For CBS news workers - NOT a forgery - DOCS were typed on an

[junker]

IBM Selectric which was introduced in 1961 and was HUGELY adopted by the USofA Military and were ubiquitous throughout all the services including the NAT Guard by 1969.

AND as every clerk who ever worked on knows...the typing balls came in a variety of fonts (including Times NEW Roman) and had proportional spacing (one of its big claims to fame).

SO likely the docs are legit and were typed on a Selectric.


http://www.etypewriters.com/history.htm

[Trajan]

1. Thanks Junker .....

Cant say it enough : George Bush ???? Stop lying!

[troublemaker]

2. Please find this:

Don't worry about anything having to do with formatting -- proportional spacing, alignments, centering, etc.. That's a red herring since business machines were well capable of all of that.

Try to find this type face in an actual TYPED sample:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/09/06/politics/main641481.shtml

All that matters is basic letter shapes. (Proportion and weight and shapes of strokes cannot be determined from degraded xeroxes. Only the most basic letter forms can.)

We want an IBM type ball face that looks like the memos The face must have a closed top 4 with no foot serif and a 3 with a rounded top (not a flat top)

[Joanne98]

7. A DUer just posted that she had a ball. she was getting ready to test it

But I think it was in GD 2004 that just went down. i'll try to find the link.

[Sequoia]

3. I was in the Air Force and used an IBM Selectric

in 1974. Yes, those font balls were cool and I wanted more than just Times Roman, 12 pitch. As I recall, we all had those typewriters on our base.

[Ducks In A Row]

6. same here, except the Navy

I didn't have to type things too often, but those little font balls were fun.

I haven't thought of that in years. Wow.

[StClone]

4. What can they do but say they are forged ?

These documents would have to be part of an elaborate Rovian Ruse. I wouldn't put it past him but until there is any proof these are legit.

[PROGRESSIVE1]

5. I would add ABC to the list of CNNFOXMSNBCCNBC!

Those scumbags use Drudge as a source. :grr:

ABC = All Bush Channel

[BeHereNow]

8. HEY Junker!

:hi:
Where have you been?
I've missed your posts!
BHN
:hug:

[rowire]

9. Memo Not in Selectric Font

According to the Selectric Typewriter Museum at

http://www.selectric.org/selectric/index.html

the available fonts are listed there:

10 Pitch Type Styles: Advocate, Bookface Academic 72, Delegate, Orator, Courier 72, Pica 72, Prestige Pica 72

12 Pitch Type Styles: Adjutant, Artisan 12, Courier 12 Italic, Scribe, Prestige Elite, Courier 12, Elite 72, Letter Gothic

Special Typing Applications: Light Italic, Script, Printing ANSI-OCR, Symbol 10, 108 OCR, Manifold 72, Symbol 12

To my layman's eye, none of those fonts look quite like Times New Roman, or the font on the CBS memo.

LET'S NOT GET SUCKERED INTO THIS. ROVE IS OFFERRING A DISTRACTION AND WE ARE BITING.

[Individualist]

10. Your attempt to discredit

the documents is pathetic. CBS has said the documents were extensively vetted by independent experts. They stand by their authenticity.

[John BigBootay]

11. Odd how we all now trust the MSM so completely... n/t

[rowire]

13. Be Smarter Than Rove

I'm only trying to save us from falling into a trap. These documents could not have been typed on a Selectric based on the font, spacing, superscript, and the fact it contains "straight" and "curved" apostrophes.

Is it mere coincidence that typing the same words into Microsoft Word results in spacing and line breaks, if left to Word's defaults, are identical to those in the CBS document?

This is too easy. It is a trap. Let's destroy Bush with existing verified documents and leave this garbage to Rove and Co.

[HFishbine]

16. Read this

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/9/10/34914/1603

Then be sure to share it with your friends. :hi:

[Individualist]

20. ROFL

Excellent advice, HFishbine. The good news about all this is that the longer the White House liars and their idiot supporters try to discredit the documents, the longer the news coverage will last.

[RetroLounge]

24. great line by Kos

"One moral of this story: If you put a picture of a chimpanzee next to a picture of George W. Bush, line them up exactly, and shrink them down to only a few pixels across, they'll look pretty much the same, at that resolution. Whether you think that proves anything depends on your point of view."



RL

[rowire]

29. DNC Is Distancing From Forgeries

Maybe you need to inform Terry McAuliffe. He seems to believe the same thing I do. And I bet he has a little more info on this than you do.

From today's Washington Post.

"I can unequivocally say that no one involved here at the Democratic National Committee had anything at all to do with any of those documents. If I were an aspiring young journalist, I think I would ask Karl Rove that question," Mr. McAuliffe said.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

30. Link please.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

21. Is it mere coincidence that so many folks pop out of the woodwork...

...when Rove needs some help attempting to discredit a valid news story about the Squatter-in-Chief?

[Name removed]

18. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ProfessorGAC]

19. And You Obtained This Information, Where?

And your credentials to make this determination are? I'm actually not doubting you as much as looking for a reason to believe you.
The Professor

[Media_Lies_Daily]

22. Thank you SO much for your single contribution to the DU forum....

...you'll have MUCH better luck peddling that crap over in Freeperland.

[Swede]

23. I guess you should just vote for Bush then.

Thanks and see ya.

[LynnTheDem]

25. Such desperation

Sorry to bring you bad news, freeper, but the documents are AUTHENTIC.

Need help with the definition of that word?

[enki23]

12. this is all so fucking stupid

they are in the same typeface--proportional font, superscript and all--of other records already long released by the bush administration itself.

thanks for playing, all, but it won't fly.

[Cleita]

14. As an office worker in the sixties, I used IBM selectric and IBM

Executive typewriters through a variety of jobs. Word Processing didn't become widely used until the 1980's. That font is very familiar to me and I don't think it can be reproduced on a computer printer either dot matrix or bubblejet, because depending on the type of ribbon you used, the results would be a slight bleeding of the ink into the paper if a cloth ribbon was used.

Also, with both carbon ribbons and cloth ribbons, some of the keys would strike harder than others in an IBM Executive typewriter. because the human typist's strikes would vary in force. On the Selectric, although the ball was supposed to strike evenly, that was only true with a brand new ball. In very short time, certain letters that were used a lot, like the a and s, would wear down appearing differently than the less used letters.

This was my experience anyway.

[Individualist]

15. My experience also

I was a secretary in the 60's and 70's and used IBM Selectrics.

[TahitiNut]

17. As I recall, the Executive had a movable carriage/platen ...

... while the Selectric had a left-right movable typing element. It seems fairly clear to me that the memoranda were typewritten on the Executive and the vertical placement of the letters shows the typical vertical "slop" of a carriage that, while detenting from right to left under the keystrike, varies slightly in it's vertical alignment. Sometimes the linefeed didn't quite finish its registration when doing a carriage return and would finally 'settle' a little into the next typed line.


One of the things I recall typists liked about the Selectric was that it didn't knock over vases and coffee mugs :-) - and the vertical "slop" was enormously lessened.

[Red State Rebel]

26. Did it do the superscript??

If it did, they are screwed!

[AntiCoup2K4]

27. The History of the Selectric page is GONE!!

Geezy fucking pete are these bastards hacking a fucking typewriter history site now to cover up their lies???

[Karenina]

28. Lewis Carroll on bad acid.