With the overwhelming support that was shown for the

[FatSlob]

gay marriage ban in Missouri, what does that mean for the rest of the country? I rather suspect that about 1/2 of states will end up with a ban. What implications will that have for the "full faith and credit" clause of the Constitution?

[dflprincess]

1. The problem with putting civil rights to a popular vote is that

the people who aren't part of the group affected and aren't all bent out of shape about the issue are apt not to show up to vote.

I have a cousin in KC she is pretty apolitical but, last time we talked she said she doesn't see what the big deal about Gay Marriage is and why shouldn't Gays get married? Did she bother to vote? No, it's just not a big issue for her. (I'm not saying she's right, I'm just saying that's probably the attitude of a lot of people who don't oppose Gay Marriage but don't see it as an issue that affects them.)

[FatSlob]

2. Are you saying that...

...this type of issue is more likely to cause those vehemently opposed to gay marriage (the Falwell crowd) to flock to the polls, while the masses aren't motivated to actually do something?

[democratreformed]

3. I think that's what she (or he) is saying.

Most people don't think deep enough to see that loss of civil liberties for one group makes it easier for all groups to eventually lose them. It's sad, but it's true.

[FatSlob]

4. I can't believe that I never thought of that before.

[MaryH]

6. Missouri is full of Evangelicals and

Pentacostals. They don't care about Constitutional Rights. All they care is that they get their way. Kansas is the same way.

It's not a matter of "deep thinking" about an issue. They are against abortion rights and gay marriage so they will vote to ban it.
What other people think about it is not the issue. They want the US to be a certain way - and that's all that matters.

I know. I live here amongst them.

I don't get it. This world has way too many people on it. If we don't start paying attention the world won't be able to support anyone. But - that is not important. What is important is that people are "killing" innocents by the hundreds of thousands.

[democratreformed]

7. Yeah, I know you're right too.

I live amongst them too. Central Arkansas here. A large part of my dad's family is Pentecostal.

Everything you said is true.

[MaryH]

8. I don't know which is worse

Evangelicals or Pentacostals. World was created 5,000 years ago complete with geological record. Adam was a real guy.

Don't know if Pentacostals are big the "Rapture" like the Evangelicals.

Interesting to study - hard to live with.

Here, we just never talk about anything. If we do we just get into a big fight. We just talk about the weather a lot.

I am always so taken aback when people discuss abortion rights out loud. Or gay rights. I always look around to see who is listening.

[democratreformed]

9. Sounds alot like here.

Pentecostals are definitely big on the "rapture". And all the fire and brimstone talk. When I was young, I used to go to church with my granma some. When I was about 12 or 13, I once walked out b/c it was Mother's Day and the preacher was saying that "mothers who aren't in 'the church' aren't fit to be mothers" and "their children are the worst children around", etc. I left that church and walked home. Never went back. When I was older, I got in an argument with one of my cousins about my grandpa going to hell. I told her I had seen him, during the last year or so of his life, in church, actually crying and distraught because he couldn't manage to get the "Holy Ghost". How wrong is that? She said that we mere mortals just don't always know what's in someone's heart to keep them from being "saved". I basically told her that was the biggest bunch of crap I had ever heard. My grandpa went to church regularly but just didn't have that "magic moment" that the others looked for.

My husband says that he went to church with his grandparents once. He says when all the ppl. started "shouting" and jumping around, it scared him to death. He says he hid under the pew. He never went back either.

All in all, the Pentecostals and Evangelicals are a pretty close minde lot. We pretty much don't discuss the things you mentioned either unless we know we're with more open-minded individuals. Or, if you're in public, you talk very quietly - sometimes even in whispers.

One of the most striking things that has happened to me in the past three years is when I was talking to someone outside a high school basketball game. We were discussing our non-agreement with the war. We were both whispering and looking around to make sure noone else slipped up on us.

[MaryH]

10. Thank you for your response

I didn't realize- until I started reading this board - how much of the time I don't say what I think. I just think it because to say it would cause trouble and immediate disagreement.

So - I don't really have free speech. But I do still have freedom of thought.

I would never, ever bring up abortion or gay marriage at work. I also never say much about being a Democrat. My boss is a fierce Republican. His whole family is.

The people I work with really don't know much about politics - don't listen to the News much - don't really think about things much. So it will be easy for them to still vote Republican.

[dflprincess]

5. Sadly, yes that is what I'm saying.

Again, I didn't say it was right - I just suspect that's the way people are. Look at what voter turn out ususally is in this country - there's a lot of people who won't bother to vote on any issue (or for a candidate) unless they believe it affects them directly.

However, I would love to be proved wrong on this.