Help me debunk this

[tishaLA]

bullshit. What does anyone know about the people behind and/or the claims made on this idiotic site? http://www.swiftvets.com/

Thanks in advance.

[EstimatedProphet]

1. They sure show a very few of the vets in the support picture

a lot less than was on stage at the convention. Wonder why it is that so many of the vets that were at the convention don't support Kerry?
/sarcasm off

[Capablanca]

11. Kerry war experience

This highlights what I have been thinking all along. Kerry is just another opportunistic polititian who is manipulting the truth. This is what you disdain about Bush. Why can't you see it in Kerry too?

[Sparkly]

12. Because it's all false.

These people did not serve *with* Kerry. The men onstage with Kerry did.

Nice try. Hope you enjoyed your visit here.

[Maestro]

14. @capablanca

[EstimatedProphet]

19. You didn't notice my "/sarcasm off" note, did you? n/t

[TexasSissy]

2. The crew members were lined up on stage @ the convention.

There were about seven of them. The photo in the link you give shows that only two support him. That would be incorrect. At no time did Kerry say that those veterans were ALL of the men he served with. That would be a stupid claim, when it would be obvious to anyone that he served with a lot more than that.

But SEVEN of his band of brothers supporting him, incl. one whose life he saved, ARE SEVEN MORE than Bush's "band of brothers" who are supporting him.

[Maestro]

3. It's republican backed

and solely existing to smear Kerry.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/conason/2004/05/14/gannon/index_np.html

You'll need a subscription to read more.

I'll post more links in a second.

[fishface]

4. It's hard to debunk bunk like this.

They're got a hardon for him and are spinning the story in the worse possible way against him.Fact is he earned his medals and they're pissed about what he did after he came back and they're being supported by an ardent Bush supporter.

Texan funds anti-Kerry vets
Houston Republican gave $100,000 to Swift Boat Veterans for Truth


07:30 PM CDT on Friday, July 23, 2004

By WAYNE SLATER / The Dallas Morning News


AUSTIN – Houston homebuilder Bob Perry, a major supporter of President Bush and the Republican Party, is the biggest financial backer of a veterans group seeking to discredit Democrat John Kerry's military service, according to federal records.

DNC Online
Round-the clock convention coverage, video, speakers, speeches and schedule. Find it all on DallasNews.com .
Mr. Perry gave $100,000 to Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, a group that has been critical of Mr. Kerry's anti-war activities after he returned from Vietnam. That accounted for two-thirds of the organization's receipts to date.

Swift Boat Veterans for Truth also has hired a Dallas-area private investigator to gather information about Mr. Kerry's three Purple Hearts. Group members, including some who served with Mr. Kerry, argue he did not deserve the medals and is not fit to be president.

The Kerry campaign has accused Swift Boat Veterans of being a politically motivated group with ties to the Republican Party and the Bush administration. The Bush campaign says it is not associated with the group.

EDITED BY ADMIN: COPYRIGHT

[Moderator]

23. fishface

Per DU copyright rules
please post only four
paragraphs from the
copyrighted news source.


Thank you.

DU Moderator

[salin]

5. the group is funded by a texas political crony of bush

I don't believe any of those involved with that bunch served with Kerry, (different times of service and different boats). I believe all but one serviceman who served with Kerry on the swiftboat has endorsed Kerry and is working in one way or another to support his candidacy.

[Maestro]

6. Here's more

I find this site to be disingenuous at best.

http://www.disinfopedia.org/wiki.phtml?title=Swift_Boat_Veterans_for_Truth

http://mediamatters.org/items/200405040004

[Maestro]

7. And unlike other high ranking officials

Here is Kerry's official service record.

http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_kerry/military_records.html

[tishaLA]

9. Thanks n/t

[Sparkly]

8. more

http://mediamatters.org/items/200405050004
http://www.snopes.com/politics/kerry/service.asp

[fishface]

10. and more

Baptism by Fire
Crew Members Recall Incident That Earned John Kerry a Silver Star
By Jake Tapper
ABCNEWS.com

June 24, 2004— Sen. John Kerry talks about his four months in Vietnam — it's a centerpiece of his presidential campaign — but there's one thing he won't talk about: the day he killed a Vietcong soldier at close range and earned a Silver Star.

"It's a key part of him," said a Kerry friend. "It was a pivotal moment in his life. But he doesn't talk about it."

Added another source close to Kerry, "it's the reason he gets so angry when his patriotism is challenged. It was a traumatic experience that's still with him, and he went through it for his country." It affects the way Kerry lives his life every day, the source said, since "he knows he very well would not be alive today had he not taken the life of another man never ever met."

-snip-

The man was still running down a path when they got to the bank. Kerry, Belodeau and Michael McDarris, in hot pursuit, saw the Vietcong soldier. Short recalled: "The guy was getting ready to stand up with a rocket on his shoulder, coming up. And Mr. Kerry took him out … he would have been about a 30-yard shot. Which, we were dead in the water up on the bank, point blank. If he missed us, he would have to, you know — there's no way he could miss us. He could've thrown a rock and taken me out."

-snip-

More: http://abcnews.go.com/sections/Nightline/Politics/kerry...

[LTR]

13. O'Neill was Nixon's anti-Kerry attack dog three decades ago!

Guess he still hasn't gotten a life.

[Maestro]

15. Let's send O'Neill a Kerry Kit

www.kerrykit.com

[imax2268]

16. here's even more from Salon...

From Salon...
(snip)
On closer inspection, the ostensibly nonpartisan "Swift Boat Vets" seem to have another pair of significant sponsors with deep and long-standing Republican connections in Missouri. Both are officers of Gannon International, a St. Louis conglomerate that does lots of overseas business in, of all places, the Socialist Republic of Vietnam.


Ties to Gannon can be traced via the Swift Boat Vets Web site (as an alert reader advised me last week). On April 14, the site was registered under the name of Lewis Waterman, Gannon's information technology manager, at 11301 Olive Boulevard in St. Louis, the firm's headquarters address. Although Waterman wouldn't discuss why he had set up the Web site, he didn't deny that his boss, Gannon president and CEO William Franke, had asked him to do so...
(snip)

(snip)
Franke is well known in Missouri as a longtime Republican Party activist and financier. In 1976, he managed John Danforth's victorious Senate campaign; two years later, he ran unsuccessfully for Congress. He also failed in an attempt to resuscitate the defunct St. Louis Globe-Democrat (which was, despite its name, a staunchly Republican newspaper) in 1986. Before the Globe-Democrat finally went under in 1987, Franke had obtained a commitment from the state industrial development authority -- all of whose members were appointed by then Gov. John Ashcroft -- to raise $9 million in tax-exempt revenue bonds to keep the paper afloat.

Last June, Franke gave the maximum $2,000 to the Bush-Cheney campaign, and he has since donated an additional $2,000 to House Majority Leader Tom DeLay's political action committee, Americans for a Republican Majority, and $2,000 more to Keep Our Majority, the PAC operated by House Speaker Dennis Hastert.
(snip)

there's more there...just sign up for the day pass and read the rest of it...

[madmom]

17. a thought about swiftvets against Kerry...

is anyone familiar with the phrase"I think thou doest protest to much". Is it possible that they want Kerry silenced about these atrocities because they are the ones who did them? Think about it spread the word make others think about it maybe they will shut up then.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

18. Here's the problem with groups like swiftvets.com The links on this

thread debunk them and show their origins/support thoroughly.

But you see, Rove doesn't care about this. Because they recognize that the huge majority of voters on BOTH sides, including theirs, don't follow any of this too closely and will never be aware of the debunking.

Most only have to know that there's some group of swift boat vets that say Kerry is a shithead, and that's good enough for them. I hear the results of this frequently here in TX. "Yeah Kerry likes to go on about his Vietnam service but did you know something like 17 out of 20 of the surviving veterans of those boats, I'm not too clear on the numbers but I heard it on the radio, are against him?"

So you see, just the very formation and existence of such a group, or of some pimp like John O'Neill, works. Because all the KoolAid drinkers want to know is that there is such a thing, that reinforces their prejudice. Even if you try to explain about the group or provide other info, they usually DON'T WANT to know. Sad but true.

The only thing we can do is to promote truth to those who are inclined to listen, and get our side out to vote.

[RobertSeattle]

20. Ask any of these swift boat a-holes one thing...

If John Kerry had won the Medal of Honor and it was indisputable, would you STILL not vote for him?

BTW, I still wait for Swift Boat Vets Against Obama any day now...

[soggy]

21. saw this today on snopes...

http://www.snopes.com/politics/kerry/swift.asp

it's hard to debunk an opinion, but a great deal has been blown way out of proportion, as all but one of kerry's "shipmates" never actually served at all with kerry.

[yankeedem]

22. Sounds like the Arkansas Project

all over again. Get ready for 8 years of smears.

Two days before the election, one of these groups will claim that JFKerry was in the back seat when Ted Kennedy had his accident, and not only that he held Mary Jo's head under water.

[Johnny B. Goode]

24. Stupid conservatives

The stinking' conservatives are just trying to make people believe that vets and soldiers are on their side. Before they go attacking John Kerry's record they should take a look at Bush's!