All the hurricane news I see stresses the need for water.

[madfloridian]

I thought that was the job of FEMA or Red Cross or the state or somebody. Even CNN's Anderson Cooper was seen on TV in Punta Gorda yesterday asking for water for the people there.

Have I missed the pictures of people handing out food? Maybe I have missed something? Isn't that someone's job? Has anyone seen the "military trucks rolling down I-75" as Jeb said yesterday so smugly?

Maybe I missed it. Our son in Orlando was without power over 24 hours. Our county's schools are closed all next week. I have not heard of that since Donna.

Are people getting water and I am missing it on the local news?

[ItsMyParty]

1. mad----please keep us updated because this is one of the areas

where Papa Bush got his butt fried in Andrew. Those people did not have water and this was all suppose to be under control and kinks worked out if it happened again. Jeb and George are all over the news screaming how prepared they were. If there are problems getting the people water again, this is poltical dynamite waiting to explode....talke about "like father, like son (sons)"........

[madfloridian]

4. I honestly don't know. Comparing news. Wasn't FEMA funding cut?

Just heard Orlando station saying they have some water at some gas station. I have been trying to compare, and the common factor seems to be that help is on the way.

Has it come? I don't know. We got lucky here, only out of power a few hours. Many stores are still out of power in our county.

I feel like we are not getting the whole story here. We used to see disaster pictures of people getting water and food handed out in neighborhoods.

We used to have long discussions here at DU about FEMA, and I believe they were cutting some funding.

[progressivebydesign]

8. I remember reading that FEMA was being funneled to Homeland Sec.

That was a bone of contention recently in D.C. I wish I could find the info. FEMA is becoming an arm of Homeland Security, NOT what it was intended to do, which is helping after these natural disasters. It's like our National Guard, being used for Iraq and Afghanistan in frightening numbers, leaving our states vulnerable like this.

I want Florida to get the help it needs.. because it's the right thing to do, NOT because it's a swing state. I'm becoming ILL at reading the GOP strategist comments about how this is a political opportunity for Bush, etc. It's just sickening to think that human misery is being preyed upon, as it was after 9/11... NOTHING Bush does is for it's own good.. it's ALL political.

I hope everything works out right, and the water gets there, and help gets there... I know it will, because the hurricane landed in a battleground state. Sad, but true.

[jean]

15. if that's the case Tom Ridge should have his butt down there stat!

[smirkymonkey]

27. And the Homeland Security funds are being funneled

into yet another crooked politician's pockets.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/03/26/homeland.hiring/#

"The Department of Homeland Security has temporarily stopped hiring employees for two of its main divisions as it seeks to find out if it is facing a large budget shortfall or simply having problems reconciling the books after the largest government merger in history.

Using current spending figures, budget analysts projected large budget deficits by the end of the fiscal year.

The spokesman declined to specify the amount of the projected deficits, saying that different methods resulted in different projections. But the Wall Street Journal reported Friday that the potential shortfall is $1.2 billion."

There is also another thread discussing this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2218009

[jean]

10. just saw this:'On Storm, Bush Aims to Be Unlike Dad' - what's the reality?

Did they prepare a massive PR campaign for this, are they spinning news coverage or are they actually helping the people???

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=2026&ncid=2026&e=1&u=/latimests/20040815/ts_latimes/onstormbushaimstobeunlikedad

Even before Hurricane Charley struck, the second Bush White House was poised to act, this time backed by another Bush in the Florida governor's mansion. Hours after Hurricane Charley made landfall, federal aid was flowing, and the president was to arrive this morning.

As emergency crews and National Guard troops swooped in to help residents across the state, the start of the cleanup Saturday brought a public relations effort apparently designed to show that history would not be repeated. President Bush, brother Jeb Bush — Florida's governor and the president's state campaign chairman — and other state Republicans showered Floridians with promises, assurances and lists of toll-free numbers they could call for help.


"While this is a day of complete devastation and real tragedy, and there's a lot of sadness in people's hearts right now, I'm absolutely convinced that, in a shorter period of time than we experienced in Hurricane Andrew, people's hopes will be lifted," Gov. Bush said.


At the same time, the state's lieutenant governor, Toni Jennings, a Republican and a former state senator from Orlando, addressed reporters in her hometown. "We were better prepared than we've ever been before," she said. Jeb Bush, as a resident of Miami in 1992 and a Florida director for his father's reelection campaign, witnessed firsthand the personal and political fallout of the earlier storm.

[Cha]

19. Too bad bush is going to be Just Like his pappy...

One Term!

[jean]

2. will Jeb/W be forced to say, "Help is on the way?" The track record

for these guys is not great in the area of pre-planning and serving the needs of the people.

This is not meant to be flippant in the face of the death and destruction caused by Charley, but just look who is inspecting the damage:



President Bush salutes upon exiting Marine One at Southwest Florida International Airport in Fort Myers, Fla., after touring the devastation of Hurricane Charley Sunday, Aug. 15, 2004. (AP Photo/Scott Martin)

[progressivebydesign]

7. Wow he broke a record getting there...

.. how long did it take him to get to Ground Zero?

[jean]

17. yeah and his apparently spit up some lunch on himself too

[Tsiyu]

24. This picture disgusts me

An AWOL slob being saluted by active duty ( whussat?) military.

Go back to Crawford and submit to the liver failure destined to do you in.

Mr. Bush*, you are a heartless coward.

[Generic Other]

30. There's 2 marines who could have been providing emergency support

instead of sweltering ueslessly in full dress uniform.

[Digit]

53. Dressed up for the cameras?

Seems kind of silly when you have very high humidity.
Yep, they seem dressed for photo-ops.

[DemBones DemBones]

62. In fairness, troops assigned to greet a commander in chief are

in full dress by orders from their CO. With Bush* dressed "like one of the common folks" for campaigning, the contrast is a bit bizarre.

[Chelsea Patriot]

47. Hootch Stain On Shirt

This fucking hung-over pig can't bother to show up in clean clothes.

[Junkdrawer]

3. Prediction: Photo ops of help, massive suffering off camera...

Any bets? :shrug:

[madfloridian]

5. We are seeing more and more of that.

I am very suspicious. Will go and monitor some more to see if a pattern emerges.

[Junkdrawer]

11. Remember Afghanistan and Iraq just after the invasions?

the news (especially NPR) was just full of "The US military building schools and soccer fields" stories.

The truth was that the troops were busy securing oil fields, pipelines, and guarding oil tanker truck convoys.

Then when the unemployment riots started, the Iraqis and Afghans appeared to be ingrates.

[jean]

13. but there have to be Floridians with cameras, cell phones and

internet access - surely Bush/Cheney won't be able to shut them down


- it would be helpful to have some Florida bloggers on the scene, like Riverbend (Baghdad Burning http://riverbendblog.blogspot.com/ )

[Cha]

20. Of course, cnn, faux, msnbc will be

using this as a massive photo op for the bush boys.

We'll see what happens as far as the voting goes.

[jean]

6. go over to yahoo and look through the pix - there are tons showing

The People and the destruction.

[iamjoy]

9. Welcome To "Smaller" Government

Really, all these people who say we need smaller govt, can't expect the govt to take care of you etc - are they now expecting govt help? The majority of people in Southwest Florida are Republican. I don't say this to be cruel, merely to point out that rugged individualism isn't all it's cracked up to be.

I live just east of Orlando. I was pleased that Orange County came out yesterday morning to clear the big oak trees that had fallen and were blocking our street. That is what our tax dollars do for us.

I don't know if we have power yet, as of yesterday evening we didn't so my husband and I came up to my mother's house to enjoy the air conditioning and internet service!

added on edit:
where are you?
by the way, don't know about who does what but I know after Andrew the Red Cross was asking for all kinds of donations, water, clothing, etc. If you want to help, call your local Red Cross and find out how. Keep in mind, some of the hardest hit areas are not accessible due to debris. This is why we are told to have supplies on hand. I wonder how you are supposed to keep track of 12 gallons of water when your house is ripped to pieces around you.

[madfloridian]

12. Wonder if faith-based initiatives are supposed to be in the pic here?

How far along on that are we? Just a thought, a random one at that. Let the people take care of themselves with the help of God.

Sorry, guess I am upset today.

[jean]

14. you have every right to be very upset! What you've been through is

horribly traumatic and life-changing. What can we do to help you and your neighbors?

Really - why don't you launch a stream of consciousness post of whatever comes to mind -

what:
needs to be done
necessities are lacking
kind of man/woman power

whatever you can think of - we want to hear from you!

[iamjoy]

23. Indeed...

Just what some one who just had their house blown away, has little or no insurance & has just walked 2 miles in sweltering heat needs - a religious sermon with their water.

[alcuno]

16. Listen - people should have their own stuff for the first 48 hours.

At least. I'm from Florida, as I believe that you are, and we are all taught to have emergency supplies on hand for the first couple of days. My mom thinks she's a Mormon and could likely last 6 weeks.

Anyways, I just don't think it's reasonable to expect water within the first 36 hours. Roads have to be cleared of debris and power lines first.

There are people who are trying to "catch" Jeb and his brother on hurricane preparedness or what is done afterward. Personally, I think the story is the way that all the focus was put on Tampa/St. Pete to a point that these people really let down their guard.

[Digit]

26. What supplies???

When your home has been blown to smithereens, what supplies, where???

[alcuno]

49. If your house has been blown away, you're not living in it.

You are going to end up in an emergency shelter or in someone else's home. I'll say it again, people who choose to stay in their homes need to have supplies for the first couple of days and that is their responsibility; it enables the emergency workers to provide help for the people who need it immediately.

[madfloridian]

51. There were not many shelters that were accessible.

They have been urging people to stay home unless they felt threatened, and our whole county only had about 6. Very large county.

Many people would not have had a way to get there, seniors, disabled, poor.

AND I will say this again.....most everyone has their supplies. But if a hurricane hits the wrong place and your home is blown away....then you have no supplies.

Please don't be so cold about all this.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

61. Most of the people who stayed had pets. There is nowhere to go w/pets.

You have to set that up waaay ahead of time and in my case I have 3 cats and 2 birds. I don't feel very comfortable in leaving them in some strange place which is most likely not any safer than my own home.

[madfloridian]

28. If a hurricane hits you, you have no supplies.

We always stock up with water, canned goods, batteries. Most people do. However if your house is blown away you have nothing.

[jpak]

33. I have a "Go Bag" (day pack) I pack for Hurricanes

It's got:

3 liters water/Gatorade,

3 cans of Chef Boyardi's finest pop-top ravioli (yes, I can eat it cold) and 6 Cliff Bars.

3 pair each clean underwear, socks and tee-shirts

one pair clean shorts (all clothes in ziplocks)

a roll of toilet paper (in a ziplock)

a small box of baby wipes

a couple large garbage bags and extra ziplocks

my ultra light rain gear

a few plastic disposable bowls/knives/spoons/forks,

an ultralight headlamp w/extra set of batteries

a Candle Lantern.

a butane lighter and waterproof matches

a Swiss Army Knife

Insect repellant

a small tarp with guylines rolled and tied to the top of the pack

a couple 4-packs of canned food for my kitten - he's got a carry-on kennel with more food and water in it.

and my passport/birth certificate/check books in a ziplock.

If I have room, I thow in my water purifier, my ultralight butane stove and a small pot (all for making potable water), a small bar of soap, a small towel (in a ziplock) and my Walkman.

I also keep my cellphone charged and have an extra charged battery (this assumes one has cell service after the storm...)

I've been in hurricanes before and the aftermath is the worst part...

[WolverineDG]

37. consider adding

(& i'm speaking from experience here)
a utility bill (further proof of address if they're really serious about keeping looters & looky-loos away)

your kitten's vaccination records (mine had to get shots all over again when i ran from hurricane brett & the san antonio shelter offered free space for pets of evacuees.)

:thumbsup:

dg

[Cha]

18. Water is of the ultimate importance.

When we had the hurricane on Kauai..after the siren warning woke up the whole Island at 5:30am ..the first then we did was go to the store to buy water and batteries and they were all out of both.

It was my first and only hurricane ..but now I would know what to do in preperation. Get tons of water in a safe spot for the aftermath because there won't be any ..and have plenty of batteries and candles ..cause they won't be any electricity, either.

And you have to have food scources that don't require refrigeration.

I'm hearing the problem is that the people of Punta Gorda weren't evacutated.

[SW FL Dem]

21. I just saw a report on the local news

about places to get free ice, water and food. They weren't Red Cross or military though. It was a local charity and a local grocery store. We lost our power for over 24 hours too. Luckily we got it back yersterday afternoon. We are supposed to start school tomorrow, and are awaiting a decision from the school board.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

22. Faith based help no doubt. eom

[BeFree]

25. Water is the biggest problem

Water systems supplying many houses now have many leaking pipes at any of the destroyed houses. So, what you have is very little pressure and possible contamination, and that's only at the systems who have power restored.

Rain coverings are the next most immediate need. Many roofs lost their shingles, holes have appeared in many others and the next rainstorm will increase the damage to houses and furnishings.

Movement in many areas will be by foot only as downed trees are blocking many roads. Glass, roofing nails and other debris make travelling hazardous.

If help is not quickly delivered, the suffering will increase and people will be harmed even more than they are now. Giant water trucks had better be set up quickly and property repairs undertaken as rapidly as possible.

Water lines and power lines whose ends have been broken will keep those systems from coming on line for extended periods.

South Florida has had this coming for a long time. The state should be prepared, but I fear it never was.

If this storm had hit the Tampa Bay area, we might have been hearing about thousands of dead people. Thankfully, Charley hit one of the least populated parts of Florida....

[onethatcares]

42. How can I help?

Is it possible to get thru with 100-200 gallons of water and hand it out? I'm in St Pete, I'm a carpenter, I'm not looking to cash in on anything, but, how can I help? Sorry I can't afford more than the water, but it's what I'll bring.

[BeFree]

45. Helping out

Water should have been delivered already by large tankers.

Cook stoves and lighting will be needed. Carpenters will be needed but you will have a real hard time doing any work because the 'authorities' won't let an individual anywhere close without a contractors license.

When you can get there, onethatcares, be careful of getting flat tires and bring all the supplies you can for yourself... you will be much less efficient if you too are thirsty and hungry.

I have family that lives in Tampa bay, some 600 miles from here. Had it hit Tampa, I would have been on the road.

Let's all thank God that more people were not affected by this storm because the 'authorities' will make a huge mess of it by not allowing neighbors to help neighbors without the state's blessing.

[onethatcares]

48. been here for about 30 yrs, more like 27 and understand the

legalities of working without the licenses and workers comp and the incorporation thing and all of that. What I'd like to do, is not give the beauracracy something to hand out, just show up, hand out what I have, and go away. No harm no foul. Gaud, who'da ever thought that to be a carpenter you had to be incorporated and licenced? Smaller government and all that i guess.

[BeFree]

50. Yeah, like I said

Neighbors can't even help neighbors anymore without a license!

If you took water down there, you'd not get anywhere close to where the damage is. Wait a couple of weeks and getting around will be a lot easier. There will still be people without water.

I went down to Marcos after Andrew and heard stories of carpenters getting arrested for not being 'officially recognized by the state'. Seems someone was ripping people off. Not like Enron though, and not like all the 'recognized' builders that rip people off every day. Nope, just hard-working carpenters giving it a go at supply and demand economics.

Many people will suffer even longer because of the intolerance from the State.

[BrendaStarr]

29. FEMA trucks loaded and ready for Florida --Aug 13

http://news.tbo.com/news/MGB4NPG4VXD.html (that's from the 14th, but there were similar ones on the 13th)

But now:

I only see FEMA head talking to Bush (yahoo pictures).



Then they talk about the loans people can get later in some other news reports.

http://www.theledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20040815/NEWS/408150448/1039

And I caught some reports on the actual rescue relief effort, and I read nothing about FEMA there.

http://www.staugustine.com/stories/081504/new_081504007.shtml

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/9403516.htm?1c

This next one again mentions FEMA directors talking to Bush
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/08/15/president_bush_surveys_charleys_aftermath/

Here's mention of a place that residents can get cold showers, but not food or water at. That would be my first priority--not http://www.heraldtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20040815/BLOG02/40815026&template=art_blog&EntryNo=2
And still no mention of FEMA actually doing anything.

http://www.heraldtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20040813/BLOG02/40813119&template=art_blog&EntryNo=4

This next report says that FEMA is assessing housing needs:
"We are formulating a catastrophic housing plan," he said, "and we are looking for large buildings that are vacant."

And finding housing will become more urgent as more tropical storms and depressions are on the horizon, he added. "We don't want to put people in tents."

At least 250,000 more structures are damaged, he added.

FEMA officials and members of Florida's Voluntary Organizations Active in Disaster (VOAD) are working together to assess the devastating damages and pressing needs as search-and-rescue continued in the hardest hit areas. At least 15 people were confirmed dead by Saturday afternoon but that number was likely to grow over the next two days, said local officials.

But if studies and assessing is all they are about then why were they

Positioned To Deliver Tons Of Emergency Supplies
President Bush declared four Florida counties a disaster area Friday, allowing the Federal Emergency Management Agency to send tons of supplies and hundreds of relief workers to help victims of Hurricane Charley. (From first link at top.

Bush said: You know the job of the federal government and the state government is to surge resources as quickly as possible to disaster areas. And that's exactly what's happening now. We choppered over and saw the devastation of this area. A lot of people's lives are turned upside down. We've got ice and water moving in, trailers for people to live in are moving in.

but then he goes on about how people are supposed to help each other.

Well, I've got -- you know, these good folks here, this is this man's house here. His parents were uprooted from where they were living. They came here to spend the night. And that's what you're beginning to see. You're beginning to see neighbors helping neighbors. A lot of people who have been dislocated are staying with a friend or a neighbor. You know, out of these catastrophes the spirit of America really shines, and that spirit is neighbor helping neighbor. So that's the lesson here.
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/040815/nysu017_1.html

From reading "Against All Enemies" it seemed that FEMA was supposed to be at least right behind the first responders.

Either FEMA went AWOL or the news media is.

[madfloridian]

32. Good research! Max loan is $5000. Unbelievable!

Your home is destroyed and you get 5000. I heard Bush stammering about neighbor helping neighbor.

[pinto]

31. I've seen no mention of Nat'l Guard support. Watched the update this AM

(west coast time) and figured one of the bushes would take the photo opportunity to announce NG help. Seems like all uniformed assistance was being provided by local PD's and FL state law enforcement.....did hear the busboy in chief say "compassion was on the move" though, whatever the heck that meant.

[Hampsterfoot]

34. Where...

Where is the national guard when you need them?

[BeachBuckeye]

35. Need water for sure!

Working outside doing clean-up we drink enormous amounts of water. Can't get enough water. Our power still out and we have yet to see the first National Guardsman although, I heard there were about 200 of them in Charlotte County. Our local community is doing everything possible to help one another but outside help from the feds or the state is, so far, nonexistant. I got a generator but now, there is a shortage of gasoline to run it. I hope more arrives by tomorrow. All the groceries lost all of their meat, produce, refrigerated and frozen products. I saw a McDonalds open today and there was a line stretched a 1/4 mile down the road just to get in the parking lot. Looked like there was an auction going on. LOL! Spirits are high and we are dry.

[Cha]

36. "Spirits are high and we are dry"

That's the tude, Buckeye!

When I went through a cat 5 hurricane on Kauai in '92..I remember calling my Mom in Denver at a phone bank set up by Fema and I asked her to send water..we needed water. She said.."water?!!"

I was having Post Iniki Stress Syndrome!B-)

[madfloridian]

39. That is scary, Guy.

I know we are learning that our county, Polk, where the eye passed in Central Florida, has more damage than thought. Schools are closed for a week, power is out in a lot of places. Many buildings destroyed.

I will just bet you we are farther down the totem pole for help than you guys are.

Neighborly help can only go so far, especially when no one has anything. Good luck to you.

[pitty]

41. Help would be there but

at least 4 DMAT teams are cooling their heels in Ocala since last night. Told to sit tight for another 24 while they get coordinated, prob fighting over who goes where. What a waste of time, money and manpower.

[madfloridian]

44. Sit tight for 24 hours? Tell us more about this. Ocala did not get hit.

How scary is that? Our area got bad damage, just about like SW Florida and 4 teams are sitting in Ocala??

[pitty]

55. Well not in Ocala anymore...

but in Tampa...were sending to Cape coral but now decided to let them do nothing AGAIN!

[madfloridian]

56. Self deleted.

Responded to wrong post.

[pitty]

57. I was talking about the DMAT teams

still twiddling their thumbs since yesterday morning.

[madfloridian]

58. Ooops sorry about that. I deleted it. Thanks for catching it.

I had two windows open in this thread, don't know why. I am wondering why they are being held there so long.

[pitty]

59. Now they are

told they are going to a temporary shelter for special needs people in Sarasota. The fifth change...hope they are actually used this time!

[madfloridian]

63. I was just watching one of these teams at work in Charlotte County.

It was on the local news. They said the hospitals there were badly damaged, and more help was needed.

The reporter, a lady, nearly made me cry...and she was as well. She had gone by the local mortuary, which was equally damaged. They just did not know how many fatalities, they had no way of communication.

They have not yet checked through all the trailers.

[Zing Zing Zingbah]

38. I'm in Orlando too..

Metrowest area. We got our power back last night. They are trying to get everyone's power back by Saturday. The kids go back to school on Wednesday in Orange County. I heard on TV that people can get water and ice from fire stations. I heard in some places grocery stores were giving water away for free.

[ParanoidPat]

40. How close is the nearest port that could handle an aircraft carrier?

It's my understanding that a nuclear powered aircraft carrier could supply enough power and clean drinking water to supply a small city. :)

Too bad most (7 of 9) of our carrier battle groups are off the coast of China saber rattling. :(

[Dob Bole]

43. The National Guard Brought it in 1994

I remember this, because a nasty old man whose house wasn't even flooded took it all.

[madfloridian]

46. Just heard on Bay News9...Tampa just NOW sending Natl Guard south.

The storm hit Friday. They are sending Guard today...Sunday.

And in this thread the 4 DMAT teams sitting in Ocala waiting for instructions.

Jeb's Florida, anything can happen and usually does.

[Junkdrawer]

52. Well, the 5 Guardsmen are tired. They've been doing photo ops...

all day.

Here they are:



And from a different angle:

[madfloridian]

54. Ha Ha. We thought the same thing earlier today.

I do hope that was not you taking the pics, and that you are not in an area with all that destruction. We did think we saw the same guys a lot.

Thanks for sharing.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

60. There's tons of people in Florida w/out power. Naples, Ft. Myers, etc.

Haven't seen any National Guardsmen around either and we had looting here.