Bush,Machiavelli,StraussIF NO EXTERNAL THREAT EXISTS ONE MUST BE INVENTED

[Pallas180]

Bush, Machiavelli,StraussIF NO EXTERNAL THREAT EXISTS ONE MUST BE INVENTED


http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article5646.ht...
-SNIP-
"Strauss’s teaching incorporated much of Machiavelli’s. Significantly, his philosophy is unfriendly to democracy—even antagonistic. At the same time Strauss upheld the necessity for a national religion not because he favored religious practices, but because religion in his view is necessary in order to control the population. Since neo-conservatives influenced by Strauss are in control of the Bush administration, I have prepared a brief list that shows the radical unchristian basis of neo-conservatism. I am indebted to Shadia Drury’s book (Leo Strauss and the American Right) and published interviews for the following:

First: Strauss believed that a leader had to perpetually deceive the citizens he ruled.

Secondly: Those who lead must understand there is no morality, there is only the right of the superior to rule the inferior.

Thirdly: According to Drury, Religion “is the glue that holds society together.”<40> It is a handle by which the ruler can manipulate the masses. Any religion will do. Strauss is indifferent to them all.

Fourthly: “Secular society…is the worst possible thing,” because it leads to individualism, liberalism, and relativism, all of which encourage dissent and rebellion. As Drury sums it up: “You want a crowd that you can manipulate like putty.”<41>

Fifthly: “Strauss thinks that a political order can be stable only if it is united by an external threat; and following Machiavelli, he maintains that if no external threat exists, then one has to be manufactured.”<42>

Sixthly: “In Strauss’s view, the trouble with liberal society is that it dispenses with noble lies and pious frauds. It tries to found society on secular rational foundations.
-SNIP-
a long read but if you want to know what the neo-cons are doing, here it is.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article5646.ht...

[Pallas180]

1. The Neo-Cons bible - Leo Strauss's teachings.

lie, cheat, manipulate, create an external threat,


use religion to manipulate and control,

a leader does not have to moral, only superior, and

always, always deceive the citizen.





Sound familiar yet ??

[BeHereNow]

2. Can't open the link-

Who is the author?
Maybe I can find it somewhere else?
Thanks-
BHN

[Pallas180]

3. When you get the page that says it doesnt open

hit where it says www.clearinghouse.com
and it seems to open then

The original title is about dominionism...

or go to that site and put in search: Dominionism

[BeHereNow]

6. informationclearinghouse.info

opened for me-
That article originated on Katherine Yurica's site-
I thought it looked familiar!
Her site is the other one I visit everyday-
DU and The Yurica Report.
http://www.yuricareport.com
I have passed that article to everyone I know.
Thanks for sharing it here again-
it is an extremely important read.
It will be a fatal mistake to underestimate who these
people are and just how MUCH power they
have amassed politically.
Their insane world vision is a perfect fit
with the fascist agenda and the fact that the two
parties have joined forces is a terrifying fact.
BHN

[nolabels]

33. Wait till they all get into a cat fight,

Congressional Accountability for Judicial Activism Act of 2004 (Introduced in House)

HR 3920 IH
and the small but predictable response from the
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1100245/posts

[stavka]

4. Who's Leo Strauss?

[Narraback]

5. I believe he is the "Godfather" to the Neocons as a

"thought leader" to the Chicago school of "trickel down" theory. The PNACer follow his line of thought.

[stavka]

7. Sort of a self-help Guru for Tyrants?

I remain intellectually curious where wealth crosses path with intellectual conservative dynamic thought?

I see it's results...

I see, historically that such strategy for wealth and power always fails

But where do these frustrated intellectual self-anointed super geniuses actually hook up with the pampered sons of the wealthy who seem to rule the kingdom? I'd think they'd all be thought of as D&D geeks and laughed out of the room....

Do they do somebody's homework at Yale and one day get invited to the party where a drunk says...."Hey - this guy's smart! - did you see the ass on that waiter chick!"

[shraby]

26. Google Leo Strauss

and educate yourself on his teachings.

[BeHereNow]

8. X'actly...

His philosophy and writing are the foundation and framework
of the PNAC documents.
Completely void of any moral or ethical considerations,
a view of power that completely eliminates any
human consideration- cold and calculatied social
engineering, plain and simple.
He often echoed Plato, but without the morality.
Plato taught that only those of highest moral character
could be trusted to lead, for they alone were the only
members of society who were capable of resisting
the corruption that power brings.
The Straussian twist was that moral character was
a silly notion, that there was no such thing and that
those who held power should indeed decieve the
people because they were not fit to think for themselves
and not fit to lead, only to be led, at any cost.
We have a Straussian government.
That should scare the hell out of anyone
who even slightly comprehends how Strauss
translated Plato.
BHN

[stavka]

9. Pretty much Ayn Rand then?

[BeHereNow]

10. The Virtue of Selfishness...

"When "the common good" of a society is regarded as
something apart from and superior to the individual good
of its members, it means that the good of some men takes
precedence over the good of others, with those others
consigned to the status of sacrificial animals."
Ayn Rand, "What is Capitalism?" Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal

Guess which end of the food chain we are on
under the Strauss worshipers?
BHN

[anarchy1999]

11. Mindless Eaters?

n/t

Mr. A

[BeHereNow]

13. Hey you!

How are the plans for CR coming?
I'm booking my NZ flight this week...
can't wait to visit a kind country.
The vitriole here in this one is making it hard
to get out of bed.
BHN

[Pallas180]

17. WOW. it's been many yeasrs since I read Atlas Shrugged -

but I seem to remember it seemed rather harsh and unfair - even at that time.


This apparently is exactly how we, the non-billionaires, are considered by the current government and the shadow government that has been working against this government for most of the 20th century.
Well, at least it took them 100 years. And if we are lucky, or we
make enough noise, perhaps we can defeat them.

"it means that the good of some men takes
precedence over the good of others, with those others
consigned to the status of sacrificial animals."

[Pallas180]

15. BeHereNow - Interesting you paraphrased that - I

came across a quote of David Rockefeller which paraphrased those
words:

"those who held power should indeed decieve the
people because they were not fit to think for themselves
and not fit to lead, only to be led, at any cost"

his quote was more that they were not fit to choose a leader
(by voting).... here it is:

" "It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan if we had been subject to the bright lights of publicity during those years"......"The supernational sovereignity of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national autodetermination practiced in past centuries".
David Rockefeller, International Banker




and of course it was David Rockefeller who brought Strauss to this country, Strauss tutored Rockefeller, and Rockefeller introduced this kind of thinking by installing Strauss at the Chicago
University where Ledeen and Ashcroft studied Straussian theory and
graduated the same year.

His theory on governement has been adopted by most American economists and several have won Nobel prizes, even though 'laissez faire' capitalism, (free market) capitalism run amuck without regulations, has always been a failure....as we are seeing now.

[BeHereNow]

19. Ever Read Taylor Caldwell?

"Captains and the Kings: A Novel About the American Dynasty"
Copyright 1972
In 1972, she included the following introduction to this book.
"Foreword

This book is dedicated to the young
people of America, who are rebelling
because they know something is very
wrong in their country, but do not know
just what it is. I hope this book will help to
enlighten them.

There is not, to my knowledge, any family
like the "Armagh Family" in America, nor
has there ever been, and all characters,
except those obviously historical, are my
own invention. However, the historical
background and the political
background of this novel are authentic.
The "Committee of Foreign Studies" does
indeed exist, today as of yesterday, and
so does the "Scardo Society," but not by
these names.

There is indeed a "plot against the
people," and probably always will be, for
government has always been hostile
towards the governed. It is not a new
story, and the conspirators and
conspiracies have varied from era to era,
depending on the political or economic
situation in their various countries.

But it was not until the era of the League
of Just Men and Karl Marx that
conspirators and conspiracies became
one, with one aim, one objective, and
one determination. This has nothing to do
with any "ideology" or form of
government, or ideals or "materialism" or
any other catch-phrases generously fed
to the unthinking masses. It has absolutely
nothing to do with what they call "such
trivialities." They are also beyond good
and evil. The Caesars they put into power
are their creatures, whether they know it
or not, and the peoples of all nations are
helpless, whether they live in America,
Europe, Russia, China, Africa, or South
America. They will always be helpless until
they are aware of their real enemy.

President John F. Kennedy knew what he
was talking about when he spoke of "the
Gnomes of Zurich." (1) Perhaps he knew
too much! Coup d’etat are an old story,
but they are now growing too numerous.
This is probably the last hour for mankind
as a rational species, before it becomes
the slave of a "planned society." A
bibliography ends this book, and I hope
many of my readers will avail themselves
of the facts. That is all the hope I have.

Taylor Caldwell"

She tried to warn us- nearly 40 years ago.
BHN

[Pallas180]

20. I read her novel about Luke, but not this one....it was said

you know, that she was a medium, a psychic, because her details of
time periods seemed to be of things and details she could not have known in the 20th century...


"This is probably the last hour for mankind
as a rational species, before it becomes
the slave of a "planned society"


Prescient. And what I have come to understand about the plan and the planners.

And yet, Communism, Marxism, Leninism was a planned society and did not last even 100 years. Capitalism is the other extreme, but we have
an ideology of freedom. As they take away each liberty and right, we
Americans are more and more aware of America and our freedom and rights slipping away. Capitalism without freedom, Corporations are king, is on the horizon....and Im not sure electing Kerry will be a
change from that...it's as if this country would have to make 180 degree u-turn. Or stop. Just stop.

And that won';t happen unless a majority of Americans know exactly what plan they have in mind for us and what is happening.

It's all here in black and white...We just need to condense it so
that it can be understood.

[NashVegas]

12. Or As Anyone in Media Marketing Can Tell You

If you want to win, you must have a war.
If you want to have a war, you must have an enemy.
If you have no enemy, you must create one.

[CaTeacher]

14. I believe it!

Makes a lot more sense than--the A-Rabs are coming to get us.

[Pallas180]

16. Ahem. Which brings us to 9-11. Real or manufactured?

opinions?

but here's the rules :)

you have to back it up with a link which supports your theory.

[BeHereNow]

18. MANUFACTURED!

ABSOLUTELY!
My source?
Project for the New American Century
document: "Rebuilding America's Defenses..etc..."
The mad ramblings of Paul Wolfowitz, a student
of Michael Ledeen, who taught the ramblings of Strauss
as he added his own twisted thinking.
The results?
September 11th 2001.

BHN

[Pallas180]

21. "Sama was our boy - CIA'd for the past 25 years -

Zbigniew Brzezinski


Zbigniew Brzezinski and "The New Pearl Harbor"


Brzezinski with Osama photos here:
http://www.geocities.com/RepresentativePress/binLadenph ...



"Between 1978 and 1992, the US government poured at least US$6 billion (some estimates range as high as $20 billion) worth of arms, training and funds to prop up the mujaheddin factions.

Other Western governments, as well as oil-rich Saudi Arabia, kicked in as much again. Wealthy Arab fanatics, like Osama bin Laden, provided millions more.

Washington's policy in Afghanistan was shaped by national security advisor, Zbigniew Brzezinski,(co-founder of Tri-lateral Commission with David Rockefeller) and was continued by his successors. His plan went far beyond simply forcing Soviet troops to withdraw; rather it aimed to foster an international movement to spread Islamic fanaticism into the Muslim Central Asian Soviet republics to destabilise the Soviet Union."

(well that worked well, didn't it Ziggy?)

[Pallas180]

22. The Plan - Waiting For The Opportunity - MANUFACTURED

the plan - waiting for the opportunity


Years, even decades before 9/11, plans had been drawn up for American forces to take control of the oil interests of the Middle East, for various imperialist reasons. And these plans were only contingent upon "a catastrophic and catalyzing event, like a new Pearl Harbor," to gain the majority support of the American public to set the plans into motion. When the opportunity presented itself, the guards looked the other way . . . and presto, the path to global domination was open.

Simple, as long as the media played along. And there is voluminous evidence that the media play along. Number one on Project Censored's annual list of underreported stories in 2002 was the Project for a New American Century (now the infrastructure of the Bush Regime), whose report, published in 2000, contains the above "Pearl Harbor" quote.



1) "Rebuilding America's Defenses,"

2) the Project for a New American Century's 2000 report, and

3) "The Grand Chessboard," (a book published a few years earlier by Trilateral Commission co-founder Zbigniew Brzezinski)

all three recommended an imperial US military presence in the oil basin of the Middle East and the Caspian region; and also suggested that American public support for this energy crusade would depend on public response to a new "Pearl Harbor".

This is not "theory." It's fact.




"In past ages, a war, almost by definiton, was something that sooner or later came

http://www.onlinejournal.com/Commentary/011004Hasty/011 ...

[Pallas180]

23. Yes. Manufactured.

Did obl just happen to relocate to afghanistan nomansland ?


or did someone say," why don't you go over there for awhile - make some trouble - then we'll say you're making a lot of trouble and we have to go get you....and while we're there, we'll take over the country so our gas pipeline can go through..and your family will make several billion more and so will my family...kay sama? Sure Sahib. sounds good to me."

There was a deal with Russia and they needed to bring a pipeline down
through Afghanistan and Iraq, the gas companies were negotiating for years but Saddam was giving them trouble...and the Taliban didn't know when to stop bargaining, so the Afghanis were hanging up the pipeline also, - private oil companies were doing the negotiation --One was Condosleeza's and Unocal - I remember the article and I probably posted it somewhere -we could find it.

Their alternative was to truck it up through Russia to a port which would have been much more expensive.

So 1000 American boys lives is not as expensive or 20,000 Iraqi and
Afghani lives.

I never believed Iraq was over OBL and Saddam -

but I did believe Afghanistan was to get OBL. What a sham.

It was oiland geopolitical positioning all the time.

And we should look at Chechnya. That's probably why Putin is killing them..they must be in the way of the pipeline and have oil or gas themselves.

What a sham. But there's more.

To Be continued.... after you look at the map next.

[Pallas180]

24. HINT:

[LunaC]

25. Manufactured, of course!

I know you're already familiar with this timeline, Pallas180, but I offer this to those who aren't......

PNAC 101 - Stealth Coup of the WH and Rise of the Neocons
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=2234142#2237784

[shraby]

27. The shortest distance between

two points..the oil of Azerbaijan/Caspian Sea and the Persian Gulf to export it is across Iran. Did I hear the war drums for Iran???? Only one country to cross instead of several. Watchout people if Bush gets another term.

[Pallas180]

28. Good Morning Schraby - now here's

a DU'er who knows what's going on in the oil lobby!

[BeHereNow]

35. Yup, Yup, Yup-

They've secured Afghanistan and are building
the bases in Iraq, not to mention a HUGE embassay-
So they basically have Iran surrounded- Iran was always
the target. That's why they were such good buddies
with Saddam for so many years. That is why they put
the Taliban in power. When Saddam and the Taliban
didn't play according to plans, the US said, don't fuck with
us, and 911 provided the cover for the REAL reasons
we are in the ME.
If you study the map Pallas provided, you will begin to
see just how treacherous this situation is.
Look where China and Russia are in relation to Iran.
They too had their own designs for pipelines, which
are quite different than the Azarbejian headquarters
plans.
If we attack Iran- guess who else we are taking on?
BHN

[Pallas180]

47. China, temporarily is appeased, the pipelines from Caspian will

flow West, yes, but China and Japan are in on the deal and there will\
be a pipeline flowing East, also, and the Saudis and bin ladens are also partners.....

now do you see why he went to Afghanistan & Iraq - and we had a
"New Pearl Harbor"?

[Pallas180]

48. Thanks Luna.

:hi:

[EstimatedProphet]

39. Manufactured. How about an idea which supports my theory?

9/11-19 terrorists take over 4 airplanes, which hold how many people? 100 each, versus 5? 150? 200?
How many vets do we have in this country? How many people with martial arts training are there in this country? Me, for one, and many more I'm sure.
And they took over the planes and rammed them into buildings, WITH BOX CUTTERS. NO ONE tried to fight as the planes were rammed into buildings? Except for one plane, of course.
I'm just saying...

[Pallas180]

46. EST PROJECT - we're looking at who committed the act and

we think we know now, rather than how it happened...the 9 11 commission kind of white washed how it happened...but if everyone was
told to standdown - then it was pretty easy for it to happen.

[Pallas180]

49. ? ? ?

:kick:

[in_cog_ni_to]

29. The Despoiling of America....DOMINIONISM

<snip> George W. Bush began to wield the sword of God’s revenge with relish from the beginning of his administration, but most of us missed the sword play. I have taken the liberty to paraphrase an illustration from Leo Strauss, the father of the neo-conservative movement, which gives us a clue of how the hiding is done:





“One ought not to say to those whom one wants to kill, ‘Give me your votes, because your votes will enable me to kill you and I want to kill you,’ but merely, ‘Give me your votes,’ for once you have the power of the votes in your hand, you can satisfy your desire.”<4>





Notwithstanding the advice, the President’s foreign policy revealed a flair for saber rattling. He warned the world that “nations are either with us or they’re against us!” His speeches, often containing allusions to biblical passages, were spoken with the certainty of a man who holds the authority of God’s wrath on earth, for he not only challenged the evil nations of the world, singling out Iraq, Syria, Iran, and North Korea as the “axis of evil,” but he wielded the sword of punishment and the sword of revenge against his own people: the American poor and the middle class who according to the religious right have earned God’s wrath by their licentiousness and undisciplined lives.



To the middle class he said, “I’m going to give you clear skies clean air and clean water,” then he gutted the environmental controls that were designed to provide clean air and water. The estimated number of premature deaths that will result: 100,000.<5> He said to the poor and to the middle class: “I’m going to give you a prescription drug program, one that you truly deserve.” Then he gave the drug industry an estimated $139 billion dollars in increased profits from the Medicare funds and arranged for the poorest of seniors to be eliminated from coverage, while most elderly will pay more for drugs than they paid before his drug benefit bill passed.<6> After that he arranged for the dismantling of the Medicare program entirely, based on the method outlined by his religious mentors.<7> He said to the people of America, “I’m going to build a future for you and your children,” then he gutted their future with tax breaks to the rich and a pre-emptive war against Iraq, and the largest spending deficit in history.<8>



This article is the documented story of how a political religious movement called Dominionism gained control of the Republican Party, then took over Congress, then took over the White House, and now is sealing the conversion of America to a theocracy by taking over the American Judiciary. It’s the story of why and how “the wrath of God Almighty” will be unleashed against the middle class, against the poor, and against the elderly and sick of this nation by George W. Bush and his army of Republican Dominionist “rulers.”<snip>


This is VERY long, but VERY interesting and VERY scary.

http://www.yuricareport.com/Dominionism/TheDespoilingOfAmerica.htm

[Pallas180]

30. "Give Me Your Votes ...Because....I want to kill you"-Prof. Strauss'

More Strauss teachings to the neo-cons:


One ought not to say to those whom one wants to kill, ‘Give me your votes, because your votes will enable me to kill you and I want to kill you,’ but merely, ‘Give me your votes,’ for once you have the power of the votes in your hand, you can satisfy your desire.”<4>



To the middle class he said, “I’m going to give you clear skies clean air and clean water,” then he gutted the environmental controls that were designed to provide clean air and water. The estimated number of premature deaths that will result: 100,000.<5> He said to the poor and to the middle class: “I’m going to give you a prescription drug program, one that you truly deserve.” Then he gave the drug industry an estimated $139 billion dollars in increased profits from the Medicare funds and arranged for the poorest of seniors to be eliminated from coverage, while most elderly will pay more for drugs than they paid before his drug benefit bill passed.<6> After that he arranged for the dismantling of the Medicare program entirely, based on the method outlined by his religious mentors.<7> He said to the people of America, “I’m going to build a future for you and your children,” then he gutted their future with tax breaks to the rich and a pre-emptive war against Iraq, and the largest spending deficit in history.<8>

From "The Despoiling of America"

http://www.yuricareport.com/Dominionism/TheDespoilingOf...

Thanks Incognito,

[in_cog_ni_to]

34. You're welcome.

It's happening as we speak/type. :(

[Pallas180]

38. I expect this is one of the Germans the Dulles brothers

helped bring over from Nazi Germany after the war...but I haven't
looked into Strauss' origins yet....just the damage he has caused.

Remember Angleton said he had to pledge to Dulles that he would not
investigate 60 people Dulles brought over.

[Gwerlain]

31. To really understand, you need to go a bit farther back...

Here. Carl Schmitt. If you examine this man's prescription, you will begin to understand how the "Conservative Revolution" of 1994 was orchestrated.

"Schmitt argued that liberals, properly speaking, can never be political. Liberals tend to be optimistic about human nature, whereas "all genuine political theories presuppose man to be evil." Liberals believe in the possibility of neutral rules that can mediate between conflicting positions, but to Schmitt there is no such neutrality, since any rule -- even an ostensibly fair one -- merely represents the victory of one political faction over another. "

Keep reading after that one- it gets more interesting really fast.

If you start looking at what has happened as we have moved from the agrarian, to the manufacturing, to the information economy, you will see how the changes have produced social pressures that leave our society ripe for these tactics and strategies. You will also see how the values that the Neo-cons hold take advantage of the greatest strengths of the information and service economies and turn them into liabilities. More later.

[Pallas180]

32. You mean like this ?

thanks Gwerlain...they knew way back that influencing the news that
people heard and read and forming "policy think tanks" to influence
the direction of bureacrats in govt was the way to go:

Carnegie - part of the original bankers/robber barons of the early 20 th century...perhaps only a dozen families really at the top of wealth, who refused to let go of influencing every facet of govt., to the point where they tried to gather a 500,000 man army to overthrow
FDR (see Smedley Butler' book - google)

Mellon married into the Scaiffe family , Sarah Mellon Scaiffe, who begat Richard Mellon Scaiffe - living proof that their idea of the
Aryan breed did not work :)

There's a Sarah Mellon Scaiffe foundation which was originally known
for aiding "birth control" a euphemism for sterilizing, racism and engineering the Aryan race for superior breeding - a lot has been scrubbed from the net - but there was connection with the original "Pioneer Fund", Olin and AEI, where Cheney is now.

Richard Mellon Scaiffe has continued his mother's interests and his
own far flung way out wild ultra right causes under the names of these
Foundations, with Newt Gingrich and influence over many media outlets.

It's disgutsting. We been took . Over many years. Big Time.

OTHER LINKS ABOUT EUGENICS, LINKS TO THE CONSERVATIVE MOVEMENT:
Religion in Politics: The Pioneer Fund
Religion in Politics: The Bell Curve
Pioneer Fund: Home Page
Pioneer Fund Website: About the Pioneer Fund (including list of directors)
The Pioneer Fund Speaks Out
S. Rosenthal: Academic Racism
Racist Science and the Pioneer Fund
Funding of Science
B.Mehler: In Genes We Trust:--When Science Bows to Racism
American Renaissance
Institute for Study of Academic Racism (Home Page)
Challenging the Racist Science of The Bell Curve
The Anti-Immigrant Backlash
ISAR: Pioneer Fund Grants
The Pionner Fund, W. Draper, and "this moment in history"
Steve Forbes and the Pioneer Fund
Jesse Helms and the Pioneer Fund
Rich Aherns and the Pioneer Fund
Fund Aids Race-Based Science and Busing Foes
Congressman Abercrombie Nails Pioneer Fund
Draper Secretly Funds Southern Segretationists
Antifa Bulleting: International Network of Fascists

[BeHereNow]

36. WELCOME TO DU!

Great publication, that link you provided.
Thanks!
I bookmarked it so I can go back and read other
articles there.
Look forward to hearing more from you!
BHN

[Gwerlain]

37. Thanks!

:)

[Pallas180]

44. me too. welcome

:hi:

[Pallas180]

45. Charming. When some Americans call these neo-cons Nazis -

then they are not far off...their philosophers Strauss and Schmitt
espouse such lovely ideology:

"Conservatives are not bothered by injustice because they recognize that politics means maximizing your side's advantages, not giving them away.

If unity can be achieved only by repressing dissent, even at risk of violating the rule of law, that is how conservatives will achieve it."

[Selwynn]

40. The Link is not working for me.

[Pallas180]

41. Selwynn, try this:

http://chronicle.com/free/v50/i30/30b01601.htm

[porkrind]

42. Wikipedia's article on Strauss...

Here you go:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leo_Strauss

:dem:

---

Read about the Right-Wing "Master Plan": http://www.zmag.org/chomsky/sam/sam-contents.html

Have you read "War is a Racket"?: http://lexrex.com/enlightened/articles/warisaracket.htm

Read George Orwell's classic "1984" free online here: http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/1984

[Pallas180]

43. Porkrind ?? LOL - thanks - good info

:hi: