When did the war on poverty turn into the war on the poor?

[prolesunited]

Ranks of Poor, Uninsured Rose in 2003

WASHINGTON - The number of Americans living in poverty increased by 1.3 million last year, while the ranks of the uninsured swelled by 1.4 million, the Census Bureau (news - web sites) reported Thursday.

It was the third straight annual increase for both categories.
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=3&u=/ap/20040826/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/census_poverty


These figures are simply astounding. Can you imagine what they would look like after four more years of Bush.
Approximately 35.8 million people lived below the poverty line in 2003, or about 12.5 percent of the population, according to the bureau. That was up from 34.5 million, or 12.1 percent in 2002.

We are inundated with the rhetoric of self-reliance and pool yourself up by your bootstraps, but just look where the greatest increase was — children. Would the Republicans have us rescind child labor laws?
The rise was more dramatic for children. There were 12.9 million living in poverty last year, or 17.6 percent of the under-18 population. That was an increase of about 800,000 from 2002, when 16.7 percent of all children were in poverty.

And don't forget that poverty rates have no connection to real life. ONE person would have a hard time living on $18k in many parts of the country. How could FOUR people even manage.
The Census Bureau's definition of poverty varies by the size of the household. For instance, the threshold for a family of four was $18,810, while for two people it was $12,015.

I guess these people might as well curl up and die if they get sick or injured.
Nearly 45 million people lacked health insurance, or 15.6 percent of the population. That was up from 43.5 million in 2002, or 15.2 percent, but was a smaller increase than in the two previous years.

What happened to LBJ's vision?
"... poverty is not a simple or an easy enemy.

It cannot be driven from the land by a single attack on a single front. Were this so we would have conquered poverty long ago.

Nor can it be conquered by government alone. . . .

Today, for the first time in our history, we have the power to strike away the barriers to full participation in our society. Having the power, we have the duty .. . . .
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/mod/1964johnson-warpoverty.html

Why have so many turned their backs? Why is this no longer a priority? Why do we so often blame those who are caught in this cycle?

Finally, what can we do to make it a priority once again?

[wurzel]

1. Clinton's "Welfare Reform".

Clinton made it totally respectable for neglect of poverty in this country.

[Kanary]

10. Bingo! That's what I was going to say.

Democrats now want to be completely enamored of Clinton, so they won't/can't admit what damage was done by his policies. So, the only way most Merkins know how to cope with that is to bury it, and put it out of their minds.

So what if more people die because of that......

One more way the conservatives have convinced Dems to do their bidding, and won another round.

Rah.

Rah.

Rah.

Kanary

[Sugarbleus]

26. Dems began to move to the "Center" also a cause...

I read a piece last night--'JK, I'm not a {redistribution} democrat'(at "dissidentvoice.org) that said Kerry signed that Welfare "reform" thingy too.. Yikes! Is it true?

Even Nixon had many more "Social" programs in place than we see today. Reagan, of course, was the "big bang" and partly the reason that sent the Dems to the center...

I'm still voting Kerry because Bush will kill the whole world..but I'm disappointed in our party for their shift. :(

[Kanary]

32. Yes, it's true, and I never expected Kerry to be any "savior"

I said months ago "I'll be just as dead with a DEM administration, as a RW administration", but all I got was blasted for it. Those of us who are gonna suffer the cutbacks are supposed to paste on a smile, and work for the interests of all the others, and forget that it may be our own undoing.

And, as for the Dems "holding Kerry's feet to the fire", given that any thread about poverty sinks here at DU, I'm certainly not counting on the support of my Dem "friends" after the fact.

Yes, color me bitter. Maybe "disappointed" is enough for you, but the fact that I won't survive this is *more* than disappointment for me.

Kanary

[Sugarbleus]

38. I can be called pretty bitter too........ I try to find

SOMETHING to hang onto to keep my balance. It's hard.

I get soooooo angry, so worked up. Blood pressure goes sky high. I get physically sick, I lash out. I worry, I freak out. I'm positively LIVID some days.

My sister and I talked about this some time back. We discussed the issue of people going "postal" (a curious cliche' at the time). We agreed that people can only be pushed so far; they either forcefully push back or die trying. I think the uppity class wishes we'd do the latter.

Since I'm responsible for the raising of my g.son, I HAVE to control myself. That's hard too. Today, I took a break. We gathered a few bucks and went to San Francisco for the day. It was beautiful; hot actually, and peaceful. We had to get away from the doom and gloom and "what iffing"--if just for a day.

So, I understand what you are saying. Laughter and a little time away helps me calm down and find some balance--though not actual satisfaction. I don't know if you or I will ever see the society we long for; one that is truely moral, ethical, and fair for all. I guess we have no choice but to just keep shoving these issues into the faces of whomever has an ear....

My best to you Peace~~

[Kanary]

39. Yes, the ups and downs are exhausting.

Thanks for your kind note...... it's such a rare thing here at DU, and hugely appreciated!

"they either forcefully push back or die trying. I think the uppity class wishes we'd do the latter."

I agree with you completely, and have been thinking of this a lot. A couple of months ago, there was a front page article in the Sunday Denver Post about the cuts to medical care, and one interview really got me....... it was about a man who is dependent for his life on a prescription he must take, and they want to cut that and make it not possible for him to get it. He talked about which way to die.... quietly, or ......... he talked about immolating himself on the steps of the state capitol. I'M SO ASHAMED OF MY COUNTRY FOR PUSHING PEOPLE TO THIS POINT THAT I COULD THROW UP ALL OVER EVERYONE!

And, yes, it pisses me off that any thread on poverty here on DU crashes very soon. Can people simply not care anymore about people like this man????

As for keeping our spirits up..... that has become impossible for me. I have an eye injury that is so painful that *nothing* is enjoyable, and the loss of vision is hampering everything for me, and has made my world very small. Yes, those who can certainly need to get away and smell the roses. But, most poor folk don't have that luxury.

"I guess we have no choice but to just keep shoving
these issues into the faces of whomever has an ear.... "

Exactly, and I do that. But, it would certainly be easier if we all had Dems around us who supported us in doing so. Largely in part because of my eye, I'm fresh out of fight anymore. I'm basically not caring about much of anything. I just can't.

Kanary

[Sugarbleus]

41. I'm really sad to learn about your eye.... PM me if you want. n/t

[Deja Q]

18. The truth

While our capitalist system was comparatively benevolent from 1940-1979, it had its flaws and it neglected the poor.

Reagan vilified the poor and urinated on them.

So did Bush I.

Clinton was a centrist shill (aka another republican). A wolf in sheep clothing. He did 'welfare reform' but, geez Louise, forgot about 'corporate welfare' in the process.

Bush II is far worse than what even Reagan could ever hope for. Worse, Bush II pretends to be a devout Christian and all of the other cattle cack shovelings.

[jwirr]

37. Blaming Clinton for welfare reform is missing the point.

I am poor and because of a severely disabled daughter I have lived in poverty all my adult life. I know a little about then and now. Welfare reform was supposed to change the program to one that helped place clients into the work force. However there are several problems with that idea today.

Newt reform went too far. It is indeed forcing families to become homeless when it refuses to recognize that there are places where there are no jobs, that most low-income jobs do not pay a living wage and that there is often problems with obtaining education, transportation and child care.

Unfortunately this is not easy to fix. Each state administers its own programs and it is entirely the attitude of the state that counts. If the state does not offer supporting programs that help the client after they start work then it can and does lead to homelessness, illness and even death. However in states where there is ample help to get an education, extended medical insurance, food stamps, job coaches, good child care etc. welfare reform can work to enhance the life of the recipient. I have watched many young people in my state gain a positive self-concept and be able to contribute to their families wellbeing.

[Kanary]

40. Clinton NEEDS to be blamed, and held accountable for his actions.

It was nothing more than political expediency, as was Kerry's vote. Maybe you dont' mind being sold down the river, but I DO.

I suggest you watch "A Day's Work For A Day's Pay", and look at the faces of the grieving families whose relatives died because of Clinton's damned policies.

Yes, I'm sick of all the adoration of Clinton, and so little said about what he did. Those who died deserve better.

Kanary

[DebJ]

50. Liked your post. And just sending you a hug and saying that

I too struggled for twenty years raising a handicapped son. He has bipolar disorder. His medicines cost me over $500 a month in many years when I didn't have health insurance....to have health insurance, you need a STABLE job. When you change jobs, you lose your coverage. If I wasn't outright paying for his medicine, then many years I paid COBRA premiums of over $500 a month...but at least that way his other medical expenses were covered. I also have a daughter, and I was determined that her life would NOT end up like mine, no matter what I had to do. I let them foreclose on my house so that I could pay the part of her tuition she couldn't get loans for instead. (The only tuition assistance we could get was a $1000 grant the first year from the college, and an equally small Pell grant.) Because I often did not eat well, or indeed, many days did not eat anything at all, now my health is a problem...
America can do better!

[ElementaryPenguin]

2. The day Ronald Reagan was elected president.

Things really started in reverse from that point on.

[Susang]

11. Bingo

After all, where did that "welfare queen" stereotype come from originally? Reagan. He succeeded in equating poor with lazy in ways that simply astounding. Lately I've felt like I've been sent back in time to those days. :scared:

[swag]

3. January 21, 1981, noon Eastern time, that's when.

[lapfog_1]

9. Yup

That would be my answer too.

When I was growing up (60's 70's), hobos (tramps) were the homeless
of the day... but they were a historical reference only (30's, maybe
40's after the war). Homeless people simply didn't exist. Then
Ronnie Raygun came to power and basically closed a lot of mental
institutions and then we had homeless. And ever since then, it
seems that homelessness is either getting worse or remaining about
the same. BTW, this isn't to say that the homeless today are former
mental patients, it's just that we became used to homeless and
poverty became something that no one wants to deal with.

[jwirr]

36. Institutions

The problem with the mass release of persons from institutions was not their release but the fact that they were released without any community based programs to meet their needs.

[DebJ]

51. Yep. I was working in Washington DC shortly after Raygun's

policies threw many many people out of St. Elizabeth's mental hospital in DC. They literally just roamed the streets. One day as I got gas at a local service station in N.E. D.C., I saw a man walking down the street dressed in a huge tricolor wig, a bathrobe, and slippers, shuffling down the street with one hand inside the robe manipulating his private parts. This is the work of compassionate conservatives.

[BiggJawn]

30. And almost exactly one year later, I was Poor.

Jan. 15, 1982, at midnight.
I was laid-off from the now-defunct Western Electric Company.
That was about $20,000 a year for working a screwdriver on a line. 2 weeks later I was in a warehouse for $98 a week

It was 1990 before I was back to 20 kilobucks.
In the 14 years since, i've managed to add about 19 more kilobucks to that. I imagine my 39 kilobucks now buys less than my 20 kilobucks did in 1981...

I SHIT on the memory of Ronald Reagan. I hope he's nice and warm, now.

[stellanoir]

4. when

the untenable war on drugs started, social programs were slashed, welfare reform took hold, housing costs became disproportionate to wages, the value of education was minimized, lobbyists got increasingly more control, tax breaks for the wealthy were allowed, the media bowed to the elites. .

and fascism (aka corporatism) was permitted to masquerade itself as "compassionate conservatism."

In other words, ever so slowly, the rights of the individual have been trumped by corporate interests over the past 20 years, but in the past 4 years it's been overtly blatant.

Psssssst. this really hasn't been a democracy for quite some time.

Oh well.

[eyesroll]

5. It's going to get worse, proles...

The overtime situation is largely unknown.

I'm lucky, in that I have a good-paying job that never entitled me to overtime -- I'm not going to lose anything or be forced to work more hours for no more pay. But a lot of people went into work this week with, really, no idea whether they'd have a 25% de-facto pay cut in next week's check. The bosses are as confused as the

I write for a very Republican audience, and some of them are quite happy -- they expect to be able to classify JANITORS as "team leaders" -- with no actual leadership responsibilities, and put them on exempt salaries. It's sickening.

I was never opposed to re-doing overtime laws -- hell, there still were "key-punch operators" and "leg men" job descriptions within the law. But laws should never, ever mean people will be forced to work more hours for less money. I'm afraid this is going to force another few million onto the unemployment lines (why hire a new person when you can just have people work longer hours?).

I think the poor lose, because the poor do not make campaign contributions. That's cold, but part of it.

I'm nominating this thread. It's important.

[prolesunited]

17. Thank you

It did make it, but it seems to be lost in the other news of the day.

I guess this issue hits close to home as I used to be one of those living in poverty without health insurance. I somehow survived and emerged in a better place.

I don't think it was because I was in any way superior. I just got some good breaks and some help from family and mentors.

I haven't forgotten and I don't think anyone deserves that kind of existence.

[librechik]

6. Reagan always hated the poor and workers

He felt everyone should succeed on their own without any help (unlike himself) but to make sure only the best people survived the struggle, he felt obligated to throw hurdle after hurdle at them.

Ronny was a dyed in the wool Nazi social Darwinist eugenics proponent, and seemed to feel it was his merciful duty to help the poor starve to death by cutting their bewnefits. Meanwhile Reagan wore jodhpurs & rode palominos while carrying a cocktail and a cigarette.

But the second event was Gingrich's Contract on America in 1994, when the Repukkkes finally captured the House after 40 years of Dem domination. They have abused that advantage and gradually changed rules, made political appointments and gerrymandered so now their stranglehold on government is quite intimidating.

Shrub has quietly inserted hand picked followers into as many protected civil service positions as possible. They all want to help Ronnie kill the government and strangle the poor. It will be very difficult for Kerry to root them out and replace them with our people, and they will fight him every step of the way unless we get Congress back too.

To them being poor is unAmerican. They're rich and patriotic. That must mean that all patriots are rich, therefore only the rich are patriotic. That is the Federalist bottom line, for centuries. Male Landholders rule.

[jwirr]

35. Nazi Social Darwinism Eugenics

Bingo!!! According to Edwin Black's "War Against the Weak" the idea that there was a superior race was very alive in the United States in the early 1900s. The idea was later taken up by Hitler who used it to exterminate 6 million Jews and 4 million other "unfits". This eugenics idea included the idea of superior Germanic races, survival of the fittest, withholding "charity" from the "unfit". These "unfit" included, the mentally ill, mentally retarded, other illnesses including blindness, immigrants, non-Germanic races, persons living in poverty, anyone who did not fit the definition. This is where the anti-welfare ideas started (imported from England) and also the idea of worthy recipients. The ironic thing is that many of the rw Bible thumping preachers are the first to follow this anti-Christian idea. They want us to teach creationism in schools but practice darwinism in our personal lives. They want us to read the stories of the loving Lord Jesus and practice the opposite in their lives.

[tom_paine]

7. When Raygun appeared in Philadelphia, Mississippi

for the unsaid reason of showing solidarity with the Racist Freeper Murders of the 3 Civil Rights workers.

Yep, they Freeped 'em good, didn't they?

</sarcasm off>

The sad part was the unwritten statement of that day was the declaration of War on the Poor offering a Faustian bargain

Let us help you revive Cyber Jim Crow as well as Confederate Pride in exchange for your good jobs, health care, infrastructure, and Constitutional Governance.

Now what was promised (unspoken) in Philadelphia, Mississippi is now coming true, and the Busheviks are now offering the NeoConfederates (unspoken) a place on the Citizen Corps and in the Right Wing Death Squads, which will probably NOT be called that (bad PR, you see, plus those Libruls had it comin' dontchaknow) and which will probably take about as long to come to fruition as the time between Raygun in Mississippi and the Death of the Old Republic in 2000.

I wouldn't give a bucket of warm spit for those forced to live in Amerika in 2050.

Not a bucket of warm spit.

[prolesunited]

8. Good graphic borrowed from NO2W2004's thread.

[Susang]

12. I wonder how the stats do when you break it down by gender?

I'll bet that's a real eye opener. :eyes:

[prolesunited]

13. More about the insurance issue

Insurance premiums rose 14 percent last year, six times the rate of inflation, according to the Henry J. Kaiser Family Foundation.

Eight out of 10 uninsured people were in families in which at least one person had a job, according to the Washington-based Kaiser Commission on Medicaid and the Uninsured.

Employers such as Procter & Gamble, Honeywell International Inc. and Pitney Bowes Inc. shifted more of the cost to workers, who paid on average 50 percent more last year than they did in 2000.

A government advisory panel convened by the nonpartisan U.S. Institute of Medicine said in June 2003 that illness, developmental problems and premature death among the uninsured cost the U.S. as much as $130 billion a year in medical expenses and lost productivity.

Uninsured patients are taxing the hospital industry, which under federal law must treat emergency cases regardless of whether the patient is insured. HCA Inc., the largest U.S. hospital chain, said in an Aug. 6 filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission that uninsured emergency room visits rose 16.9 percent in the second quarter this year after jumping 26 percent in the first three months.

http://quote.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000087&sid=aoEuMRyykP.E&refer=home



Personally, I think the health care issue is vital to helping cure poverty. How many bankruptcies and how many people become homeless as a result of uncovered medical expenses?

Also, how can people be productive and hold down jobs if they are chronically ill or diseases like diabetes are not being managed appropriately?

[DaveSZ]

14. Reagan

After Reagan, you had to run as a Republican to be elected a Democrat.

[UTUSN]

15. & You Thought the FIRST 4 Yrs Were a Nightmare

Try this scary article on for size.

*******QUOTE*******

http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2004/08/25/bush_se...

And you thought his first term was a nightmare
What Bush has planned for America if he wins.

- - - - - - - - - - - -
By Charles Tiefer

.... Under Bush's slogan of an "ownership society," the Republicans intend a long-term effort, using changes in Medicare, Social Security and taxes to pit better-off and worse-off Democrats against each other, offering all-but-irresistible incentives for some to desert the others -- and any progressive national coalition. ....

A second-term Bush agenda will constantly impale Democrats on the dilemma of abandoning their poorer, sicker, older and minority groups, or seeing their better-off, healthier and younger members lured off to the other party. If it sounds like a political nightmare for the Democrats, that's because that's what it is planned to be. ....

********UNQUOTE*******

[MisterP]

16. Nixon admin: thay began sabotaging the Great Society by underfunding

and "restructuring": witness Sen. Moynihan's "revamping" of welfare programs for lump-sum cash.

[quaker bill]

24. Actually underfunding started on day one.

Nixon just made it worse.

[ikojo]

19. Once poverty could be painted with a black or other non white face

is when the war on the poor began. In the 1930s people saw the poor as primarily rural whites. There was some documentary in the early 60s that awakened people to the continued existence of poverty, especially among migrant farmers.

Mention the word welfare or welfare queen and you can bet most people see a non white woman with a bunch of kids, eating steaks and driving a cadillac. Democrats AND Republicans are complicit in this stereotyping.

It is no longer a priority because the poor have been swept under the rug. The poor wait on you at McDonalds but you don't think about that. The poor clean your offices at night but you don't even see them. The poor take care of our elderly and they are barely noticed let alone thanked for doing something we don't want to do. The poor prepare meals for kids in schools but their parents never see them. The poor transport kids to school on buses and are treated like garbage.

The poor are all around us but yet we remain blind to their plight.

Here is an essay on racism and the welfare state and why there is a more generous safety net in Europe...

http://www.project-syndicate.org/article_print_text?mid=1540&lang=1

The Racism of the Welfare State

Alberto Alesina


Two demographic acids are corroding Continental Europe's welfare states. One is Europe's aging population. The other is the flow of immigrants from soon-to-be new member countries in the European Union and from outside the union.

-snip-

Consider this: according to the World Value Survey, whereas 60% of Americans believe that the poor are "lazy," only 26% of Europeans hold this belief.  Not surprisingly, those who adhere to such beliefs are more averse to redistribution and welfare, and evidence shows that in the US, those who express more "anti-minority" points of view are also more averse to redistribution and more likely to have less sympathy for the poor.

-snip-

It seems easier for white middle class Americans to consider the poor less worthy of government support if they think of them as different. To put it crudely, but candidly, indifference comes easy if the poor are assumed to be mostly "black." This is more difficult in Norway, where rich and poor are white, often blond and tal

[HotPotato1]

20. Which do you consider to be more successful?

1) The War on Poverty
2) The War on Drugs
3) The War on Terror

Three unwinnable quagmires if you ask me.

[prolesunited]

21. Maybe that's because

we don't want to do what's necessary to win any of them. It does not mean they are unwinnable.

What would you suggest be done about poverty?

[ikojo]

22. One of my friends is active in the Basic Income Guarantee (BIG)

movement. Put simply, it is a movement to guarantee everyone a basic income sufficient enough to meet BASIC needs. It would not allow people to live in luxury but would allow them to do what they wanted. For instance, my friend said that if there was a BIG in the US he would do philosophy related stuff (he's getting his PhD in philosophy right now).

A BIG would mean MORE competition for employees and thus would cause an increase in wages because employers would understand an employee is no longer at their mercy for a meaningless job.

Supposedly Nixon supported some sort of basic income guarantee. Of course Nixon would be too liberal for today's two political parties.

http://www.usbig.net/

The basic income guarantee (BIG) is a government insurance no citizen's income will fall below some minimal level for any reason. All citizens would receive a BIG without means test or work requirement. BIG is an efficient and effective solution to poverty that preserves individual autonomy and work incentives while simplifying government social policy. Some researchers estimate that a small BIG, sufficient to cut the poverty rate in half could be financed without an increase in taxes by redirecting funds from spending programs and taxes deductions aimed at maintaining incomes.

[Sugarbleus]

27. Interesting....bookmarking this... n/t

[Yupster]

28. I think I would be a historian then

if there was a BIG.

But who will be the coalminers?

[prolesunited]

29. And exactly how

do poverty-level wages make people want to be coal miners? :shrug:

[jwirr]

45. BIG

The Earned Income Credit is a start of what you are talking about. It needs to be raised to make the average hourly wage a $10 to $11 and there needs to be health care insurance, access to educations funds and adequate child care services along with the income. It would be more convenient if that Earned Income Credit were monthly but then we are back to the administration cost to document everything. This program not only helps the working poor it also helps small businesses that really cannot afford higher wages because they also are on the edge of bankruptcy.

[Disturbed]

25. War on whatever...

Why is there always a war on something?

The Working Poor are the servants of the wealthy.

Soon there will be a huge shift of the Middle Class to the Working Poor. That is the Neo Fascist dream.

The Right Wing Agenda

Abolish

Social Security
Medicare
Employer supplied health insurance
Unemployment Benefits
Welfare
Collective Bargaining
EPA
Public Education
Public Housing

[jwirr]

31. The working poor are the servants of the wealthy

Not so fast it is more correct to say that the working poor are the servants of us all. They are the waiters, waitresses, nurses aides, garbage people, dish washers,etc. They are our neighbors, our friends, our family. We are just to blind to see.

[kimchi]

52. True, jwirr--and welcome to DU.

Everytime my lazy or rushed hindend goes into McDonald's I think "there for but the grace of the Gods..." I can't imagine these people can make ends meet. Increasingly, the job is filled with adults. I worked there as a teen, and there were very few adults.

By an accident of death, we own our tiny house. The property taxes alone are 300/mo. Increasingly we are surrounded with yuppies, because unless you make at least 75,000 you can't afford these little hovels.

If my husband were unable to work, we would lose our house. My father is in his 70's, and when my mother died he sold the house he worked his entire life to buy to pay her medical bills. I told him not to, but he is too proud to have that debt hanging over his head.

I got out of poverty through education, luck, and hard work, and it took me until I was 36. All of my family, save one who is a contractor, are poor. They work in old folk's homes, at restaurants, and convenience stores. I help as much as I can; but they don't want charity. They want a living wage--which I can't give them.

[Green Lantern]

43. This war on something concept

is fairly simple. They stick us with an idea, an issue, that is larger than we are. They use it to shift focus from our own problems to the country's problems. It gives us the larger than life issue to stare at and wonder about while they pluck us blind. They have cover, as it were, to use, for example, a war, to re-vamp the rules for us. Changes in tax structure, retirement, Social Security, health care, etc etc etc.

They sandbag us with their crap and call us unpatriotic when we dare question it.

No more Bushwa.

[jwirr]

33. solutions

The Two-Percent Solution by Matt Miller is a beginning to the answer.

[prolesunited]

44. Could you provide a synopsis or some links?

I'm not familiar with that.

Why do you think that would be a beginning to the answer?

[jwirr]

46. Two-Percent Solution

His book and web-site outline a way to address the basic problems of education, working poor, etc. in a bipartisan way. He says that is the only way we will ever get these things done - stop fighting and work toward reasonable compromises. He also tells us we have only 10 years to do this in because once the boomers retire it will take ALL if the money the government takes in simply to address their needs. It is a common sense book/site.

[prolesunited]

47. Do you have a link?

What compromises does he put forth that you find acceptable?

[quaker bill]

23. When Ronald Reagan was elected.

It is just that simple.

[camero]

34. 1973

Free Trade and Deregulation started at about the same time. The poor and middle class have been hurting ever since.

Reagan and Bush sped up the process. This Bush has sent it into hyperdrive.

[TahitiNut]

42. "35.8 million people" is more people than ALL of Canada ..

... or all of Algeria, or Morocco, or Kenya, or Afghanistan, or Peru, or Nepal, or most of the countries on the earth.

[kimchi]

53. Wow, TahitiNut, that puts it into perspective.

I'm so sad for the direction our country is going.

[leesa]

48. When Reagan started the lies about Welfare Queens

[HEyHEY]

49. Right around the time Gordon Campbell was elected

Well in this province anyway