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August 19, 2004: As smoke billows from the Imam Ali Mosque in Najaf

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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:18 AM
Original message
August 19, 2004: As smoke billows from the Imam Ali Mosque in Najaf
Reports from Najaf state that smoke is rising from the Imam Ali Mosque where Iraqi insurgents are based and around which US Marines are deployed.

How many mistakes are Bush and the neoconservatives making at this moment?

It is Dr. Allawi who is demanding that those in Moqtaba al-Sadr's militia lay down their arms. It is US Marines surrounding the Mosque in an effort to enforce that demand.

Do the Bushies think that a Shiite Prime Minister will be able to take the blame for the destruction of the most sacred structure to Shi'as? Do they think that will shield them for the blame?

The problem is that Moqtaba and his followers believe Dr. Allawi is an American puppet. He and rest of the interim government were installed by the Bushies and are responsible for carrying out their will. Their authority is backed not by Iraqis, but by American troops. Moqtaba may be a demagogue, but at least he is an Iraqi demagogue and the armed me who follow his direction are Iraqis.

This will be blamed on Americans collectively, including those of us who from the beginning thought this war was a mistake.

In the beginning, the Bushies told the American people that Shiites, who were oppressed and murdered by Saddam, will welcome US troops as liberators. We who protested Bush's plans knew the difference between liberation and colonial piracy and assumed that the Iraqi people would have even less trouble determining the difference.

It looks like the Left was right once again.

The invasion of Iraq had nothing to do with any stated reason given for it. All of those reasons -- Saddam possessed a large biochemical arsenal, Saddam would soon build nuclear weapons, Saddam was allied with al Qaida -- were debunked long ago. To be accurate, they were debunked even before the start of the invasion.

However, there was a naive belief that Bush would bring democracy to Iraq. Bush, who sits in the White House in spite of losing the last election. Bush, who calls the police state-enabling Patriot Act necessary and whose allies in Congress fight tooth and nail to maintain its most egregious features. Bush, who by executive decree establishes a network of off shore gulags were men are held incommunicado without charge and tortured. Bush is hostile to democracy both at home at abroad. The idea that he would bring democracy to Iraq or anywhere else is simply absurd.

The invasion of Iraq was not about making Americans safer from terrorists and it was not about bringing democracy to anybody. It was about seizing a sovereign nation's natural resources and its national assets and putting them in the hands of western transnational corporations like Halliburton and Shell Oil. It is, simply put, imperialism. Imperialism, like slavery, is something based on the idea that some men have the right to rule over others and to take from them something of value. That is the antithesis of democracy.

For years, the Iraqi people have been faced with a number of ugly choices. Democracy has never been an immediate choice; it is not now. However, sovereignty is a first step on the road to democracy and that is something al-Sadr and his followers offer the Iraqi people that Bush and Dr. Allawi do not. The first step toward a democratic Iraq is expelling the neoconservative imperialists from the land of the Iraqi people.

A tyrant, said Plato in The Republic, is one for whom nothing is so sacred that he will not destroy it in an attempt to satisfy his insatiable lusts. At this moment, to satisfy his lust for power and wealth, Bush's forces are attacking and smoke is rising from a structure that is sacred to millions around the world.
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DrWeird Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:21 AM
Response to Original message
1. Pretty sick shit.
To bad there's people at DU defending this atrocity.
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merh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:26 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. Who is defending this?
I cannot believe that there is anyone that believes there is a viable defense that should be afforded this atrocity.

WWIII is around the corner. :scared:
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DrWeird Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. Go check out LBN.
There'll be more, shortly. Probably in this thread.
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atreides1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. But There Are
There are some here at DU that have said and will keep on saying that it's not the fault of the soldiers/marines, that the blame is with the administration. And that the troops don't have a choice.

But this type of belief is like saying that only the ones who instgated a riot are responsible, when their part ended the moment the mob decided to loot and burn.

The troops have a choice, the same choice made by some troops in the closing years of Vietnam. Whole platoons were refusing to go out on patrol, and the military had no way of stopping this insubordination, short of court martialing an entire platoon.

All it takes is one, just one soldier or marine, maybe even a pilot on a bomb run over Fallujah, to say no. But that kind of courage does not exist, sure it takes courage to patrol a street, or to go out on a convoy, but the courage to say "no this isn't right", has not shown itself yet. If it has the "media" hasn't bothered to report it.
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kysrsoze Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #4
12. Well, it's some new Freeper-type and Frodo. It's not worth reading
Nobody else is subscribing to their point of view.
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nostamj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:21 AM
Response to Original message
2. photos


The sounds of intense fighting erupted today around Najaf's Imam Ali mosque, and two of the mosque's minarets appeared damaged, according to a CNN producer inside the compound. It was unclear if the fighting signaled the start of an offensive against fighters aligned with Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr who are holed up inside the mosque.



A blast follows a U.S. airstrike in Najaf today.
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:24 AM
Response to Original message
3. yes -- well put
by refusing to let Iraqis have any degree of completely independent self-determination we are shooting ourselves in the foot.
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jackstraw45 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
5. And the Corporate Media story of the day? GOOGLE...
Pathetic.

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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. SHARK ATTACK OFF FLORIDA COAST!
Was I close? :evilgrin:
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nostamj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. well... CNN has been featuring the story all day
and it is the top story on their website. MSNBC is doing live Olympics coverage... I've seen some Google coverage but, Najaf is hardly being ignored (on CNN)

are you watching Fox? :shrug:
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Tsiyu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:49 AM
Response to Original message
10. What A Sad Time
we are involved in actions that will have long term consequences.

Historic actions, destined to lead to more pain, misunderstanding and hatred.

But don't watch folks. Just keep buying stuff and keeping yourselves distracted. We are journalists. We're here to help.

Screw Reality. Screw the Truth.

Very sad.....
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Dancing_Dave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. Indeed, this is a disaster
It's high time we re-activate the anti-war movement. Hopefully, the big Peace demo against the Republican Convention in New York will help get some momentum going again.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
13. We'll show 'em what Democracy means! The survivors, that is.
How long before we hear, "We had to bomb the shrine in order to save it."

These kind of actions used to be called war crimes.
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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 12:14 PM
Response to Original message
14. If this is how we have to play to win
Edited on Thu Aug-19-04 12:15 PM by jpgray
We lose. Sorry, but even if the insurgents attack from the holiest mosque and make it a target, we still lose if we attack it. Of course, this tactical problem wouldn't exist if it hadn't been for a series of disastrous strategic mistakes. The biggest one got us into Iraq in the first place.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-19-04 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
15. Another smart move by Bush/Rove.
This will enfuriate the Iranians, thus making them more hostile and bellicose, giving BushCorp more ammunition for the upcoming October airstrikes.
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