40. well, that's just it Loreths

The Supreme Court voted for this.

Now we have to try again in November.

[havocmom]

32. Welcome to the DU, Fone Book! Great post

Back when I was in school, a very loooong time ago, some students typed up the Declaration of Independence as a petition and tried to get people to sign it. They had a hard time getting many signatures.

It would probably be an interesting experiment these days. My guess is it would get more signatures today than a year ago!

[Zookeeper]

46. Welcome to DU, Fone Book...

Good post, but I think I just saw the FBI heading to your door....

[mandyky]

17. I'd say it was the next to the last question

Will it take another revolution to regain the great nation of America as we once knew it?

I've been wondering this for months now, as we DUers have contemplated suspended elections, etc...

[Just Me]

20. Wow. That's one of the best letters I have ever read!!!

Are any of us being "watched"? Well, of course, you silly. After all, we are dealing with folks who believe there is a flood of conpiracies to alter/influence/destroy nation-states,...just like they do.

Does the fact that we are being "watched" stop me from thinking/feeling/speaking? Nope.

[happynewyear]

23. I could have written a letter far worse than that!

Good thing I never have I guess. Gee whiz, you cannot even express your opinion anymore it seems.

This really makes me angry. :grr:

I really hope this man doesn't suffer any further "visits" nor "consequences" from writing this letter to the editor of a local newspaper. How sad America has become. I suspect our freedom of speech has been flushed down the toilet with the rest of our rights eh?

Not good, not good at all.

:dem: :kick:

[Name removed]

25. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LittleApple81]

28. Did they publish the FBI visit on the paper? Or how did you find out? n/t

[shraby]

30. Time for a call to the

ACLU. The friend of free speech.

[Hornito]

63. Little Apple, see Post #58

n/t

[dusty64]

31. There is NOTHING in this

to warrant that action. The writer did NOT call for violent revolution, although I've heard many rightwing extremists do so and nothing EVER seems to happen to them.

[T Bone]

47. Are the freepers currently calling for S. Carolina to secede being visited

by the FBI ?

I didn't think so.

[David Dunham]

33. The FBI agents acted improperly and violated First Amendment.

[peacetalksforall]

35. Revolution will evolve in the form of people opening their eyes.

Hopefully, the pace will equal the pace of the rights thefts that are being imposed on us. It's a race between the rest of the nation waking up through education - calmly, but assuredly...before it's too late and we are punctured with immunizations and drugs and experiments, brainwashed, and in a state of becoming submissivley hungry and homeless. But, our hope is that they will always need our cheap labor and there will always be a need to keep up the illussion of freedom and democracy and ownership. I hope for more. Wake others. It takes a long time to wake up from the illusions we've been living under.

Protest out-sourcing, killing, vote theft, and our leaders inability to seek peace because of the wealth of war.

[bob2340]

44. I don't get it I guess

I don't see anything wrong with the letter, nothing illegal.
Do we no longer have free speech??

[ShaneGR]

42. I see NOTHING in this article about FBI visits....

Link to FBI visit story please....

[Media_Lies_Daily]

53. Hello, Houston...we have an uplink malfunction...

...ever think that the poster might KNOW the letter-writer personally?

If you're so gung-ho to find the link, find it yourself.

[Hornito]

64. sgr2: See Post #58

n/t

[Beatrix]

56. Required to investigate?

Please someone correct me if I am wrong.

Is it possible the FBI are REQUIRED to investigate any reports they receive? Maybe some right winger decided to file a report with the FBI (which could have been based on no legal base), yet they are required to investigate reports even if it's obvious it's 99% likely BS?

Just a thought.

[catzies]

57. If they're doing it so quickly and efficiently after a letter to the paper

Why where they all frighteningly incompetent in the days leading up to 9/11, and since? And that's discounting their non-treatment of the Saudis and others allowed to leave because that call of course came from higher up. So that's not their fault.

[Beatrix]

61. Uhhh ok

My post was asking rather or not they were required to investigate reports specifically in this topic.

Why are you attacking me for this?

[catzies]

77. What makes yout think I'm attacking you?

I didn't even address you personally; my comments are confined only to the actions of the agents and what/who the Powers That Be deem important.

[Ms. Clio]

65. So they read the letter for themselves, recall the 1st Amendment

and move on to something else, like, oh, I don't know, finding the anthrax mailer, stuff like that.

I don't believe they are required to interview anyone solely on a random right winger's report.

This little chat with the feds was clearly intended to intimidate the letter writer.

[Hornito]

69. My guess is, that someone either called the FBI and complained,

and/or, perhaps the agents read the letter themselves, and decided to make the contact. Either way, what they did was intimidation, and goes against both the spirit, and the law, of the 1st Amendment.

[Name removed]

60. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Hornito]

67. You'll have to ask the guy who wrote the letter.....

It wasn't me. See Post#58 for an explanation.

[thebigidea]

70. Were you pleased?

[Hornito]

71. WTF are you talking about?

Did you read my Post #58?

[thebigidea]

72. I didn't reply to you, I'm talking to guy who hates Carter & Feinstein

[Delano]

73. I'm sure there are more than a few folks here...

who have thought about the eventual possibility of the tree of liberty needing to be watered. That's not the same as openly calling for it, though, is it?

Maybe some busybody reader called them about it. I suppose they have to respond to every potential threat?

[Hornito]

75. LOL! ".....tree of liberty needing to be watered." Well phrased!

n/t