Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Dammit. A whole *new* kind of vote fraud

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU
 
WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-09-04 11:55 PM
Original message
Dammit. A whole *new* kind of vote fraud
This happened in Kansas City. Received via email:

==

I want to warn you about a new kind of voter fraud we just learned about
the hard way yesterday. Most of you know my son Joseph. When my family
went to the polls to vote, Ben and I were able to, but Joseph, who had
been on the rolls and voted in the last election, was unable to because
his name did not appear on the voter registration rolls for our
precinct. At the time this happened, only about 5 or 6 people came and
went in the polling place (midday), but one other man, a regular all the
poll workers recognized, also found he was off the rolls. He left before
we finished trying to clear it up and before we could offer him a ride
downtown to the Election Commission, where we went next (and spent much
of the hottest afternoon this year). We never saw him down there and
figure he probably didn't go because of work or transportation. Or maybe
just the hassle.

We assumed it was just some computer glitch. At 18th & Walnut, they were
swamped, but we waited. It turned out that Joseph had been reregistered
by someone who had his birth date and the last four digits of his SS# at
a new address in another precinct. 5420 Locust, to be exact. (We live at
1115 E. 76th St.) Joseph was concerned about identity theft, naturally,
but the director of elections, who had had to take his case, assured him
that it was simple voter fraud. She was seeing a lot of it. She said an
organization had paid someone to reregister him. When he asked how they
could have his personal information, she said it was because
organizations could and did buy the rolls and that info was on them.
(Incidentally, this is no criticism of the Election Commission. They
handled it as well as they could under the circumstances.)

This is a nearly flawless scheme of voter fraud. No one is thrown off
the rolls, so no red flags in the system go up. But when you're moved to
another precinct on the rolls without your knowledge, the only way you
can vote is to go down to the central office and wait to have it taken
care of individually. People move and reregister every day, and
legitimate organizations like Rock the Vote often send in bundles of
registrations from events. You can't even learn the true extent of it
since many voters can't take the time from work or haven't the
transportation to go downtown and spend hours straightening out so they
can vote. And without them doing that, it looks just like a legitimate
change-of-address.

We don't think it's any coincidence that we live in a predominantly
African American, overwhelmingly Democratic precinct. Last night at an
event at the Kerry headquarters in town, I spoke with an African
American woman who had three friends at work all suddenly gone from the
rolls of their normal polling place. All live in different mostly black,
strongly Democratic precincts. None of them went downtown. All had to go
on to work. Look at November and see what we're facing.

Joseph has given the state Kerry campaign a written statement about
this. After he posted it on his live journal to encourage his friends to
check their registration before November or vote absentee, a reporter
from the Pitch interviewed him by phone and a representative of the
Western Missouri ACLU asked him to send a statement to them, which he's
doing. I think we need to get the word out about this as widely as
possible and encourage people to check their voter registration address
before the elections or vote ahead of time by absentee ballot (where the
discrepancy will show up before the election and can be fixed).

You all know how critical this election is. Please pass this information
on to everyone you can, and take any opportunity you have to publicize
it so people will know about it and protect their right to vote.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
ParanoidPat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-09-04 11:58 PM
Response to Original message
1. Not really new Will.....
.....Just getting more exposure! :evilfrown:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-09-04 11:58 PM
Response to Original message
2. If there's a bright side, it's that this sounds like retail theft
rather than Diebold/ES&S/Sequoia-style wholesale vote theft.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:15 AM
Response to Reply #2
9. but still could be organized on a massive scale
therein lies the problem.

There should be a check of three forms of identification for any reregistration done through the mail, and a 90-day deadline before the election.

I just changed my registration in March, and anyone who had my SS# could have done it. Piece of cake.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:02 AM
Response to Original message
3. By Any Means Necessary
That's our real problem. They will stop at nothing, they have not qualms. There's no such thing in their world as ethics or honor or doing what's right. They will lie cheat and steal and that's just our problem.

Is this the only planet I can live on?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:07 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. Audio won''t play..........the work of trollsaboteurs??????
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:08 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. oops, disregard...........wrong post
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Oilwellian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:16 AM
Response to Reply #3
10. Did you read Ray McGovern's piece?
"Whatever it takes"

On Friday I listened to a reporter asking a tourist in Washington, DC, whether he felt inconvenienced by all the blockages and barriers occasioned by the heightened alert. While the tourist acknowledged that the various barriers and inspections made it difficult to get from one place to another, he made his overall reaction quite clear: "Safety first! I don’t want to see another 9/11. Whatever it takes!" I was struck a few hours later as I tuned into President Bush speaking at a campaign rally in Michigan: "I will never relent in defending America. Whatever it takes."

How prevalent this sentiment has become was brought home to me as Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-Ohio) quizzed 9/11 Commissioner Bob Kerrey (a former Democrat Senator from Nebraska) at a hearing last week on the commission’s sweeping recommendation to centralize foreign and domestic intelligence under a new National Intelligence Director in the White House. Kerrey grew quite angry as Kucinich kept insisting on an answer to his question: "How do you protect civil liberties amid such a concentration of information and power?"

Kerrey protested that the terrorists give no priority to civil liberties. He went on to say that individual liberties must, in effect, be put on the back burner, while priority is given to combating terrorism. Whatever it takes.

Does this not speak volumes? Would Kerrey suggest that Americans act like the "good Germans" of the 1930s, and acquiesce in draconian steps like postponement or cancellation of the November election?

http://www.buzzflash.com/contributors/04/08/con04327.html
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rumguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:04 AM
Response to Original message
4. Britney Spears
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cosmicaug Donating Member (676 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:10 AM
Response to Original message
7. Please don't spread that.
It looks like it might possibly come from here: http://www.gonemild.com/2004/08/voter-fraud-in-kansas-city.html

If the one comment there by a certain Tony Ortega is true, then there's no fraud here. Wait and see.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:12 AM
Response to Original message
8. Just make September.. Voter Awareness Month
1. Pay a visit to the registrar's office
2. Make them SHOW you that you are indeed registered.
3. Demand PROOF in WRITING..make the attending person SIGN,date, and timestamp it.
4. Take that with you when you vote.

If you are "not" on the rolls, you have plenty of time to correct it.
If you ARE..you just verified it, and can rest easy :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
drdtroit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:23 AM
Response to Original message
11. Everyone vote absentee
I've already signed up for my ballot.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kanary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. I do. But, it occurred to me.......
that if someone changed my registered address, then the absentee ballot wouldn't go to the right place, correct?

Kanary
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
KharmaTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:36 AM
Response to Original message
13. A Question...or two
Here in Illinois, when you register to vote, you receive a voters registration card that states all your vitae along with the various districts you belong to...all the way to School Board Dog Catcher. This card is issued by the board of elections. I've heard of several cases where a person would go into vote, there was no record in the polling place, but the person had the registration card and identification. After a quick call downtown, the registars were told to accept the card. Is there a similar situation elsewhere?

Yes, this type of fraud is not new...it's probably been done in Chicago many times over...and I can't see how this could happen on a mass scale in a major city where the Democrats control the Board Of Elections or other major positions. An abnormale change in addresses should be picked up. The case worker in this incident mentioned that she knew of several of these incidents going on...isn't there some king of investigation or public outcry?

I encourage those fear being "Diebold'd" or other problems on election day...as well as ALL college students going back to school...to vote absentee.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kanary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:42 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. I suspect it depends on the election judge(s) at the polling place.
If they don't feel like making a phone call, then..........

I'm saying this because the judges where I have to vote are real snoots. They act like a bunch of sorority sisters. I wouldn't count on them giving me the correct time, let alone making a phone call on my behalf.

I ask again about absentee....... if someone changed the address, wouldn't the absentee ballot be sent to the wrong address?

Kanary
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Senior citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 12:57 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. Yes, it would, Kanary

So it probably pays to take the time to check with the registrar in September, just to be sure.

I wonder, when you get something like this straightened out, does the registrar strike the fraudulent voter from the rolls? Otherwise your vote would still be cancelled out by a fraudulent vote.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kanary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. Speaking of senior citizens...... ^_^
I live around a lot of elderly people, and know that there is no way they will even be able to go to all this effort.

This whole thing makes me sick.

That one very twisted group of people has taken over this beautiful country is a CRIME.

Kanary, who also wonders about the fraudulent voter being struck out.........
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
KharmaTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 01:16 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. It's Your Right...Don't Let The Judges Intimidate
You should have a Democratic poll judge whose job is to make sure you cast your vote. He/she isn't doing their job if you don't feel free in going into your polling place.

At the least, get the names of any Judges that is giving you a tough time, and if it's a serious problem, I'd call the board of elections and write a letter to your local paper describing what happened.

When I voted absentee...in the stone ages...I went to Village Hall to pick up my ballot. Several of the kids we registered here, who are going off to college, also went to the local Village Hall and was able to get a ballot (or when they become available) with just their voter ID card and Drivers license.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kanary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 01:19 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. Please...... don't make it like it's somehow my fault....
Edited on Tue Aug-10-04 01:21 AM by Kanary
Last year I filed a formal complaint. I do my best. If I threatened a judge to make her make a call, they'd just call the cops on me. There's only so much that I can do.

I have a lot of health problems, and can't make this a career.

A little understanding, eh?

Kanary
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
KharmaTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 02:21 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. Definite Understanding
I'm not aware of your situation and don't think I was accusing you of anything. I'm just surprised that if you're having problems voting or with judges the Democratic party would like to hear about it...moreso if it's one of their own.

I just want as many of us at the polls on Nov. 2 (I tell Repugnicans that due to the heighten security threat the election has been secretly moved to Nov. 3 so the terrorist and Democrats won't know it).

CHeers!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kanary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 02:29 AM
Response to Reply #19
20. It was the damned *Party* that moved my caucus location
so that I couldn't go. I assure you, they didn't give a rip.

The DEM party here in CO has been a very cold and unwelcoming institution for many years, now. I'm not the only one who gave up on it.

This year, the Kucitizens, and then the Miles supporters, got so organized that they made quite a bit of headway into the party, much to the consternation of the party "regulars". I wish you could see the nasty letters they ("regulars") wrote.

No, thinking that my party would come rushing to my aid is a fantasy.

Your wording was an assumption that I wasn't doing anything. We need to stop and take a breath and *learn* what the other's situation is before making assumptions. When people have to explain themselves, they tend to get a bit irritable after a while of that.

We don't all come from the same sort of situation, and don't all have the same resources.

Maybe someday my party *will* have concern.

I'm not holding my breath.

Kanary
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nomatrix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-04 04:13 AM
Response to Original message
21. Same thing happened in 2002 election
I was told I chose to vote absentee, when I showed up at the polls.
I know that I didn't.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Mon May 13th 2024, 07:11 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC