Went to our company happy hour and some Repub. guy said about his date:

[kerry-is-my-prez]

"She's not perfect but at least she's not voting for Kerry." I said "Well I'm voting for him." He was shocked (this is a very Repub. area and we're all Realtors so I guess he just assumed I was Repub.)

He then said "Well I know you're really smart - THAT'S why you're voting for Kerry. You follow all that stuff. You know TOO much..."

Please note that he was totally serious. This guy is not very bright so I can see how he might think that a lot of people are more intelligent than he is. He then went on to sort of insinuate that I was too smart and that it was better to keep it simple....

THIS IS WHAT WE'RE UP AGAINST FOLKS. Many people think that society would be better off if we all just stay "simple." People who are too intelligent shouldn't be listened to - they're just sort of eccentric. George Bush is good because he's "simple" and deals with things in a simple way. Kerry is too smart and therefore will just muddle things up.

Maybe we'd be better off if we started talking about how intelligent Bush is and spread a rumor that he actually has an IQ of 180. Point out that he went to Harvard and Yale. He's so smart that he can't be trusted....

I asked him why he was a Bush supporter and he said "You've got to think of your children and their futures." I pointed out that with the deficit and the tax cuts that his kids futures would be bankrupt. I told him about John McCain saying "They're spending money like drunken sailers."

He said "No - they're not doing that." I plan on sending him an article I have that quotes McCain and other Repubs talking about BushCo's fiscal irresponsibility.

[mhr]

1. Stupid Is As Stupid Does

eom

[rfranklin]

4. Life is like a box of chocolates...

The ones marked "Republican" are actually turds.

[HEIL PRESIDENT GOD]

9. I'm going to be saying that all day! n/t

[Catherine Vincent]

2. I think if you keep giving this guy facts about Bush and the

republican party, he will switch his vote to Kerry. Good luck.

[proud patriot]

3. A friend who is voting for Kerry , said that to me last week

"you know too much"

:wow: WTF? is wrong with that ? I thought .

Of course I know a lot , I made it my JOB to know it,
so I could tell all my friends and family who spend
their lives working or in commute traffic what's up.

So many of my friends greet me with "So what's going
on in the world Trish?" They count on me and trust me .

I just don't see how a person can think someone knows
too much . :shrug: I'm not wired to understand the concept
of not knowing being good .

[kerry-is-my-prez]

5. I think these people think we're eccentric or something....

n/t

[proud patriot]

perhaps

but I still don't get it

[opiate69]

11. Damn, we need Bill Hicks now more than ever....

"So, I'm in a waffle house, minding my own business, reading a book.. ok, I'm alone, I don't know anybody, so I'm reading.. waitress walks over and says (thick southern drawl)-'What you readin for?'... wow... not 'what am I reading, but what am I reading for?'.. dang it.. you stumped me.. I guess I read for a lot of reasons, but one of the main ones is so that I don't end up being a fucking waffle waitress... so then this trucker gets up from the next table, and says 'Well.. looks like we got ourselves a reader.'.. what the fuck? Did I just step out of some intellectual closet? I read.. there. I've said it.."

[proud patriot]

24. LOL

:crazy:

[bobbieinok]

35. at university libraries in all parts of the country: I check out 10 books

and get the comment - 'that's a lot of books; are you really going to read them all??'

at UNIVERSITY LIBRARIES!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?

[robbedvoter]

6. You fancy pants elitist you!

"Librul" Hollywood has glorified ignorance intensely for the past 10 years or so - Gump, half of the Travolta movies all star saintly idiots loved by all. I remember a Travolta creation where the idiot gets smart somehow and all hate him. I remember the Simpsons took on this amazing theme - Homer gets the crayon extracted from his brain, gets smart and awful (to all but Lisa), so in the end he shoves another crayon up his nose and returns to acceptable idiocy.
I wonder how long we'll even have the option not to shove crayons up our noses....

[Zan_of_Texas]

7. Awl y'all no 2 much.

Really, that is a good point -- intelligence, research, science, curiosity, even facts -- all are "OUT" -- ignorance and simplicity are "IN".

An educated citizenry is necessary for democracy.

But, for dictatorship, an educated citizenry just gets in the way.

So, any questions about why education is not really a priority of the Bush administration?

[Sydnie]

8. Clinton said it clearly

If you think, you vote Democrat. Plain and simple.

You should ask this guy why he expects MORE of his children then he expects of himself. Doesn't he expect that his children will learn and KNOW more when they finish their education? Should they go through school and never have an original thought, even if it does challenge his father's beliefs, which are based on lack of education?

I have been told that very thing about many subjects over the years -- "You can convince anyone of anything because you do your research, but that's not a good thing when you challenge authority". What kind of shit is that? Don't be informed so you can take an active part in things that effect your life, your children's lives, your community, your neighborhood, let alone your government. That's the message that I get. Not that I am any smarter than the next guy, just that I must have too much time on my hands to be able to comprehend the bigger picture of how one action might have a consequence on more than what was intended.

It's lazy people that are the problem. Lazy minds are easily amused. I guess my problem is that I am not easily amused. I have to watch a movie that I might not have ever intended to watch if I begin to watch it, to its' end to see how it turns out, read a book that I might not agree with to explore and challenge my own beliefs.

We all talk about wanting to provide a good education to our children. Should we not begin with ourselves and set the example for our children? Should we not make sure that the children are taught critical thinking skills as well as memorization skills?

Guys like that really irritate me.

[wickywom]

10. Only a brainwashed individual

would so willingly accept thier own stupidity.
Christ that is scary.

[msmcghee]

12. Most people fear and hate ambiguity.

People who have been threatened hate and fear it even more. Karl Rove understands this very well - inside and out. Most Republican poiticians understand it intuitively. That is the emotional horse that they rode into power on.

(Psychological) conservatives can easily dismiss any factual data that does not conform to their worldview - a worldview that hides from or denies ambiguity. Cognitive dissonance means nothing to them. The strength of the emotional attachment to their memes is way stronger than their need to resolve logical inconsistencies.

If you want to change their minds convince them that *Bush is a flip-flopper (ambiguity) - is nuanced (ambiguity) - is an intellectual (ambiguity).

Not that I'd recommend that you bother as that would be impossible. :eyes:

[bleedingheart]

13. I get the 'I don't follow this stuff..it's too complicated" comment

all the time...

people dumb themselves down...

[Individualist]

14. No doubt about it

the dumbing of America is evident in this article by Paul Campos.

http://insidedenver.com/drmn/news_columnists/article/0,1299,DRMN_86_3197088,00.html

-snip-

This sounds like a surreal joke, but then stories about contemporary politics often do. There is no polite way to phrase this: when it comes to politics, the average person is an idiot. Depressing evidence for this claim can be found in a recent New Yorker essay by Louis Menand, which surveys the political science literature regarding why people vote the way they do. The conclusions from this literature include:

No more than 10 percent of the population can be said to have a coherent political belief system, using even a loose definition of that term. Most peoples' political beliefs, to the extent they have any at all, suffer from a lack of what political scientists call "constraint," i.e., little or no logical connection exists between the positions they hold. For example, a large proportion of voters see no contradiction between being in favor of both lower taxes and increased government services

-snip-

[Ronnie]

18. I can't think of anything in life

that isn't layered. And most people don't get past the top layer. That's why lying is such a successful campaign strategy.

[Zorra]

15. Plato said this:

"One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors."

[Nordic]

16. Wow! What an awesome quote!

[enough]

19. You musta learned that by reading.

Beautiful quote.

[Cha]

22. I remember being impressed by

that quote in 2000 and have repeated it often..

And look what we got..THE BIGGEST INFERIOR ON THE PLANET EARTH!

[Bimini_Twisted]

17. You, with your fancy words and all your puntuation

Momma says my head would explode and I would ruin my beautiful mind. Mamma says, I can learn everything I need to know from Faux News. Momma says Rush Limpballs is an intellectual

[Pax Argent]

20. I don't know that it will help

A week or so ago I compiled a page of fairly simple examples of how Bush is f'ing up the economy and how his policies have contributed to the slow-down and, in some cases, the reverse of the positive economic trends that we enjoyed during the Clinton years.

I included charts clearly showing the trending for employment, deficits, the national debt, and how China is rapidly coming to match us in GDP and is taking hundreds of billions out of our economy every year in trade deficits. All of this was derived from the Census Bureau and other easily accessible, non-partisan sources. I was informed that it was all just left wing spin. This was from a fairly successful private businessman with a degree in computer science. Another of my friends who is a hard right-winger just ignored the whole thing without comment.

It comes straight down to the fact that a lot of folks believe that intelligence not used in pursuit of profits is largely a waste of time or dangerous and that anyone who cares or thinks about anything but themselves or profit is delusional.

[Disturbed]

23. Intellectuals..

are the 1st group that are killed in a revolution of fascist power mongers.

[Astrochimp]

26. my thinking on this-

leftbehind, it is also that some will not admit they are wrong,even when shown the facts. As I post and argue on msg boards, it has become easy to spot them, they make a claim, someone post the truth, yet they can never acept it.

My FIL is much like this- a great guy, but to get him to do anything diffrent, you must let him think it was his idea.

Did you post your page on DU? Do you have a link?


David

[Pax Argent]

30. No, I'm not that technologically advanced

I relied on good, old fashioned Microsoft Word.

Economic Conditions

Economic Power Dictates National Power
GDP Growth Under Clinton (4.1% in 1999; 5% in 2000)
GDP Growth Under Bush (.3% in 2001; 2.45% in 2002; 3.1% in 2003)
GDP significantly slower under Bush
Chinese Economic Power Skyrocketing
GDP Growth for China (7% for 1999; 8% for 2000; 7-8% for 2001; 9% in 2002; 9.1% in 2003)
Chinese GDP only second to the US
(US = 10 Trillion vs. China = 6 Trillion)
Trade Deficit to China has increased from $6 Billion a year in 1985 to $124 Billion in 2003
Currently on track to break this record ($83 Billion as of 7/04)

United States Debt at Record High

Bush Economic Policies Degrading US Economic Power
National debt currently at $7.5 Trillion in 2004 –NEW WORLD’S RECORD
Yearly interest on debt is approximately $310 Billion for 2004
Defense spending approximately $399 Billion (excluding special funding requests for Iraq)
Debt expected to top $8 Trillion in 2005
Bush has grown the National Debt by 35%
Record Budget Deficits
After climbing out of deficit hole left by Reagan/Bush I, Clinton left office with a Budget Surplus of over $200 Billion/year
Bush’s budget deficits have been over $125 Billion in 2002, over $350 Billion in 2003, and over $500 Billion in 2004
Budget deficits are being generated to partially subsidize the War in Iraq and the Bush Tax Breaks

Poor Job Performance on Jobs

Under Bush the Nation has LOST jobs for the first time since the Great Depression
Clinton generated 22 Million jobs over his presidency
Approximately 1 Million jobs have been lost since Bush took office
New jobs generated typically pay less than jobs lost
Walmart advises its personnel to get on welfare
Unemployment rates shot up under Bush
Unemployment rates under Clinton were down to under 4%
Current Unemployment rates under Bush are 5.4%. down from over 6% in mid-2003.

Its a lot better with the accompanying charts, but you get the idea. By the way, welcome aboard!
:)

[Astrochimp]

32. thanks

Thanks! hope you don't mind if I C&P a few lines from it, to post on another board-


"GDP Growth Under Clinton (4.1% in 1999; 5% in 2000)
GDP Growth Under Bush (.3% in 2001; 2.45% in 2002; 3.1% in 2003)

National debt currently at $7.5 Trillion in 2004 –NEW WORLD’S RECORD
Yearly interest on debt is approximately $310 Billion for 2004
Debt expected to top $8 Trillion in 2005
Bush has grown the National Debt by 35%

After climbing out of deficit hole left by Reagan/Bush I, Clinton left office with a Budget Surplus of over $200 Billion/year
Bush’s budget deficits have been over $125 Billion in 2002, over $350 Billion in 2003, and over $500 Billion in 2004"


But they will invoke 9-11


Edit- just found this you may want to add-
http://www.factcheck.org/article.aspx?docID=249

Since Bush took office, the middle-income group has declined by 1.2 percentage points , and now constitutes less than 45% of all households. At the same time, households with less than $25,000 in income have grown by 1.5 percentage points, and now make up 29% of all households. So a large number of households have slipped out of the middle group and into the lower-income range over the past three years.

"...median income has declined by $1,535 since Bush took office , or 3.4 percent. And while the decline leveled off last year and may even be climbing again in 2004, most households are clearly worse off economically now than they were when the President was sworn in.

"......On the other hand, we do know that another 1 million persons were without health insurance in 2003. Since Bush took office, the number without health insurance has grown by 5.2 million, to 45 million.

More good stuff on that link.

David

[PassingFair]

34. You've hit the nail on the head, left...

...it's all about the dollar. I recently was promoted at work and everyone knows that I now make 3 times what I did before. (Economy left me SERIOUSLY underemployed). All knew my democratic tendencies. Most of the people at work are either freepers or know-nothings. They all think I must "get it" now. They are surprised that I remain militant (in their eyes).
I really believe that most of these people have an empathy deficiency. They absolutely cannot see beyond their own noses. Also, there are always mitigating circumstances for them and theirs. Everyone else gets what they deserve.

:puke:

[Cha]

21. Thanks! I must be WAy SMart, too!

CAuse I know way too much! :o

[0rganism]

25. Is your republican friend a sports fan?

If he is, I just betcha he knows all kinds of things. Football fan? I bet he knows the starting quarterbacks for every team in the NFL, and maybe even their career stats. Does he follow baseball? Even better -- he probably knows starting and relief pitchers for every team out there. He could give you a solid guess at a point spread in a game between any two teams, in a matter of seconds. Golf fan? I bet he knows the details of the 20 best courses and the people leading up the PGA tour this month. He probably knows the best club to use from the fairway on every single hole at the local course.

The tragedy is he probably can't bring himself to know the names -- let alone party affilliations and campaign donor stats -- of the senators in the states adjacent to the one you're in. He doesn't want to know how the policies of this administration are actually affecting him or his offspring; it's too painful, he'd rather pretend it's all going swimmingly. These rules and strategies aren't that much harder to learn than any sports game, and the player stats are just as easy to memorize if you pay attention. Yet somehow, people who are clearly able to think for themselves when it comes to professional sports dumb themselves down when it comes to thinking about politics.

Poisonously ironic. If we could somehow make professional politics as exciting as professional sports, our country might just make a recovery.

[Cha]

27. Great post! It is that Exciting to me..

but then I know my Country is on the line and these ostrich types couldn't care less UNLESS it gets personal and hits their pocketbook or wallet.

Or like some of the people who voted for bush in 2000( and have had relatives die because of him) that are Now for Kerry!

[Bridget Burke]

31. "If we could somehow make professional politics as exciting ....

as professional sports, our country might just make a recovery." That's the problem.

And when did politics get so dull? As a kid, I remember watching the political conventions with commentary by Huntley & Brinkley. OK, the nominee is picked before the convention now--but interesting stuff was said at the both conventions. Even if the dozen or so spouters of Republican talking points after each Democratic speech were not balanced by enough people answering Zell's tirade with "Is that guy nuts or what?"

Do you know what really bothered me during the Florida "Recount"? (Even beyond the fact that it appeared we were going to get the unelected moron shoved down our throats?) It was the boredom of most of the talking heads. I've always come out for the Democratic candidates, have read the Texas Observer off & on, but I hadn't been really into politics in a long time--but I found the unfolding story quite fascinating. All the newsguys & newsgirls just found the whole thing such a waste of their valuable time; they wanted Gore to give up so they could go back to their regular lives. The message: Politics is boring. Ignore it. Hey, here's a hot murder case!

[gordianot]

28. Similar Experiences

I have heard the following reasons voting for Bush.

Democrats are going to take away our guns.

We follow what the Bishop says and we should follow the Bishop (St. Louis area. I asked this person if they lived in 1930's Germany would they have voted for Hitler, he too was endorsed by church officials (after he came to power).

Kerry is a member of the Illuminati (was shocked to hear Bush is also a member of Skull and Bones, minister did not explain that).

I am dead set against abortion and Kerry is for abortion.

I feel certain this is not unique to Missouri.

[Eric J in MN]

29. gore-is-my-president - can you give us a link to the article? nt

nt

[porphyrian]

33. He's a Good Consumer!

Good Consumers know that it's best not to think TOO much, that there are Authorities who can do that for you and translate it into a simple set of instructions for Good Consumers to follow everywhere. Thinking too much on your own allows for too much probability of error, and you can't trust your own judgement when you've got your children and their futures to think of.

[VOX]

36. Remember the rap against Gore? Wonkish. Brainy. Too intellectual.

Jeez-- When did being intelligent and informed become a liability? It's as if the dumbed-down Americans are justifying their own dumbed-downedness -- i.e., intelligent people can't be trusted to be *tough.*

There also is a more insidious element here -- that "smart" and "intellectual" translate to "girly" or "effeminate," and "simple" and "basic" translate to "manly" and "decisive." All of which, of course, is total horseflop.

I think that in many (too many) ways, * is genuinely ignorant ("stay the course"), but I'm certain that his handlers make sure that he keeps on playing it simple, to appeal to the debased-base.