I need sources to confirm the following beliefs I have in regard to these

[Bombtrack]

issues or "charges" I have made in an argument with a righty.

1 - That Bush had to be pressured to invade Aghanistan instead of just focusing on Iraq post 9-11, by people like Realists in congress and Tony Blair.

2 - That the plan Bush used to invade Afghanistan and remove the taliban was more or less the "Clinton Plan".

[nadinbrzezinski]

1. you sahall find all of this in Clarke's book

[Bombtrack]

2. I was asking more along the lines of sources I can link too

Newspapers. Magazine articles etc.

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[salin]

6. ? I don't follow

Niether point makes team bush look very good.

I have never heard the first point - except in allusion to the immediate desire to use 911 to get Saddam (remember Bush pushing Clarke, shortly after 911, to get any info tying Iraq to the WTC attacks...)

However Franken writes about the second point in his book, with Clarke being the person who had developed the plan... but the Clinton team not acting - as the timing would have fallen into the transition period - and the Clinton folks didn't think (iirc) that it was wise to stick a new administration with an inevitable (or ongoing) military action as had happened in to Clinton in Somalia.

[Eloriel]

4. I don't think you're right about either

Condi admitted after that May 2002 "Bush Knew" headline that the plan for Afghanistan was on Bush's desk the week before 9-11. THere was the small matter of that AMOCO pipeline, remember (edited to add: the one for which Enron did the feasibility study a few years prior).

I've never seen anything (certainly not that I can remember) about the Afghanistan invasion being a Clinton plan.

But, hey, good luck. I guess.

[salin]

5. Actually the second point is raised in Al Franken's book

ala Clarke.

Accordingly (if I recall correctly) there was great concern about OBL and Afghanistan and the plan to step up the pressure on the Taliban to get at al qeada (remember the Cole bombing happened in October)... a plan was drawn up - but, the Clinton folks thought it was inappropriate to start a military action (or even the build up to something - which is what was part of the strategy, I believe, to coerce cooperation from the Taliban) which would be forced upon the next administration (as had been done to the Clinton team per Somalia). THus the plans were shelved. I believe this gels with what Clarke has written and said in regards to trying to get high level briefings with Condi et al per al qeada briefings.

I don't know if the whole plan was developed, or if it was in more skeleton form. Would have to go back and read to remember.

[Bombtrack]

7. I watched a Clinton Q&A at I believe some University where he said that

The reason Bush and co. were able to act so quickly with the invasion was that it was essentially the "Clinton plan"

[Bombtrack]

8. bump

[faithnotgreed]

9. on #1

yes i definitely read that (blair "insisted" bush go into afghanistan first) specifically somewhere though that doesnt answer your request for links!

sorry ill go check for that but just wanted to pipe up before the thread disappeared