I'm having a crisis.....

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

a spiritual crisis. I hope this post is ok here. I feel most comfortable posting it here.

Here's what's happening: I DO believe in a Higher Power, that is not in question. But I am starting to....question....the Jesus story.

Here's why: I can readily accept that some parts of the Bible did not ACTUALLY happen. For instance, I do not take the Creation story in Genesis literally. I think it is yet another example of our human nature: to want to explain the creation of earth and the birth of humanity. Simple as that. I simply don't go in for the whole rib and dust thing.

There are other stories that I believe are mythical.

So how can I take just ONE story (the Jesus story) and say "Oh but THAT one is probably true?" How can I do that?

I find myself attracted more and more all the time to Buddhism. I have read many books on it, I have meditated daily for the past two and a half years. I love the teachings of Buddhism.

But I honestly get a bit.....scared when I think of giving up the whole Jesus story. The whole bit about the only way to heaven is through me part haunts me a bit, I will admit.

Call me weak-minded if you will (though I hope you won't, as I hope I will get some thoughtful responses), but I am being honest.

What to do?

[wildmanj]

1. crisis

the bible did not fall from the sky untouched by human hands----believe what you want-----just stay involved in those things which are spiritual

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

10. I will

and thank you. I've never been one to believe the Bible is the perfect word of God. I guess in that sense alone, I don't fit with most Christian denominations....I just think too much can get screwed up/lost in translation. And it's been translated a LOT.

Then there are those "lost" books with Gnostic teachings, which really makes me question the rest of it. If it is so perfect, why are parts of it missing?

Anywho.

[jackieforthedems]

35. I Know What You Mean

I was raised in the Catholic faith up until I was around 8, then my parents divorced, and I didn't return to church until I turned legal age. Anyway, I still attend church in a Catholic parish, and although I don't agree with all of their beliefs, I like to attend church in a church. However, lately, I have been on the verge of leaving. This upcoming election has me being pressured by not only my religion, but other Christians that if I vote Kerry, how can I be a Christian - that the Democratic party stands for all that is unGodly, etc... I believe in God, I am not personally for abortion, I don't believe in killing of any kind. But because I support Kerry, I am going to Hell, I guess. There are so many things going on in this world, and there are so many issues at stake, most of which I do not agree with Bush on. I don't believe in mixing religion with politics either. So, if I do leave the Church, I'm not yet sure as to where I'll go next. But I do believe in God.

[cally]

2. Most of us do

I've given up finding the true path but rather a path that I feel comfortable with. I've been where you are and I choose to make a spiritual life that's comfortable to me. I believe in a God and the rest I accept I need to learn more about. I'm a Christian but :shrug"

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

5. That's about how I feel

maybe this is more about my accepting that I don't know the answers and I might not EVER know them and being ok with that.

Hmmmm. Thanks, that actually helped a lot.

[cally]

22. I'll share a little bit more

I'm a Christian because that's how I was raised. I've had great experiences with churches and Christians. I know many who have been harmed by Christianity but for me it has guided my life. It's who I am. It's been hard to actually learn about religion and faith. I have so many quetions and it is a lifelong pursuit. For me, I've concluded that I can learn, question, connect but I don't have to stop being a Christian. It's one path to God and Jesus just preaches all that I believe (forget all the later commentary but look at his actual words as much as we know.)

[Gryffindor_Bookworm]

3. The two are not irreconcilable.

Phil Jackson (the famous basketball coach) was raised by Pentacostal ministers and now calls himself a Buddhist Christian. His book, Sacred Hoops, is excellent.

Dawn

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

4. Yeah

and there's also the book "Living Buddha, Living Christ" by Thich Nacht Han (don't know if I got his name right). I have it and have read it many times and it is awesome. He just breaks things down so well.

[seventhson]

6. The teachings od Jesus and Buddha are essentially the same

(at their essence)


Love; Compassion, the divinityy of the entire creation.

There are lots of Buddhist Christians as well as as Jewish Buddhists whose beliefs are not contradictory.

I know a lot about this subject (and have travelled to the Holy Land).

There is no doubt that Jesus existed and his impact is undisputable. In Esoteric and Eastern Religion the "Avatar" (a divine human incarnation on a mission from the Creator) comes periodically to teach and enlighten us. Buddha was such a teacher as was Jesus. Some say this is the same soul. Krishna too.

Check out the story of Elias and Elijah, for example.

Buddhist influence on Judaism, Christianity and Islam are indisputable as there was trade in ideas as well as goods with India and the Holy Land.

There is only ONE truth and many ways of seeing it.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

15. I've called myself a Buddhist Christian for many years

and in essence, I can't say I disbelieve Jesus ever LIVED. I just wonder about the rest of the story.

I think at this point I should simply look at the teachings of both Jesus and Buddha. I have read them and I figure if you live by that, you really can't go wrong.

[NightTrain]

7. A friend of mine adopted what she calls "Frankenfaith."

She looked into several different religions, cherry-picked the parts that she liked about each one, and somehow managed to seamlessly fit them into what my friend calls her faith. Perhaps you could try something like that? :shrug:

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

13. I seem to have done that over time

but I'm not sure how comfortable I am with THAT, either. Guess I now have to question my compulsive need to believe ALL of a faith or none of it, huh? LOL.

[Pale Blue Dot]

8. I am not a Christian,

but I believe that Jesus existed, and that he was a great liberal. I think that Gandhi is a modern-day equivalent.

Don't let the conservative jerks who have co-opted your faith have an influence on you. I believe that they are completely wrong about Jesus.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

11. Oh I do too

I just CANNOT reconcile how I can take THIS part of the Bible and say "yes true" and say "meh" to the rest. Because I honestly do not believe in the creation myth. I believe in Darwin's theory and the related modern addendums to it.

[Pale Blue Dot]

17. So I guess you'll never go here?

http://www.themeparksonline.org/tponews.asp?ID=3610

I know exactly what you mean. I have a problem with any religion that takes a bunch of words written by men as the "gospel truth".

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

18. LOL

yeah pretty good bet I won't ever go there!

Ah the struggle. It's what life is about, isn't it? I do also believe in reincarnation, though I don't think it is a Christian belief.

[Pale Blue Dot]

19. Reincarnation scares me.

I'm not even close. :D

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

21. Why?

You might screw up this time around and come back as a cockroach next time? }(

Hee hee. I think it is a fascinating concept.

[Pale Blue Dot]

23. A cockroach? I wasn't aiming that high.

:D

Ah well, I've still got a few years left to get it right. :-)

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

25. Amoeba???

Kidding. You were probably Ghandi or someone like that. People always seem to claim they were someone famous, never just some peasant serf who lived their life in obscurity, LOL!

(I think I was Janis Joplin...I was born the day after her death. Kidding! About thinking that, not the dates, that is true...)

[Pale Blue Dot]

29. I WISH I was Gandhi.

I was probably the one hired to approach him when he was on one of his hunger strikes and say "Mmmm, this muffin is delicious! Don't you want just one little bite?"

I feel like I'm spending this life trying to make up for that...

But you understand, don't you, Miss Joplin? :evilgrin:

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

31. Hey freedom's just another word

for nothin' left to lose......

[RhodaGrits]

26. yeah, brian weiss' stuff is amazing :-)

I've heard him speak several times and went to one of his seminars.

[RhodaGrits]

9. Good luck. I completely understand. It has taken me 30+ yrs

to finally admit that I do not believe in Christianity. A great book to read is: The Closing of the Western Mind: The Rise of Faith and the Fall of Reason by Charles Freeman.

I have beliefs that have evolved over my lifetime. You need to find your own path. For me, it did not lead to atheism. Find your own truths, you will know them because they resonate for you. The journey is worth the effort.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

12. Thank you

good advice. Everyone has been so wonderful on this thread.

[Fovea]

14. bag the mythos, keep the faith

tienmin my friend. Heaven is all around you, or it is surely nowhere.
Hell is all around you too. You must decide which you want to live within, and which you will oppose.

Be Blessed.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

16. Thank you.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

20. You may find some surcease in...

Actually conducting your life by the basic tenets of the Christian Faith(Tenets that find parrelels in other fully-formed religions). Love, compassion, charity, service to others. The Buddhists would call that "Boddhisattva".

For some of us, just belief and talk and Sunday services just isn't enough.

Try reading some of Jack Spong's books. I find them helpful. He's a damn smart man, the fact that he confirmed me in the Episcopal Church notwithstanding. ;-)

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

24. I do that

and I guess I need to just not worry so much about the doctrine, the dogma, but simply living by those tenets, which is something I strive to do each day.

"Belief and talk and Sunday services" aren't enough for me, you are right. I have read about "Boddhisattva" and loved the description. I love how open Buddhism is. How focused on peace and love and compassion. I know Christianity is supposed to be, but it seems my observation of the practice of it has really gotten me down....

[NMDemDist2]

27. I am not a Christian

but I strive to be christ-like

why must you believe the parables to practice the path?

the teaching is the message, what matters the medium?

:hug:

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

28. Very good points

Thank you.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

30. To everyone who replied:

I want to thank you. I was really not expecting such a response so quickly and I have to admit, I was half-expecting a bit of derision for even believing in a higher power and I got none. That just speaks to the people who are here.

Thank you. You have helped more than you know. I think sometimes we just have to get our thoughts straightened out from time to time.

[midwayer]

32. Buddhism is an interesting religion

Taught, were some of the deepest meanings for lifes journey without the existence of God or Universal Diety.

Very close to the spirtual concepts which Christ may have been attempting to convey to mankind.

This has given me much spiritual insight in my lifetime and helped to tie it all together into a meaningful sense.

Although, the constant battle and journey for me is actually living it and expressing it. Something which I, sometimes, have difficulty with as do many within our human existence.

There might be something here for you to help tie it together, then again

there may not:

The Life And Teachings Of Jesus
PAPER 131: Section 3.
Buddhism

http://urantiabook.org/newbook/ppr131_3.html

&

http://urantiabook.org/newbook/index.html

The second half of the book is totally devoted to the life of Jesus

[jackieforthedems]

33. A Neat Site To Visit

www.wyattmuseum.com. Ron Wyatt has photos of Noah's Ark on his site, and he also may have found the Ark Of The Covenant in one of his expeditions.

[midwayer]

34. Jackie..that is a great site

thanks

Biblical Archaeology is fascinating

[jackieforthedems]

36. It Helps The Ones Questioning To See Something

Photos always help. Like I said above in another post, I don't think religion is as important as believing in God is. Religions are really just divisions that we did to ourselves - God didn't categorize us into religions - we made our own choices, etc...

[starroute]

37. Understand the teachings of Jesus in a mystical, not a literal, sense

Is this the part you have problems with? -- "I am the way, the truth and the light; no man cometh unto the Father but by Me."

Those problems arise because Christianity, as an organized religion, has always taken those words in the most literal, exclusive, and narrow-minded way possible. But that is far from the only way of taking them.

The great mystics of all religions have always taught that there is a higher force which leads beyond this world and that anyone who completely surrenders their ego is capable of merging entirely into that force. (This is what Buddhism knows as Nirvana.)

That higher force is not comprehensible in ordinary worldly terms, so it is spoken of in metaphors. One of those metaphors is "the Way," because it is a path leading to transcendence. Another is "Truth," because our ordinary intuition of the difference between true and false is analogous to the difference between higher reality and the sham of everyday life. Another is "Light," probably because of the association of light with visionary experiences.

It is also recognized in all mystical traditions that the great teachers who stand as a living embodiment of this identification with higher being can help their followers to make the same transition. Even after a teacher leaves this world, something of their spiritual power remains to help those who are prepared to tap into it.

Would Jesus, as an egoless being who had perfectly realized his merger into a higher identity, have really said anything as seemingly ego-centric as "no man cometh unto the Father but by Me"? If you truly believe in the message of Jesus, you have to recognize that the word "Me" in that sentence meant not "me, Jesus" but rather something that could be crudely expressed as "Me, the higher force which has completely filled and superseded the earthly vehicle of Jesus."

If you can keep that in mind, it will help you find your way safely from the limited Christianity of the churches to the true Christianity of Jesus.

I also recommend the poetry of Rumi as a useful bridge between your Christianity and your Buddhism. Here is one of his poems, as translated by Coleman Barks:

Not Christian or Jew or Muslim, not Hindu,
Buddhist, sufi, or zen. Not any religion
or cultural system. I am not from the East
or the West, not out of the ocean or up
from the ground, not natural or ethereal, not
composed of elements at all. I do not exist,
am not an entity in this world or the next,
did not descend from Adam or Eve or any
origin story. My place is placeless, a trace
of the traceless. Neither body or soul.
I belong to the beloved, have seen the two
worlds as one and that one call to and know,
first, last, outer, inner, only that
breath breathing human being.

[jsw_81]

38. You're in good company

The vast majority of the world's population rejects the Jesus story and the only reason why you give it any credence is because you live in a majority Christian society that has forced it on you since birth. If you had been born and raised in Japan or India or some other land it's highly unlikely that you would even give it a second thought. The fact that you're fearful about changing your worldview just shows how effective the indoctrination has been. It can be very difficult to break free from this sort of childhood indoctrination, but with time and effort it can be done.

I wish you luck in your spiritual journey and sincerely hope that you find happiness.

[faithnotgreed]

39. im a member of the green party and i will stand up to be counted.

i love Jesus

i cant say i relate to your crisis but i do very much understand why this happens. many are taught certain things about God and the bible. and likewise many people are turned off by the way humans have led their lives while at the same time espousing this Christianity.

im what is referred to as a Christian and im so very thankful, i was raised in a progressive evangelical quaker church. social justice combined with teaching of Christ.
but because i dont combine in the ways of the world, i have not usually felt that there were many out there like me. but thats just me.

i believe in the Bible. i believe deeply in Jesus and His teachings.
what various members of my family recall about me from the time i was about 5 years old, was the way i related to Job and would talk about and read his story. i always loved that book and now that im older i can see why God put that in my path from the time i was very young.

i am sorry youre struggling but clearly you are a thoughtful and caring person. that matters greatly.

best wishes on your journey....

[Baja Margie]

40. Well, here's a thought -

There are people who believe that Jesus, for his unaccounted for years, actually traveled and lived in India, which wouldn't come as a big surprise if you compare the ideologies of both Religions.

I found some books very helpful:

Walking the Bible, by Bruce Feiler

Rabbi Jesus, by Bruce Chilton

Jewish-Christian Debates, by Jacob Neusner & Bruce Chilton

Genesis, was an excellent coverage by PBS awhile back, and is out in book form.

Find a young Jesuit priest and talk to him, a good Buddist monk, and talk to him, and a good Rabbi, and talk to him. They will all lead you on the right path.


xxxooo

[faithnotgreed]

41. i think you meant that for the original poster? thank you though

they sound like some good books....

[Baja Margie]

42. Yes, faithnotgreed, that was meant

for the original poster. I really enjoyed Rabbi Jesus, couldn't put it down, I think you can order it through the internet on Bruce Chilton's site.

Take care, God bless.

[faithnotgreed]

43. thank you kindly marjorie. and a warm (overdue) welcome!