I'm building a collection of Martha Stewart's Living,

[MoonRiver]

from the time she was convicted until she leaves jail. It will be a testimony to the bravery of a woman witch hunted because she is a Democrat. Of course I'll keep my subscription going after she's released, but the issues during her time of persecution will become another collector piece for me. In addition to supporting Martha, I like to collect things!

[demnan]

1. I've been taking her magazine for about a year

It's one of my favorite escapes from politics when I want something light to read.

[MoonRiver]

4. I love her magazine!

I never subscribed until I wanted to make a statement to Martha about my support and also help her company. I'm glad I did and will definitely keep subscribing. There is a wealth of tips and its a beautiful mag to boot.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

2. my daughter has a complete collection of Matha Stewart's Living from day 1

she worked for her.

[MoonRiver]

5. Cool!

:bounce:

[IrateCitizen]

3. Oh, screw Martha Stewart!

Seriously, I could care less that she's a Democrat. That doesn't change the fact that she's a self-absorbed, coldhearted bitch. She's made a life out of "image" while not really producing anything of true substance. Furthermore, she pretty much abandoned (emotionally, at least) her immediate family in order to further her own ambition. Not exactly the kind of value system we should aspire to.

While I think it was a fraud that they targeted her while there were much bigger fish out there to catch, I don't pity her one little bit. What she did, while common in "upper-crust" circles, is still illegal. She tried to use insider information to make herself a little bit richer, while those without that information would be left to hold the stock as it tanked. Fuck her.

[Bridget Burke]

6. I don't live up in Westchester County,

So I'm not conversant with the gossip about Martha Stewart's family; sounds fascinating. As a successful business woman, she's a "self-absorbed, coldhearted bitch". A man would be called focused & aggressive.

Many people don't produce anything of true substance; not that many Nobels get handed out. Her work is amusing & somewhat useful if you don't take it too seriously. She'll come out of this experience stronger.

[IrateCitizen]

7. I wouldn't refer to a man behaving that way as "focused and aggressive"

I'd refer to him as a cold-hearted, self-absorbed bastard.

Values are not the sole domain of one gender or another. They're universal. Personally, I have little respect for people who are so overly aggressive and competitive (usually resulting in them being less cooperative and compassionate) that they are willing to do "whatever it takes" in order to "succeed".

Many people that do produce things of true substance -- teachers, health workers, caretakers, etc. -- don't get Nobels either. But I would call their work infinitely more important than Martha Stewart's -- in spite of the fact that Stewart became a millionaire several times over for her work, while the teachers and caregivers can usually just aspire to be middle or upper-middle class.

As for her family, I don't have any kind of special insight. Everything I spoke of was mentioned on an episode of A&E's "Biography" that profiled her. And also, she's not in Westchester, she's in Connecticut.

[MoonRiver]

8. You seem to imply that because she's got some personality traits

you, and others, don't like that justifies her imprisonment!

[Squeech]

12. Martha Stewart stole

Well before the alleged insider trading. She ripped off her partners in her original catering business. She ripped off other chefs' recipes for her cookbooks. Zillions of her craft projects are just old New England ways of doing things, it's just that she was the first one to do them on camera.

There are successful women who are targeted unfairly because they're successful women. Martha Stewart is not, however. By all accounts (at least the ones not written under her direction), she's been conspicuously exploitative and cruel to everyone she's worked with, or for, or over.

[IrateCitizen]

14. Thank you for another voice of sanity on this, Squeech!

I'm glad there are others in this thread that are able to see Martha Stewart for what she is, regardless of political affiliation or gender.

[Eloriel]

21. Oh, how terrible

Zillions of her craft projects are just old New England ways of doing things, it's just that she was the first one to do them on camera.


And ways to garden, as well. Why she even features plants and flowers that have been around for ages. AND, she uses antiques and collectibles as well. Gasp!

Yes, and zillions of her recipes are too. That's not in the least unusual -- recipes aren't copyrightable material. There are usually many different ways to make a Caesar salad, even if it was a chef named Caesar who first put it together. That's the nature of the beast: you can create a recipe, but if you want to keep it to yourself, then you'd better never share it with anyone, or let clever food-oriented people taste it 'cause they'll recreate it anyway, or become a food manufacturer (which STILL won't mean your recipes won't get recreated by others).

Get real. Get a clue. She never claimed that what she does or shows people how to do is original.

I've heard that she's not easy or pleasant to work for (but consider it mostly gossip), and have no knowledge one way or the other about "ripping off her partners" (and frankly doubt that you do either). But none of that has ANY bearing on her current legal situation.

This irrational resentment of Martha Stewart and her work is beginning to get on my nerves.

[Book Lover]

28. Then how about some rational loathing?

The dispute exploded in late-May when, according to a 23-year-old landscaper working for Macklowe, an enraged Stewart tried to run him over with her truck.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/stewart.html

She's just another spoiled brat.

[IrateCitizen]

13. Reading comprehension is a good thing. I suggest you try it.

I'll repeat for you the second paragraph of my initial post on this topic:

While I think it was a fraud that they targeted her while there were much bigger fish out there to catch, I don't pity her one little bit. What she did, while common in "upper-crust" circles, is still illegal. She tried to use insider information to make herself a little bit richer, while those without that information would be left to hold the stock as it tanked. Fuck her.

You're right -- Martha Stewart possesses certain personality traits that I don't like. I also find those personality traits and our embrace of them over others to be largely destructive to our society as a whole. However, if you read this excerpt from my initial post again, you will see that your post to which I am currently replying is a inaccurate and unfounded statement.

Well, maybe you won't see it that way, but perhaps others will....

[0007]

26. Gimme a break! A thief is a thief and lies to justify. Martha got off

light.

[charlie]

31. Got off easier than Tommy Chong, anyway

9 months for glass bongs, whatta travesty.

[Eloriel]

20. I don't think you're in a position to judge whether or not

she "produced anything of substance." I think she has, and does. In fact, I'm a big fan of her work. She brings style and panache AND knowledge and expertise to the whole subject of creating a home.

It's quite elevating, and that's a GOOD thing.

I'm not currently a subscriber, but I have been in the past and of all the magazines that are typically targeted at women, I found hers the most useful. I also used to watch her TV show quite regularly, and got quite a bit out of it. It was fascinating -- and educational -- to see some of the things she did. There were segments on cooking and baking (not all of which I was interested in other than for educational purposes), segments on fixing things (replacing a screen, refinishing furniture, framing a print, many others) which were IMO especially interesting because I saw her doing things which I normally make my DH do but as a result realized I COULD do myself, segments on proper care of linens and antiques, and many other useful "domestic arts" type tasks. Gardening, raising chickens, needlework, crafts (and fairly decent ones), taking care of pets, getting organized (storage ideas), etc., etc.

My favorite segments were those that focused on artists and artisans who created beautiful works of art. Basketweavers, glassblowers, quiltmakers, woodworkers, jewelrymakers, and so many others. She showcased incredible work and the artists who created them. Very inspiring.

I also appreciated very much that she promoted organic gardening.

Everyone who has a home has to take care of it, and everyone needs to feed themselves. I really can't think that there's anyone who couldn't have found something useful and/or inspiring from her work. I personally thought it was wonderful that she brought an uplifting, knowledgeable, stimulating and educational approach to those things. I've learned a lot from her, and really respect both that she took such an elevated approach to "homekeeping" as she calls it, or "women's work" as too many think of it, AND that she made good money from it. Whodathunkit? I especially loved her gardening tools and supplies -- excellent, useful, much of it not available anywhere else.

I also have 3 of her cookbooks. One of them literally changed my life relative to food. The other 2 I'm not as crazy about, but I still refer to them fairly frequently.

You can despise and disdain her for whatever reasons you choose, but I think you're barking up the wrong tree about what is and is not something of "substance." I also think you never spent any time at all either watching her shows or reading her magazines. Or maybe you just disdain "women's work" and the women who promote it as something valuable and -- of substance.

[IrateCitizen]

22. Ahh, the classic Eloriel cheap shot...

Or maybe you just disdain "women's work" and the women who promote it as something valuable and -- of substance.

Yeah, that's it. :eyes:

As usual, Eloriel, you're utterly predictable -- and needlessly adversarial in the process. You're in no position to judge how I feel about work around the home, not knowing me or anything about me.

My mother is a HUGE fan of Martha Stewart. However, the stuff she does -- it isn't at all original. Stewart is a master of taking bits and pieces of things, and throwing them together under her name brand. If this actually helps people to live a better life, that's good. However, it also doesn't excuse the cutthroat methods she has consistently used in order to advance her personal standing and career -- the Imclone stock case being just one more example.

I've lived on my own for a number of years. Since my wife has a demanding schedule between school and work, I cook and clean a good bit in our house. Even before my wife had this schedule, we split the cooking and cleaning duties. I will plant and maintain a small garden this upcoming spring. So don't sit there on your high horse and proceed to judge me when you know nothing about me, Eloriel.

You actually start your post with, "I don't think you're in the position to judge..." and then proceed to pass your judgement on me while knowing next-to-nothing about me? It would be funny if it weren't so sad -- and sadly, predictable, coming from you.

[0007]

27. I applaud you for your post.

[Bridget Burke]

33. "taking bits of pieces of things and throwing them together"

Is pretty much the definition of housework. And decoration. And cooking.

[IrateCitizen]

35. We're talking about two different things...

I'm referring to what Martha Stewart is good at is taking decorating ideas, landscaping ideas, cooking ideas that other people have developed at one time or another, throwing them together, and putting her brand name on them. It's a highly successful marketing strategy -- but don't pretend that she's actually the one "creating" all this stuff. She just is extremely astute at how to package and sell it.

I may not have much respect for Martha Stewart's value system, but I would never describe her business acumen in a disparaging manner.

I'm well aware that this could also be used to describe the act of cooking or decorating as well. But that's not the context in which I was speaking.

[Eloriel]

36. Again, you insist on your silliness

I'm referring to what Martha Stewart is good at is taking decorating ideas, landscaping ideas, cooking ideas that other people have developed at one time or another, throwing them together, and putting her brand name on them. It's a highly successful marketing strategy -- but don't pretend that she's actually the one "creating" all this stuff. She just is extremely astute at how to package and sell it.

She has never claimed that she originated or created all these things. It's not really the nature of the beast to "create" many new things in those areas. NO landscaper, NO cook or chef, NO decorator can do their work without drawing on the work of others, often to a near 100% extent. Hint: that's why there are schools TEACHING those things.

I just think your resentment on this point is downright laughable.

[IrateCitizen]

37. Not nearly as laughable as your sermonizing, Eloriel.

I must admit I am supremely surprised that you were able to refrain from an all-out cheap shot in this post. You only referred to my "silliness".

I guess it's a start.

I'm done with this. Have a nice weekend!

[stanwyck]

9. the whole "let's get Martha" vendetta

does have that uncomfortable "we're going to punish you for being a successful businesswoman" undercurrent. Men may not understand this. But for those of us women who've been in the workplace for years, Martha being sent to prison for a personal stock deal has a nasty anti-female vibe. Don't tell me there aren't thousands of male investors who dumped their stock early. And were never prosecuted. In fact, they were slapped on the back and told what a great job they did. Like GWB. Check out his business career.
Martha was targeted for her visibility and her success. People have a vicious need to tear down a winner. And particularly if she's a high profile female. Look at what Hillary has had to endure. And, now, Teresa. The knives come out when a woman gets too much power.

[MoonRiver]

15. Thank you!

[FlaGranny]

19. Thank you. Right on target. n/t

[Eloriel]

23. Make that me three

There was so much GLEE on the part of the media about this whole problem she had -- there absolutely WAS and IS an anti-woman vibe about it -- a rather celebratory one.

I think we're talking about something like $60,000. And one of the government witnesses (for the prosecution) LIED, which has been proven and is also why her case is on appeal. I can't think of any other case similar involving a man where there was such celebratory glee over their legal problems.

[Shopaholic]

10. I buy her Weddings magazine

and I'm not even currently dating anyone. But it's just such a gorgeous magazine (and there are projects in there that are adaptable to other purposes). I love Martha and I really miss her show.

[mopinko]

11. saw a free martha stewart

handmade "bumpersticker" in the back window of a car yesterday. thinking of making a "free martha" button. when does she get out?

[MoonRiver]

16. I seem to recall her sentence was 8 months,

but could be wrong. At any rate, its just a few months.

[Eloriel]

24. Five months -- and she's serving it willingly to get it out of the way

She didn't have to until her appeal, and only if that were unsuccessful. She prefered to get it over with and be able to just move on.

[MoonRiver]

30. It was a good idea. The fascists would never let her get off, unlike

Kenny Boy.

[Bridget Burke]

17. Wouldn't a ribbon work?

In "Martha Green", of course....

[SemperEadem]

25. Free Martha Stewart!!! I have a dinner party to plan!!!!!

[AP]

18. This is funny because she's in jail because she lied to cover up her greed

in fear that if people found out about it, they wouldn't buy her magazine or buy her housewares. However, people are now using her imprisonment to promote her magazine and wares.

When you're rich, you can never lose. (Which is sort of the reason she's in jail...she and her broker felt that if you're really rich, you should never lose.)

[grasswire]

29. we owe Martha a good deal

...if just for elevating taste in inexpensive K-Mart items. Instead of garish crap made of shoddy material, people of modest means can purchase coordinated linens and household items that are better made and more tastefully designed. I think that's a good thing.

She is a teacher, first and foremost. But she also fills the role so lacking today -- the extended female family member who knows just how to do everything. Those women are disappearing from American life. The teaching of tradition and of real homemaking is of unmeasurable value.

I honor her for that. And I think she'll be an infinitely better person for her prison experience.

Oh, and just her lemon mousse recipe redeems anything she may have done, IMO.

[SemperEadem]

34. not to mention her cranberry/apple/almond crisp...

and recipes for pie dough that are the flakiest and lightest anywhere!

Martha is da bomb!

[Eloriel]

38. Another excellent point

and it bears repeating:

She is a teacher, first and foremost. But she also fills the role so lacking today -- the extended female family member who knows just how to do everything. Those women are disappearing from American life. The teaching of tradition and of real homemaking is of unmeasurable value.

IrateCitizen wants to complain because what she demonstrates and promotes (teaches) isn't her own original work. But resurrecting and resuscitating some of the by now near-forgotten knowledge, skills and techniques is, as you point out, vitally important as well.

[SemperEadem]

32. you may hate on her, in fact...

Hate all day on her, but at the end of the day, she is still the Doyenne of Gracious Living and no one yet is big and bad enough to step into her shoes and take her place, no matter how hard they try and how lame their shows are.