Some humility is in order. Olympic results justify pride, not arrogance.

[hansolsen]

One of my pet theories is that American arrogance is one of the root causes of the terrorism that has reared its ugly head in this old world. In my opinion, a little humility would do more to make America secure than all the military bluster that Bush has unleashed to ill effect. So in the search for humility, let's turn to the Olympics.

Media commentators are all over TV beating their chests and making big noises about the fact we won more medals (103) than any other country. But wait a minute. Is this a fair comparison??

I took a few minutes and added up the medal totals for two comparable areas of the world, Western Europe, including the UK, and Eastern Europe, including Russia. These groups are roughly comparable in total population to the U.S., and represent heavily industrialized societies that can support the infrastructure that helps produce large numbers of Olympic athletes. Here are the numbers:

U. S. of America -- 103

Western Europe -- 290

Eastern Europe -- 256

Not much to brag about when looking at the total numbers. But that is not the end of the story. We are discussing arrogance, and while arrogance is found at all levels of society, I think I could find a consensus of opinion that arrogance is highly concentrated in white male Americans who vote Republican -- so lets see how they are doing. Lets strip out all the American Olympic medals won by women and by athletes of color. Now, unfortunately, I don't have an actual breakdown of the numbers this way -- they would never be reported in these categories for obvious reasons, but I do have an anecdotal summary based on my own watching of the events. Here it is:

White American men who voted Republican didn't win shit at the 2004 Olympics, especially compared to their peers around the world. Sure, some white American men won medals, and I don't want to take away from their individual achievement. But I see nothing in their collective achievement that should make any American arrogant about our Olympic results. Instead, we should collectively be a little humble about it, in my opinion. So I hereby assert, a little humility is in order, and I fully expect it to be on display in white male Republican America. They owe it to the world.

Damn their arrogance.

[Djinn]

1. it's stupid to have pride in this anyway

in my opinion - unless you had anything to do with the win, help the athletes to train, raised funds for them??, what has it got to do with the average american? - I live in Australia where athletes are moer respected than pretty much everyone else and being able run slightly faster or jump slightly higher than someone else is viewed as the pinnacle of achievement and I just don't get the "pride" thing?

[peacetalksforall]

2. You want propaganda artists to count or analyze?

[anakie]

3. it looks even worse when a medal per head of population

comparison is made.

USA 280 million people 103 medals approx 1 per 2.8 million

Australia 20 million people 49 medals approx 1 per 400,000.

[hansolsen]

7. Yes, Australians are 7 times more likely to win an Olympic medal. N/T

[Djinn]

27. and how much do we pay for them

per head of population Australia pays more than any other nation in public funds to develop sports...I'm a bit of sport Grinch btw, which makes me a complete freak here

[alarimer]

12. The US usally has the largest delegation

So for them to win 100 medals is not surprising.

[hansolsen]

17. Yes, and we have the largest delegation because we draw from a huge

population, and because we have the affluence needed to support athletes at advanced training facilities.

Yes, we also have a large delegation because we have dedicated athletes, but collectivley we don't have nearly as many as Europe.

[bloom]

4. It's interesting to see your break down

Our country does not appreciate/ fund the arts much either.

The Republicans have helped see to that.

Except for the few major male sports like basketball/football/golf/whatever, it seems most sports endeavors don't get much monetary support. I'm surprised we do as well as we do...

[alarimer]

11. the only sports that matter

are football (not soccer) and racing. All those other sports, most of them at least, get very little attention and support in the US.

[democratreformed]

5. I think that's a perfect way of putting it. I had never thought of that

before. There is a BIG difference in pride and arrogance. Pride with humility is a positive value. Arrogance is a negative value, IMO. That's one of the many things that irritates me the most about GWB's administration - the naked raw disgusting ARROGANCE.

[henslee]

6. You mean responses like wE BiTcHsLaPpEd those sniveling French winos is

inappropriate? Just kidding.

[hansolsen]

8. Yes, that is exactly what I mean. Plus the bitch slapping of the U.N, the

drop pants and take a shit on the Keota Accords, the middle finger to the world court, and all the rest. I would lump in the very idea that we can tell the world who can have WMD and who can't -- that is the height of arrogance, IMO. By what right do we get to decide that??

Might makes right is the arrogant philosophy that drives the Bush administration, and they are going to get a million Americans killed if it keeps up.

[Booster]

9. I do have to praise the Americans that I have seen win.

They haven't come across as arrogant at all to me. The media, yes, and NBC does that mainly because that's what they think Americans want to hear, but I don't think the atheletes themselves have been arrogant - but then I haven't watched every single event.

[alarimer]

13. the athletes have been pretty cool

I have to give them that.

[salib]

14. You obviously did not see

The men's volleyball against Russia. An American player practically shook the net judge out of his seat after a call. He SHOULD have been thrown out, but then the U.S. is so much better than the others at challenging the rulings. I am impressed and inspired by what the athletes have done. I am even more inspired by the idea of the Olympics. It was good to see it in Athens. It was wonderful to see the rest of the world cheering the Americans, at the opening ceremonies. Wonderful.

[hansolsen]

15. Yes, I agree wholeheartedly. And I pull for them to win, celebrate when

they do, and cry a little when the national anthem is played. My heart swells with pride that they represent America, and I admire their individual achievement.

But all that has little or nothing to do with keeping track of which country won the most medals and bragging that America leads the way again. That comparison is misleading.

Humility starts with accepting the basic principle of fundamental fairness and equity in all things. Corporate America isn't a great believer in fundamental fairness and equity. All they care about is winning, and they will cook the books in order to win if they have to.

The grand medal count, unadjusted for population, is a minor cooking of the books. It is small wonder that NBC chooses to report the overall results that way. But it is a shame.

Just think how nice a segment they could do if they mentioned the medals per unit of poulation, and ranked the countries that way. NBC could honor many small countries like Australia that deserve a little recognition (and Norway in the winter Olympics, for example). And good old America would appear somewhere near the middle or bottom of such a ranking -- and all things considered, it would be good to acknowledge that.

Humility is good for the soul. It is also good for national security.

So say I.

[Kahuna]

10. The Bible says, Pride goeth before the fall. Apparently...

bush and the fundies skip over that passage.

[hansolsen]

16. The only Biblical reference Shrub knows is "-- an eye for an eye". N/T

[trumad]

18. Another stupid hate america thread....

what is it with you fucking people!

[hansolsen]

19. I don't hate America. I hate the arrogance exhibited by some Americans

in high places. That arrogance is going to get a million people killed if it is allowed to rule the day.

George Bush is America's first boy Emperor. Arrogance is his middle name.

[trumad]

21. Oh please

it's sports... It's fucking sports.... When we kick a ball through the net it's sports... When we preemptively bomb a country that's arrogance. I refuse to walk around and add more self loathing to the mix because of a sporting event....

[hansolsen]

25. Hey, I'm not talking about the sporting event, I'm talking about our media

coverage of the event. The media keeps track of total medals and reports it daily. And they do it with a shit eating grin and a lot of chest pounding that I don't see from the athletes themselves.

All I'm saying is that if we are going to keep score on total medals, lets keep a fair score.

It's like America playing Germany in football, and reporting that we won 103 to 60, but failing to mention that while the Germans had 11 players on the field, we had 50 players lined up on our side. What the fucks with that?

[jdj]

26. yes, we ARE what's wrong with this country today.

why they don't just kill all our commie pinko faggot asses is beyond me.

Must be keeping us around for potential slave labor once the coup is complete.

[daleo]

20. Agreed, raw Olympic medal counts are meaningless (a little stats now)

If you take the first 25 medal winning counties (who won 78% of the medals), and sort them in the different ways, here are a few key results:

First in total medals, U.S. (Australia is fourth, Canada 18th))
First in gold medals, U.S. (Australia is fourth, Canada 21st)
First in medals, adjusted for population, Australia (U.S. is 19th, Canada 18th).
First in gold medals, adjusted for population, Norway (Australia is second, U.S. is 17th, Canada is 19th.

It took about 2.7 million Americans to win a medal, but only about 386,000 Australians.
It took about 7.8 million Americans to win a medal, but only about 900,000 Norwegians, and about 1.1 million Australians.


Canada comes in just ahead of the U.S. in the population per medal, needing about 2.6 million Canadians per medal. Our press has been going through copious hand-wringing at our poor showing, and comparing ourselves unfavorably with the U.S., with the usual comments about good old American capitalist spirit versus the Canadian unwillingness to achieve excellence. Yet, this simple statistical correction shows how idiotic these conjectures are.

Not to take anything from the Australians, who do an amazing job. It must be all those Labour governments that they have elected. Nor to take anything away from the U.S. - 19th isn't bad when you consider how many countries there are in the world.

These numbers might change a bit depending on population source, and whether all the medals were in on my medal count source, but the essential finding will be about the same.

I suspect if China does very well at the next Olympics, the U.S. and other western media will quickly pick up on the population per medal concept, especially if China overtakes the U.S. in the overall medal count. This is a distinct possibility in Beijing.

[hansolsen]

22. Thanks. 19th out of 25. About what I thought. N/T

[hansolsen]

23. If you could break out the stats just for white American males who voted

Republican, I'll bet we came in 25th out of 25.

[KamaAina]

34. In golds, we barely managed to hold off the Chinese

35 for the USA, 32 for China -- which was barely even on the map a mere generation ago.

I have always been of the belief that a silver or bronze medal, plus three bucks, will get you a grande latte at Starbucks. The Chinese, apparently, agree: more than half of their total medals were gold.

This could get downright ugly, what with the next Games in Beijing and all.

[Djinn]

38. Nope

Not to take anything from the Australians, who do an amazing job. It must be all those Labour governments that they have elected. Nor to take anything away from the U.S.

we've had more conservative governments throughout our history - and it looks like John Howard is going to win the one just called too (sigh) - our sporting proficiency is down to a few things: firstly the fact that being good at sport trumps every other human achievement here so there is more reason for kids to aspire to success in sports than science, arts, philanthropy etc secondly an inferiority complex (our cultural cringe) which see's us needing to be better than the big boys at something, which leads to the third reason - we fund sports with public money more so than most countries.

If you worked out medals per $$ then we'd be somewhere at the bottom.

[renegade000]

24. well

i think they probably send more atheletes than we do too

i mean taiwan sent 83 or something like that...thats a really large amount for a nation that size. i think it all evens out.

who cares anyways...

[Awsi Dooger]

28. Uneven analysis, since each country has limited entrants

In events like swimming and track and field, for example, the USA is allowed three entrants maximum. If you add six or eight or whatever Western European countries together, their total entrants in an event will dwarf the USA allotment, guaranteeing a larger chunk of the medals over a significant number of events.

In some respects, the USA is actually discriminated against due to population and therefore depth. Again, using swimming and track and field, in many cases the USA's 4th thru 8th finisher in the Olympic trials is far superior to the top performer from another country, but the USA can send only three participants. The USA would earn a far greater percentage of total medals if an open qualifying standard were used, let's say anyone who beat 10.20 seconds in the 100 meters, instead of a quota by country.

[daleo]

30. If the U.S. can send their top three

And their top three are the top three in the world, they will win all three medals. So, I don't think this objection stands up.

[muriel_volestrangler]

31. For sports where the USA gets 3 entrants, you're right

but quite a few only allow 1 entrant per country - eg most, if not all, of the team sports. However, it would only make a real difference if the USA could have produced more teams with a realistic chance of winning another medal - perhaps one or two swimming relays, a few team sports like women's basketball or softball. I think overall, the performance of Australia does stand out, and that of the USA roughly compares to that of Europe, east or west.

[daleo]

32. Also, this caveat probably applies to other nations as well

I am not an expert on Olympic sports, but I am sure it is not only the Americans who sometimes have to leave world class athletes behind, while countries with less accomplished athletes take their places. I am sure the Russians could make the same complaint in some sports, for example.

There have been various analyses done that show medal counts are quite predictable:

http://www.dartmouth.edu/tuck/news/newsroom/pr20040726_olympics.html

""When you get right down to it, the national success at the Olympics is as much about economics as about individual athletic prowess," says Bernard. The study explains that over the last 40 years, national Olympic medal totals have been driven by four distinct factors: population, per capita income, past performance, and a host effect."

But people like to impute something about national character, spirit, competitiveness, etc. into these things, and use medal counts as evidence for ethnic (e.g. Nazi Germany) or ideological superiority (e.g. cold war medal race between Soviet Union and USA). It was ever thus.

[Awsi Dooger]

33. That is very true in the Winter Olympics

Austrians, for example, have to leave behind skiiers and ski jumpers who would dominate the national competitions of other countries.

Any area where a nation is extremely deep in talent produces this problem -- Romanian gymnastics, Russian skaters, Chinese divers, American sprinters.

[the_outsider]

29. don't know how many of the white male athletes voted republican

but I do not think "White American men who voted Republican didn't win shit at the 2004 Olympics" is a fair statement.

I spent some time on internet and found out that out of 35 gold medal winners - 18 are white men, 9 are white women, 5 are black men and 3 are black women. I have not counted total medals, but will not expect the proportions to be terribly different.

It's not exactly accurate because some of the events are team events and the teams have mixed ethnicity. I went by the race of the majority of the players, so I counted basketball gold for black women and football, softball golds for white women.

Anyways, I think these numbers do not support your claim about the performance of white men. These numbers are more in proportion with population/opportunity across different demographic groups.

Another interesting tidbit is out of 18 golds for white men, 9 came in swimming and 6 of them were won (4 individual, 2 relays) by Phelps, so that skews the numbers a little bit.

If you add up the medals of all former USSR countries, they beat USA handily in both total and gold counts.

I completely agree with less arrogance and more humility point of view in your post. I would also very much like to see a less biased and more global,objective Olympic coverage for a change.

[Mr. Blonde]

37. But remember the former USSR would only be sending one athlete

to the games instead of the many that those countries now send. This also skews the reults in the original post because there is a much greater number of athletes competing from the areas that are compared to the US. I'm not sure what the cap is in each event but I'm guessing 3 for track and swimming. This means our 3 athletes are being compared to however many countries are in each block x 3. It isn't a fair comparison.

[Blayde Starrfyre]

35. Oh shut up

Democrats need to be retaking patriotism and national pride, not giving the Republicans fodder to say we hate America. I love the Olympics, I wear my 1980 U.S. hocket team jersey, and I love it when America wins.

Let's celebrate our athletes' accomplishments, not demean them by whining about how, population wise, they should have more than Eastern Europe or some garbage.

[msmcghee]

36. What does it mean?

If my country gets more medals, even per capita, than another country - what exactly is there about that to be proud of?

Many people will be dumbfounded by that question. Of course, we should be proud of our nation, our state, our party, our school - they'd say. Whatever group we belong to - it's so important that we establish our "betterness" that few ever even ask why that is the case.

Well, you may be surprised to find that I believe it can be good to seek "betterness". That quest motivates people to find their limits - and surpass them. And we humans do have a lot of limits that deserve passing.

But the battle for Olympic medals is just like any other battle. It can be fought for the right or wrong reasons - and it can be waged with the right or wrong methods.

The Olympics is not sports - it is big money entertainment - just as much as professional football. The myth of amateur standing is just a way to differentiate the Olympics from pro soccer, pro-football, pro-basketball, etc. - sports that the Olympics must compete with to capture audience and sponsors. To do that you have to differentiate your product.

But like most other pro-sports - the real competition is between the athletes and the drug testing companies.